UON
Junglist Massive
+223|7079
Last nights dispatches showed an interesting investigation into the current situation in Iraq.  This investigation appoints the majority of blame for the sectarian violence to the Shia militia, and not the Sunni insurgents.  There are some very valid points and it definitely showed a different perspective than you get from the mainstream media.

http://www.channel4.com/news/dispatches … sp?id=1226
Thousands of civilians are being deliberately killed every month in Iraq - more than were killed in the final years of Saddam's regime. Working with local Iraqi journalists, reporter Deborah Davies shows how night after night death squads rampage through Baghdad's previously mixed neighbourhoods. Up to a hundred bodies a day are dumped on the streets, often showing signs of torture with electric drills. Whole areas of Baghdad have now been ethnically cleansed.

While the US and UK governments have been blaming Sunni insurgents and al-Qaeda for the deaths, Dispatches reveals how the majority of these murders have been carried out by the Shia militia which have systematically infiltrated and taken over police units and entire government ministries. And it highlights how the killers act with impunity - there's little investigation into their activities.

Dispatches has obtained disturbing video footage showing how the Shia-controlled Interior Ministry has run a network of secret prisons where Sunnis are imprisoned, horrifically tortured and killed. Mohammed Al Daini, a Sunni Iraqi MP describes to Davies how he recently discovered such a jail and found hundreds of terribly tortured prisoners. The men had been imprisoned when the current finance minister Bayan Jabr was interior minister and in charge of the police.

Aida Ussayran, a secular Shia and a Human Rights Minister in the last government reveals to Dispatches how she and her staff discovered dozens of prisoners were being tortured and abused inside the interior ministry, again while Jabr was the minister. She challenged Jabr but he said that although this had been happening inside his own ministry he had no knowledge of it.

Two of Jabr's former US advisors tell Davies that they repeatedly warned the US government about Jabr and their concerns that money was being siphoned off to fund a Shia militia called the Badr brigade, which was taking over the Housing ministry, and that the militias were growing in number and power to such an extent that today's slaughter was inevitable. The US authorities fired both of them.

Dispatches also reveals evidence linking sectarian killings to the special police commando units. Davies speaks to Gerry Burke, a senior US advisor in Iraq for most of 2005. He reveals that he saw entire units of the Badr Brigade enrolled in the police and special commando units. He also says that Jabr failed to implement proper investigations into killings which senior Iraqi policemen believed were being conducted by commando units under Jabr's direct control.

The Badr brigade is not the only powerful Shia militia. The Mahdi army, under their commander Moqtada al Sadr, controls large parts of Baghdad. They have infiltrated the health ministry and control many hospitals. An Iraqi doctor tells Davies how Sunni patients are often killed inside the hospitals.

And as the US troops prepare to leave for Iraq, Dispatches asks whether they will end up fighting forces controlled by the very people their own government has installed and funded.

Dispatches challenges Mowaffaq Al Rubaie, Iraq's national security advisor, an eyewitness to Saddam's execution and a key player in the Shia hierarchy that now dominates the Iraqi government, as to whether that government is genuinely committed to ending sectarian violence. Davies interviews Philip Zelikow, a former key policy maker in the administration who helped develop the new US strategy, about whether the administration understands the degree of militia control over the Iraqi government. And she speaks with former Iraqi Prime minister Iyad Allawi who tells Dispatches this Government is not committed to national reconciliation because the militias have penetrated the entire Iraqi system.
If anyone finds this on youtube or google video or something, then please post the link.

So, what do people think, will the new troop boost simply be combatting a problem which was created by the US and UK policy in Iraq? Are the Shia death squads justified in their actions against Sunni muslims?  Will elimination of the death squads require undermining the new Iraqi government, or are they entirely separate entities?

Please discuss but don't flame.  Thanks.
usmarine2007
Banned
+374|6793|Columbus, Ohio
I am willing to bet they are sponsored by a state or a very rich person, or both.
unholypoo
unholy what?
+10|6807
Wow, religion really sucks.
usmarine2007
Banned
+374|6793|Columbus, Ohio

unholypoo wrote:

Wow, religion really sucks.
QFT
JahManRed
wank
+646|7054|IRELAND

There are links between the death squads and high-ranking Shia politicians. The Shia militia that these politicians control have systematically infiltrated and taken over police units like the Baghdad Commando squad whom every member was a member of the Mardi Army who were recruited in one mass group by New Iraqi ministers to do their will. These politicians are aligned with hard liners like Muctada al-Sadr. Even entire government ministries have been infiltrated. These special police units are closely linked to the death squads, indeed they often are the death squads. And the killers act with impunity. There's little investigation into their activities as internal affairs and the serious crime units are too scared themselves to investigate these police units.
Special American advisers to the police and various government departments have been warning the Iraqi and American administrations that the present government has been infiltrated at every level by Shia extremists intent on ethnically cleansing Iraqi on the Coalition withdrawal. Interesting that these advisers were fired when they questioned their superiors about the architect of the ethnic cleansing quick rise to minister of interior.

So why night after night is the media flashing death tolls followed swiftly with reports of Sunni insurgents and al Qaeda being involved when the majority of the murders are by Shia's. They drop the bodies of at the same places at the the same time nearly every day. It was quite easy for an Iraqi journalist to film the police dropping off bodies. The special American adviser admitted he knew of the regular body dumps but was powerless to do anything. He would have lost his job.

Is the new Shia majority government ready to become a partner in the War On Terror? Or are they terrorist themselves?
usmarine2007
Banned
+374|6793|Columbus, Ohio
^^  Damn.  I actually like one of your posts.
unholypoo
unholy what?
+10|6807

usmarine2007 wrote:

unholypoo wrote:

Wow, religion really sucks.
QFT
Really, most wars can be attributed to people of one religion not liking people of another religion.
DesertFox-
The very model of a modern major general
+796|7111|United States of America

unholypoo wrote:

Wow, religion really sucks.
As does intolerance

However, that could have been expected, the infiltrators I mean. Disgusting that we needed an Iraqi security/police force so badly that anybody can get in. Watching shows about the fighting, it's even been shown that some insurgents manage to get in and then turn on the troops.
crimson_grunt
Shitty Disposition (apparently)
+214|7080|Teesside, UK

unholypoo wrote:

usmarine2007 wrote:

unholypoo wrote:

Wow, religion really sucks.
QFT
Really, most wars can be attributed to people of one religion not liking people of another religion.
C'mon guys this is said virtually every thread of this type please don't turn it in to another religion sucks derail.

UON wrote:

If anyone finds this on youtube or google video or something, then please post the link.
Never saw the program but assuming this is it or at least part of it.
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7027|132 and Bush

crimson_grunt wrote:

unholypoo wrote:

usmarine2007 wrote:

QFT
Really, most wars can be attributed to people of one religion not liking people of another religion.
C'mon guys this is said virtually every thread of this type please don't turn it in to another religion sucks derail.

UON wrote:

If anyone finds this on youtube or google video or something, then please post the link.
Never saw the program but assuming this is it or at least part of it.
[youte]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_oKVJ7Mxo[/youtube]
America "Has not put into Power" anyone. They had elections. It's obvious there are animals in that country. It's sad to look and see that aside from the war crap like that is going on as well.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
crimson_grunt
Shitty Disposition (apparently)
+214|7080|Teesside, UK

Kmarion wrote:

America "Has not put into Power" anyone. They had elections. It's obvious there are animals in that country. It's sad to look and see that aside from the war crap like that is going on as well.
huh?  I take it your arguing with the documentary?  you do realize it can't hear you?

Haven't watched yet will prob see if I've got time tomorrow.
JahManRed
wank
+646|7054|IRELAND

The documentary quoted the OP interviewed a USMC Sniper who witnessed and intervened just before the police put to death a group of Sunni men. Said his orders were never to speak of the incident. That is the problem. Denial by the Bush administration at every level, that the current Iraqi government is malfunctioning, corrupt and polarized.. The glassing over of abuse and corruption in order to get a quick exit is bad 'nation building'
UON
Junglist Massive
+223|7079

crimson_grunt wrote:

Never saw the program but assuming this is it or at least part of it.
That's part one from last November.  Thanks for the link. 

If anyone finds/uploads part 2 please post.

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