Stats?MajorHoulahan_MASH wrote:
If it wasnt for treatment of gunshots, half of those number of people wouldnt be needing medical treatment in the hospital in the first place....
If "stats"said only 10 % , that would still be 10 % too many...usmarine2005 wrote:
Stats?MajorHoulahan_MASH wrote:
If it wasnt for treatment of gunshots, half of those number of people wouldnt be needing medical treatment in the hospital in the first place....
If "stats"said over 50 %, that would mean thousends of people too many...
Criminals? Suicide?.....How about that?MajorHoulahan_MASH wrote:
If "stats"said only 10 % , that would still be 10 % too many...usmarine2005 wrote:
Stats?MajorHoulahan_MASH wrote:
If it wasnt for treatment of gunshots, half of those number of people wouldnt be needing medical treatment in the hospital in the first place....
If "stats"said over 50 %, that would mean thousends of people too many...
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070418/ap_ … r_shooting
Better ban guns there too, oh wait they already did.
And farmers in Britain are allowed rifles/shotguns aren't they?
Better ban guns there too, oh wait they already did.
And farmers in Britain are allowed rifles/shotguns aren't they?
If I was living in the US and some1 shot me with a weapon, permit or not license or not - it still wouldnt stop me from suing you due to "excessive force", when a simple FUCK OFF would suffice.
So could every hard core christian, All it is, is a book, nothing sacred... just a book, paper with ink on it.ATG wrote:
Honestly?=OBS= EstebanRey wrote:
And what part of "evolution" don't you understand? Do you believe every word in the bible because its says it the absolute truth?ATG wrote:
What part of " shall not be infringed " do you not understand?
Causes of death in USA, 2000
Guns: 29,000
Illicit use of drugs 17,000
How many of those deaths are the result of police shootings? Or do those not count?
I could use the Bible to wipe my ass and sleep well at night.
Hospitals benefit to Society -> Hugehate&discontent wrote:
i found this on google i think from 2005:
Medical malpractice is currently the third leading cause of death in the United States. Approximately 200,000 people in the United States die each year due to mistakes by medical professionals and prescription errors, according to a recent report from the Journal of the American Medical Association (JAMA). It was reported that 12,000 deaths a year result from unnecessary surgery - 7000 from medication errors in hospitals - 20,000 deaths are caused by other hospital errors - 80,000 deaths a year from hospital born infections and 106,000 deaths a year from non-error, adverse effects of medications.
hospitals kill more people that guns.
if i quoted this wrong, sorry.
Guns benefit to Society -> extremely small to non existent (should be banned).
And while we are on this topic of what kills people.
Smoking benefit on Society -> All negative (should be banned)
Drugs benefit on Society -> All negative (should be banned)
Cars benefit on Society -> Huge
Knives benefit on Society -> Large
The costs associated with cars and hospitals is vastly outweighed by there benefits they create, where guns add nothing to society yet are a huge cost to it.
Hardly, and FYI its not illegal (well Automatics are), its just much much harder and the rules and regulations of owning one are a lot tougher.NemeSiS-Factor wrote:
Well, it illegal for you to own a gun. So jealous much?
And the perpetual problem grows. You just have no idea of what its like living in a (relatively) gun free nation. Guns are not easy to get legally or illegally, so theres no need for guns as self defence, so guns become harder to come by and the problem goes away.Desolater wrote:
There are so many easy ways to get guns legally or illegally it dosnt matter what the law says. But if a criminal has 1 so should I.
Well I hope you are out tomorrow with all your gun buddies to try and overthrow this corrupt government, if not, either your to scared, or the 'constitution' didn't work as planned. Either way your gun ownership is usless if your not going to use it.Dezerteagal5 wrote:
First of all. The Constitution is a set of 'rules' that were made by the founding fathers of America, so that the new country they made, will NOT become corrupt (like its becoming today).
You'll have a fun time trying to kill someone with a bullet without a gun to fire it from.S3v3N wrote:
An Unloaded Firearm is pretty much useless. You gun control types have it all wrong. Ammunition is responsible for a persons death. Ask any medical professional, what killed the person, Its not the colt 1911A. IT was the .45ACP round fired out of it. The only way a gun without bullets can kill somebody is if you impale it in their eye and it hits the brain or if you pistol whip them enough.
don't post unless you have read the entire thread. how are you able to speak in the correct context if you have not read all previous posts!? /rhetorical question.nukchebi0 wrote:
I don't favor banning guns. That would be dumb. I have a much better solution. Regulate the manufacture of ammunition, and tax it so that a single bullet costs around $500-1000. This way, no one can afford enough bullets to go on a shooting spree, but can have enough for that secure sound of loading a chamber. By regulating ammunition, it would ensure that ammunition isn't distributed illegally. (And if it was, people would still pay high prices.)
You're right Camp Perry has been having rifle matches for quite some time, actually it's where the civilianJOJOBA wrote:
I'm surprised there has been very little mention of guns being used as sport.
Camp Perry, an active base located in Ohio, right on Lake Erie, has been running for over 100 years. If i remember correctly, they have been holding target shooting competitions since 1903 (basically since the rifle came out). in those 100+ years, i know for fact that not one person has been shot during those matches. people have a better chance of dying from heat stroke at Camp Perry than they do of getting shot when they are at the base.
responsibility is very important when owning a gun, and there is proof to show. Camp Perry is a responsible society, and the result is the fact that not one person has ever been shot in 100 years of competitions.
M-14 was born, so it holds a special spot in my heart. The matches have been there since 1907 so you were close. And I too was also surprised by the lack of people saying firearms are used primarily for hunting or sport.
Is that the National Guard base? If so, I shot my worst rifle score there. Damn Lake Erie breeze.bob_6012 wrote:
You're right Camp Perry has been having rifle matches for quite some time, actually it's where the civilianJOJOBA wrote:
I'm surprised there has been very little mention of guns being used as sport.
Camp Perry, an active base located in Ohio, right on Lake Erie, has been running for over 100 years. If i remember correctly, they have been holding target shooting competitions since 1903 (basically since the rifle came out). in those 100+ years, i know for fact that not one person has been shot during those matches. people have a better chance of dying from heat stroke at Camp Perry than they do of getting shot when they are at the base.
responsibility is very important when owning a gun, and there is proof to show. Camp Perry is a responsible society, and the result is the fact that not one person has ever been shot in 100 years of competitions.
M-14 was born, so it holds a special spot in my heart. The matches have been there since 1907 so you were close. And I too was also surprised by the lack of people saying firearms are used primarily for hunting or sport.
Yes sir, it's a National Guard training camp. Sucks about your score, that breeze can be kind of strong.
Depends on the state.TigerXtrm wrote:
There is nothing wrong with regulation laws on guns. Here in Holland, the country so well known for drug abuse and paid sex, guns are extremely illegal IF you don't have a permit to have one. Get a permit and you can have as many guns as you want (or as many as your permit allows). And whether or not you get a permit is based on your personal history. If you've ever been in jail, no permit. History of violence? No permit. Ect. Ect. In other words only people who are deemed responsible enough to own a gun can have one.
Now don't throw the argument 'some states in America also require permits' at me because you know just as well as I do that even a 4 year old with a fake ID can get a permit.
You need guns for your protection? Protection against who? The other lunatics who also own a gun and got their hands on it just as easily as you did? Protection against burglars? Better make sure he doesn't fall down and hit his head when you shoot him, he might sue you.
If you think having a gun in your night drawer makes you saver then what would be the harm in having a decent permit system in place to make sure only normal people can have guns? If you are so confident that you are responsible enough to handle it then you shouldn't be opposed to a rule like this. Instead everyone is shouting that guns should be completely legal and at the same time all these idiots are wondering where kids get the weapons to commit these school shootings. The people shouting for legality are the exact reason a permit rule should be in place because deep down these people know they wouldn't pass a permit background check, along with more then half of the American population.
Tiger
Washington State its fairly hard to get a CCP. But If you are Military all you gotta do is pass the finger test. And pay $60, wait 72 hours and its yours. My brother in law went through a massive nuttroll, and he was in a law enforcement academy trying to get his. Mine was quick, But then again I have never had any serious run ins with the law.
I guess it all depends on who shot you. Dead men can't sue.-101-InvaderZim wrote:
If I was living in the US and some1 shot me with a weapon, permit or not license or not - it still wouldnt stop me from suing you due to "excessive force", when a simple FUCK OFF would suffice.
Last edited by d3athwi5h4 (2007-04-17 22:22:47)
united states is to far up the shit for gun control to make any difference.
An interesting note which I didn't include in my sole post in this thread:
If in fact 29,000 people died due to gun related deaths in the year 2000 it means there were 79 deaths a day due to gun violence. The tragedy at Virginia Tech claimed 32 lives as you all probably know.
What's the bigger tragedy here?
If in fact 29,000 people died due to gun related deaths in the year 2000 it means there were 79 deaths a day due to gun violence. The tragedy at Virginia Tech claimed 32 lives as you all probably know.
What's the bigger tragedy here?
[Blinking eyes thing]
Steam: http://steamcommunity.com/id/tzyon
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Ignorance? Indifference?Ty wrote:
An interesting note which I didn't include in my sole post in this thread:
If in fact 29,000 people died due to gun related deaths in the year 2000 it means there were 79 deaths a day due to gun violence. The tragedy at Virginia Tech claimed 32 lives as you all probably know.
What's the bigger tragedy here?
Btw: "Guns don't kill people, death kills people." - From one of the GTA games.. Vice city I think
My advice to the few people in here that understand the point the OP was making:
Never argue with idiots. They will take you down to their level and beat you with experience.
The plural stands for the majority of the staunch geniuses posting in this thread. It doesn't matter what you say, how you say it, or how legitimate your point is. You are arguing with, well...idiots, so save your breath. The most valuable lesson I learned here in a very short time, and a lesson that will serve me for the rest of my life I am sure. I hope you find as much use in this as I did!
Never argue with idiots. They will take you down to their level and beat you with experience.
The plural stands for the majority of the staunch geniuses posting in this thread. It doesn't matter what you say, how you say it, or how legitimate your point is. You are arguing with, well...idiots, so save your breath. The most valuable lesson I learned here in a very short time, and a lesson that will serve me for the rest of my life I am sure. I hope you find as much use in this as I did!
No one is arguing this point, in fact... to even bring this up shows your ignorance for the opposing argument.rdx-fx wrote:
A gun is a tool. It's an inanimate object.. a chunk of metal.
It is not some inherently evil mythical item that turns normal people into drooling homicidal maniacs.
Yes but its again another american thing, a prison should be a place for rehabilitation, not somewhere to put away the people you'd rather ignore.You want to outlaw something? Outlaw violent criminals, outlaw psychopaths and homicidal maniacs.
Get them off the streets, and keep them off the streets.
When is a gun ever 'good'? There is no reasonable social benefit from gun ownership, so why take the risk with people using them for 'bad' when they offer nothing 'good' in return.It's the person behind the trigger that determines whether a weapon is 'good' or 'bad'.
No, but a gun does give a borderline psycho the ability to commit murder and crime with relative ease. If someone attacks you with a knife, baseball bat etc, you have many more options for defence then compared with someone who has a gun.As with most 'unsolvable' arguments, the Pro-gun and Anti-gun sides are arguing two completely different topics.
Pro-gun sees a gun as a tool, in the hands of the 'good guys', to defend their lives, liberty, and way of life.
NOT as an instrument to settle petty arguments.
Anti-gun sees a gun as an inherently evil item, that has the mythical power to convert rational men to rabid "gangbangers" or whatnot. Or, at best, that said 'inherently evil' gun will push a borderline psycho over the edge..
I believe you are overlooking one of the primary reasons firearms were invented and are so popular. Hunting, that's it plain and simple. Firearms are used for hunting which is good, very good in my, and many others opinions.DrunkFace wrote:
When is a gun ever 'good'? There is no reasonable social benefit from gun ownership, so why take the risk with people using them for 'bad' when they offer nothing 'good' in return.
Last edited by bob_6012 (2007-04-18 00:43:13)
Care to bring facts to support that sir. . . .MajorHoulahan_MASH wrote:
If it wasnt for treatment of gunshots, half of those number of people wouldnt be needing medical treatment in the hospital in the first place....hate&discontent wrote:
i found this on google i think from 2005:
Medical malpractice is currently the third leading cause of death in the United States. Approximately 200,000 people in the United States die each year due to mistakes by medical professionals and prescription errors, according to a recent report from the Journal of the American Medical Association (JAMA). It was reported that 12,000 deaths a year result from unnecessary surgery - 7000 from medication errors in hospitals - 20,000 deaths are caused by other hospital errors - 80,000 deaths a year from hospital born infections and 106,000 deaths a year from non-error, adverse effects of medications.
hospitals kill more people that guns.
if i quoted this wrong, sorry.
or simply revise that statement!
QFT[CANADA]_Zenmaster wrote:
My advice to the few people in here that understand the point the OP was making:
Never argue with idiots. They will take you down to their level and beat you with experience.
The plural stands for the majority of the staunch geniuses posting in this thread. It doesn't matter what you say, how you say it, or how legitimate your point is. You are arguing with, well...idiots, so save your breath. The most valuable lesson I learned here in a very short time, and a lesson that will serve me for the rest of my life I am sure. I hope you find as much use in this as I did!
This is why I stopped paying attention and taking the Debate and Serious Talk Thread seriously.
Because hunting really helps the community and society?bob_6012 wrote:
I believe you are overlooking one of the primary reasons firearms were invented and are so popular. Hunting, that's it plain and simple. Firearms are used for hunting which is good, very good in my, and many others opinions.DrunkFace wrote:
When is a gun ever 'good'? There is no reasonable social benefit from gun ownership, so why take the risk with people using them for 'bad' when they offer nothing 'good' in return.
Apart from pest control (which should be conducted by the government), hunting is a personal pass time. It is for your own personal enjoyment and as such is a very selfish argument.
So what? Are you trying to say, that burglary or stealing something is worth death sentence? Not even rape is. And at least average joe shouldn't be the judge by pulling the trigger. Especially when you live in a promised land of lawyers.S.J.N.P.0717 wrote:
But that statistic doesn't say why they were killed. They could have been trying to rape someone, break into a house, rob something.
Yes hunting helps the community and society by keeping the damn deer out of the cities which is still happening anyway. It should not be left up to the government to do this because they have more important things to worry about. I don't need the government to do everything for me, I'm perfectly capable of making my own decisions and I prefer to keep it that way thank you. It may be for personal enjoyment but it's my privilege to that enjoyment, and I do not think it is a selfish argument because of the thousands upon thousands of hunters we have here in my country. Why should we have our hunting guns taken away because someone got a hold of a gun and did something bad, how many people out there who do own guns never do anything illegal with them? Millions of people that's who.DrunkFace wrote:
Because hunting really helps the community and society?bob_6012 wrote:
I believe you are overlooking one of the primary reasons firearms were invented and are so popular. Hunting, that's it plain and simple. Firearms are used for hunting which is good, very good in my, and many others opinions.DrunkFace wrote:
When is a gun ever 'good'? There is no reasonable social benefit from gun ownership, so why take the risk with people using them for 'bad' when they offer nothing 'good' in return.
Apart from pest control (which should be conducted by the government), hunting is a personal pass time. It is for your own personal enjoyment and as such is a very selfish argument.
Edit: Took out a thought
Last edited by bob_6012 (2007-04-18 00:54:31)
not to mention that he's historically inaccurate...the first bladed device was used for hunting...and warring.Parker wrote:
LOL=OBS= EstebanRey wrote:
Stupid an ignornat, knives were designed to faciltate cutting materials such as food and materials. Guns were invented to kill and maim...S3v3N wrote:
In England, how many deaths are the result of stab wounds.
So should knives be outlawed?
another person from europe thinks he knows what will solve all these shootings.
let me tell you something, its not a fucking invasion i fear. i live in the #1 most dangerous city in the united states, highest homicide rate, period. i have comfort in knowing that my kimber 1911 will spit pure fire if need be to protect my family and myself. see, you dont understand because you dont have to deal with gangbangers and drive-bys.
dont think for a second you know what you are talking about when you try to dictate OUR rights.
oh and as far as knives go, i have seen alot of knives that are used as tools. on the other hand i have seen MANY knives that were made with the intention of being used in combat. the very design of said knives are to withstand the abuse of stabbing into bone, cutting flesh and the ability to penetrate the body much more than other knives. you dont get to decide that knives are tools and firearms are weapons, sorry it just doesnt work like that.
How the hell can you do that? Round up everyone, and let the sane ones out after a year?rdx-fx wrote:
You want to outlaw something? Outlaw violent criminals, outlaw psychopaths and homicidal maniacs.
Since we cannot keep people from wanting to kill people, we can at least take away their means of killing people - make poisons and guns harder to get to, make sure it's as hard as it can possibly be for the people to have even just the possibility of killing someone.
You can't outlaw people - it's simply impossible. The USA would have a second Guantanamo Bay - I'm sure most of the world's against that.
-konfusion