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CommieChipmunk wrote:

lowing wrote:

CommieChipmunk wrote:

They? as in Europe?  We sprinted into Afghanistan right after 9/11.  We were getting ready before then though.  Seems strangely similar to Vietnam if you ask me (Gulf of Tonkin).

If there is an actual chance that we can help people in need and not profit in any way off of it, you bet that America will be no where in sight.

Ya mean like the Berlin Airlift. the Marshall Plan

maybe this article.  http://www.heritage.org/Research/Tradea … /wm630.cfm


I tell ya, everyone hates us, but EXPECTS us to feed the world.........ISOLATIONISM!!!!!

k, we are a hegemony, er we were now I don't know.  But by being the "most powerful nation in the world" you're supposed to help the rest of the world, in my opinion.  This is the only reason I don't think that socialism/communism is a good idea.  Because by being the most powerful nation in the world you have so much that you can make great advances in many different areas.  (Opposed to a world where everyone is equal and no one really has enough).  Unfortunately that power is being wasted on war.


And let me tell ya, everyone hates us, because our politicians are ignorant as hell.  War is the powerful man's sick pleasure.  Is it necessary? nope.. it's childish and immature, but we find ways to make it necessary.

my point being.  war is not always the answer and never should be.  It'll always be better to help people (even if they aren't from your country) than to send young boys to their death.

lowing wrote:

CommieChipmunk wrote:

lowing wrote:

Ya mean like the Berlin Airlift. the Marshall Plan

maybe this article.  http://www.heritage.org/Research/Tradea … /wm630.cfm


I tell ya, everyone hates us, but EXPECTS us to feed the world.........ISOLATIONISM!!!!!

k, we are a hegemony, er we were now I don't know.  But by being the "most powerful nation in the world" you're supposed to help the rest of the world, in my opinion.  This is the only reason I don't think that socialism/communism is a good idea.  Because by being the most powerful nation in the world you have so much that you can make great advances in many different areas.  (Opposed to a world where everyone is equal and no one really has enough).  Unfortunately that power is being wasted on war.


And let me tell ya, everyone hates us, because our politicians are ignorant as hell.  War is the powerful man's sick pleasure.  Is it necessary? nope.. it's childish and immature, but we find ways to make it necessary.

my point being.  war is not always the answer and never should be.  It'll always be better to help people (even if they aren't from your country) than to send young boys to their death.

It also might help if those countries that have their hands out for aid from the US, were not the same countries that are hostile to the US.

Wars were fought long before Bush came to office and will be fought long after he is gone. This isn't a Gene Roddenbury universe here.

I find it hard to understand why anyone would endorsing helping countries that our hostile toward you. Pretty damned stupid.

lowing wrote:

CommieChipmunk wrote:

lowing wrote:

It also might help if those countries that have their hands out for aid from the US, were not the same countries that are hostile to the US.

Wars were fought long before Bush came to office and will be fought long after he is gone. This isn't a Gene Roddenbury universe here.

I find it hard to understand why anyone would endorsing helping countries that our hostile toward you. Pretty damned stupid.

Uhhg.

Okay, this is why I hate politics.  I don't give a shit how hostile the leaders of a country are towards me.  Most leaders do not know shit.  And in the places where the people need our help the most, the leaders are very wealthy and corrupt, the list goes on...  It's the actual people who I care about. 

I guarantee that if you go around giving a starving child food to eat, or saving towns from being mowed down by some chaotic rebel group, you will make many more allies than you will enemies.

funny doesn't seem to be working in Iraq.

CommieChipmunk wrote:

lowing wrote:

CommieChipmunk wrote:

Uhhg.

Okay, this is why I hate politics.  I don't give a shit how hostile the leaders of a country are towards me.  Most leaders do not know shit.  And in the places where the people need our help the most, the leaders are very wealthy and corrupt, the list goes on...  It's the actual people who I care about. 

I guarantee that if you go around giving a starving child food to eat, or saving towns from being mowed down by some chaotic rebel group, you will make many more allies than you will enemies.

funny doesn't seem to be working in Iraq.

hmm.  If I was living in fear of some foreign soldier killing me every day, I sure as hell would want them out

Kmarion wrote:

CommieChipmunk wrote:

And let me tell ya, everyone hates us, because our politicians are ignorant as hell.

It's more than that... much more.

"Europe is in the midst of an identity crisis. They have to deal with their brutal past while being insulted by Americas upstart success. The old continental powers are still far from forgiving us for supplanting them in the strategic arena. If we were as cruel as Europe was in the wake of the twentieth century wars we would be much better liked. The primary goal of Western European societies for the past half century has been to prove the US is as cruel and corrupt as they themselves have been. When your heritage is genocide, wars of aggression, or cowardly surrender the record of the United States can be hard to bear. They cannot avoid measuring themselves against us, but the disparities they discover are so great that Europe's moral delinquents cannot resist comforting themselves with the lies about our purported clumsiness, violence, and crudity without pausing to ask themselves how such a pathetic mediocrities could have built the richest, most powerful, and desirable society in history. When it comes to self examination the heartlands of Europe are simply the Mid-east lite."

Kmarion wrote:

CommieChipmunk wrote:

And let me tell ya, everyone hates us, because our politicians are ignorant as hell.

It's more than that... much more.

"Europe is in the midst of an identity crisis. They have to deal with their brutal past while being insulted by Americas upstart success. The old continental powers are still far from forgiving us for supplanting them in the strategic arena. If we were as cruel as Europe was in the wake of the twentieth century wars we would be much better liked. The primary goal of Western European societies for the past half century has been to prove the US is as cruel and corrupt as they themselves have been. When your heritage is genocide, wars of aggression, or cowardly surrender the record of the United States can be hard to bear. They cannot avoid measuring themselves against us, but the disparities they discover are so great that Europe's moral delinquents cannot resist comforting themselves with the lies about our purported clumsiness, violence, and crudity without pausing to ask themselves how such a pathetic mediocrities could have built the richest, most powerful, and desirable society in history. When it comes to self examination the heartlands of Europe are simply the Mid-east lite."

Fredrik wrote:

1+ for that post Commie

Over here in Europe George Bush and Co has been considered terrorists for quite a while...

Blehm98 wrote:

Drakef wrote:

Blehm98 wrote:

I say next time something really big threatens europe we tell tell them 'tough luck, better luck next time, we decided we won't help out when you guys really need us becuase of the lack of gratitude for our actions...  so yeah'

we have saved the world many times, and sometimes it was very preemptive.  I say we let europe get shredded by some global threat then we find some stupid excuse not to help them.  Then when britain is all thats left we come back and save the world

oh wait, that was world war two...  just we didnt have a stupid excuse, it was fairly good

What has Europe done that is truly so terrible?

"Many times"? "Very preemptive"? I'd love to read this history I have yet to hear of.

well, it all depends if you call WWII, the Cold War, Korean war, and Vietnam wars possible threats to humanity.  I do, as all those wars were faught against one enemy who could have destroyed all of europe with ease.  If it weren't for the US, none of those wars would ahve been won, and all the thanks we have recieved from europe is a bit from some of the brits and nothing but whining and complaining from everyone else.  No matter what america chooses to do, we get screwed, because the world is in a dark age, and the best choices for the world to make right now are not the bad choices and the good choices, more a careful consideration of the bad things the choices will bring and going with that.

I do consider the Iraq war a preemptive strike against terrorism and a possible threat as well, due to Saddam's obvious attempts to get chemical and nuclear weapons, regardless of whether or not you believe he had them

Kmarion wrote:

CommieChipmunk wrote:

And let me tell ya, everyone hates us, because our politicians are ignorant as hell.

It's more than that... much more.

"Europe is in the midst of an identity crisis. They have to deal with their brutal past while being insulted by Americas upstart success. The old continental powers are still far from forgiving us for supplanting them in the strategic arena. If we were as cruel as Europe was in the wake of the twentieth century wars we would be much better liked. The primary goal of Western European societies for the past half century has been to prove the US is as cruel and corrupt as they themselves have been. When your heritage is genocide, wars of aggression, or cowardly surrender the record of the United States can be hard to bear. They cannot avoid measuring themselves against us, but the disparities they discover are so great that Europe's moral delinquents cannot resist comforting themselves with the lies about our purported clumsiness, violence, and crudity without pausing to ask themselves how such a pathetic mediocrities could have built the richest, most powerful, and desirable society in history. When it comes to self examination the heartlands of Europe are simply the Mid-east lite."

Last edited by CameronPoe (2007-01-06 05:41:05)

lowing wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

It's more than that... much more.

"Europe is in the midst of an identity crisis. They have to deal with their brutal past while being insulted by Americas upstart success. The old continental powers are still far from forgiving us for supplanting them in the strategic arena. If we were as cruel as Europe was in the wake of the twentieth century wars we would be much better liked. The primary goal of Western European societies for the past half century has been to prove the US is as cruel and corrupt as they themselves have been. When your heritage is genocide, wars of aggression, or cowardly surrender the record of the United States can be hard to bear. They cannot avoid measuring themselves against us, but the disparities they discover are so great that Europe's moral delinquents cannot resist comforting themselves with the lies about our purported clumsiness, violence, and crudity without pausing to ask themselves how such a pathetic mediocrities could have built the richest, most powerful, and desirable society in history. When it comes to self examination the heartlands of Europe are simply the Mid-east lite."

That's bollocks. America was very much admired here until the last five years or so. I had no preconceived ideas about America when I went there for the first time in 2000. What you printed is just plainly wrong. Besides my country has no imperialistic crimes in it's past. You're generalising - what you should be saying is 'the UK and France' (if anything). The European system of government is designed in such a way that we will never be able to compete economically against USA. If we were so goddamned concerned about our strategic position we'd scrap welfare and adopt the cut-throat capitalism of USA. The fact is we don't aim to be a 'superpower', confirmed by the fact that our system of government could never really allow us to be.

SO when exactly did Europes dream of owning the world end??

YOU "had no preconcieved ideas about America" ? Do you speak for all of Europe now?

The fact is your system of socialized govt., giving everything to everyone for free is going to bankrupt you. Enjoy. Then who ya gunna blame? Already blamed the jews last century, who is next.? Certainly will not be yourselves. America perhaps, the writing is on the wall for this I think.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2007-01-06 05:55:03)