BF2S Forums What would it take for you...

Id need to see some serious evidence. Either for a miracle to happen to me or one of my family.

I ain't changing my entire outlook on life and life style without something prity Major.

I was counting on joining all the Major religions when on my death bed anyway to be sure

Faith is faith, I can't think of anything.

KILLSWITCH wrote:

I would need some example of divinity.  Maybe an angel or the good Lord himself to come and greet me.

Ha, if I saw an angel or something, my first thought would be that someone is trying to pull a fast one on me. So there is nothing to convince me.

KILLSWITCH wrote:

Funny how back in the day all of these divine miracles and visits from above used to occur every now and then.  Where are they now?  They sure had fun writing the Bible.

They used to smoke crack back then.

sergeriver wrote:

KILLSWITCH wrote:

Funny how back in the day all of these divine miracles and visits from above used to occur every now and then.  Where are they now?  They sure had fun writing the Bible.

They used to smoke crack back then.

Nah, you're mistaking it with frankincense and myrrh.
Those where the popular drugs back then.

Pierre wrote:

Nothing really, it's all a matter of faith, you can't prove that God does or does not exist.

You agnostic.

I'm willing to accept any religion that convinces me - but they have to make sense to me. I can't accept a religion that doesn't make sense at all. It has to have a connection with real life, and also has to represent some ideals I stand for.

I would never believe in a god, for that matter - but I could believe in fate, destiny and all that stuff... But not a guy who created the earth.

-konfusion

sergeriver wrote:

Pierre wrote:

Nothing really, it's all a matter of faith, you can't prove that God does or does not exist.

You agnostic.

I guess... depending on the definition of it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agnosticism wrote:

Agnosticism (from the Greek α-γνωστικισμός, meaning "without", and gnosticism or gnosis, meaning "knowledge") is the philosophical view that the truth value of certain claims — particularly metaphysical claims regarding theology, afterlife or the existence of God, gods, deities, or even ultimate reality — is unknown or, depending on the form of agnosticism, inherently unknowable due to the nature of subjective experience perceived by that individual.

I was raised catholic and went to all the Catholic schools and universities so I should know something about it .

On topic: if you 'believe' you will see certain things as a miracle, if not you will see it as coincidence.

jord wrote:

I say know like that because I suppose it'd just be like when you sleep but don't dream, only you can't think because you're dead...

Your syllogisms amaze me.

sergeriver wrote:

Atheists/Agnostics: ...to recognize God exists?

Religious: ...to accept God doesn't exist?

Atheists can't be shown proof, so they would have to experience something that would drive them to faith. Agnostics operate on possibility. You can neither prove nor disprove the existence of God or a God-like entity with current technology, so the matter must be left in the open. I believe this is the most reasonable viewpoint. The religious operate on faith, so it would probably take an event that causes resentment to break said faith.

Last edited by unnamednewbie13 (2008-04-04 11:14:26)

sergeriver wrote:

Atheists/Agnostics: ...to recognize God exists?

Religious: ...to accept God doesn't exist?

Unequivocal, indisputable proof.

Wow, that wasn't very difficult.

Hate to tell you this serge, but the question is not a "functional" question...that's not how things work.  In generations past, such persons who witness miracles do NOT suddenly begin to believe or accept.  This is why such things of God must be "earned" by a trial of faith.

To explain more clearly, the pathetic 5 senses you non-believers value so highly mean exactly NOTHING in terms of "knowing" of God's existence.  I've seen people witness miracles they did not "earn" and they failed to adhere to principles form whence the miracle sprang...cures of ulcers, AIDS, various sicknesses, removal of evil spirits, answers to questions, protection, etc.   There's a (forgive the irony) "scientific" factor in "knowing" such things.  This is why even "Christians" who talk the talk, don't walk the walk...they've witnessed things they never applied an ounce of faith towards, or they simply believe by compulsion or peer pressure something they didn't work out themselves.

I have a handful of divine truths, having tried them time and time again, seen them manifest time and time again WELL beyond any coincidence, reasoning, worldly "science," etc..things no man could drag out of me...because "I" qualified them myself by exercising just faith and gaining the witness of them afterwards.

So no, an atheist (sincere or not) who sees the dead raised may quickly discount, explain away, or forget such a thing and it will profit them nothing.  The atheist who sincerely goes "looking" for an honest and personal witness of any of the many aspects of God's existence will find it..and it will remain with them forever.  I would say "knowing" something from faith is much like burning something into your soul.

usmarine wrote:

Simple.  Stop having babies killed in microwaves for starters.  If you are "all powerful," then put a fucking stop to that shit.  I mean WTF.  That is part of your "plan?"  Well fuck your plan.  I am not going to worship something if part of their plan is to have a baby be born for couple months, then get fried in the microwave.  Oh and don't start with the "he gave people free will shit."  If people have free will and he cannot/does not control what is going on, then what the fuck are you worshiping?

So you think an all powerful God should stop ALL crimes, or just the microwaved baby crimes?  If God intervened in all things bad, maybe death so we'd all stay around forever, happy, in our little emo world..then what is the point?  And sometimes God does intervene..based on the faith of others, a unique plan that requires longevity for someone, something well beyond the wisdom you and I have.

Your rant shows that you have no belief in a world after this one, and it's a reasonably derived rant that many have "how could He let this happen."  And you answered it sort of when you mentioned free will.  If you understood what the purpose of this world was, then you'd understand how sacred our right to choose is.  We do all have the right to choose good or bad.  The blessings of choosing good are peace in this world and in the next..the choice to do bad causes us pain in this world and in the next.  The more of one over the other (karma as some would put it) will shape your soul and you will partially earn your judgment.  But if none of that mattered, if this life didn't progress to something else, then yes, it would seem heartless and tragic that a baby was killed because it would seem they have no chance at life or happiness.  But as it is, they do.  That brief, painful, dark mortal existence is NOTHING compared to the eternal nature of our soul.

Last edited by IRONCHEF (2008-04-04 12:02:40)