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2008-02-06 03:33:46
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6777|'Murka

MAGUIRE93 wrote:

David.P wrote:

Spetsnaz > SAS > Seals > Everything else.
SFOD-D >SEALS > SAS > Stsnaz > Everything else.
SAS is pretty kick ass
but NUTHING even comes close to Delta Operators
Delta was formed on the SAS model.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
2008-02-06 05:56:43
M.O.A.B
'Light 'em up!'
+1,220|6589|Escea

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

one of the silliest things people do is compare special forces.   Honestly,  unless any of us have served in SF, I dont think any of us could accurately say which one is best.  I write this, my entire life being a Green Beret fan boy.  But I have mad respect for all the worlds special services.
Same I don't believe there is one ultimate Special Forces group, every one of them has their strong points. I've always had an interest in GSG-9 and GIGN. Delta Force from what I've read uses very similar training methods of the SAS as that's what it was based upon.
2008-02-06 07:13:47
The_Guardsman
Tally Ho!!
+81|7111|I'm not sure.... Buts its dark
For Thatcher to give the go ahead for this operation takes big bollocks! For if it went wrong then she might not have lasted the years she did.
Unfortunatly because of Operation Nimrod its pushed the Regiment straight into the lime light and thats bad. If it were'nt for those lot the vast majority of people would not have heard of the SAS. So they have problems trying to operate and it does'nt help with the press all over them like a tramp on chips. So they can't get away with some of the stuff they had done before. There was a program on the other night where certain bods from the regiment did some black ops stuff. They sort of left the regiment to help out. Unfortunatly l can't remember much from the program... I've been to sleep since then
Someone mentioned the bloke that got tangled in his line and got burnt. He got the Military Medal for that. Because he cracked straight on after being cut down.

Someone mentioned that a film was'nt made about it. No there wasn't how ever there was one made along the lines called Who Dares Wins staring Lewis Collins!
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=vUDe6saJFmM   Best bit of the film!

Oh and to do abit of pissing on other Special Forces, as l belive this is where its going. Spetsnaz are not that fantastic. Anyone remember the hostage situation that went horribly wrong? Also l don't really rate the yanks, they've had alot of fuck ups. All the gear and no idea at times!
Mossad is bloody good how ever.

I spoke to a Nam vet when l was over in the states with my Company and spoke to him. He said that he bumped into some of the SAS blokes and that they did some real damage out there!
Oh and 68 Genral Service medals where issued to British Troops for South East Asia.
2008-02-06 10:31:15
Switch
Knee Deep In Clunge
+489|6830|Tyne & Wear, England
Just wondering if any of you older guys remember this happening?  Where were you at the time, and what was it like during the week all of this happened?
Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known.
2008-02-08 05:04:20
The_Guardsman
Tally Ho!!
+81|7111|I'm not sure.... Buts its dark
Just watched the documentary and its a bloody good one! The part which is so called controversial, where the chaps in black slotted 2 bods in one of the rooms. My thought is this. Stuff them, they had plenty of chances to give up and they did'nt and then they slotted an innocent individual. As far as l'm concerned they got what they got. Oh and for the price of a few rounds they have saved the British tax payer thousands in Jail bills!
2008-02-08 06:56:30
Bernadictus
Moderator
+1,055|7103

MAGUIRE93, David.P, FEOS.

Stop the pissing contest indeed. Everything below this post about who's force is better gets the vacation!

Documentary was kick ass.
2008-02-08 06:59:17
Parker
isteal
+1,452|6761|The Gem Saloon
just another reason why Charlie Beckwith modeled Delta after the Special Air Service.........
2008-02-08 08:35:05
FEOS
Bellicose Yankee Air Pirate
+1,182|6777|'Murka

Bernadictus wrote:

MAGUIRE93, David.P, FEOS.

Stop the pissing contest indeed. Everything below this post about who's force is better gets the vacation!

Documentary was kick ass.
What pissing contest have I participated in? All I said was that Delta was built on the SAS model, which is merely an objective fact.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
2008-02-08 08:36:36
GunSlinger OIF II
Banned.
+1,860|7010
different roles, different missions. All special operations are above the rest. Even Pakistan's.



not Irans.
2008-02-08 09:18:47
M.O.A.B
'Light 'em up!'
+1,220|6589|Escea

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

different roles, different missions. All special operations are above the rest. Even Pakistan's.



not Irans.
Exactly.

Good example would be that even within idividual Special Ops groups they are split into different roles, (SAS mountain troop for example).
2008-02-08 09:30:38
SEREVENT
MASSIVE G STAR
+605|6474|Birmingham, UK

FatherTed wrote:

Fucking skilled shit.

This is one of the reasons i consider the SAS as the best "Spec Ops" group in the world.
According to training and whatnot, they are.

Anyways, i think they used footage of that in that in that episode of "Ultimate Force".
I might be wrong though.
2008-02-08 09:32:42
jord
Member
+2,382|7044|The North, beyond the wall.

M.O.A.B wrote:

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

different roles, different missions. All special operations are above the rest. Even Pakistan's.



not Irans.
Exactly.

Good example would be that even within idividual Special Ops groups they are split into different roles, (SAS mountain troop for example).
Apart from the lesser known SBS. Arguably they have the advantage of being less known and less followed by media. However they lack resources, funding and only recruit from the Royal marines. They also only use boats, as opposed to Mountain, Para, Boat, Mobile troops of the SAS>
2008-02-08 09:39:08
SEREVENT
MASSIVE G STAR
+605|6474|Birmingham, UK

jord wrote:

M.O.A.B wrote:

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

different roles, different missions. All special operations are above the rest. Even Pakistan's.



not Irans.
Exactly.

Good example would be that even within idividual Special Ops groups they are split into different roles, (SAS mountain troop for example).
Apart from the lesser known SBS. Arguably they have the advantage of being less known and less followed by media. However they lack resources, funding and only recruit from the Royal marines. They also only use boats, as opposed to Mountain, Para, Boat, Mobile troops of the SAS>
Of course, me reading "The Hijack, The protector, The Operative" and the other book by that guy who was in the SBS, i know about them.
2008-02-08 09:51:32
M.O.A.B
'Light 'em up!'
+1,220|6589|Escea

Bf2-GeneralArnott wrote:

jord wrote:

M.O.A.B wrote:


Exactly.

Good example would be that even within idividual Special Ops groups they are split into different roles, (SAS mountain troop for example).
Apart from the lesser known SBS. Arguably they have the advantage of being less known and less followed by media. However they lack resources, funding and only recruit from the Royal marines. They also only use boats, as opposed to Mountain, Para, Boat, Mobile troops of the SAS>
Of course, me reading "The Hijack, The protector, The Operative" and the other book by that guy who was in the SBS, i know about them.
SBS is like the SEAL's (I think) but much less equipped.
2008-02-08 11:41:48
Ghandi767
Member
+17|6989|Hanging in the Balance

M.O.A.B wrote:

Bf2-GeneralArnott wrote:

jord wrote:


Apart from the lesser known SBS. Arguably they have the advantage of being less known and less followed by media. However they lack resources, funding and only recruit from the Royal marines. They also only use boats, as opposed to Mountain, Para, Boat, Mobile troops of the SAS>
Of course, me reading "The Hijack, The protector, The Operative" and the other book by that guy who was in the SBS, i know about them.
SBS is like the SEAL's (I think) but much less equipped.
SEALs, Delta and SAS are really all the same. Elite Counter-Terror/Special Operations Units. Seeing as though none of us have access to the files of their missions, exploits, failures, training, etc. its not possible to determine the best.

WRT Spetnatz, I hope you guys realize Spetnatz isnt a unit, just the Russian Term for "Special Forces".
2008-02-08 14:40:53
M.O.A.B
'Light 'em up!'
+1,220|6589|Escea

Ghandi767 wrote:

M.O.A.B wrote:

Bf2-GeneralArnott wrote:


Of course, me reading "The Hijack, The protector, The Operative" and the other book by that guy who was in the SBS, i know about them.
SBS is like the SEAL's (I think) but much less equipped.
SEALs, Delta and SAS are really all the same. Elite Counter-Terror/Special Operations Units. Seeing as though none of us have access to the files of their missions, exploits, failures, training, etc. its not possible to determine the best.

WRT Spetnatz, I hope you guys realize Spetnatz isnt a unit, just the Russian Term for "Special Forces".
Nah was referring to SEAL's also do operations at sea on ships whatnot, beach landings in wee inflatables, same for SBS. I did know about the Spetznaz though, whatever the actual correct spelling .
2008-02-09 01:26:10
jord
Member
+2,382|7044|The North, beyond the wall.

M.O.A.B wrote:

Ghandi767 wrote:

M.O.A.B wrote:


SBS is like the SEAL's (I think) but much less equipped.
SEALs, Delta and SAS are really all the same. Elite Counter-Terror/Special Operations Units. Seeing as though none of us have access to the files of their missions, exploits, failures, training, etc. its not possible to determine the best.

WRT Spetnatz, I hope you guys realize Spetnatz isnt a unit, just the Russian Term for "Special Forces".
Nah was referring to SEAL's also do operations at sea on ships whatnot, beach landings in wee inflatables, same for SBS. I did know about the Spetznaz though, whatever the actual correct spelling .
There only reason for SBS is they're unheard of. (Which I'm not helping)

Royal Marines and SAS can do beach landings.
2008-02-09 03:19:06
-101-InvaderZim
Member
+42|7210|Waikato, Aotearoa

KILLSWITCH wrote:

11:30, 30th April 1980, London, England

A six-man group of terrorists known as the 'Democratic Revolutionary Movement for the Liberation of Arabistan', take control of the Iranian Embassy in Great Britain, taking twenty-six men and women hostage.  Their motives soon become apparent, they have two demands:  The release of ninety-one of their comrades, being held by the Iranian government for alleged political crimes, and for the autonomy of an oil-rich region in southern Iran known as Khuzestan.

After five tense days of negotiation, between the terrorists and police negotiators, things appeared to be going well and five of the initial twenty-six hostages had been released.  However volatile relationships inside the embassy deteriorated which led to the execution of the first hostage 'Abbas Lavasani'.  Six hours later his body was thrown onto the street.

The knowledge of the execution prompted the then Prime Minister, Margaret Thatcher to go ahead with the SAS assault.  The SAS who had been on standby since the incident begun received their final briefing, and it is widely thought that Thatcher herself gave the SAS direct, and later on, controversial orders as to leave no terrorist alive.  At 19:23 on May 5, four teams, dressed in black armed with MP5's and flashbangs begun Operation Nimrod.

http://i29.tinypic.com/2w2havc.jpg

Eleven minutes later, it was all over.  The SAS escorted all but one of the remaining hostages outside alive, and eliminated all but one of the terrorists.  Fowzi Nejad remains in prison to this day.

OK, I tell you this because I just watched a fascinating BBC documentary accounting these incredible events, and wanted to share it with BF2s.  It would be six years before I was born so I was very sketchy regarding the Embassy siege, but the documentary really brought home what an awesome job these guys did all those years ago.  Sure there were controversies which the documentary covers, but after watching, these guys have my full support, and more to the point my utmost respect.

I know, at about an hour and 20 minutes it's long, but I urge you to find the time to watch the whole thing, and if not start from Part 13 where the 'action' begins.
A movie was made kinda loosely based on it called SAS:The Final Option..... but yeah the SAS (whether its 22SAS, NZSAS or SASR) are definately not the sort you want to fuck with.....

Which reminds me, a friend told me a story about an 18yr old kid almost getting himself killed when he broke into a house that had 4 SAS troopers
drinking piss in the dark. Poor bastard didnt quite know what had hit him when it was all over 4 seconds later...... lolz
2008-02-09 03:27:31
xRBLx
I've got lovely bunch of coconuts!!
+27|6722|England - Kent

KILLSWITCH wrote:

Ollie wrote:

It was before my time, but I've seen documentarys about it. Pretty gripping shit.

Didn't one of the SAS drag one of the hostage takers behind some buildings and execute him? Or am I way off?
This is what I'm talking about when I say controversy.  Presumably because Thatcher told them to leave no terrorist alive, one SAS member preceded to drag a terrorist inside the Embassy (in order to kill him?).  But another member of the SAS stopped him from doing so, because the worlds media was literally watching live.  The documentary details it better, but by the sounds of it this is the documentary you've allready seen.
True.
I have seen this before. What happened one of the terrorists mingles in with the hostages when he was made aware of this he led him back into the building and shot him.
2008-02-09 03:40:00
psH
Banned
+217|6750|Sydney

Commie Killer wrote:

FatherTed wrote:

Spetznaz is just brute force.
Thats the Russian way. The Western countries try to change minds the nice way...and usually fail. The Russians just go kill people and problem solved.
exactly. it gets the job done.
2008-02-10 12:34:27
The_Guardsman
Tally Ho!!
+81|7111|I'm not sure.... Buts its dark

Ashlite wrote:

Commie Killer wrote:

FatherTed wrote:

Spetznaz is just brute force.
Thats the Russian way. The Western countries try to change minds the nice way...and usually fail. The Russians just go kill people and problem solved.
exactly. it gets the job done.
Yes and they dont really do a good job of it ethier!
Taken from Wiki reference Beslan school. Not good. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beslan_sch … age_crisis


Official fatalities
Hostages 334
Police and civilians 8
Emergency workers 2
Special forces 11+
Hostage-takers 31
Total 386+
-
Official wounded
Special forces 55
Other 728
Total 783

At the end of the day as long as no one was being killed then they could keep trying to talk them out and hope for a happy ending with no lose of life. As soon as they slotted someone then the chaps in black bimble through the window and end the siuation.
2008-02-10 12:41:01
The_Guardsman
Tally Ho!!
+81|7111|I'm not sure.... Buts its dark

-101-InvaderZim wrote:

A movie was made kinda loosely based on it called SAS:The Final Option..... but yeah the SAS (whether its 22SAS, NZSAS or SASR) are definately not the sort you want to fuck with.....

Which reminds me, a friend told me a story about an 18yr old kid almost getting himself killed when he broke into a house that had 4 SAS troopers
drinking piss in the dark. Poor bastard didnt quite know what had hit him when it was all over 4 seconds later...... lolz
The film was renamed Who Dares Wins.... Best bit of the film



Oh good always makes me laugh when idiots do something stupid and get there come upence! Another thing that makes me laugh is lunatics that happy slap people and end up getting a shoeing from the bloke! Always good for morale!
2008-02-10 12:45:42
IrishGrimReaper
Field Marshal | o |
+142|7088|Ireland | Monaghan

I say Irish Army Ranger bust them up

I can't remember exactly, but was there not a scandal on that incident that most of the terrorists surrendered and the SaS shot them execution style anyway? not that I probably wouldn't do the same.

And no I'm not talking about a certain mission in COD4...


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_army_rangers

Last edited by IrishGrimReaper (2008-02-10 12:53:31)

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2008-02-10 12:48:04
137twozerosniper
Member
+57|6931|UK
SBS>SAS>Paras>Marines

trainning to be a para atm
2008-02-10 12:53:31
The_Guardsman
Tally Ho!!
+81|7111|I'm not sure.... Buts its dark

IrishGrimReaper wrote:

I say Irish Army Ranger bust them up

I can't remember exactly, but was there not a scandal on that incident that most of the terrorists surrendered and the SaS shot them execution style anyway? not that I probably wouldn't do the same.

And no I'm not talking about a certain mission in COD4...
Yep it was mentioned that 2 terrorists throw weapons out of the window, before 2 chaps in black kicked open the door shouted morning fragels and put them against the wall and slotted them. Well at the end of the day, they were given every oppotunite to walk out of the place but decided to shoot an innocent person. Fuck them, they knew what they were getting themself into and besides the SAS saves the tax payers money by slotting them, as we don't have to pay for there time in jail

 

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