ph4s3 wrote:
The only "fair" income tax is one that taxes all people equally -- as a percentage, not a dollar figure --, regardless of pay. Say 10% or so, period. Someone earns 50k, they owe 5k. Someone earns 500k, the owe 50k. Someone earns 50B, they owe 5B. What the hell is wrong with you that you think someone who earned 50B needs to pay more than 5B in taxes? That's a million times more than the guy who earned 50k, and you're gonna say that's not enough??? I guarantee you that this guy is doing more to stimulate the economy with his investments and consumption than the guy making 50k. Yet you want to charge him MORE of a percentage just because he has it?!?! That's not taxation, it's theft.
When you consider how much more power rich people have over the average citizen through buying politicians with lobbyism, then it makes perfect sense that the rich should pay more. They get more out of the system than the average person, because they can afford to buy the people in charge.
ph4s3 wrote:
We all presumably have the same access to government institutions, programs, schools, etc. Why should one person pay more than the next as a percentage of their overall income? It's blatantly unfair but very easy to say since the "rich" are "evil" of course and didn't do anything to actually earn it like work hard, study hard, etc. (please note the sarcasm in that statement).
I'm guessing you're not poor or working class, are you?... Life isn't an even playing field, and it never will be. The least we can do is make it easier for working people to rise in income. Some people do live off of the system, but most people on welfare spend a short time on it before adjusting into a new job.
ph4s3 wrote:
I suspect most of you are young and haven't had the pleasure of working your a$$ off only to see 31% (my effective tax rate for FY2006) of your earned income taken from you by the force of government. That's food off my table, gas out of my car, trips we didn't get to take to see the grandparents, etc. I work HARD for my family and I resent it very much that someone takes any of it away from me or them. I resent it even more when I think about how much time I had to spend away from my family to earn that money. I accept the responsibility of it, though, as a condition of citizenship as well as a cost of the benefit of working in this economy and raising my family here. However, when idiots start spouting off that higher earners should pay a larger percentage of their income I get offended and just damned mad. I'm by no means in the upper income brackets, but F### you and F### anyone else that wants to take more than what I already have to pay. I fully intend to move up in income brackets over the next 20-25 years of my career and it pisses me off to think how much more money I'm going to have to give to the government.
This is why I suggest we lower taxes on people in the bottom four brackets and raise them among the top one. In general, corporate income taxes should be higher than personal income ones.
ph4s3 wrote:
I guess my libertarian flat tax side is showing now..
I used to be Libertarian until I realized how unrealistic many of their beliefs are.
ph4s3 wrote:
All that being said, I think an income tax is actually unfair because it taxes people for something they've not benefited from. Being paid $1 or $1M doesn't help anyone if they don't spend it. I think the only fair tax would be a consumption (sales) tax. By all means this can (should?) be progressive and luxury items like new cars should have a higher tax cost to them than groceries. But I digress...
The answer to the question is... More than 10% is too much. Make it a 10% tax, across the board, on every earner, individual and company alike. Do away with all the tax loopholes, deductions, credits, etc and charge everyone 10%. Stop using the tax code to further social, economic or any other agendas. Furthermore, do NOT charge people taxes on government distributions such as SSI, etc. That is money we've paid IN to the system, we shouldn't have to pay a penalty when we get it out.
You'd have to cut federal spending by at least half in order to implement this system. Granted, I wouldn't necessarily be against that.
ph4s3 wrote:
Lastly, and perhaps most importantly, I realize that reality must play a role here and there should be a minimum threshold under which no one pays taxes because even 10% would be an undue burden. I propose it should be at approximately 2.5x the poverty level. Because seriously, the poverty level for a family of four is like 20k. That's insane. Make under 50K for a family of 4 and you should pay no taxes. From there it should go up say 1% per 1K over 50K, maxing out at 10% from 60K on up.
And I still think there should be a national consumption/sales tax, perhaps in lieu of the income tax.
Well, at least we agree on the poverty aspect.
Last edited by Turquoise (2007-03-18 16:38:42)