I am not generalizing.............everything I said is a fact.CameronPoe wrote:
Explain exactly how you are not generalising...lowing wrote:
as paranoid
as generalizing
a racist
ignorant
a hate monger
a bigot
and of course last but certainly not least...................................a nazi.........
stingray, catbox, david p. fededsteve, scootch over let the man sit........ welcome to the club
Explain exactly how you are not bigoted... (don't make me dredge up your quotes)
You must have a guilty conscience.........I didn't call you a groupie. lolJahManRed wrote:
Lowing, I am no ones groupie............I have my own opinions. You are complaining about labeling, while you throw labels around yourself. Practice what you preach. And for the record I am no lover of the UK, they occupy my country and I come from a long line of nationalists who have been very active against the occupation.lowing wrote:
yup......Cam and his groupies have said all is well.....................sooooooooo you are hereby labeled:
as paranoid
as generalizing
a racist
ignorant
a hate monger
a bigot
and of course last but certainly not least...................................a nazi.........
stingray, catbox, david p. fededsteve, scootch over let the man sit........ welcome to the club
When the kind of Phobia which is being perpetuated towards the Muslim people was aimed at my people 30 years ago by the British, the number of Irish 'terrorists' multiplied and turned a ragtag, unorganised, dying organisation into the worlds most efficient terrorist organisation ever. I see these same mistakes being repeated and I have genuine concerns about this direction.
You people are on the outside looking in. Comment on UK foreign policies and going on in the wider world were we are all observing on a level playing field. We level headed individuals make up our own opinion about our own country, we refuse to take what the right or left wing media says as gospel, never mind people who have probably never set foot on UK soil.
Your just frustrated that we refuse to be put in the typical Democrat/Republican molds that you guys all seam to have to fit into.
No one said that?/!!........yer kiddin' right?? I have been called and accused of everything from being paranoid to being a Nazi in regards to Islamic issues in Europe.Bertster7 wrote:
No one said that.lowing wrote:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/ho … 80522.htmlFatherTed wrote:
This is a general statement:
To everyone outside of GB:
You may read Fox, MSNBC, Sky etc, and think there is a radical muslim problem.
Real life however, is more accurate than the aforementioned news (lol) services.
How 'bout UK news?.,.......................yeah, there is no problems in England regarding Islam.
No problems in England with regards to Sharia courts, which that article is not related to. There are issues of religious based violence towards women amongst numerous religious communities in the UK, Sikhs and Hindus cause about as many problems on that front as Muslims though. It's not an "Islam Problem", it's an immigrant problem which has been demonstrated to recede from generation to generation. The problem is the continued rate of immigration from vastly differing cultures, something which the EU is placing more and more, much needed, stringent restrictions on. The more recent immigrants are typically the problem - their children become Anglicised sufficiently for this not to be a long term issue if immigration gets sorted out.
Maybe the UK shouldn't let so many Muslims into their country. Plenty of people want to move to the First World. The British should be more selective in who they let in.Pubic wrote:
If they use those "courts" as a mechanism to resolve civil issues then theres not really a lot that can be done about it. Criminal are a different matter entirely, IF they come to the attention of the British legal system.
Wasn't there a survey taken within a year or so of now, which found out that 1 in 5 UK muslims wanted sharia law in the UK? Immigration isn't generally allowed with the understanding that the immigrants will try and erode/restrict the freedoms that their receiving nation gives to all of it's citizens. A sizeable chunk of UK muslims want sharia...given present-day examples of countries with sharia law and in particular the UK "honour" killings, I think that a negative reaction to the suggestion of sharia courts in the UK is justified.
When in rome, do as the romans do?
It's difficult to make an assumption about the tolerance of Islam as taught in the Qu'ran. It is an ambiguous argument, without clear definitions. Today's Islamic radicalism does give a certain portrayal to a violent religion that will not tolerate other religions, but that opinion contrasts with history. Likely the most prominent example is Andalusian Spain of Islamic rule. Following the 711 invasion of Iberia by Islamic armies, religious freedom was completely tolerated on the peninsula, as was custom for all areas of Muslim conquest. I name Spain as the most significant, as it became a region where existed Islam, Christianity, and Judaism in near harmony. In fact, Jews facilitated and significantly aided the Islamic invasion. I remember reading of one incident in the eighth century in Cordoba, the Islamic capital of Andalusia, where after decades of Muslims and Christians praying and worshiping in the same Christian church (as Islam commanded respect for fellow 'People of the Book'), the church was removed to create an Islamic mosque. Immediately, the Christian community was reimbursed fully so as to build a new church. Christianity of the Dark Ages was severely more intolerant than Islam, especially when it came to other religions.lowing wrote:
3. Islam as taught in the Koran is a violent and intolerant religion.
interpreted as just retribution to those that betrayed him.Turquoise wrote:
What about Muhammad's handling of the Qurayza Jewish tribe? That wasn't exactly tolerant....
It's not that the majority of Muslims are pulling this shit. The problem is that too many well-intended Europeans aren't calling out the ultraconservative Muslims for their bullshit. If Europeans and moderate Muslims would just tell the conservative Muslims to fuck off, this wouldn't even be much of a problem.David.P wrote:
Oh fuck it! I'm tired of this pc bullshit regarding Islam! It is not nor has ever been a religion of peace! Right now the things its doing in europe are only to bring about another caliphate, And gullible westerners ashamed of the actions of their ancestors, Are helping it right along because they dont wanna be seen as racist's, When they infact are repeating the same steps that led to ww2!
No. I have a better idea. Which i wont say because of the brutality and gruesomeness of it will make half the people here vomit uncontrollably.GunSlinger OIF II wrote:
put muslims in concentration camps?
Last edited by David.P (2008-02-12 20:17:57)
I didn't tell you that. Note the underlined section above.lowing wrote:
No one said that?/!!........yer kiddin' right?? I have been called and accused of everything from being paranoid to being a Nazi in regards to Islamic issues in Europe.Bertster7 wrote:
No one said that.lowing wrote:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/ho … 80522.html
How 'bout UK news?.,.......................yeah, there is no problems in England regarding Islam.
No problems in England with regards to Sharia courts, which that article is not related to. There are issues of religious based violence towards women amongst numerous religious communities in the UK, Sikhs and Hindus cause about as many problems on that front as Muslims though. It's not an "Islam Problem", it's an immigrant problem which has been demonstrated to recede from generation to generation. The problem is the continued rate of immigration from vastly differing cultures, something which the EU is placing more and more, much needed, stringent restrictions on. The more recent immigrants are typically the problem - their children become Anglicised sufficiently for this not to be a long term issue if immigration gets sorted out.
Please do not try and tell me that I have NOT been told that Islam in Europe is a NON-ISSUE and that all of this is just media hype and generalizing.
well, from what I can tell, we are not "taking it" any worse than you. I guess we're all defensive about the internal affairs of our respective nations.FEOS wrote:
There. I believe others have said something similar in the past regarding UK/EU interest in US domestic policy...JahManRed wrote:
You people are on the outside looking in. Comment on UK US foreign policies and going on in the wider world were we are all observing on a level playing field. We level headed individuals make up our own opinion about our own country, we refuse to take what the right or left wing media says as gospel, never mind people who have probably never set foot on UK US soil.
If you dish it out (not YOU necessarily, but EU forum members in general), then you need to take it.
well, let us hear it. Because all I have heard from you, lowing, FEOS and the like so far is complaining and bickering.David.P wrote:
No. I have a better idea. Which i wont say because of the brutality and gruesomeness of it will make half the people here vomit uncontrollably.GunSlinger OIF II wrote:
put muslims in concentration camps?
EDIT: And no no mass genocide this time.
Given that it expressly contravenes many laws of the Q'uran I don't exactly regard it as the most wholesomely Islamic activity in the world. Don't make me reprint for the 4th time.lowing wrote:
1. Islamic terrorism is just that Islamic terrorism
You would think that but the contrary has been demonstrated in the likes of Turkey. I do agree there are some fundamental differences however.lowing wrote:
2. Islam as it is taught in the Koran does not mesh with the values and morals we have esptablished in the west.
Islam as it is taught in Saudi Arabia is a far far cry from how it is taught in the US, UK, France, Turkey, Jordan, Morocco, etc. In the same way Jews aren't taught to adhere to the less savoury elements of the Torah, most Muslims aren't taught to follow the less savoury elements of the Q'uran.lowing wrote:
3. Islam as taught in the Koran is a violent and intolerant religion.
That is true. But I'm not a fan of further immigration from the Islamic world and never contended that I was, I'm certainly an ardent opponent of illegal immigration. Young British Muslims have demonstrated however that a generation or two in they pretty much forget about Islam and follow western norms.lowing wrote:
4. The greater the Islamic immigration into a country they greater the risk of radicalism in that country.
Last edited by CameronPoe (2008-02-13 00:53:32)
FEOS - no hypocrisy there. I don't care about your internal affairs - your healthcare system, your taxes, your gun laws, any of that bullshit.FEOS wrote:
Wow. The hypocrisy is rampant.
Not directed at you specifically, Cam.CameronPoe wrote:
FEOS - no hypocrisy there. I don't care about your internal affairs - your healthcare system, your taxes, your gun laws, any of that bullshit.FEOS wrote:
Wow. The hypocrisy is rampant.