BF2S Forums Here is some of your "freedom fighters" in action

I love how we have so many experts here who understand what is happening in Iraq. Im sorry but its not just one romantic group of "freedom fighters" with a splinter of radicals that do things like what usmarine2007 cited. The suicide bombing is predominately done by foreign jihadists. Al qaeda is present with their own agenda of course and are responsible for a lot the insurgent "training" and organization. There are still baath loyalists floating around. A LOT of these groups are militia/gang hybrids. A militant form of organized crime. There are also the religious sects that are fighting each other. All these groups (I was briefed once an estimate of 300 distinct groups) are vying for power with complicated and shifting alliances and conflicts among themselves.
The real freedom fighters in iraq are the ones that are facing enormous danger and risk to their families to stand up and try to stabilize their country. The young iraqis in IP and IA that give up what little they have to go against the odds and try to make it safe again. No, Iraq is not free right now, it is a martial state. No one is denying that. But has no one connected the dots that it is in a martial state because of the ongoing violence? Or do you really think the US enjoys sitting there? Martial state will end when the violence ends and then the ever-mentioned freedom will be a reality. But we have all these agenda driven groups continuing the violence for the sake of "freedom" (in reality: for the sake of THEIR power). To say that some thug group that purposely kills innocent civilians are "freedom fighters" makes me sick. These groups are not fighting for "freedom." They are fighting for their respective group to have control of Iraq.

You are a fool if thought that usmarine2007 believes the insurgents in the article of "freedom fighters."

ATG wrote:

Why can't you just call a spade a spade and condemn the child killing bastards without reservations?
By sidestepping that fact or ignoring it, you morally support the concept of flagless fighters using children as weapons of war.
Which leads to more civilians deaths,
which leads to more hatred of American policies,
lengthens and complicates a battle while effecting our policy zero.

Your energies would be better spent rallying people to cease accepting suicide bombings as politics and stateless terrorists as non-combatants.

Perhaps we need shouldn't be there, but we sure as hell aren't leaving anytime soon and until it's somewhat stable. Or at least until Obama is elected http://i19.tinypic.com/4hddnkg.gif. So let's have some constructive criticism.

I completely condemn the people who blew up that truck, without reservation... that conclusive enough for you? You do realise the 'terrorists' around the world you speak of do not have a union or a charter. Different sets of people all around the world fight and kill for different reasons. Some are murdering bastards and some are disenfranchised people who are themselves the victims of state terrorism.

What America has done is they've declared a 'War on Terror'; on a basic semantic level this tries to equate all forms anti-establishment activity and just gives more power to those that are in office. Whether you're blowing up a truck full of kids in Iraq or trying to fight for your family's right to live in your family home in Palestine in the 'War on Terror' you're on the bad side and that's it. It convinces people like you ATG that all forms of anti-establishment activity are one and the same.

My time is best spent campaigning against brutal terrorism perpetrated both by rebel groups and Governments alike. Just because you wear an expensive soldiers uniform it doesn't mean you're the good guy.

Braddock wrote:

What America has done is they've declared a 'War on Terror'; on a basic semantic level this tries to equate all forms anti-establishment activity and just gives more power to those that are in office. Whether you're blowing up a truck full of kids in Iraq or trying to fight for your family's right to live in your family home in Palestine in the 'War on Terror' you're on the bad side and that's it. It convinces people like you ATG that all forms of anti-establishment activity are one and the same.

.

Terror is a "tactic", and terrorism is an abstract idea. Neither of which can have war declared on them. A "war on terror" is not even possible. A war on extreme religious militants is however definable.

Braddock wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

Terror is a "tactic", and terrorism is an abstract idea. Neither of which can have war declared on them. A "war on terror" is not even possible. A war on extreme religious militants is however definable.

It's even smarter than the old vague enemy 'communism' as it's more general, covers a broader range of people and political beliefs and is more of a tangible threat to the Western world than communism ever was. I disagree with religious extremism and the killing of innocent civilians as part of a political campaign/struggle, that's why I hope Norway's acceptance of Palestine's new Government will hopefully lead Palestinians away from suicide bombings and the like.

I'm reminded of the first version of the Patriot Act.

The "Uniting and Strengthening America by Providing Appropriate Tools Required to Intercept and Obstruct Terrorism" Act, was signed into law by President George W. Bush on October 26, 2001. The stated purpose of the law is to "deter and punish terrorist acts in the United States and around the world, to enhance law enforcement investigatory tools, and for other purposes."

What the hell is that shit?

devildogfo wrote:

I love how we have so many experts here who understand what is happening in Iraq. Im sorry but its not just one romantic group of "freedom fighters" with a splinter of radicals that do things like what usmarine2007 cited. The suicide bombing is predominately done by foreign jihadists. Al qaeda is present with their own agenda of course and are responsible for a lot the insurgent "training" and organization. There are still baath loyalists floating around. A LOT of these groups are militia/gang hybrids. A militant form of organized crime. There are also the religious sects that are fighting each other. All these groups (I was briefed once an estimate of 300 distinct groups) are vying for power with complicated and shifting alliances and conflicts among themselves.
The real freedom fighters in iraq are the ones that are facing enormous danger and risk to their families to stand up and try to stabilize their country. The young iraqis in IP and IA that give up what little they have to go against the odds and try to make it safe again. No, Iraq is not free right now, it is a martial state. No one is denying that. But has no one connected the dots that it is in a martial state because of the ongoing violence? Or do you really think the US enjoys sitting there? Martial state will end when the violence ends and then the ever-mentioned freedom will be a reality. But we have all these agenda driven groups continuing the violence for the sake of "freedom" (in reality: for the sake of THEIR power). To say that some thug group that purposely kills innocent civilians are "freedom fighters" makes me sick. These groups are not fighting for "freedom." They are fighting for their respective group to have control of Iraq.

You are a fool if thought that usmarine2007 believes the insurgents in the article of "freedom fighters."

They are all terrorists buddy.  You can't argue that.

Pieeater wrote:

"Terrorism expert Walter Laqueur in 1999 also has counted over 100 definitions and concludes that the "only general characteristic generally agreed upon is that terrorism involves violence and the threat of violence"."

So America and Israel are terrorists then, agreed?

usmarine2007 wrote:

Don't forget the Aussies or the Brits.

Yep, them too.

usmarine2007 wrote:

Right because we are taught in boot camp to pack a car full of explosives with kids and blow it up.

You'd think a military power like the US would have more sophisticated military training.

Mr.Pieeater wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

Braddock wrote:

What America has done is they've declared a 'War on Terror'; on a basic semantic level this tries to equate all forms anti-establishment activity and just gives more power to those that are in office. Whether you're blowing up a truck full of kids in Iraq or trying to fight for your family's right to live in your family home in Palestine in the 'War on Terror' you're on the bad side and that's it. It convinces people like you ATG that all forms of anti-establishment activity are one and the same.

.

Terror is a "tactic", and terrorism is an abstract idea. Neither of which can have war declared on them. A "war on terror" is not even possible. A war on extreme religious militants is however definable.

Extreme Religious Militants are terrorists.  Don't play with words trying to make a point.  It never works.

Here is a Wiki definition to prove you wrong.

"Terrorism expert Walter Laqueur in 1999 also has counted over 100 definitions and concludes that the "only general characteristic generally agreed upon is that terrorism involves violence and the threat of violence"."

P.S.- You suck.

Not true at all.  War cannot be waged against an abstract noun, that's a fact.  According to what that guy said, almost every nation in the history of the world has used terrorist tactics, which I don't think most people would agree with. 

Playing with words?  Ever watched Court TV?  Anyone who has any understanding of the US Judicial system knows that even a few misplaced words can have a completely different meaning.  Kmarion is absolutely right...

P.S. - You suck worse

Kmarion wrote:

Braddock wrote:

What America has done is they've declared a 'War on Terror'; on a basic semantic level this tries to equate all forms anti-establishment activity and just gives more power to those that are in office. Whether you're blowing up a truck full of kids in Iraq or trying to fight for your family's right to live in your family home in Palestine in the 'War on Terror' you're on the bad side and that's it. It convinces people like you ATG that all forms of anti-establishment activity are one and the same.

.

Terror is a "tactic", and terrorism is an abstract idea. Neither of which can have war declared on them. A "war on terror" is not even possible. A war on extreme religious militants is however definable.

I think the "War on Terror" is a bit more catchy for the more uneducated type. . . .

But your right, it is a war on religious fundamentalism/those who support them. . . .

Bottom line is we need to win! Cause I have no plans of adopting wearing a turban, praying five times a day to a God I dont want to worship, and or abiding/subjected to/by Sharia law anytime soon. . . .

By the way, is anyone surprised they (terrorists) used children to "kill the infidel"?? Cmon, it was only a matter of time. . . . they cant beat us using conventional means, hence the IED/VBIED's (VBIED with child device as it is now apparently) etc.

They are sick fucks that need to be sent back to Allah's underworld! And the only way they stop "doing" what they are "doing" is through military force. . . . You cannot negotiate with an enemy that sacrifices its own children to blow up the "infidel". . . its impossible.

Last edited by fadedsteve (2007-03-20 16:48:04)

Bertster7 wrote:

fadedsteve wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

Terror is a "tactic", and terrorism is an abstract idea. Neither of which can have war declared on them. A "war on terror" is not even possible. A war on extreme religious militants is however definable.

I think the "War on Terror" is a bit more catchy for the more uneducated type. . . .

But your right, it is a war on religious fundamentalism/those who support them. . . .

Bottom line is we need to win! Cause I have no plans of adopting wearing a turban, praying five times a day to a God I dont want to worship, and or abiding/subjected to/by Sharia law anytime soon. . . .

By the way, is anyone surprised they (terrorists) used children to "kill the infidel"?? Cmon, it was only a matter of time. . . . they cant beat us using conventional means, hence the IED/VBIED's (VBIED with child device as it is now apparently) etc.

A turban?
Is there a problem with Sikh extremists suddenly?

Or are you just totally ignorant of all these other cultures?

Oh god. . . .

For fucking christ sake. . . .you know what I mean!! The fucking Arab wrap they wear on their goddamn heads!! I believe its called the Shemagh or Sheik whatever. . . .

I am not concerned either way!! I just dont want to be forced to wear one!! And forced we will be if they had their way of world domination. . . .

I am very respectful of other cultures. . . I just dont have white guilt, like half you liberals suffer with day in and day out!!

Last edited by fadedsteve (2007-03-20 16:52:41)

Bertster7 wrote:

fadedsteve wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:

A turban?
Is there a problem with Sikh extremists suddenly?

Or are you just totally ignorant of all these other cultures?

Oh god. . . .

For fucking christ sake. . . .you know what I mean!! The fucking Arab wrap they wear on their goddamn heads!! I believe its called the Shemagh or Sheik whatever. . . .

I am not concerned either way!! I just dont want to be forced to wear one!! And forced we will be if they had their way of world domination. . . .

There is NO required headgear for men under Islam. Some of them choose to wear stuff round their heads, 'cos it's sandy.

Well. . . .I guess you would know, you do live in Pakistan. . .I mean England! Sorry  sarcasm*

Apparently though English schools can ban (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,259870,00.html) those wraps if they want too!!! Holy Shit is their gonna be a holy war in England!!!  Wait till some muslim want to wear the wrap, and some snotty English dean tell them they cant wear it!! lol!! Let the beheadings begin!!

Last edited by fadedsteve (2007-03-20 16:58:25)

Spearhead wrote:

weamo8 wrote:

usmarine2007 wrote:

"Insurgents in Iraq detonated an explosives-rigged vehicle with two children in the back seat after US soldiers let it through a Baghdad checkpoint over the weekend, a senior US military official said Tuesday."


http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20070320/wl … 0320203409

What in the hell is wrong with these people?  I can not comprehend how people can possibly become so cold-hearted.  The vast majority of these people follow Islam.  Have the ever read the Quoran?  Wtf?

The same thing could be said for any religious extremist.  The very idea of religious extremism is the notion that "You're right, everyone else is wrong, and if they try to convince you otherwise, it is just a test of your belief in god".  They freaking breed kids for the sole purpose of brainwashing them and using them as fighters.  The worlds pretty sick.  It's almost as if these nuts are behind modern times by a few hundred years.

Almost behind the modern times. . . . .

THEY ARE behind the "modern times"!!!

They are a fucked up people/culture, and I have no problem saying that either!! That part of the world has a "middle ages" mentality with modern day weapons!! That is a recipe for disaster!!! As demonstrated. . .

I just cant wait till our country (USA) switches its method of energy (ie getting rid or our oil dependence).  So these miserable fucks can go back to becoming insignificant and killing each other in their sand box without our interference!!!

Last edited by fadedsteve (2007-03-20 17:04:50)