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2008-03-18 11:37:30
Stingray24
Proud member of the vast right-wing conspiracy
+1,060|6708|The Land of Scott Walker

IRONCHEF wrote:

Stingray24 wrote:

Newsflash ... Obama had this man as an adviser to his campaign.  Doesn't agree with him huh?  Obama has supposedly been a member at the man's church for over 20 years.  If he disagrees with him enough to disown his views in front of the nation, why continue to attend there and have him as a campaign advisor?  He told the nation he disagrees with this man out of political necessity, nothing more.
Source for Obama's "previous" pastor as a campaign advisor?  Did you also just watch his "race speech?"  If there's ANY reasoning ability by ANY human, said human can thus reason that one thing has nothing to do with the other. 

Stingray, if the NRA did something bad, should you, a member, or at least as a gun rights advocate, be responsible for that bad behavior, even if you're running for president?  If the NRA was actually created as the KKK was disbanded and outlawed (as depicted in Mike Moore's movie), and actually had KKK leaders running it, should you be considered as a racist?  Even if you didn't condemn the racist language used by said NRA leaders who you give money and support to?

I wouldn't consider you a racist, slanted, or an idealogical tool at all.  I'd consider you a member of a club that has good and bad ideals.  I consider Obama a "previous" member of a congregation whose pastor said some stupid, racists, anti-American things..that's it. 

Sorry if this is heated, I just had this argument with my Mom.
Source?  Obama.  He has stated this pastor is an adviser in his own speeches, yet he says he had no idea about his extreme views?  Pardon me if I call bullshit.  The NRA is an organization, much different than an individual whom one has characterized as a mentor and adviser for two decades.  Yet, if your hypothesis was true, I would not give money and support to the NRA because their views contradict my values.

Oh and since we're talking about the NRA.  How'd you like Obama's refusal to vote against a statewide ban on all handguns in his state?  How about his support for a ban on all types of semiautomatic weapons?

Last edited by Stingray24 (2008-03-18 11:44:34)

2008-03-18 11:47:47
Morpheus
This shit still going?
+508|6262|The Mitten

DonFck wrote:

Since day one of following various campaigns, I've been astonished by the ability of candidates to dig up dirt on their opponents, and if not them, their fucking family or maybe their neighbour.

Campainging and elections have become jokes. It's not who's the best person for the job, it's who can cover up their past the best/the past of their relatives/people near them. E.g. who the fuck would give a flying fuck if someone puffed some herb in the 70's? Apparently, everyone, if the opponent manages to spin it correctly.

And no you tits, I'm not speaking of the U.S alone. We all suck.

Endrant.
Reporter: So, tell me, what is your stance on abortion?
Candidate: Vote for me, my opponent sucks!
R: What about Gay Rights?
C: Vote for me, my opponent sucks man balls!
R: Do you have any feelings on Global Warming?
C: Vote for me, my opponent slept with his mother!
R: How do you think we can end the War on Terror?
C: Vote for me, my opponent is a floppy dick!
R: Any final thoughts?
C: Vote for me, my opponent will kill all you love!
R:  Well, you seem very qualified.
EE (hats
2008-03-18 12:42:12
Ender2309
has joined the GOP
+470|6834|USA
guys, obama's pastor was pretty much just a jumping off point. the meat of the post was concerning voters.
2008-03-18 12:50:14
KEN-JENNINGS
I am all that is MOD!
+2,979|6895|949

Stingray24 wrote:

Newsflash ... Obama had this man as an adviser to his campaign.  Doesn't agree with him huh?  Obama has supposedly been a member at the man's church for over 20 years.  If he disagrees with him enough to disown his views in front of the nation, why continue to attend there and have him as a campaign advisor?  He told the nation he disagrees with this man out of political necessity, nothing more.
Obama has him as a SPIRITUAL advisor, not a campaign advisor.  Listen to his speech this morning, I'm certain Obama himself clarified his position regarding Pastor Wright.

He told the nation he disagrees with many of his messages ("profoundly").  He told the nation this because the (liberal LOL) media is taking him to task for Wright's speeches.  Can't attack the political issues?  Attack his character for keeping company with someone with radical views.
2008-03-18 12:53:10
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6864|132 and Bush

D6717C wrote:

Stingray24 wrote:

Newsflash ... Obama had this man as an adviser to his campaign.  Doesn't agree with him huh?  Obama has supposedly been a member at the man's church for over 20 years.  If he disagrees with him enough to disown his views in front of the nation, why continue to attend there and have him as a campaign advisor?  He told the nation he disagrees with this man out of political necessity, nothing more.
Exactly. Now Obama is trying to do some damage control by giving a B.S. speech to cover his ass.
Newsflash, he wasn't his political adviser. He attended the church to listen to the word of god. Not to talk about cab drivers picking up Hillary Clinton. Is that really difficult to understand?

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

the only people this issue will effect are the ones that wouldnt vote for him in the first place.
It is extremely likely they didn't even listen to Obama's speech today. Aside from being spoon fed the occasional out of context spin from a gop schill talking point.

IRONCHEF wrote:

Source for Obama's "previous" pastor as a campaign advisor?
Specualtion is the source for the agenda driven.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
2008-03-18 14:03:57
topal63
. . .
+533|6981

KEN-JENNINGS wrote:

Stingray24 wrote:

Newsflash ... Obama had this man as an adviser to his campaign.  Doesn't agree with him huh?  Obama has supposedly been a member at the man's church for over 20 years.  If he disagrees with him enough to disown his views in front of the nation, why continue to attend there and have him as a campaign advisor?  He told the nation he disagrees with this man out of political necessity, nothing more.
Obama has him as a SPIRITUAL advisor, not a campaign advisor.  Listen to his speech this morning, I'm certain Obama himself clarified his position regarding Pastor Wright.

He told the nation he disagrees with many of his messages ("profoundly").  He told the nation this because the (liberal LOL) media is taking him to task for Wright's speeches.  Can't attack the political issues?  Attack his character for keeping company with someone with radical views.
There's a bit of irony here... no?

A few people on this (and other forums) kept posting "David Duke likes/supports Ron Paul," and the like, before he dropped out... now Obama keeps company with a racist and those same people - decry "no biggie." I just think it's kind of funny.
2008-03-18 14:06:00
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6864|132 and Bush

topal63 wrote:

KEN-JENNINGS wrote:

Stingray24 wrote:

Newsflash ... Obama had this man as an adviser to his campaign.  Doesn't agree with him huh?  Obama has supposedly been a member at the man's church for over 20 years.  If he disagrees with him enough to disown his views in front of the nation, why continue to attend there and have him as a campaign advisor?  He told the nation he disagrees with this man out of political necessity, nothing more.
Obama has him as a SPIRITUAL advisor, not a campaign advisor.  Listen to his speech this morning, I'm certain Obama himself clarified his position regarding Pastor Wright.

He told the nation he disagrees with many of his messages ("profoundly").  He told the nation this because the (liberal LOL) media is taking him to task for Wright's speeches.  Can't attack the political issues?  Attack his character for keeping company with someone with radical views.
There's a bit of irony here... no?

A few people on this (and other forums) kept posting "David Duke likes/supports Ron Paul," and the like, before he dropped out... now Obama keeps company with a racist and those same people - decry "no biggie." I just think it's kind of funny.
Obama's pastor wasn't writing letters in Obama's name for twenty years. See the difference?
Xbone Stormsurgezz
2008-03-18 14:08:38
GunSlinger OIF II
Banned.
+1,860|6907

topal63 wrote:

KEN-JENNINGS wrote:

Stingray24 wrote:

Newsflash ... Obama had this man as an adviser to his campaign.  Doesn't agree with him huh?  Obama has supposedly been a member at the man's church for over 20 years.  If he disagrees with him enough to disown his views in front of the nation, why continue to attend there and have him as a campaign advisor?  He told the nation he disagrees with this man out of political necessity, nothing more.
Obama has him as a SPIRITUAL advisor, not a campaign advisor.  Listen to his speech this morning, I'm certain Obama himself clarified his position regarding Pastor Wright.

He told the nation he disagrees with many of his messages ("profoundly").  He told the nation this because the (liberal LOL) media is taking him to task for Wright's speeches.  Can't attack the political issues?  Attack his character for keeping company with someone with radical views.
There's a bit of irony here... no?

A few people on this (and other forums) kept posting "David Duke likes/supports Ron Paul," and the like, before he dropped out... now Obama keeps company with a racist and those same people - decry "no biggie." I just think it's kind of funny.
the irony I see is the fact that these same people that are so against Obama's racist pastor said nothing to criticize Ron Paul or the goons he attracts/works with/accepts money from.
2008-03-18 14:48:02
topal63
. . .
+533|6981

Kmarion wrote:

topal63 wrote:

KEN-JENNINGS wrote:


Obama has him as a SPIRITUAL advisor, not a campaign advisor.  Listen to his speech this morning, I'm certain Obama himself clarified his position regarding Pastor Wright.

He told the nation he disagrees with many of his messages ("profoundly").  He told the nation this because the (liberal LOL) media is taking him to task for Wright's speeches.  Can't attack the political issues?  Attack his character for keeping company with someone with radical views.
There's a bit of irony here... no?

A few people on this (and other forums) kept posting "David Duke likes/supports Ron Paul," and the like, before he dropped out... now Obama keeps company with a racist and those same people - decry "no biggie." I just think it's kind of funny.
Obama's pastor wasn't writing letters in Obama's name for twenty years. See the difference?
And David Duke was? LOL (I don't know of any such ghost writer nonsense, and would seriously doubt the truth of any web-link nonsense you could come up with to support that nonsense, if you bothered to do so).

I am not sure what it is you think you're doing? Explaining something to me? Making the road map to reality clearer for me (/sarcasm). Telling me there are always differences? So what... I wasn't considering the differences I was considering what elements are, in terms of blind-support/blind spots, (might be) somewhat similar; ironic.

David Dukes relationship with Ron Paul is/was non-existent for all I can tell. That's just a kook that likes someone kinda kooky.
Obama on the other hand has this guy as a spiritual adviser... this is a real relationship and it's with a racist. (See the difference? /sarcasm)

Ron Paul - I never really identified with him,
Obama likewise... btw this pastor revelation is meaningless to me.

Side note: Interestingly this almost made me think Double "D," might be human?
According to Wikipedia, “It is alleged that using the pseudonym Dorothy Vanderbilt, Duke published a self-help book for women, titled Finders-Keepers, in 1976. The publication gives advice to women regarding vaginal exercises, fellatio, analingus, and anal sex. The manual is no longer in print and hard to find; however, the Times-Picayune, a New Orleans newspaper, managed to find a copy and trace the trail of its proceeds to the original author via the publisher. Duke compiled information from various women’s self-help magazines, and published the book to raise money for his activities, though the book turned out to be a flop.
2008-03-18 15:04:06
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|6864|132 and Bush

topal63 wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

topal63 wrote:

There's a bit of irony here... no?

A few people on this (and other forums) kept posting "David Duke likes/supports Ron Paul," and the like, before he dropped out... now Obama keeps company with a racist and those same people - decry "no biggie." I just think it's kind of funny.
Obama's pastor wasn't writing letters in Obama's name for twenty years. See the difference?
And David Duke was? LOL (I don't know of any such ghost writer nonsense, and would seriously doubt the truth of any web-link nonsense you could come up with to support that nonsense, if you bothered to do so).

I am not sure what it is you think you're doing? Explaining something to me? Making the road map to reality clearer for me (/sarcasm). Telling me there are always differences? So what... I wasn't considering the differences I was considering what elements are, in terms of blind-support/blind spots, (might be) somewhat similar; ironic.

David Dukes relationship with Ron Paul is/was non-existent for all I can tell. That's just a kook that likes someone kinda kooky.
Obama on the other hand has this guy as a spiritual adviser... this is a real relationship and it's with a racist. (See the difference? /sarcasm)

Ron Paul - I never really identified with him,
Obama likewise... btw this pastor revelation is meaningless to me.

Side note: Interestingly this almost made me think Double "D," might be human?
According to Wikipedia, “It is alleged that using the pseudonym Dorothy Vanderbilt, Duke published a self-help book for women, titled Finders-Keepers, in 1976. The publication gives advice to women regarding vaginal exercises, fellatio, analingus, and anal sex. The manual is no longer in print and hard to find; however, the Times-Picayune, a New Orleans newspaper, managed to find a copy and trace the trail of its proceeds to the original author via the publisher. Duke compiled information from various women’s self-help magazines, and published the book to raise money for his activities, though the book turned out to be a flop.
Obviously I was referencing the letters. That was where I had the real problem. The David Duke thing was just cooberating evidence. Find me racist remarks written literally in Obama's name for a lengthy period of time and maybe I'll consider the remarks from another person as a reflection of his character.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
2008-03-18 15:22:03
konfusion
mostly afk
+480|6813|CH/BR - in UK

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

the only people this issue will effect are the ones that wouldnt vote for him in the first place.

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

I think if Obama's pastor's words really change your opinion on Obama, youre an idiot.
Agreed on both counts.

People love a bit of dirt on the candidate they're not voting for so they can go "See? I told you mine's better than yours."

-konfusion
2008-03-19 03:49:19
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6914|USA

Ender2309 wrote:

dammit. its this kind of shit that makes me want to return to a full electoral college. hey, great! obama's pastor said some stuff that people don't like! well, thats great. don't vote for the pastor then. but wait! he's not running. so basically he's just an angry guy with a harsh point of view that happens to be the spiritual leader for somebody running for president. thats great. i don't know about you, but my pastor's points of view are not my own.

why do americans, and really people in general, love to shit bricks every time somebody even remotely connected to a candidate does something "wrong?" if obama's cousin's best friend's uncle who met obama once had a thing against mexicans would we weigh that? no! so why his pastor? what is so special about something that this man said? why must his private life dictate his political one? look at clinton! yeah, he had a fucked up personal life, but nobody can deny he was a pretty damn good president. yeah, he shafted the military a little bit, but nobody's perfect and we don't really need a large standing army anymore now that the cold war is over.

i'm so sick and tired of the nature of the times voters, the party allegiance voters, and the no content voters. VOTE FOR ISSUE STANCES!

if you hate absolutely everything McCain stands for, don't vote for him! what does it matter that you're a registered republican? I am too, but i'll take Obama over McCain over Clinton.

the reason the world is so fucked up is because of the stupidity of the masses, especially in america. our political system is far too tangled for corrupt politicians to do major damage.

/rant.
........and I am quite sure you would be so understanding if Hillary's preacher made racial comments about blacks, and Hillary supported it by staying a member of this "church".
2008-03-19 04:05:55
jsnipy
...
+3,277|6785|...

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

I think if Obama's pastor's words really change your opinion on Obama, youre an idiot.
QFT
2008-03-19 04:20:34
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6914|USA

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

topal63 wrote:

KEN-JENNINGS wrote:


Obama has him as a SPIRITUAL advisor, not a campaign advisor.  Listen to his speech this morning, I'm certain Obama himself clarified his position regarding Pastor Wright.

He told the nation he disagrees with many of his messages ("profoundly").  He told the nation this because the (liberal LOL) media is taking him to task for Wright's speeches.  Can't attack the political issues?  Attack his character for keeping company with someone with radical views.
There's a bit of irony here... no?

A few people on this (and other forums) kept posting "David Duke likes/supports Ron Paul," and the like, before he dropped out... now Obama keeps company with a racist and those same people - decry "no biggie." I just think it's kind of funny.
the irony I see is the fact that these same people that are so against Obama's racist pastor said nothing to criticize Ron Paul or the goons he attracts/works with/accepts money from.
1. Ron Paul has no chance for the presidency of the US.

2. David Duke was ostracized for his white supremest background, of which I am sure you had no tolerance, and just wanted to stick with the issues. Nope? well then we have yet another double standard. What a shock
2008-03-19 04:24:47
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|7034|PNW

Obama has a bit more than a passing acquaintanceship with his pastor, but he could be best buddies with the ghost of Stalin and the changelings with holes in their souls would still vote for him.
2008-03-19 04:25:17
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6914|USA

konfusion wrote:

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

the only people this issue will effect are the ones that wouldnt vote for him in the first place.

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

I think if Obama's pastor's words really change your opinion on Obama, youre an idiot.
Agreed on both counts.

People love a bit of dirt on the candidate they're not voting for so they can go "See? I told you mine's better than yours."

-konfusion
Am I not allowed to be concerned about the prospects of him being voted for, for no other reason than because he is black and not because of the issues?.

Are the people who vote for him because he is black racist? You would consider me a racist for voting for McCain because he is white, but people who vote for Obama because he is black is a non-issue? I don't think so.
2008-03-19 04:32:49
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6914|USA
An Observation:

I find it funny that for the first time in US history a candidates private life and his private associations is off limits and irrelevant, and to mention it makes you a racist. Never before.
2008-03-19 04:33:45
..teddy..jimmy
Member
+1,393|6912
who's obama?
2008-03-19 04:36:56
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|7034|PNW

..teddy..jimmy wrote:

who's obama?
You're a racist.
2008-03-19 04:41:43
..teddy..jimmy
Member
+1,393|6912

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

..teddy..jimmy wrote:

who's obama?
You're a racist.
nigga pls
2008-03-19 05:14:08
13rin
Member
+977|6742

Ender2309 wrote:

dammit. its this kind of shit that makes me want to return to a full electoral college. hey, great! obama's pastor said some stuff that people don't like! well, thats great. don't vote for the pastor then. but wait! he's not running. so basically he's just an angry guy with a harsh point of view that happens to be the spiritual leader for somebody running for president. thats great. i don't know about you, but my pastor's points of view are not my own.

why do americans, and really people in general, love to shit bricks every time somebody even remotely connected to a candidate does something "wrong?" if obama's cousin's best friend's uncle who met obama once had a thing against mexicans would we weigh that? no! so why his pastor? what is so special about something that this man said? why must his private life dictate his political one? look at clinton! yeah, he had a fucked up personal life, but nobody can deny he was a pretty damn good president. yeah, he shafted the military a little bit, but nobody's perfect and we don't really need a large standing army anymore now that the cold war is over.

i'm so sick and tired of the nature of the times voters, the party allegiance voters, and the no content voters. VOTE FOR ISSUE STANCES!

if you hate absolutely everything McCain stands for, don't vote for him! what does it matter that you're a registered republican? I am too, but i'll take Obama over McCain over Clinton.

the reason the world is so fucked up is because of the stupidity of the masses, especially in america. our political system is far too tangled for corrupt politicians to do major damage.

/rant.
Yea fuck that.... Obama has been going there for 20 YEARS.  Now all of a sudden Obama decides to break ties?  Yea.  Bullshit.  Why now does Obo now all of a sudden care that his pastor a racist?  I know....  Obama's a fucking racist too (closeted).  At least his pastor has the balls to come out and trash the "USKKKofA".  Oh, pray tell what is Obama saying?  What are his real policies?  Does any one know.  Yea, he's got the answers, but they are all hollow. 

PS.  Clinton was a boob and bad president too.
I stood in line for four hours. They better give me a Wal-Mart gift card, or something.  - Rodney Booker, Job Fair attendee.
2008-03-19 07:23:00
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6674|'Murka

True, Obama's pastor is not Obama.

This isn't about what Obama says. It's about Obama's judgement. Will he be loyal to a fault just like GWB? Will he keep people on in his administration who are divisive enough to cause the administration to work at cross purposes?

He was aware of what his pastor was saying. He was aware of how vitriolic his pastor's sermons could be (and were). Yet he chose to stay in that environment, supporting that church, and by default, Rev Wright. By supporting that pastor, he supported the message being relayed...good, bad or indifferent. Now that his pastor's views and speeches have come to light, he decides to "distance himself" and say he didn't agree with him.

That's all well and good, but it exposes him as just another pandering politician. If he had truly felt the way he says, he would have "distanced himself" from that pastor after the first or second instance of such hateful speech. Instead, he only does it after it comes to light.

How's that for "change"? He's no different than any other politician.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
2008-03-19 09:22:29
konfusion
mostly afk
+480|6813|CH/BR - in UK

lowing wrote:

Am I not allowed to be concerned about the prospects of him being voted for, for no other reason than because he is black and not because of the issues?.

Are the people who vote for him because he is black racist? You would consider me a racist for voting for McCain because he is white, but people who vote for Obama because he is black is a non-issue? I don't think so.
What you just said has nothing to do with what I just said. You're looking for the race thread. This is the pastor and "dirt-on-a-candidate" thread. I think it's stupid and childish to find dumb sensationalist news stories to gloat about other candidates' downfalls. People always ignore the stories about their own candidates... And the people who fall for this shit don't deserve to vote.

-konfusion
2008-03-19 09:49:37
Lotta_Drool
Spit
+350|6446|Ireland

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

I think if Obama's pastor's words really change your opinion on Obama, youre an idiot.
Bush's Pastor that is one of his advisors preaches that blacky invented HIV and we should ship them all back to Africa in a row boat.  I voted for Bush anyway because Bush is not his Pastor, right.  I mean hell, it tells me nothing when someones spiritual advisor is a racist bigot.

GS - You are a racist.
2008-03-19 11:32:24
GunSlinger OIF II
Banned.
+1,860|6907

lowing wrote:

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

topal63 wrote:


There's a bit of irony here... no?

A few people on this (and other forums) kept posting "David Duke likes/supports Ron Paul," and the like, before he dropped out... now Obama keeps company with a racist and those same people - decry "no biggie." I just think it's kind of funny.
the irony I see is the fact that these same people that are so against Obama's racist pastor said nothing to criticize Ron Paul or the goons he attracts/works with/accepts money from.
1. Ron Paul has no chance for the presidency of the US.

2. David Duke was ostracized for his white supremest background, of which I am sure you had no tolerance, and just wanted to stick with the issues. Nope? well then we have yet another double standard. What a shock
the only double standard I see is the one that says the people that dont like Obama because of his pastors remarks have no problem with the Ron Paul's campaign attracting/working with/accepting money from white racist groups/people.  The fact that he has no chance has nothing to do with the point I thought I made pretty clear.  You see double standards...so do I.

 

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