http://youtube.com/watch?v=fRZSzdQuOqM& … mp;search=
this whole thing is pretty f*cked up if u ask me.
this whole thing is pretty f*cked up if u ask me.
Also almost as old as Jesus.
You still worked up over it?
You still worked up over it?
Now if all that is true, thats fucked up, but then, if you look at the credits at the end, "conspiracynews.net", kinda makes me wonder.
....
Remember the Maine!
Thats all im saying...cant speak Tagalog though...
Thats all im saying...cant speak Tagalog though...
That clip doesn't make me any more or any less annoyed at Israel ...that's what Israel does: act rashly and heavy-handedly, often with disastrous consequences.
If you believe the conspiracy sites as well as the list of witnesses, LBJ ordered that no fighters assist from the nearby US carrier, saying something to the effect of "I want that ship going to the bottom!". Plausible, and sounds like one of LBJ's classic temper tyrades. The attack failed, the Sauds got OPEC rolling 3 years later, and we got a war in Vietnam instead.
Damn Jews. See............what have I been saying?
I'm onto to you usmarine! It's a classic FOX News tactic ...every time there's a thread about Israel put in a joke comment about hating Jews until eventually the words 'Jew' and 'Israel' become fused in the psyche and attacking one equates to attacking the other!usmarine2005 wrote:
Damn Jews. See............what have I been saying?
...how's that for a conspiracy theory?
I ain't that smart cupcake.Braddock wrote:
I'm onto to you usmarine! It's a classic FOX News tactic ...every time there's a thread about Israel put in a joke comment about hating Jews until eventually the words 'Jew' and 'Israel' become fused in the psyche and attacking one equates to attacking the other!usmarine2005 wrote:
Damn Jews. See............what have I been saying?
...how's that for a conspiracy theory?
watch this one its alot better and talks to almost everyone that was involvedCommie Killer wrote:
Now if all that is true, thats fucked up, but then, if you look at the credits at the end, "conspiracynews.net", kinda makes me wonder.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid … 0992512471
OLD.ScOrPiOn1189 wrote:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=fRZSzdQuOqM&mode=related&search=
this whole thing is pretty f*cked up if u ask me.
Not to mention, it started off with a reference to Operation Northwoods.
Do some of your own research. Don't blindly accept what youtube tells you. Good Lord. One of these days, I'm going to make a video that proves, with no evidence whatsoever, the earth is the center of the universe. And put it on youtube. And what makes me sick is that there are people who are gullible enough to believe it. Hell, if I blame it on Bush, I might have a new religion.
If i'm not mistaken that took place when the hills were young, and all you forum oldies were but young tykes
too bad i've forgotten most of the information about that incident, i'd have to look it up against to remember everything
too bad i've forgotten most of the information about that incident, i'd have to look it up against to remember everything
yeah ya gotta hate a country that never plays fair by hitting back harder than the one that hit first. Damn Israel defending itself! Who do they think they are.Braddock wrote:
That clip doesn't make me any more or any less annoyed at Israel ...that's what Israel does: act rashly and heavy-handedly, often with disastrous consequences.
I hear this bullshit all the time, and it kills me. You are actually criticizing Israel for not putting up with terrorism or for defending itself, by hitting back harder when they get hit.
Last edited by lowing (2007-07-30 02:31:35)
Do you really want me to restart our circle argument about how Israel set up camp in the Middle East displacing loads of Palestinians in the first place and how the Jews left that land when the going got tough and shouldn't have expected to waltz back in without 'ruffling a few feathers'.lowing wrote:
yeah ya gotta hate a country that never plays fair by hitting back harder than the one that hit first. Damn Israel defending itself! Who do they think they are.Braddock wrote:
That clip doesn't make me any more or any less annoyed at Israel ...that's what Israel does: act rashly and heavy-handedly, often with disastrous consequences.
...I believe in a two state solution where Palestinians keep their extremists in check and Israel stops acting like a bunch of war criminals with their heavy handed collective punishment. Shall we just leave it at that or shall I warm up for another 18 pager?
GO ahead and warm up because you simply can not defend the Arab nations posture against Israel that lead to the 6 day war and the aftermath that ensued. Israel is on the defensive and always has been since 1948. Its actions has always been in the interest of self preservation and not destroying nations or taking over the ME.Braddock wrote:
Do you really want me to restart our circle argument about how Israel set up camp in the Middle East displacing loads of Palestinians in the first place and how the Jews left that land when the going got tough and shouldn't have expected to waltz back in without 'ruffling a few feathers'.lowing wrote:
yeah ya gotta hate a country that never plays fair by hitting back harder than the one that hit first. Damn Israel defending itself! Who do they think they are.Braddock wrote:
That clip doesn't make me any more or any less annoyed at Israel ...that's what Israel does: act rashly and heavy-handedly, often with disastrous consequences.
...I believe in a two state solution where Palestinians keep their extremists in check and Israel stops acting like a bunch of war criminals with their heavy handed collective punishment. Shall we just leave it at that or shall I warm up for another 18 pager?
I'm not defending extremism and blind hatred of Israel and I'm certainly not defending the murder of innocent civilians by Palestinian militants but if Israel thinks it's justified in its brutal treatment of the Palestinians it is truly deluded and lost in its own extremist Zionist vision. How someone can only view Israel as victims without acknowledging the displaced Palestinians, who were robbed of their homeland, is simply beyond me. If the Mexicans set up camp in Wyoming and began building a vast military power claiming that they had once been resident there prior to the discovery of North America by the Europeans how do you think America would act?lowing wrote:
GO ahead and warm up because you simply can not defend the Arab nations posture against Israel that lead to the 6 day war and the aftermath that ensued. Israel is on the defensive and always has been since 1948. Its actions has always been in the interest of self preservation and not destroying nations or taking over the ME.Braddock wrote:
Do you really want me to restart our circle argument about how Israel set up camp in the Middle East displacing loads of Palestinians in the first place and how the Jews left that land when the going got tough and shouldn't have expected to waltz back in without 'ruffling a few feathers'.lowing wrote:
yeah ya gotta hate a country that never plays fair by hitting back harder than the one that hit first. Damn Israel defending itself! Who do they think they are.
...I believe in a two state solution where Palestinians keep their extremists in check and Israel stops acting like a bunch of war criminals with their heavy handed collective punishment. Shall we just leave it at that or shall I warm up for another 18 pager?
And if Israel thinks brute force will prevail they are wrong, unless they carry out a mass killing of the entire Palestinian race the Palestinians will not cease in their struggle to regain their land. Israel needs to accept that the land belongs to both sides now (as do the Palestinians) and extreme right wing Governments that continue to create de facto plantations and order rocket attacks on residential areas do not help things in the long run. Just look at Northern Ireland, we have finally arrived at something resembling normality after both sides softening their stance.
Last edited by Braddock (2007-07-30 02:59:09)
Hmm.. US ordering an attack against Americans for an excuse to go to war, sound Familiar?
Israel has offered olive branches in the past, only to be answered with rocket attacks and suicide bombers, oh, along with the voting in office a terrorist group well known for its determination to see Israel destroyed. Do you really think the Palestininians are helping them selves by such actions? The fact is all these groups have tried to do, is destroy Israel, and Israel, in its fight for survival, has won the upper hand and intends on keeping it. This somehow pisses you off.Braddock wrote:
I'm not defending extremism and blind hatred of Israel and I'm certainly not defending the murder of innocent civilians by Palestinian militants but if Israel thinks it's justified in its brutal treatment of the Palestinians it is truly deluded and lost in its own extremist Zionist vision. How someone can only view Israel as victims without acknowledging the displaced Palestinians, who were robbed of their homeland, is simply beyond me. If the Mexicans set up camp in Wyoming and began building a vast military power claiming that they had once been resident there prior to the discovery of North America by the Europeans how do you think America would act?lowing wrote:
GO ahead and warm up because you simply can not defend the Arab nations posture against Israel that lead to the 6 day war and the aftermath that ensued. Israel is on the defensive and always has been since 1948. Its actions has always been in the interest of self preservation and not destroying nations or taking over the ME.Braddock wrote:
Do you really want me to restart our circle argument about how Israel set up camp in the Middle East displacing loads of Palestinians in the first place and how the Jews left that land when the going got tough and shouldn't have expected to waltz back in without 'ruffling a few feathers'.
...I believe in a two state solution where Palestinians keep their extremists in check and Israel stops acting like a bunch of war criminals with their heavy handed collective punishment. Shall we just leave it at that or shall I warm up for another 18 pager?
And if Israel thinks brute force will prevail they are wrong, unless they carry out a mass killing of the entire Palestinian race the Palestinians will not cease in their struggle to regain their land. Israel needs to accept that the land belongs to both sides now (as do the Palestinians) and extreme right wing Governments that continue to create de facto plantations and order rocket attacks on residential areas do not help things in the long run. Just look at Northern Ireland, we have finally arrived at something resembling normality after both sides softening their stance.
Bottom line is, it has been shown time and time again, as soon as Israel tries to let its gaurd down they are exploited. Israel says no fucking more, and I don't blame them.
I like debating with you lowing and you're always very factual but you're prone to selectivity with your facts when it comes to Israel. I know the olive branch has been extended ...but by both sides, and both sides suffer at the hands of their extremists. Remember Yigal Amir who killed Rabin after he signed the Oslo accords? And what about the 2002 Saudi peace initiative (a fairly reasonable deal where both sides are concerned)? You say the Palestinians have elected extremists to office but that's what constantly happens in Israel, they go for extreme right wing leaders over moderate ones. I don't find it surprising that Israel have crushed their neighbours in almost every war they've had, given that the US have put them in the position of having one of the most dangerous armies on the planet, I just find it very unfair.lowing wrote:
Israel has offered olive branches in the past, only to be answered with rocket attacks and suicide bombers, oh, along with the voting in office a terrorist group well known for its determination to see Israel destroyed. Do you really think the Palestininians are helping them selves by such actions? The fact is all these groups have tried to do, is destroy Israel, and Israel, in its fight for survival, has won the upper hand and intends on keeping it. This somehow pisses you off.Braddock wrote:
I'm not defending extremism and blind hatred of Israel and I'm certainly not defending the murder of innocent civilians by Palestinian militants but if Israel thinks it's justified in its brutal treatment of the Palestinians it is truly deluded and lost in its own extremist Zionist vision. How someone can only view Israel as victims without acknowledging the displaced Palestinians, who were robbed of their homeland, is simply beyond me. If the Mexicans set up camp in Wyoming and began building a vast military power claiming that they had once been resident there prior to the discovery of North America by the Europeans how do you think America would act?lowing wrote:
GO ahead and warm up because you simply can not defend the Arab nations posture against Israel that lead to the 6 day war and the aftermath that ensued. Israel is on the defensive and always has been since 1948. Its actions has always been in the interest of self preservation and not destroying nations or taking over the ME.
And if Israel thinks brute force will prevail they are wrong, unless they carry out a mass killing of the entire Palestinian race the Palestinians will not cease in their struggle to regain their land. Israel needs to accept that the land belongs to both sides now (as do the Palestinians) and extreme right wing Governments that continue to create de facto plantations and order rocket attacks on residential areas do not help things in the long run. Just look at Northern Ireland, we have finally arrived at something resembling normality after both sides softening their stance.
Bottom line is, it has been shown time and time again, as soon as Israel tries to let its gaurd down they are exploited. Israel says no fucking more, and I don't blame them.
What needs to happen in Israel/Palestine is what has happened in Northern Ireland ...the blame game needs to stop (it's totally pointless) and both sides need to accept that the other is here to stay and REAL leaders have to stand up on both sides and control the grass roots extremists ...and that is NOT easy, it will sadly take many, many years.
I agree but here is the real problem,Braddock wrote:
I like debating with you lowing and you're always very factual but you're prone to selectivity with your facts when it comes to Israel. I know the olive branch has been extended ...but by both sides, and both sides suffer at the hands of their extremists. Remember Yigal Amir who killed Rabin after he signed the Oslo accords? And what about the 2002 Saudi peace initiative (a fairly reasonable deal where both sides are concerned)? You say the Palestinians have elected extremists to office but that's what constantly happens in Israel, they go for extreme right wing leaders over moderate ones. I don't find it surprising that Israel have crushed their neighbours in almost every war they've had, given that the US have put them in the position of having one of the most dangerous armies on the planet, I just find it very unfair.lowing wrote:
Israel has offered olive branches in the past, only to be answered with rocket attacks and suicide bombers, oh, along with the voting in office a terrorist group well known for its determination to see Israel destroyed. Do you really think the Palestininians are helping them selves by such actions? The fact is all these groups have tried to do, is destroy Israel, and Israel, in its fight for survival, has won the upper hand and intends on keeping it. This somehow pisses you off.Braddock wrote:
I'm not defending extremism and blind hatred of Israel and I'm certainly not defending the murder of innocent civilians by Palestinian militants but if Israel thinks it's justified in its brutal treatment of the Palestinians it is truly deluded and lost in its own extremist Zionist vision. How someone can only view Israel as victims without acknowledging the displaced Palestinians, who were robbed of their homeland, is simply beyond me. If the Mexicans set up camp in Wyoming and began building a vast military power claiming that they had once been resident there prior to the discovery of North America by the Europeans how do you think America would act?
And if Israel thinks brute force will prevail they are wrong, unless they carry out a mass killing of the entire Palestinian race the Palestinians will not cease in their struggle to regain their land. Israel needs to accept that the land belongs to both sides now (as do the Palestinians) and extreme right wing Governments that continue to create de facto plantations and order rocket attacks on residential areas do not help things in the long run. Just look at Northern Ireland, we have finally arrived at something resembling normality after both sides softening their stance.
Bottom line is, it has been shown time and time again, as soon as Israel tries to let its gaurd down they are exploited. Israel says no fucking more, and I don't blame them.
What needs to happen in Israel/Palestine is what has happened in Northern Ireland ...the blame game needs to stop (it's totally pointless) and both sides need to accept that the other is here to stay and REAL leaders have to stand up on both sides and control the grass roots extremists ...and that is NOT easy, it will sadly take many, many years.
Israle and Palestine find peace, do you think any of the Arab nations are going to settle for that bullshit?? Hell no!! The only way there will be peace there is by the Arab nations recognizing Israel's right to exist. That will never happen and you will still be there blaming Israel for it.
Egypt have accepted their existence, and them a Country involved in prior conflicts with Israel ...I hold hope that somewhere in the future the other nations can follow suit. US interference in the region and unconditional support of Israel definitely doesn't help the cause. If I were an American I'd REALLY be demanding more for my cash from Israel, they seem to gobble up all your aid money and just about give the minimum back to you in terms of their behaviour.lowing wrote:
I agree but here is the real problem,Braddock wrote:
I like debating with you lowing and you're always very factual but you're prone to selectivity with your facts when it comes to Israel. I know the olive branch has been extended ...but by both sides, and both sides suffer at the hands of their extremists. Remember Yigal Amir who killed Rabin after he signed the Oslo accords? And what about the 2002 Saudi peace initiative (a fairly reasonable deal where both sides are concerned)? You say the Palestinians have elected extremists to office but that's what constantly happens in Israel, they go for extreme right wing leaders over moderate ones. I don't find it surprising that Israel have crushed their neighbours in almost every war they've had, given that the US have put them in the position of having one of the most dangerous armies on the planet, I just find it very unfair.lowing wrote:
Israel has offered olive branches in the past, only to be answered with rocket attacks and suicide bombers, oh, along with the voting in office a terrorist group well known for its determination to see Israel destroyed. Do you really think the Palestininians are helping them selves by such actions? The fact is all these groups have tried to do, is destroy Israel, and Israel, in its fight for survival, has won the upper hand and intends on keeping it. This somehow pisses you off.
Bottom line is, it has been shown time and time again, as soon as Israel tries to let its gaurd down they are exploited. Israel says no fucking more, and I don't blame them.
What needs to happen in Israel/Palestine is what has happened in Northern Ireland ...the blame game needs to stop (it's totally pointless) and both sides need to accept that the other is here to stay and REAL leaders have to stand up on both sides and control the grass roots extremists ...and that is NOT easy, it will sadly take many, many years.
Israle and Palestine find peace, do you think any of the Arab nations are going to settle for that bullshit?? Hell no!! The only way there will be peace there is by the Arab nations recognizing Israel's right to exist. That will never happen and you will still be there blaming Israel for it.
...but hey, it's all okay coz Tony Blair is there to save the day now! lol
You could say the same of the Palestinians in the past. Till they were subjected to a programme of systematic economic deprivement and a prolonged terrorist campaign, culminating in the theft of their land and long term repression of their people. Along with the voting into power of known terrorist leaders well known for their commitment to removing the Palestinian people from the land entirely:lowing wrote:
Israel has offered olive branches in the past, only to be answered with rocket attacks and suicide bombers, oh, along with the voting in office a terrorist group well known for its determination to see Israel destroyed. Do you really think the Palestininians are helping them selves by such actions? The fact is all these groups have tried to do, is destroy Israel, and Israel, in its fight for survival, has won the upper hand and intends on keeping it. This somehow pisses you off.Braddock wrote:
I'm not defending extremism and blind hatred of Israel and I'm certainly not defending the murder of innocent civilians by Palestinian militants but if Israel thinks it's justified in its brutal treatment of the Palestinians it is truly deluded and lost in its own extremist Zionist vision. How someone can only view Israel as victims without acknowledging the displaced Palestinians, who were robbed of their homeland, is simply beyond me. If the Mexicans set up camp in Wyoming and began building a vast military power claiming that they had once been resident there prior to the discovery of North America by the Europeans how do you think America would act?lowing wrote:
GO ahead and warm up because you simply can not defend the Arab nations posture against Israel that lead to the 6 day war and the aftermath that ensued. Israel is on the defensive and always has been since 1948. Its actions has always been in the interest of self preservation and not destroying nations or taking over the ME.
And if Israel thinks brute force will prevail they are wrong, unless they carry out a mass killing of the entire Palestinian race the Palestinians will not cease in their struggle to regain their land. Israel needs to accept that the land belongs to both sides now (as do the Palestinians) and extreme right wing Governments that continue to create de facto plantations and order rocket attacks on residential areas do not help things in the long run. Just look at Northern Ireland, we have finally arrived at something resembling normality after both sides softening their stance.
Bottom line is, it has been shown time and time again, as soon as Israel tries to let its gaurd down they are exploited. Israel says no fucking more, and I don't blame them.
Do you really think the Israelis are helping achieve peace with these actions?Menachem Begin, Leader of Terrorist group the Irgun, Israeli Prime Minister '77-'83 wrote:
The partition of the homeland is illegal. It will never be recognized. The signature by institutions and individuals of the partition agreement is invalid. It will not bind the Jewish people. Jerusalem was and will for ever be our capital. The Land of Israel will be restored to the people of Israel. All of it. And for ever.
Israel is a country with a history of rash and unilateral military action, which quite often achieves nothing and is almost always counter productive in any attempt to establish a long lasting peace.
The Palestinians have attempted to stop any bombings/rocket attacks on many occasions, but the Palestinian government does not have a great deal of control over these things - likewise the Israeli government have attempted to reduce the number of innocent Palestians killed by Israelis, but the Israeli government does not have a great deal of control over the IDF. It is ingrained hatred on both sides that is responsible for this. Israelis are raised to hate Arabs, Arabs are raised to hate Israelis - until that stops, the killing will continue.
Last edited by Bertster7 (2007-07-30 04:55:33)
The heading should read "US vassel attacks US vessel."
Last edited by PureFodder (2007-07-30 06:44:49)