Over Xmas, I was visiting my sister's church which is a denomination of Presbyterian Church USA. Recently their congregation has voted to disassociate from the sect (or whatever its called) and go on its own. In turn, the church and congregation are in a legal battle for who gets the building.
I thought this would be interesting for discussion, this is not a "religion is stupid" thread...think of it as a small, small minority is calling the shots...and the majority is unhappy...put yourself in the shoes of the majority...what would you do?
Background:
-Some info in a recent article that was published in the WSJ:
http://www.standwithus.com/news_post.asp?NPI=859
-Presby USA is somewhat liberal when compared to others for a few reasons, and I think (my opinion) that Presbies allow a lot of flexibility to their flock in terms of allowing variations to spring up from time to time. However, the issues I list below were supported by the leadership of the organization
-Presby USA has been criticized recently for taking an anti-Israeli position (2004) and actively supporting it by providing funds to aid the Hamas and Hezbollah, writing letters congradulating these leaders, and actively participating in anti-Israeli opportunities.
-Presby USA allows gay & lesbians to be church elders (people who make decisions on local functions and support, etc). The next step is they held a vote to decide if they would allow gay & lesbian Pastors, which was defeated by 90% of the voters. Not satisfied, they held the vote again with similar results. The Presby leadership then decided that it would be allowed if the elders voted for it at their local church...which by the way is the same as current - Pastors become Pastors if the elders appoint them. This effectively disregarded the results of the vote.
-The main Presby publishing house was criticized for actively promoting a book that says the US government is directly responsible for the 9/11 attack by funding and planning the entire campaign. The Church apologized but the book has not been removed from it's lineup and has remained a promotional item for many years after the complaint was issued.
-In an attempt to make religion more friendly, Presby USA is hoping to change a few things...probably to make it more politically correct. For instance "The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit" is to be replaced by "The Mother Earth, The Spirit, and Life's Water" or something like that. (Ok, a side note here - this isn't all...so what other changes exist?)
-Nationally, many Presby USA churches have disassociated and went their own way. When this first started happening, the Presby leadership issued a plan for facing up to the possible disassociation of their churches - a memo was sent basically saying step 1) remove the Pastor, 2) remove the Elders (local church governing committee), 3) put people in place that suited their agenda.
So my sister's an elder in her church. People were voicing opinions about supporting the church because their national dues are funding of the above activities. They like their little church but are wondering why nationally their church has become politically active.
So their congregation decides to vote to see if they should disassociate. Someone not in favor of disassociating informs the national governing body. Next, the national organization informs them the pastor will be replaced and a representative will be there shortly to "help guide" the church elders. Instead, the entire congregation votes - 85% to disassociate with 15% against. According to my sister, after talking with each of the 15%, they voted no because "it'll never happen here (gay)" and "the funds went to the Palestians, not to the Hamas/Hez (even though it did)".
So there's a lawsuit to determine who's going to get the building - the congregation or the Church. If the congregation loses...they meet in a school gym until they find a new home.
So I ask you - keep in mind this isn't a "religion sucks" thread - here is a situation where you are a member of an organization who's minority is running the show - 15% or 20% supporting a political agenda you don't support, yet 25% of the money you donate goes to that cause - you and others like you funded building the local church - what do you do? Why don't the other 20% go away instead?
I thought this would be interesting for discussion, this is not a "religion is stupid" thread...think of it as a small, small minority is calling the shots...and the majority is unhappy...put yourself in the shoes of the majority...what would you do?
Background:
-Some info in a recent article that was published in the WSJ:
http://www.standwithus.com/news_post.asp?NPI=859
-Presby USA is somewhat liberal when compared to others for a few reasons, and I think (my opinion) that Presbies allow a lot of flexibility to their flock in terms of allowing variations to spring up from time to time. However, the issues I list below were supported by the leadership of the organization
-Presby USA has been criticized recently for taking an anti-Israeli position (2004) and actively supporting it by providing funds to aid the Hamas and Hezbollah, writing letters congradulating these leaders, and actively participating in anti-Israeli opportunities.
-Presby USA allows gay & lesbians to be church elders (people who make decisions on local functions and support, etc). The next step is they held a vote to decide if they would allow gay & lesbian Pastors, which was defeated by 90% of the voters. Not satisfied, they held the vote again with similar results. The Presby leadership then decided that it would be allowed if the elders voted for it at their local church...which by the way is the same as current - Pastors become Pastors if the elders appoint them. This effectively disregarded the results of the vote.
-The main Presby publishing house was criticized for actively promoting a book that says the US government is directly responsible for the 9/11 attack by funding and planning the entire campaign. The Church apologized but the book has not been removed from it's lineup and has remained a promotional item for many years after the complaint was issued.
-In an attempt to make religion more friendly, Presby USA is hoping to change a few things...probably to make it more politically correct. For instance "The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit" is to be replaced by "The Mother Earth, The Spirit, and Life's Water" or something like that. (Ok, a side note here - this isn't all...so what other changes exist?)
-Nationally, many Presby USA churches have disassociated and went their own way. When this first started happening, the Presby leadership issued a plan for facing up to the possible disassociation of their churches - a memo was sent basically saying step 1) remove the Pastor, 2) remove the Elders (local church governing committee), 3) put people in place that suited their agenda.
So my sister's an elder in her church. People were voicing opinions about supporting the church because their national dues are funding of the above activities. They like their little church but are wondering why nationally their church has become politically active.
So their congregation decides to vote to see if they should disassociate. Someone not in favor of disassociating informs the national governing body. Next, the national organization informs them the pastor will be replaced and a representative will be there shortly to "help guide" the church elders. Instead, the entire congregation votes - 85% to disassociate with 15% against. According to my sister, after talking with each of the 15%, they voted no because "it'll never happen here (gay)" and "the funds went to the Palestians, not to the Hamas/Hez (even though it did)".
So there's a lawsuit to determine who's going to get the building - the congregation or the Church. If the congregation loses...they meet in a school gym until they find a new home.
So I ask you - keep in mind this isn't a "religion sucks" thread - here is a situation where you are a member of an organization who's minority is running the show - 15% or 20% supporting a political agenda you don't support, yet 25% of the money you donate goes to that cause - you and others like you funded building the local church - what do you do? Why don't the other 20% go away instead?