Tarthkin
Member
+-1|6768
Ive been playing Mashtuur City quite a bit over the past week and have noticed a lack of understanding of the role of the Black Hawk.  Im hoping that this blurb helps clear up a few things.

     Ok, we all know about the mad dash to the Black Hawk at the start of every round and if you are lucky enough to get the pilot seat (and know how to fly) the first thing that you must do is start your own squad.  I cant stress this enough.  When you do this you not only allow other members who are in your BH to communicate with you easier but it will allow you to gain a full squad if/ when ppl get shot out of the BH.  Essentialy, if for some reason you dont get the right personel in the BH (no Engineers) the ppl in your squad can spawn back in the BH with the right kit.
     The role that you are playing when you get into the BH is Support Only.  All you are doing is providing cover for the ground units.  Before the latest patch, BH were capping machines.  But now they cap flags at the same rate as one person.  This means that while you hover over a flag like an idiot, the rest of the MEC has target practice with your a$$.  Even the worst shot with a rocket will hit a stationary target.  What you should do instead is circle a flag slowly mowing down enemy infantry while your buddies on the ground take the flag.  This is the best way to ensure a win if you have a compitant ground force.
     The first flag that you should head for is the south west flag on the MEC side.  This is where their tank spawns and if you deny them that right away than you have a very good chance of winning.  This also means that any ground forces trailing you will get an easy cap.  once this is capped you should control most of the map b/c 3 of the other 4 cappable bases are on the USMC side of the river.  This quick cap will put the MEC forces on the defencive right away and that is where the BH shines in battle.  while ou circle around the Hotel, keep an eye out for the rest of the bases being taken.  If you see a flag being nutralized rush over and take them out and alow members of your own team to retake the flag. 



My opinion on the best BH loadout:
1 support class in the gunner or pilot position
2 medics in the remaining gunner/pilot position
3 Engineers in the back cranking away
(If you want to add some explosive power replace one of the Engineers with a Sec-Ops)

For those too lazy to read all the details heres the quick version:
1) If your the pilot, start your own squad
2) Know your role, dont try to cap the flags, you'll only get you and 5 others killed
3) Circle flags to provide cover for those on the ground capping
4) If you get an AA lock dont panic, just hit X and move away


Feel free to add anything you felt I missed
beeng
Get C4, here!
+66|6792

and you loose the round terribly when the t-90 puts a round through your BH
i've seen it time and time again, where a whole squad of people is tied up bh whoring, causing a major inbalance of players -actually capping flags-
Tarthkin
Member
+-1|6768

beeng wrote:

and you loose the round terribly when the t-90 puts a round through your BH
i've seen it time and time again, where a whole squad of people is tied up bh whoring, causing a major inbalance of players -actually capping flags-
If you fly high enough and dont hover than the odds of a tank doing that are very small.  Plus i dont think one hit from a tank kills a BH.  Plus if you have a good pilot who dosnt crash into buildings than only 6 ppl every get into a BH in one round.
Johnthegreg
Member
+1|6730
No, no and NO!  The blackhawk is reserved for clan members to fly around racking up points even at the cost of losing the round.  If you get in "Bail Out!", "Bail Out!", or you will most likley get tked for your mistaken belief that the B.H. is going to be used to help win.  If you shoot down the B.H. full of clan members you will find yourself kicked from the server, even if you are on the opposing team.  The B.H. is for points whoring only!  It has no place in team play, and for anyone to try to use it in the fashion stated by Tarthkin is blasphemy!
beeng
Get C4, here!
+66|6792

Tarthkin wrote:

beeng wrote:

and you loose the round terribly when the t-90 puts a round through your BH
i've seen it time and time again, where a whole squad of people is tied up bh whoring, causing a major inbalance of players -actually capping flags-
If you fly high enough and dont hover than the odds of a tank doing that are very small.  Plus i dont think one hit from a tank kills a BH.  Plus if you have a good pilot who dosnt crash into buildings than only 6 ppl every get into a BH in one round.
ahuh
you still loose the round even if your pilot is godlike
besides, the tank is usually accompanied by a slew of vodnik fire
Lawk
Member
+2|6780

Tarthkin wrote:

Ive been playing Mashtuur City quite a bit over the past week and have noticed a lack of understanding of the role of the Black Hawk.  Im hoping that this blurb helps clear up a few things.

     Ok, we all know about the mad dash to the Black Hawk at the start of every round and if you are lucky enough to get the pilot seat (and know how to fly) the first thing that you must do is start your own squad.  I cant stress this enough.  When you do this you not only allow other members who are in your BH to communicate with you easier but it will allow you to gain a full squad if/ when ppl get shot out of the BH.  Essentialy, if for some reason you dont get the right personel in the BH (no Engineers) the ppl in your squad can spawn back in the BH with the right kit.
     The role that you are playing when you get into the BH is Support Only.  All you are doing is providing cover for the ground units.  Before the latest patch, BH were capping machines.  But now they cap flags at the same rate as one person.  This means that while you hover over a flag like an idiot, the rest of the MEC has target practice with your a$$.  Even the worst shot with a rocket will hit a stationary target.  What you should do instead is circle a flag slowly mowing down enemy infantry while your buddies on the ground take the flag.  This is the best way to ensure a win if you have a compitant ground force.
     The first flag that you should head for is the south west flag on the MEC side.  This is where their tank spawns and if you deny them that right away than you have a very good chance of winning.  This also means that any ground forces trailing you will get an easy cap.  once this is capped you should control most of the map b/c 3 of the other 4 cappable bases are on the USMC side of the river.  This quick cap will put the MEC forces on the defencive right away and that is where the BH shines in battle.  while ou circle around the Hotel, keep an eye out for the rest of the bases being taken.  If you see a flag being nutralized rush over and take them out and alow members of your own team to retake the flag. 



My opinion on the best BH loadout:
1 support class in the gunner or pilot position
2 medics in the remaining gunner/pilot position
3 Engineers in the back cranking away
(If you want to add some explosive power replace one of the Engineers with a Sec-Ops)

For those too lazy to read all the details heres the quick version:
1) If your the pilot, start your own squad
2) Know your role, dont try to cap the flags, you'll only get you and 5 others killed
3) Circle flags to provide cover for those on the ground capping
4) If you get an AA lock dont panic, just hit X and move away


Feel free to add anything you felt I missed
Preach on brotha! You are absolutely correct.
beeng
Get C4, here!
+66|6792

Lawk wrote:

Preach on brotha! You are absolutely correct.
A) dont quote the first topic, especially when its really long like this
B) dont quote the really long first topic and add nothing really useful to the thread
C) BOOBIES
Lawk
Member
+2|6780

Johnthegreg wrote:

No, no and NO!  The blackhawk is reserved for clan members to fly around racking up points even at the cost of losing the round.  If you get in "Bail Out!", "Bail Out!", or you will most likley get tked for your mistaken belief that the B.H. is going to be used to help win.  If you shoot down the B.H. full of clan members you will find yourself kicked from the server, even if you are on the opposing team.  The B.H. is for points whoring only!  It has no place in team play, and for anyone to try to use it in the fashion stated by Tarthkin is blasphemy!
Nope.  Killing the enemy helps your team.  So does not dying.  A good chopper squad will have zero deaths at the end of the round and many kills.
Tarthkin
Member
+-1|6768

Johnthegreg wrote:

If you shoot down the B.H. full of clan members you will find yourself kicked from the server, even if you are on the opposing team.
your obviously not playing on the right servers
Lawk
Member
+2|6780

beeng wrote:

Lawk wrote:

Preach on brotha! You are absolutely correct.
A) dont quote the first topic, especially when its really long like this
B) dont quote the really long first topic and add nothing really useful to the thread
C) BOOBIES
A)  I do what I want.
B)  See A.
C)  Yummy.
Charmin
Member
+1|6699
AGREE 100%

All the times i flew BH in mashtuur i just took role of the cover-given heli's like in blackhawk down, read the book, they drop troops and then fly a set pattern to take down snipers on rooftops. Thats all i do, I check my map and ask the commander which CP he wants to be taken, then I fly wide, high yawed circles around the target area, giving my Chief-gunner the right angle to mow down who ever runs down there. Just aslong as my ground troops need the support.

Also if, if i get hit by an rpg, i do get the hell out and get fixed. In contruary to what most pilots do and just stay there and 6 men end up being dead by one louzy pilot. Thats one thing most pilots dont care about, the safety of the men riding along.

Usually I fly as a medic, so whoever gets hit in my heli will be healed by me, other wise the lone dude in the door way needs to be medic and they mostly get shot out.

Also very important, is to gun down that enemy heli. And make sure the poeple in my heli report back to me where it flies, cuz flying, spotting and providing nice angle of attack are too much.
And i hate gunners who just shoot around for fun and when it comes down to it, hit jack. 

I have flown enough rounds there having not been gunned down, kept everyone alive, earned shit load of points and had a blast!!! We owned the other team big time.



Sadly, most of the times I'm f-ed by guys who crash 4-10 times a round. always try to capture CP's with 6 people in it. Dont get repairs, and always fly over the target area > so we cant shoot nothing!!!! Frstration!!!!!

but oh well, aslong as there are people like Tarthkin i'll be fine, hey man ever played on WTE?
beeng
Get C4, here!
+66|6792

Lawk wrote:

beeng wrote:

Lawk wrote:

Preach on brotha! You are absolutely correct.
A) dont quote the first topic, especially when its really long like this
B) dont quote the really long first topic and add nothing really useful to the thread
C) BOOBIES
A)  I do what I want.
B)  See A.
C)  Yummy.
A) proper forum ettiquette ensures other members wont get pissy at you
B) DU BIST VERUCKT!
C) GROSSENTITTEN
Tarthkin
Member
+-1|6768
Dont think ive ever played on WTE but post the IP and ill be glad to check it out
Lawk
Member
+2|6780

beeng wrote:

Lawk wrote:

beeng wrote:


A) dont quote the first topic, especially when its really long like this
B) dont quote the really long first topic and add nothing really useful to the thread
C) BOOBIES
A)  I do what I want.
B)  See A.
C)  Yummy.
A) proper forum ettiquette ensures other members wont get pissy at you
B) DU BIST VERUCKT!
C) GROSSENTITTEN
A) Can you provide a link to where this is documented?
Johnthegreg
Member
+1|6730

Tarthkin wrote:

Johnthegreg wrote:

If you shoot down the B.H. full of clan members you will find yourself kicked from the server, even if you are on the opposing team.
your obviously not playing on the right servers
Correct!  However, I don't play there anymore after that experience.  Scince then I have found a couple of clan servers that are really cool, even to non-clanmembers.  Yes Lawk, killing people does help your team, but when its not done in a "support" type roll to help your ground pounders cap flags, its not nearly as effective.  If you are going to fly around in the B.H. the whole round and get "0 deaths" thats great, but don't just fly around aimlessly, look at where your guys on the ground are and try to back them up.
Scarymother
Member
+1|6749
It is possible that the US could never lose Mashtuur in my humble opinion, primarily due to the difference in the BH vs "other transport choppers".

I agree with all the points that Tarthkin put up.  The reason that it does lose from time to time is because the BH isn't used correctly.  Since 1.12, it's a gunship, not for capping flags.  Indeed, except at distant points like North/South gas station even dropping off the guys in the back to cap a flag, circling to cover them and then hovering to let them back in is just too dangerous.

I will add one point - if you get in a BH, look for the BH (it may not be helpfully called "Blackhawk") squad!  If you're showing up as a blue dot in the BH and there's a squad run by the pilot you're doing something wrong.  The pilot requires active communication from the other guys in the chopper and he needs to be able to tell the gunners where the targets are.

The tanks are the only major threat to a BH if properly used - generally if you see an enemy tank, get some altitude and help out at a different point.

Oh, and watch that the Hill (32 player) or the South Gas Station (64 player) are not being capped.  It's your job to defend those points as well.
Tarthkin
Member
+-1|6768

Johnthegreg wrote:

If you are going to fly around in the B.H. the whole round and get "0 deaths" thats great, but don't just fly around aimlessly, look at where your guys on the ground are and try to back them up.
That was the reason for this post.  Too many ppl dont understand how to use the BH.  Hopefully this will help a bit
Lawk
Member
+2|6780

Johnthegreg wrote:

Tarthkin wrote:

Johnthegreg wrote:

If you shoot down the B.H. full of clan members you will find yourself kicked from the server, even if you are on the opposing team.
your obviously not playing on the right servers
Correct!  However, I don't play there anymore after that experience.  Scince then I have found a couple of clan servers that are really cool, even to non-clanmembers.  Yes Lawk, killing people does help your team, but when its not done in a "support" type roll to help your ground pounders cap flags, its not nearly as effective.  If you are going to fly around in the B.H. the whole round and get "0 deaths" thats great, but don't just fly around aimlessly, look at where your guys on the ground are and try to back them up.
Thats what killing the enemy IS.  Every enemy will eventually pose a problem to your teammates.  That problem is they want to kill them.  If there is an opposing force at a CP your guys are trying to get, the BH will most usually go that way with help from UAV.  When I gun or pilot in the BH, I dont pick out people to kill in order to support my team.  That is redundant.  If you just kill everyone possible, you shouldn't have any trouble winning the round.
cK^Bugz
Member
+0|6690
I love it when you get a BH full of people all round on this map trying to cap CP's and not getting repairs because when i get a tank i can manage plenty kills by blasting the side of the BH with a shell or 2 and watch the dead bodies falling out while at the same time doing some damage to the BH itself.

This happens alot when you get the pilots Charmin talks about not that i'm complaining because i do like the scores i can get lol but there is a few pilots who use the chopper properly and thats the games i find myself losing and maybe getting an average round score in. I also find these games really frustrating because i know the pilots good and i can't bloody get at him.
Charmin
Member
+1|6699
all the choppers i have downed with a tank were among the idiot pilots i do talk about, hovering is so dangerous for a big, slow and sluggish blackhawk.

@ scarymother, i so agree with you on the winning of the USMC in that map. There's 1 more CP on thier side of the river, and the miniguns are superior to those bb-guns on the MEC TransportHeli, but then again in other maps, the chaingun from the MEC attackheli is way better then that of the Cobra.

Nevertheless, if some poeple defend the gasstation, its most likely the USMC will win 95% of the time.

"...when i get a tank i can manage plenty kills by blasting the side of the BH with a shell or 2 and watch the dead bodies falling out...." lol yeah tha BH turns into a piniata
Superior Mind
(not macbeth)
+1,755|6699
I like cheese and porno and thats the end of that.

Oh, sorry wrong IM
Ub3r-ElitE
Teargas wh0re
+2|6727

beeng wrote:

B) DU BIST VERUCKT!
C) GROSSENTITTEN
lol

@Topic

Agreed, but the people who crash the blackawk or use it for a sightseeing tour don't read this forum at all so this thread won't help much.
Skruples
Mod Incarnate
+234|6707

Lawk wrote:

Johnthegreg wrote:

No, no and NO!  The blackhawk is reserved for clan members to fly around racking up points even at the cost of losing the round.  If you get in "Bail Out!", "Bail Out!", or you will most likley get tked for your mistaken belief that the B.H. is going to be used to help win.  If you shoot down the B.H. full of clan members you will find yourself kicked from the server, even if you are on the opposing team.  The B.H. is for points whoring only!  It has no place in team play, and for anyone to try to use it in the fashion stated by Tarthkin is blasphemy!
Nope.  Killing the enemy helps your team.  So does not dying.  A good chopper squad will have zero deaths at the end of the round and many kills.
Apparently Lawk lives in a sarcasm free zone.
Charmin
Member
+1|6699
i piloted the bh last night, great full heli, i thought i was in for a killer round, only to find blind gunners, overlooking 2 jeeps & tank, who in turn were so very dedicated to bring me down, not a shot was fired by my chiefs, the mechanics on board didnt fix a thing either, i got some points for healing but i found myself falling down in flames.

Only to loose the round becuz the entire team except 3 kept respawning at our gasstation to man the bh, only to crash it a minute later..........i weep for these sad sad souls
beeng
Get C4, here!
+66|6792

Charmin wrote:

Only to loose the round becuz the entire team except 3 kept respawning at our gasstation to man the bh, only to crash it a minute later..........i weep for these sad sad souls
That's what i was talking about before.

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