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2008-09-17 16:31:04
Spearhead
Gulf coast redneck hippy
+731|6995|Tampa Bay Florida

FEOS wrote:

CamPoe wrote:

It stands to reason he would want to be the one negotiating the withdrawal from Iraq rather than the retards who went in in the first place. They'll just end up tying his hands with imperial possessions like 'permanent military installations' and whatnot.
First, how would you feel if some random Irish politician who happened to be running for the top job went on a world tour, effectively engaging in foreign policy discussions with other countries...when he has no authority to do so?

Secondly, no one has mentioned "permanent military installations" anywhere...so just what are you referencing?
Feos, this may just be me, but I dont think you'd be thinking the same if McCain had taken that world tour instead of Obama (oh wait, didnt he do one too?  I forget).

He's also on the committee of foreign affairs... surely thats more than no authority at all?
2008-09-17 16:32:39
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6716|'Murka

Spearhead wrote:

FEOS wrote:

CamPoe wrote:

It stands to reason he would want to be the one negotiating the withdrawal from Iraq rather than the retards who went in in the first place. They'll just end up tying his hands with imperial possessions like 'permanent military installations' and whatnot.
First, how would you feel if some random Irish politician who happened to be running for the top job went on a world tour, effectively engaging in foreign policy discussions with other countries...when he has no authority to do so?

Secondly, no one has mentioned "permanent military installations" anywhere...so just what are you referencing?
Feos, this may just be me, but I dont think you'd be thinking the same if McCain had taken that world tour instead of Obama (oh wait, didnt he do one too?  I forget).

He's also on the committee of foreign affairs... surely thats more than no authority at all?
No, McCain didn't do one too.

If he traveled with the Committee, that's different. But he didn't, did he? It wasn't a Congressional trip...it was a campaign-funded trip. Totally removed from his role as a Senator. So...no. No authority at all.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
2008-09-19 16:34:27
God Save the Queen
Banned
+628|6649|tropical regions of london

(T)eflon(S)hadow wrote:

Thanks Ken for that post. Crickets love these threadz.

Spoiler (highlight to read):
.
I see that post only supporting the reasons why I feel the way I do about McCain.







(T)eflon(S)hadow wrote:

The silence is deafening, besides the usual defensiveness for his highness... Mr comelistento my $28,500 dinner speech
silence is deafening?  oh christ man, give me a break

"Supporters paid 50,000 dollars a ticket to attend the buffet dinner in Miami's InterContinental hotel, taking McCain's total fundraising in Florida to date to 26.2 million dollars."


the very night before Obama had his fundraiser where he had his "comelistento my dinner speech" dinner speech

http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5j5h … DLyu_zgDog


lets hear some of that silence.

Last edited by God Save the Queen (2008-09-19 16:40:06)

2008-09-19 16:43:37
usmarine
Banned
+2,785|7067

yes but GS.....

"thats not change, thats more of the same" 


i mean, with a slogan like that, you cant really justify 28K steaks bro.
2008-09-19 17:53:20
Spearhead
Gulf coast redneck hippy
+731|6995|Tampa Bay Florida

usmarine wrote:

yes but GS.....

"thats not change, thats more of the same" 


i mean, with a slogan like that, you cant really justify 28K steaks bro.
usmarine, have you ever considered that Obama has to lower himself to other levels in order to have a chance at winning?

I mean, its politics dude.  You kill or be killed.  But in the end both parties are killers.  Doesnt mean that one of them might not be better than the other.
2008-09-19 17:59:44
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6957|USA
Watch in the next few weeks, Biden will withdrawl from the VP slot claiming health issues. This will allow Obama to bring in Hilary to counter-act the Palin issue.
2008-09-19 18:11:42
MGS3_GrayFox
Member
+50|6473

lowing wrote:

Watch in the next few weeks, Biden will withdrawl from the VP slot claiming health issues. This will allow Obama to bring in Hilary to counter-act the Palin issue.
Too sure of ourselves aren't we?
2008-09-19 18:14:05
Spearhead
Gulf coast redneck hippy
+731|6995|Tampa Bay Florida

lowing wrote:

Watch in the next few weeks, Biden will withdrawl from the VP slot claiming health issues. This will allow Obama to bring in Hilary to counter-act the Palin issue.
If Obama did that then he deserves to lose.  Even if he wanted to, he's not a moron, lowing.
2008-09-19 18:19:49
usmarine
Banned
+2,785|7067

Spearhead wrote:

lowing wrote:

Watch in the next few weeks, Biden will withdrawl from the VP slot claiming health issues. This will allow Obama to bring in Hilary to counter-act the Palin issue.
If Obama did that then he deserves to lose.  Even if he wanted to, he's not a moron, lowing.
ya lowing i dont think so.  that would mean a loss for sure.
2008-09-19 18:25:56
Spark
liquid fluoride thorium reactor
+874|6980|Canberra, AUS

lowing wrote:

Watch in the next few weeks, Biden will withdrawl from the VP slot claiming health issues. This will allow Obama to bring in Hilary to counter-act the Palin issue.
Lulz, keep dreaming.
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
2008-09-19 19:46:57
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6957|USA

usmarine wrote:

Spearhead wrote:

lowing wrote:

Watch in the next few weeks, Biden will withdrawl from the VP slot claiming health issues. This will allow Obama to bring in Hilary to counter-act the Palin issue.
If Obama did that then he deserves to lose.  Even if he wanted to, he's not a moron, lowing.
ya lowing i dont think so.  that would mean a loss for sure.
personaaly I think it is not that far fetched of an idea. You know damn well, when Palin joined he instantly regretted not having Hillary on the ticket.

Now, claiming health issues, Biden could step aside, save face and Hillary could slid in. Biden already made a comment that Hillary would be a much better VP then him.
2008-09-20 06:41:43
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6861

FEOS wrote:

First, how would you feel if some random Irish politician who happened to be running for the top job went on a world tour, effectively engaging in foreign policy discussions with other countries...when he has no authority to do so?

Secondly, no one has mentioned "permanent military installations" anywhere...so just what are you referencing?
I don't think you could call what Obama engaged in as 'foreign policy discussions' given that a) he has no authority over anything and b) everyone he spoke will have realised this. I don't think you can prohibit such activity from prospective heads of state.

The supplemental funding bill for the war in Iraq signed by President Bush in early May 2005 provides money for the construction of bases for U.S. forces that are described as "in some very limited cases, permanent facilities." Even GS conceded in the past that the US were not spending money on building massive bases just to leave them to the Iraqis. Look at the colossal US embassy that was built ffs - a complex of ludicrous proportions slap bang in central Baghdad.
2008-09-20 06:43:30
MGS3_GrayFox
Member
+50|6473

lowing wrote:

usmarine wrote:

Spearhead wrote:


If Obama did that then he deserves to lose.  Even if he wanted to, he's not a moron, lowing.
ya lowing i dont think so.  that would mean a loss for sure.
personaaly I think it is not that far fetched of an idea. You know damn well, when Palin joined he instantly regretted not having Hillary on the ticket.

Now, claiming health issues, Biden could step aside, save face and Hillary could slid in. Biden already made a comment that Hillary would be a much better VP then him.
Simply no.
2008-09-20 07:06:18
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6716|'Murka

CameronPoe wrote:

FEOS wrote:

First, how would you feel if some random Irish politician who happened to be running for the top job went on a world tour, effectively engaging in foreign policy discussions with other countries...when he has no authority to do so?

Secondly, no one has mentioned "permanent military installations" anywhere...so just what are you referencing?
I don't think you could call what Obama engaged in as 'foreign policy discussions' given that a) he has no authority over anything and b) everyone he spoke will have realised this.
It doesn't matter. He knew he didn't have the authority and he did it anyway. He attempted to influence the Iraqi leadership in face-to-face meetings. It's a foul. No two ways about it.

Cam wrote:

I don't think you can prohibit such activity from prospective heads of state.
Yes, you can. It's illegal for anyone but the President and/or his designee to participate in foreign policy discussions. Period.

Cam wrote:

The supplemental funding bill for the war in Iraq signed by President Bush in early May 2005 provides money for the construction of bases for U.S. forces that are described as "in some very limited cases, permanent facilities." Even GS conceded in the past that the US were not spending money on building massive bases just to leave them to the Iraqis. Look at the colossal US embassy that was built ffs - a complex of ludicrous proportions slap bang in central Baghdad.
And since then, every single person who has been asked the question has said "No. We're not building permanent US bases in Iraq."

We are spending money on those bases just to hand them over to the Iraqis at some point. Just like we do with all our bases in foreign countries when we leave.

US Embassy is a State Dept thing, not a military base.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
2008-09-20 07:12:11
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6861

FEOS wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:

FEOS wrote:

First, how would you feel if some random Irish politician who happened to be running for the top job went on a world tour, effectively engaging in foreign policy discussions with other countries...when he has no authority to do so?

Secondly, no one has mentioned "permanent military installations" anywhere...so just what are you referencing?
I don't think you could call what Obama engaged in as 'foreign policy discussions' given that a) he has no authority over anything and b) everyone he spoke will have realised this.
It doesn't matter. He knew he didn't have the authority and he did it anyway. He attempted to influence the Iraqi leadership in face-to-face meetings. It's a foul. No two ways about it.

Cam wrote:

I don't think you can prohibit such activity from prospective heads of state.
Yes, you can. It's illegal for anyone but the President and/or his designee to participate in foreign policy discussions. Period.

Cam wrote:

The supplemental funding bill for the war in Iraq signed by President Bush in early May 2005 provides money for the construction of bases for U.S. forces that are described as "in some very limited cases, permanent facilities." Even GS conceded in the past that the US were not spending money on building massive bases just to leave them to the Iraqis. Look at the colossal US embassy that was built ffs - a complex of ludicrous proportions slap bang in central Baghdad.
And since then, every single person who has been asked the question has said "No. We're not building permanent US bases in Iraq."

We are spending money on those bases just to hand them over to the Iraqis at some point. Just like we do with all our bases in foreign countries when we leave.

US Embassy is a State Dept thing, not a military base.
I disagree with the prohibition of 'talking to foreign powers'. His discussions cannot have been and were not binding in any way. I don't think anyone has the right to prevent anyone from 'having a chat about future possibilities'. It doesn't smack much of 'freedom' to prohibit dialogue. I'm sure Benyamin Netanyahu does plenty of talking to US politicians despite not being in power in Israel right now. I'm sure David Cameron in England has had many's a chat with the likes of Nicolas Sarkozy and others.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2008-09-20 07:12:28)

2008-09-20 07:15:15
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6716|'Murka

CameronPoe wrote:

I disagree with the prohibition of 'talking to foreign powers'. His discussions cannot have been and were not binding in any way. I don't think anyone has the right to prevent anyone from 'having a chat about future possibilities'. It doesn't smack much of 'freedom' to prohibit dialogue. I'm sure Benyamin Netanyahu does plenty of talking to US politicians despite not being in power in Israel right now. I'm sure David Cameron in England has had many's a chat with the likes of Nicolas Sarkozy and others.
If he wants to go over as a US Senator, that's one thing. He's a representative of the US govt at that point. He went over as a private citizen who is running for President. If he made any promises of any sort to any of those leaders, he is out of line. That's the issue, not him just "hangin' with Sarkozy".
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
2008-09-20 07:36:22
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6861

FEOS wrote:

If he wants to go over as a US Senator, that's one thing. He's a representative of the US govt at that point. He went over as a private citizen who is running for President. If he made any promises of any sort to any of those leaders, he is out of line. That's the issue, not him just "hangin' with Sarkozy".
I don't know FEOS, I just fundamentally disagree with prohibiting dialogue of any kind.
2008-09-20 18:07:08
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6716|'Murka

CameronPoe wrote:

FEOS wrote:

If he wants to go over as a US Senator, that's one thing. He's a representative of the US govt at that point. He went over as a private citizen who is running for President. If he made any promises of any sort to any of those leaders, he is out of line. That's the issue, not him just "hangin' with Sarkozy".
I don't know FEOS, I just fundamentally disagree with prohibiting dialogue of any kind.
Did I say "dialogue of any kind"? There's a time and place for it...that campaign junket was neither.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
2008-09-20 19:06:33
God Save the Queen
Banned
+628|6649|tropical regions of london

FEOS wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:

FEOS wrote:

First, how would you feel if some random Irish politician who happened to be running for the top job went on a world tour, effectively engaging in foreign policy discussions with other countries...when he has no authority to do so?

Secondly, no one has mentioned "permanent military installations" anywhere...so just what are you referencing?
I don't think you could call what Obama engaged in as 'foreign policy discussions' given that a) he has no authority over anything and b) everyone he spoke will have realised this.
It doesn't matter. He knew he didn't have the authority and he did it anyway. He attempted to influence the Iraqi leadership in face-to-face meetings. It's a foul. No two ways about it.

Cam wrote:

I don't think you can prohibit such activity from prospective heads of state.
Yes, you can. It's illegal for anyone but the President and/or his designee to participate in foreign policy discussions. Period.

Cam wrote:

The supplemental funding bill for the war in Iraq signed by President Bush in early May 2005 provides money for the construction of bases for U.S. forces that are described as "in some very limited cases, permanent facilities." Even GS conceded in the past that the US were not spending money on building massive bases just to leave them to the Iraqis. Look at the colossal US embassy that was built ffs - a complex of ludicrous proportions slap bang in central Baghdad.
And since then, every single person who has been asked the question has said "No. We're not building permanent US bases in Iraq."

We are spending money on those bases just to hand them over to the Iraqis at some point. Just like we do with all our bases in foreign countries when we leave.

US Embassy is a State Dept thing, not a military base.
so how you feeling about palin going to afghanistan to speak to the president?
2008-09-20 19:28:48
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6716|'Murka

God Save the Queen wrote:

so how you feeling about palin going to afghanistan to speak to the president?
Don't like it...but that's also the first I've heard of it.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
2008-09-21 11:32:56
God Save the Queen
Banned
+628|6649|tropical regions of london

FEOS wrote:

God Save the Queen wrote:

so how you feeling about palin going to afghanistan to speak to the president?
Don't like it...but that's also the first I've heard of it.
well its happening, it was all over the news yesterday.  for an undecided voter (still dont understand how a serious voter could be undecided a little over a month before the election), you should keep your eye out on these kinds of things.
2008-09-21 18:47:23
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6716|'Murka

God Save the Queen wrote:

FEOS wrote:

God Save the Queen wrote:

so how you feeling about palin going to afghanistan to speak to the president?
Don't like it...but that's also the first I've heard of it.
well its happening, it was all over the news yesterday.  for an undecided voter (still dont understand how a serious voter could be undecided a little over a month before the election), you should keep your eye out on these kinds of things.
The first debate is scheduled for Friday. Since Obama refused to engage in the series of town hall meeting McCain had suggested, this is the first real chance to see what both of them plan to do. Campaign speeches are worthless fluff and there's no detail of any kind on their web sites.

Watched the news shows this morning and didn't see anything about it. Nor in the evening news, both local and national. They must've missed it.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
2008-09-21 21:29:29
God Save the Queen
Banned
+628|6649|tropical regions of london

FEOS wrote:

God Save the Queen wrote:

FEOS wrote:


Don't like it...but that's also the first I've heard of it.
well its happening, it was all over the news yesterday.  for an undecided voter (still dont understand how a serious voter could be undecided a little over a month before the election), you should keep your eye out on these kinds of things.
The first debate is scheduled for Friday. Since Obama refused to engage in the series of town hall meeting McCain had suggested, this is the first real chance to see what both of them plan to do. Campaign speeches are worthless fluff and there's no detail of any kind on their web sites.

Watched the news shows this morning and didn't see anything about it. Nor in the evening news, both local and national. They must've missed it.
I heard it on fox, then I heard it on msnbc then cnn.  then I did a google search for "palin afghanistan"  then I brought it up here.
2008-09-22 01:38:02
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6716|'Murka

God Save the Queen wrote:

FEOS wrote:

God Save the Queen wrote:


well its happening, it was all over the news yesterday.  for an undecided voter (still dont understand how a serious voter could be undecided a little over a month before the election), you should keep your eye out on these kinds of things.
The first debate is scheduled for Friday. Since Obama refused to engage in the series of town hall meeting McCain had suggested, this is the first real chance to see what both of them plan to do. Campaign speeches are worthless fluff and there's no detail of any kind on their web sites.

Watched the news shows this morning and didn't see anything about it. Nor in the evening news, both local and national. They must've missed it.
I heard it on fox, then I heard it on msnbc then cnn.  then I did a google search for "palin afghanistan"  then I brought it up here.
So requesting to meet with the president of one country while he's visiting the US for a UN meeting equates to traveling to five or so foreign countries and meeting with their leadership there?

I'm not particularly thrilled with the idea, but it's a far cry from what Obama pulled. I have no idea what she or the McCain campaign hopes to gain from it...all it does is pick the foreign policy scab.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
2008-09-22 01:43:56
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6861

FEOS wrote:

So requesting to meet with the president of one country while he's visiting the US for a UN meeting equates to traveling to five or so foreign countries and meeting with their leadership there?

I'm not particularly thrilled with the idea, but it's a far cry from what Obama pulled. I have no idea what she or the McCain campaign hopes to gain from it...all it does is pick the foreign policy scab.
It's the same thing as what Obama did, in terms of the principle of the thing magnitude is irrelevant.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2008-09-22 01:44:35)

 

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