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2007-04-11 08:36:37
heggs
Spamalamadingdong
+581|6835|New York

Kmarion wrote:

Masques wrote:

Kmarion wrote:


Because anyone can demand.
Yes. My question still stands.

What is wrong fundamentally with demanding respect?
Ok, let me break it down a little more extreme to help clarify. A person can molest 8 kids and demand respect. Do you give it to them? Respect should be measured by our actions and character. Not by a request for it.
To further that a bit, as soon as you demand respect, I personally find that I lose all respect I did have for that person, because they fundamentally do not know how things work. I will absolutely not respect anyone because they ask for it.
Remember Me As A Time Of Day
2007-04-11 08:36:43
sergeriver
Cowboy from Hell
+1,928|7204|Argentina

Stingray24 wrote:

sergeriver wrote:

I agree with you.  Sometimes they are a bit racist to white people and other groups.  You should consider they were an oppressed minority for quite a long time.  Maybe some of them feel they need reparations.  But if they don't like to be called nigger don't call them that.  If they call themselves nigger it's their problem.  Why does that bother you anyway?
"Were" is the operative word, no one is an oppressed minority in the US since the white male is the only acceptable target of criticism.  I could understand if someone who directly experienced slavery still felt oppressed, but most of those spouting the "I'm the same race, so I was/am oppressed" bullshit aren't even old enough to remember segregated schools.
That's why I said "were" and I'm not saying they are justified.  I'm trying to understand why they feel that way.
2007-04-11 08:37:17
David.P
Banned
+649|6721

jsnipy wrote:

Masques wrote:

And what's wrong with demanding respect?
Respect is earned, not demanded.
Actually the saying goes "Respect is not Given it's Earned"
2007-04-11 08:44:53
Stingray24
Proud member of the vast right-wing conspiracy
+1,060|6892|The Land of Scott Walker

sergeriver wrote:

Stingray24 wrote:

sergeriver wrote:

I agree with you.  Sometimes they are a bit racist to white people and other groups.  You should consider they were an oppressed minority for quite a long time.  Maybe some of them feel they need reparations.  But if they don't like to be called nigger don't call them that.  If they call themselves nigger it's their problem.  Why does that bother you anyway?
"Were" is the operative word, no one is an oppressed minority in the US since the white male is the only acceptable target of criticism.  I could understand if someone who directly experienced slavery still felt oppressed, but most of those spouting the "I'm the same race, so I was/am oppressed" bullshit aren't even old enough to remember segregated schools.
That's why I said "were" and I'm not saying they are justified.  I'm trying to understand why they feel that way.
Understood, serge. 

As to why some feel that way, it's my honest opinion that some listen to Jesse Jackson and the like far too much.  Jesse and his kind are pulling their people down by continuously branding their own race as victims.  The message is not at all empowering to the individual black person, but keeps the money flowing to Jackson and Sharpton so they can continue the fight against perceived injustice.
2007-04-11 08:46:06
Sondernkommando
Member
+22|7163
Over time, "free speech" is being curtailed, qualified, monitored and ultimately expunged.  Imus says "nappy headed"?  You don't like it?  Feel free to turn off his show, write a letter to the station, or carry a placard on the street.   If his ratings drop low enough, the show will be cancelled.

That's how it works.

But to have him suspended - almost fired - because you were "offended"?  Let me say that I am offended by pretty much every rap song I hear, so let's have those off the air right away, too.
2007-04-11 08:51:39
sergeriver
Cowboy from Hell
+1,928|7204|Argentina

Stingray24 wrote:

sergeriver wrote:

Stingray24 wrote:


"Were" is the operative word, no one is an oppressed minority in the US since the white male is the only acceptable target of criticism.  I could understand if someone who directly experienced slavery still felt oppressed, but most of those spouting the "I'm the same race, so I was/am oppressed" bullshit aren't even old enough to remember segregated schools.
That's why I said "were" and I'm not saying they are justified.  I'm trying to understand why they feel that way.
Understood, serge. 

As to why some feel that way, it's my honest opinion that some listen to Jesse Jackson and the like far too much.  Jesse and his kind are pulling their people down by continuously branding their own race as victims.  The message is not at all empowering to the individual black person, but keeps the money flowing to Jackson and Sharpton so they can continue the fight against perceived injustice.
I must agree with you.  There are certain characters that don't do anything good for their people and they only care about the money they can get.
2007-04-11 09:51:20
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7048|132 and Bush

The "song" is "This Is Why I'm Hot." It has topped the charts for the last 15 weeks.

This is why I'm hot
Catch me on the block
Every other day
Another bitch another drop
16 bars, 24 pop
44 songs, nigga gimme what you got…

… We into big spinners
See my pimping never dragged
Find me wit' different women that you niggas never had
For those who say they know me know I'm focused on ma cream
Player you come between you'd better focus on the beam
I keep it so mean the way you see me lean
And when I say I'm hot my nigga dis is what I mean
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ANw7ZVrMHCE&eurl=

The number two rap track in the nation this week is by rappers Bow Wow and R. Kelly (yes, the same R. Kelly who was indicted five years ago on a raft of child-porn charges and is still awaiting trial). The "song" is called "I'm a Flirt" and it's been on the charts for 12 weeks.

I'm a b pimpin
I don't be slippin
When it come down to these hos
I don't love em
We don't cuff em
Man that's just the way it goes
I pull up in the Phantom
All the ladies think handsome
Jewelry shining, I stay stuntin'
Thats why these niggas can't stand em
I'm a chick mag-a-net
And anything fine I'm bag-gin it
And if she got a man, I don't care
10 toes and I wanna be, cause I gotta have it

The final line:

Now the moral of the story is cuff yo chick,' cause hey,
I'm black, fresh , and I rap, plus I'm rich, and I'm a flirt.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=A2f3cuUXXRs

Let's proceed to number three on the Billboard rap charts this week (and on the charts for the past 13 weeks): "Go Getta" by a rapper named "Young Jeezy" with a special appearance by R. Kelly (again!).

You know we trap all day
Play all night
Dis Is Da Life Of A Go Getta (Ey) Go Getta (Ey) Go Getta (Yea)
U In Da Club
U C A Bad Bitch
Point Her Out (Oh)
Yea U Damn Right Ima (Ey)
You Damn Right Ima Go Getta (Ey) Go Getta (Ey) Go Getta (Yea)
http://youtube.com/watch?v=-cZeF1sG0h8

The number four song on the Billboard Rap Tracks charts is "Throw Some D's" by "Rich Boy featuring Polow Da Don" (it's been on the charts for 18 weeks).
Rich Boy sellin' crack
F*k niggas wanna jack
Sh*t tight no slack
Just bought a Cadillac (Throw some D's on that bitch!)
Just bought a Cadillac (Throw some D's on that bitch!)
Just bought a Cadillac
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bMFj0sWpIAI

And at number six is "Rock Your Hips" by "Crime Mob."

Lil' Jay, on the track,nigga, aye & you already know, its ya boi lil scrappy
we finna have the whole M-F world, rockin'in dis bitch,
look at shawty check her out. southern smokin

Chorus

I like the way she rock her hips,
then wave & sip
She rock her hips then wave & sip
She rock her hips, she rock her hips,
she rock her hips,then wave & sip

Look at them hips I like how she rock it
She bend that' thing ova, & to the ground,
she can drop it
And pop it hard,as she can, got me hard in da pants
Because she,in all her stance,
doing her Muthafuckin dance, man
Look lil' buddy cute in da face
She rock her hips to the bass, then she take a sip,
when she wave
and wonna get wit' lil Jay,
after she dance on dat pole
I pull my can so quick & fast,
when dat ass hit da flo'

Now,I got 32 flavors of dat bootylicious bubblegum
Raspberry, grape,cherry,come &
get this honeybun
Yummy-yum, baby,
not your ordinary lady
Known to drive a nigga, crazy, willie wonka wanna pay me
On the daily, off the hizzle, rock my heels shake my skittles
Soda pop it, watch it sizzle,man, this chick here for shizzle
Smokin' on the highest drizzle, wanna taste it, just a little
Rock my hips, then, make it wiggle.
Wavin' sippin' in this bizzle

(Repeat chorus)

I like it, when she show me she can rock it,
roll it, drop it to the flo'
Bouncin' slow, shawties, all pole, that's the way to go
Tell her booey-ooey got a nigga glancin'
everytime that ass react
I thought I saw a puddy cat
Gimmie, gimmie, gimmie that fat cat don't act on a pimp
You got me enticed, by the way, you rock dem hips
You's a trip, girl,doin' all dem tricks, that's what's up
I like dat shit a lot,come & holla at a thug

A-towns finest I'm the top-notch glamour chick
Tell me, if I throw it at chu,baby, can you handle it
Pistols causin' rushin', if a hatta wonna run dey lip
Step up in da club& have dem whisperin'goddamn she thick
Take it to the bar hypnotic & hennesy is on my list
Seductively moving my body now watch me rock my hips
Take a sip of the goose, I'm lookin' good & livin' lavish big boy pimpin popin dippin now tell me i'm not tha baddest

I like it she when she rock her hips then take it low
She grab the towel and wipe the pole
Oh oh shawty got it goin on , its just me and her
And im in my zone, check out her rack,
Shawty got a fat ass watch her throw dat shit back
They say she sweets like snacks
Betcha put her on da track everyday
Youn eatin lunch coutin muthafuckin stacks
One dumb radio/television shock jock's insult is a drop in the ocean of barbaric filth and anti-female hatred on the radio.

Imus gets a two-week suspension. What kind of relief do we get from this deadening, coarsening, dehumanizing barrage from young, black rappers and their music industry enablers who have helped turn America into Tourette's Nation?

Courtesy of Michelle Malkin
Xbone Stormsurgezz
2007-04-11 10:17:40
Masques
Black Panzer Party
+184|7169|Eastern PA

Kmarion wrote:

Masques wrote:

Kmarion wrote:


Because anyone can demand.
Yes. My question still stands.

What is wrong fundamentally with demanding respect?
Ok, let me break it down a little more extreme to help clarify. A person can molest 8 kids and demand respect. Do you give it to them? Respect should be measured by our actions and character. Not by a request for it.
Obviously not, but I hope you see what's wrong with someone saying that "blacks" as a group don't deserve respect. We see the group as a whole being derided because of those that are on welfare (not in an of itself cause for a lack of respect) or those that are rappers (again, what proportion of blacks are rappers or that condone the use of crude language in such media, and for every rapper that is about "bling and bitches" there are 10 others that don't get recognition).

Again, is the group as a whole responsible for the actions of less than 1%? Are whites as a whole responsible for David Duke? Or Richard Butler? Or Matthew Hale? Or Hitler?

For the record, search Google and you'll find statements by Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton (who so many of you here see fit to deride) denouncing the crudeness of modern hip-hop/rap/whatever you want to call it.

As for songs like "This Is Why I'm Hot" or works by R.Kelly, there are much larger issues than the black community. Like for instance, what does it say about the justice system that a multiple sex-offender like R.Kelly is still free to ply his trade? And just what proportion of the music audience do black people comprise? They are after all only 12-13% of the US population.
2007-04-11 10:20:54
topal63
. . .
+533|7165

Cougar wrote:

Personally, I think black people should receive no respect and no equality until they get their own people under control.
I guess it is hard for a racist... to comprehend black people are not their own-people! LOL

It is almost the same slip of the tongue.. Imus made on Sharpton's Radio show... when he feigned an apology and slipped in a "you people." LOL

P.S. This is not a Cougar bash, by suggesting he is racist, he basically is... to some degree... I applaud his honesty for openly rationalizing it.

Last edited by topal63 (2007-04-11 10:38:36)

2007-04-11 10:28:55
comet241
Member
+164|7212|Normal, IL

jsnipy wrote:

Masques wrote:

And what's wrong with demanding respect?
Respect is earned, not demanded.
couldn't have said it better
2007-04-11 10:35:31
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7048|132 and Bush

Masques wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

Masques wrote:

Yes. My question still stands.

What is wrong fundamentally with demanding respect?
Ok, let me break it down a little more extreme to help clarify. A person can molest 8 kids and demand respect. Do you give it to them? Respect should be measured by our actions and character. Not by a request for it.
Obviously not, but I hope you see what's wrong with someone saying that "blacks" as a group don't deserve respect. We see the group as a whole being derided because of those that are on welfare (not in an of itself cause for a lack of respect) or those that are rappers (again, what proportion of blacks are rappers or that condone the use of crude language in such media, and for every rapper that is about "bling and bitches" there are 10 others that don't get recognition).

Again, is the group as a whole responsible for the actions of less than 1%? Are whites as a whole responsible for David Duke? Or Richard Butler? Or Matthew Hale? Or Hitler?

For the record, search Google and you'll find statements by Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton (who so many of you here see fit to deride) denouncing the crudeness of modern hip-hop/rap/whatever you want to call it.

As for songs like "This Is Why I'm Hot" or works by R.Kelly, there are much larger issues than the black community. Like for instance, what does it say about the justice system that a multiple sex-offender like R.Kelly is still free to ply his trade? And just what proportion of the music audience do black people comprise? They are after all only 12-13% of the US population.
As I said before respect does not mean they should not be treated as equals. There are individuals I respect, but to say you respect an entire race of people does not make much sense. You are missing the middle ground here (It doesn't mean I disrespect them).

I think your less than one percent number is extremely low. Show me where you got that number and I will consider it. I hear that kind of slang nearly everyday.

There is a reason Sharpton and Jackson's denouncing of the crudeness is often under the radar. Sure they mention their discontent but they do not display outrage or call for any real action against it. Nothing to the degree they do when a non black acts inappropriately.

Last edited by Kmarion (2007-04-11 10:40:28)

Xbone Stormsurgezz
2007-04-11 11:05:53
jsnipy
...
+3,277|6969|...

Kmarion wrote:

As I said before respect does not mean they should not be treated as equals. There are individuals I respect, but to say you respect an entire race of people does not make much sense.
Agree. Blindly respecting an entire race is another form of prejudice.

Last edited by jsnipy (2007-04-11 11:07:57)

2007-04-11 11:06:57
GunSlinger OIF II
Banned.
+1,860|7091
how about the human race?
2007-04-11 11:09:31
jsnipy
...
+3,277|6969|...

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

how about the human race?
Same. I would not respect every human by default, so I would not pre judge them as a whole of being worthy of respect. Surely on some genetic level I want the human race to succeed, but from a social standpoint, no.

Last edited by jsnipy (2007-04-11 11:11:01)

2007-04-11 11:12:31
topal63
. . .
+533|7165

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

how about the human race?
Sounds good to me... race is a false conception - to me there is only Cline.
2007-04-11 11:43:03
Stingray24
Proud member of the vast right-wing conspiracy
+1,060|6892|The Land of Scott Walker
I’ll answer your questions this way, Masques.  Black folks do themselves a disservice if they disagree with the values and attitudes in rap music and yet choose to identify with the gangster image (and sometimes actions) of the rap stars they idolize.  If society is mistaken about the values of the black community, they can blame the gangster culture that many of the younger members of their community identify with.  You used white supremacists as an example of the bad 1% of whites.  Consider this: if I chose Hitler and David Duke as my heroes, am I not part of the problem by promoting their views?  Or can I blame David Duke and point at him as the issue?  I could not honestly complain about being labeled a white supremacist racist if those are the people and values I choose to identify with. 

In the same way, if I choose 50 Cent, Snoop, etc etc as my idol and they promote drug use, murder, and using women as throw away toys how can I complain when I’m looked at the same way by society?  And further, how can I complain when someone else of another race uses the language that I and my heroes use everyday?  It’s the definition of hypocrisy.  As Kmarion said, Sharpton and Jackson may be on the record denouncing the content of rap music, but they do nothing of substance to truly oppose it.
2007-04-11 11:50:16
GunSlinger OIF II
Banned.
+1,860|7091
the majority of people who buy rap music are white, middle class kids.
2007-04-11 12:17:34
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7048|132 and Bush

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

the majority of people who buy rap music are white, middle class kids.
Actually no, they download it..lol
Xbone Stormsurgezz
2007-04-11 12:19:07
Stingray24
Proud member of the vast right-wing conspiracy
+1,060|6892|The Land of Scott Walker
Majority?  You sure?  I hear a lot of rap coming out of the white kid's rice rockets zooming around my neighborhood with spoilers on the back that temporarily block the sun, but I also hear plenty of rock.
2007-04-11 12:34:07
Masques
Black Panzer Party
+184|7169|Eastern PA

Stingray24 wrote:

Majority?  You sure?  I hear a lot of rap coming out of the white kid's rice rockets zooming around my neighborhood with spoilers on the back that temporarily block the sun, but I also hear plenty of rock.
Blacks don't make up that large a percentage of the market in the US. Being generous and assuming the black population comprises 3 times the market share for rap in relation to their percentage of the general population you would still only barely pass 36%.
2007-04-11 13:33:21
Stingray24
Proud member of the vast right-wing conspiracy
+1,060|6892|The Land of Scott Walker
36% of rap music market share seems quite low, it has to be at least 50%, especially when factoring in all the other music genres out there.  There are plenty of lame white kids who are trying to be all hard playing their rap, though.  "See, I'm a gangsta . . . I'm playing Tupac and Snoop . . . I've never even held a pistol or driven through gang territory, but I fully identify with participating in a driveby."
2007-04-11 13:34:19
Hurricane
Banned
+1,153|7077|Washington, DC

I pretty much agree with Cougar on this one. If a white guy calls a black guy "nigger" in a hateful manner, it should be no different than a black guy calling a white guy "cracker."

If they want equality, then either have radio talk show sessions with the people who freely "lyric" with "nigger", or STFU. Wasn't it Sharpton who said we should eliminate racial slurs? How's that going Al? Convinced the majority of the rappers to use a few more words than "rims, hoes, bitches, niggas, caddies"?

I'll end with a Dave Chappelle quote: "America's at war with al-Qaeda, but we're still losing the war against Al Sharpton." No, I'm not a blind white supremacist; we just need someone like Sharpton or Jackson without the hippocracy.
2007-04-11 15:14:40
topal63
. . .
+533|7165

Cougar wrote:

Hypocritical. ...

5. Why should people like Don Imus and Michael Richards be subjected to the kind of scrutiny that they are when you have people like Dave Chappelle, ....

That, really is the pot calling the kettle nigger.
My personal FAVORITE(!) - Clayton Bigsby - Black White Supremacist.
http://www.metacafe.com/watch/291638/clayton_bigsby/
2007-04-11 15:22:39
Wreckognize
Member
+294|6932
As a white-middle class teen who listens to gangsta rap, I think the problem is that too many black youth see rap as a lifestyle choice.  I see it as entertainment.  If I watch a violent movie or play a violent video game, should I go around killing people?  No, of course not.  Then, if I listen to gangsta rap, why should I go around shooting people and smacking women or selling drugs?  This is the problem that I see.  Music is entertainment, not a lifestyle.
2007-04-11 15:28:59
Master*
Banned
+416|6942|United States

Cougar wrote:

Personally, I think black people should receive no respect and no equality until they get their own people under control.
This is the only thing I disagree with, you don't refuse a whole group of people respect or equality because you make generalization about the whole race as being disrespectful and lazy. I'm black and I get work done I am an honor student headed off to college to make something of myself. I don't fit your description of the black race as a whole so I should lose respect and equality? Blacks don't demand equality, they are already equal(Civil Rights Movement), there is a certain streak of negativity associated with black people which I think stems from a certain part of the " gangsta" culture that promotes violence and at the same time blacks are a minority who's ancestors suffered in the past by whites and will react like this if they sense any racism coming from whites.

The reason why black racial slurrs against whites seems ok is because blacks were the minority that were terrorized the past by whites(race riots, lynchings, segregation,slavery, racial slurrs), so most people generally don't get angry at the black comedians when they make racist jokes about whites because most see it as a autonomous way of blacks "getting back" at whites for the past. If a white comedian made black jokes instead of a black comedian making black jokes there would be a problem because of the past, the white comedian would come off as racist. Its not the skin color its what's behind it.

I personally think that  the black comedians that make fun of whites and use the N word against their own culture is wrong, in past this type of disrespect never happened blacks were distinguished and were fighting for equality which they gained but in recent years some(not all) blacks have been doing the total opposite and I think this is due to the negative environment that blacks are born into and feed into the  "gangsta" culture that I mentioned earlier.

 

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