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2007-06-29 01:11:17
B.Schuss
I'm back, baby... ( sort of )
+664|6993|Cologne, Germany

=OBS= EstebanRey wrote:

At the marketing company I work at, they told me that when Ireland imposed the ban, sales of deodrant shot up.  Some of you seem to think that a smokeless bar full of sweaty people and stale beer will smell like pot pourri, I think there will be some suprises.

I also note that a lot of people here are still naive about passive smoking and buy the sensationalist media. Go and look into the research and again you'll be suprised by conflicting evidence.  There is more eveidence on global warming than this is on passive smoking and yet we don't see cars being banned.
why are we not seeing cars being banned ( yet ) ? Because the advantages of a combustion-engine-based vehicle still outweigh the disadvantages. Until we have figured out a way to provide affordable, convenient, personal means of transportation that doesn't hurt the environment for everyone on the planet, we'll have no choice but to continue. But have no worries, fossil fuels won't last for much more than another two generations, so that problem will solve itself sooner or later.

Smoking, however, has no advantages, nothing that benefits society, and that's why it should be banned. IMHO.
2007-06-29 08:11:17
jord
Member
+2,382|6830|The North, beyond the wall.

B.Schuss wrote:

=OBS= EstebanRey wrote:

At the marketing company I work at, they told me that when Ireland imposed the ban, sales of deodrant shot up.  Some of you seem to think that a smokeless bar full of sweaty people and stale beer will smell like pot pourri, I think there will be some suprises.

I also note that a lot of people here are still naive about passive smoking and buy the sensationalist media. Go and look into the research and again you'll be suprised by conflicting evidence.  There is more eveidence on global warming than this is on passive smoking and yet we don't see cars being banned.
why are we not seeing cars being banned ( yet ) ? Because the advantages of a combustion-engine-based vehicle still outweigh the disadvantages. Until we have figured out a way to provide affordable, convenient, personal means of transportation that doesn't hurt the environment for everyone on the planet, we'll have no choice but to continue. But have no worries, fossil fuels won't last for much more than another two generations, so that problem will solve itself sooner or later.

Smoking, however, has no advantages, nothing that benefits society, and that's why it should be banned. IMHO.
Lots of things people do for pleasure have no "advantages". It doesn't mean we take away everything that people enjoy doing.
2007-06-29 09:14:40
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|6733|SE London

jord wrote:

B.Schuss wrote:

=OBS= EstebanRey wrote:

At the marketing company I work at, they told me that when Ireland imposed the ban, sales of deodrant shot up.  Some of you seem to think that a smokeless bar full of sweaty people and stale beer will smell like pot pourri, I think there will be some suprises.

I also note that a lot of people here are still naive about passive smoking and buy the sensationalist media. Go and look into the research and again you'll be suprised by conflicting evidence.  There is more eveidence on global warming than this is on passive smoking and yet we don't see cars being banned.
why are we not seeing cars being banned ( yet ) ? Because the advantages of a combustion-engine-based vehicle still outweigh the disadvantages. Until we have figured out a way to provide affordable, convenient, personal means of transportation that doesn't hurt the environment for everyone on the planet, we'll have no choice but to continue. But have no worries, fossil fuels won't last for much more than another two generations, so that problem will solve itself sooner or later.

Smoking, however, has no advantages, nothing that benefits society, and that's why it should be banned. IMHO.
Lots of things people do for pleasure have no "advantages". It doesn't mean we take away everything that people enjoy doing.
No, but if they inconvenience other people - a majority of other people - it is perfectly normal for such things to be disallowed.

If you ask me this law is nothing compared to a number of other laws that people quite readily accept, like laws on noise pollution. You aren't allowed to play loud music at nights (between 23:00 and 07:00), because it is anti-social, other people (who are in a majority) don't like it, so you aren't allowed to do it. If you do, they can call environmental health and have them confiscate your audio equipment. That is something you are doing in the privacy of your own home, yet the government has legislation in place to protect those citizens who are disturbed by it. The smoking ban is very similar, but less extreme, since it does not govern what you can or can't do in your own home.
2007-06-29 10:30:43
heggs
Spamalamadingdong
+581|6540|New York
We already have this in New York state. I was skeptical at first, but it's damn nice in bars now that there isn't smoke everywhere.
Remember Me As A Time Of Day
2007-06-29 11:15:41
buLLet_t00th
Mr. Boombastic
+178|6594|Stealth City, UK

Cougar wrote:

buLLet_t00th wrote:

You're the fucking stinky, unhealthy minority my friend! I can't fucking wait!
Fuck you.....

buLLet_t00th wrote:

But why should I have to breathe the unfiltered smoke? If they want to smoke they can go and do it somewhere else, I haven't told them they can't smoke, the big boys upstairs do that!
.....and again in a different hole.....

buLLet_t00th wrote:

Because waitresses and waiters still have to go and serve food and drinks there (I know thats a lame excuse but thats one of the reasons).

A smoker has the choice of either smoking or not smoking......a non-smoker doesn't have the choice of whether breathing it in or not (unless they're really good at holding their breath). Think about it for a second....it makes sense!
......and once more in the face for good luck.


Smoking is a choice, just like your craptastic opinion.  How would you like it if the government banned your opinion?  Working in a restaurant where people smoke is also a choice, so I guess we should ban working where you please as well, since we are banning choices and all.

I got into a fight at a restaurant about 3 years ago because of this.  There I am in the smoking section, smoking my cigarette and watching a football game on TV as I waited on my food.  Some dick-cheese, not much different than yourself, sitting 10 feet away in a booth behind a glass wall asks me to put out my cigarette.  I told him no.  He stands up and walks over to my stool and sticks his finger in my face and tells me to put it out.  So I did. 

As he turned to walk away, I grabbed the ash-tray and threw it at his head and split the fuckers nugget open, then commenced to kick the shit out of him.  Spent a night in the brig for that one.

It was my choice to smoke a cigarette.  it was his choice to eat in a restaurant that has a smoking section, it was his choice to sit 10 feet away from the smoking section, it was his choice to be a dick and it was my choice to split his head open for trying to oppress my decision to have cigarette.  The whole thing could have been avoided if the asshole would have respected the decisions of others, instead of trying to force his way on other people around him.


Moral of the story:  Don't be a dick.  Respect the choices of others.
When did I say anything about having a problem with the smoking section in a restaurant? The main time this kind of thing affects me is in a club, when there is no getting away from anybody who smokes. Why should something that causes cancer and a load of other diseases be put upon others? Read this (if you can) http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/2053840.stm and then tell me I should accept smoke in a club.

Notice that I didn't use one swear or offensive word in that statemnt.....I think your post shows that you aren't particuarly linguistic and can't get a point accross without having to say some of the stuff in your post.
2007-06-29 18:06:08
elstonieo
Oil 4 Euros not $$$
+20|6490|EsSeX

buLLet_t00th wrote:

You're the fucking stinky, unhealthy minority my friend! I can't fucking wait!
lol you sound like an x smoker
2007-06-29 18:20:09
BeerzGod
Hooray Beer!
+94|6722|United States
I'm personally glad this is happening. It's also happening slowly in the states. I smoked for about two years back when I graduated highschool and went on to college, but the things just make me sick now. It may be YOUR right to kill yourself faster by smoking, but it's not your right to expose the shit to people that want to live healthy. You also have to realize that most establishments are in favor of this and have been in favor of this for a while, but would never risk losing business by banning smoking themselves. If I was a bar owner I would be happy for the ban. People are still going to come regardless.. they'll just have to go outside to smoke, but at the same time I'd be getting more business from the people who don't come out simply because of the smoky atmosphere and horrible post bar smell.
2007-06-29 19:16:11
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6557|North Carolina
One of the few seriously negative things I see in socialized healthcare is that there is a societal incentive for the government to intervene in personal matters when everyone pays for each other's healthcare.

That being said, it makes perfect sense that the U.K. would enact such a policy as this, given their socialized system.  If I were a British citizen, I'd certainly not want to effectively pay for someone else's smoking habit, so discouraging the act overall through a widespread ban is a necessary and sensible move.

Without a socialized system in place, it makes no sense for America to enact such a ban though.  Over here, it should remain a decision made by business owners, not the government -- unless we actually switch to a socialized healthcare system later on.
2007-06-29 19:24:38
Wreckognize
Member
+294|6637
There are a lot of things that can kill you in this world.  My cigarette probably won't.  Don't like it?  Go somewhere else.
2007-06-29 19:47:49
BVC
Member
+325|6847
If smokers could smoke without it affecting me, I wouldn't have a problem with it.
2007-06-29 19:50:44
Surgeons
U shud proabbly f off u fat prik
+3,097|6642|Gogledd Cymru

Obey_m0rph3us wrote:

There are a lot of things that can kill you in this world.  My cigarette probably won't.  Don't like it?  Go somewhere else.
You seem like a nice level headed fair minded person .
2007-06-29 22:49:36
Ajax_the_Great1
Dropped on request
+206|6799
Smokers are jokers. The bans everywhere make me giggle.
2007-06-29 23:59:31
Bubbalo
The Lizzard
+541|6713

Obey_m0rph3us wrote:

There are a lot of things that can kill you in this world.  My cigarette probably won't.  Don't like it?  Go somewhere else.
Well, that makes perfect sense.  In fact, whilst we're at it, why don't we make murder legal.  You don't like it?  Go somewhere without murderers.  And speed limits are a real bore.  They're gone.  You don't like it?  Go somewhere without cars.  And, for that matter, you needs to be treated as a person.  You don't like it?  Go somewhere else.
2007-06-30 00:00:38
Bubbalo
The Lizzard
+541|6713

Turquoise wrote:

Without a socialized system in place, it makes no sense for America to enact such a ban though.  Over here, it should remain a decision made by business owners, not the government -- unless we actually switch to a socialized healthcare system later on.
Which explains why cocaine is illegal?
2007-06-30 00:07:25
{DGC}{jr.}Blitzkrieg
Member
+10|6988|Arizona
A law like this took place in early may, here in Arizona. I don't believe it's the governments choice. The bars are privatly owned buisnesses and it should be up to the owner if he wants business from a smoker or not.
2007-06-30 00:08:55
Bubbalo
The Lizzard
+541|6713
Except that businesses can then be forced to serve smokers to bring in a profit, despite the detrimental effects.  In the end, the Australian government viewed it as an occupational health and safety issue for bar staff.
2007-06-30 09:52:55
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6557|North Carolina

Bubbalo wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

Without a socialized system in place, it makes no sense for America to enact such a ban though.  Over here, it should remain a decision made by business owners, not the government -- unless we actually switch to a socialized healthcare system later on.
Which explains why cocaine is illegal?
Good point, but it's become readily apparent how useless the War on Drugs has become in America.

I realize we can't legalize cocaine, but there's no logical reason to ban smoking (tobacco or marijuana) in America.  If we get a socialized healthcare system here, then maybe a ban would make sense.
2007-06-30 21:23:49
Bubbalo
The Lizzard
+541|6713
For one, smoking is a pollutant.  For another, it causes health problems in the work force, which is exactly why other drugs are illegal.
2007-06-30 22:12:55
Stubbee
Religions Hate Facts, Questions and Doubts
+223|6895|Reality

jord wrote:

buLLet_t00th wrote:

jord wrote:


It should be the owners choice.

What's wrong with the designated no smoking parts in Pubs/ Restuaraunts?
Because waitresses and waiters still have to go and serve food and drinks there (I know thats a lame excuse but thats one of the reasons).

A smoker has the choice of either smoking or not smoking......a non-smoker doesn't have the choice of whether breathing it in or not (unless they're really good at holding their breath). Think about it for a second....it makes sense!
Fair enough, but before this ban there was still non smoking public places.

Do you really not think it should be down to the owners?

If you think about it, all the people who hate smokers would go to a pub where it is banned. That pub owner would get lots of customers...

All the smokers could go to a smoking pub, and sit and inhale smoke(their choice).

Then the two types of people don't need to see each other, and everyone is happy.
Except you gotta find waiters/staff willing to work in an atmosphere equivalent to smoking 30 packs a day.
The US economy is a giant Ponzi scheme. And 'to big to fail' is code speak for 'niahnahniahniahnah 99 percenters'
2007-06-30 22:18:54
TeamOrange
Don't be that guy
+84|6463

jord wrote:

buLLet_t00th wrote:

=OBS= EstebanRey wrote:

On Sunday July 1st the ban on smoking in enclosed places comes into effect in England & Wales and makes tomorrow night the last in which you can enjoy a fag with your pint at the local.  I for one plan to go out with a camera so I can take a picture of myself with a ciggie to show the grand kids.  Are there any other UK smokers here or anyone other smokers who live under a ban like this already?

I live in Oxford and for most of the pubs, popping outside won't be a problem; being a University city most of the pubs in town have gardens (although you do have to put up with a lot of American students, lol).  Our nightclubs, in comparison, won't currently let you out once you're in so how is that going to work?

Muscian Joe Jackson is an outspoken opponent of the smoking ban and had this to say: -

"Smokers are now the only minority whose minority status is quoted as justification for abuse.  Britain is becoming a society in which the extreme agendas of health officials and lobby groups are allowed to determine public policy. Freedom of choice, tradition, tolerance, pleasure, property rights, market forces and public opinion are being swept aside by a fanatical fringe."
You're the fucking stinky, unhealthy minority my friend! I can't fucking wait!
It's his choice if he wants to smoke, who are you to tell unhealthy people what they can and can't do.

At the end of the day, I don't smoke, but I'm not going to make out that I'm better than people that do smoke. That's because I'm not, we all have something that's unhealthy that we do...


Least we can't blame Muslims for this.
It could also hurt people surrounding you, from second hand smoke for the first 8-10 years of my life I lung issues. Now that 3 family members quit and I am all-state track. Trust me smoking affects everyone.

Just recently I was golfing with my friend, because this golf course requires you to have a party of four they paired us with two other people, one of which was a smoker, the other wasn't. This guy was a heavy smoker, he would start lighting up while he had one in his mouth. After about the fourth or Fifth hole I started to feel it, my chest and throat was hurting. I kindly asked him to stop, I explained my situation with my history with smoking, he refused to stop and told me to go somewhere else. He could stop but he decided not to; I don't have the choice. Also this ruined my day, I wasted 65 bucks to play only 9 holes, I had to leave after the front 9 otherwise I feared an asthma attack.

Last edited by teamorange (2007-06-30 23:16:50)

 

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