That would be the stupidest thing you could do. Thats how kids get shot, family members and such. Always make sure of your target. FFS i hope you never have the need to use a weapon.Mason4Assassin444 wrote:
Just hypothetically. Say you were sleeping and you heard people poking around your house, naturally you grab your home protection piece and investigate. Upon seeing figures in your living room, you open fire.
With this case, there aren't enough details about the warrant and such so Im not sure what to think. Except, if it were me and I was in her position, I would have opened fire also, probably.
I think that 92 year olds have just as much right to own a firearm, and drive as the rest of us do... I would like however to see a demonstration of weapon proficiency and knowledge of firearm safety be a requirement for firearm ownership. I also think that you should have to retake your road test for your drivers lic periodically as well.HURLEY wrote:
Thats funny!!!
im sorry but wtf is a 92 year old lady doing with a gun? if you cant drive, i dont think you should have a gun ethier.
there are a lot of great ederly drivers out there, but there are also a lot of drivers (young and old) that have no business behind the wheel of a riding lawnmower much less a car.
As the plainclothes Atlanta police officers approached the house about 7 p.m., a woman inside started shooting, striking each of them, said Officer Joe Cobb, a police spokesman.
One was hit in the arm, another in a thigh and the third in a shoulder. The officers were taken to a hospital for treatment, and all three were conscious and alert, police said.
Only the most extreme tree hugger would argue in favor of that senile woman.
One was hit in the arm, another in a thigh and the third in a shoulder. The officers were taken to a hospital for treatment, and all three were conscious and alert, police said.
Only the most extreme tree hugger would argue in favor of that senile woman.
http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/11/22/woman. … index.html
A bit more detailed version now. Apparently she got what she deserved. I stand by the police with the new details. They bought drugs from the house earlier in the day. It sounds like she knew the cops were coming.
A bit more detailed version now. Apparently she got what she deserved. I stand by the police with the new details. They bought drugs from the house earlier in the day. It sounds like she knew the cops were coming.
Something is seriously sus about that story.
America is fucked, every one has the "right" to own a extreamly dangerious weapon. The law gets backed into a corner becasue if they ever have to do this quick house raid or whatever, they are always gonna have to be ready to shoot coz every one could have a gun. Also, when the cops know they have the right to shoot and the suspect could be dangerious, you gonna want to shoot first and ask questions later coz I,pesonally, would rather kill than be killed.
Gee, I guess the moral of this story is: It is better NOT to harbor drugs and drug dealers in your home. That makes you an accomplice.Mason4Assassin444 wrote:
http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/11/22/woman.shot.ap/index.html
I'd like to know this forums opinion on the above story. Are the police justified in thier actions. Even though they may have had the wrong house?
Well.............. no shit.Choclot wrote:
I,pesonally, would rather kill than be killed.
yeah, I wrote that one down, myself.usmarine2005 wrote:
Well.............. no shit.Choclot wrote:
I,pesonally, would rather kill than be killed.
Hmmm, either the police completely f***ed up, or the informant is lying. I mean if he is some "shady" character that would cast a shadow of doubt on his statement. On the other hand, what reason would he have had to lie?
http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/11/28/atlant … index.html
Some interesting excerpts:
"An informant cited in a search warrant as having purchased narcotics at an elderly Atlanta woman's house denies buying drugs there, authorities say."
also:
"The informant also told investigators from the Atlanta police internal affairs bureau that he was told to lie about the matter, the chief said."
It seems she started shooting at them as they were trying to break down the door:
"Authorities said Johnston opened fire on police who tried to enter her home, prying off burglar bars and forcing open her door, during a "no-knock" drug raid."
The entire thing is extremely fishy. I mean would the police seriously try to cover up a botched up operation as the informant claims:
""I'm telling them, I never went to the house," the informant told the station. "The police can't say I ever went to the house.""
His last statement is particularly interesting. Next:
"The informant then said police called him and told him "you need to cover our ass."
"It's all on you -- have to tell them about this Sam dude," the informant said police told him."
HUH? Dumb informant or dumb cops, you tell me.(tbh his story seems a bit farfetched, no cops could be THAT stupid, could they?)
http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/11/28/atlant … index.html
Some interesting excerpts:
"An informant cited in a search warrant as having purchased narcotics at an elderly Atlanta woman's house denies buying drugs there, authorities say."
also:
"The informant also told investigators from the Atlanta police internal affairs bureau that he was told to lie about the matter, the chief said."
It seems she started shooting at them as they were trying to break down the door:
"Authorities said Johnston opened fire on police who tried to enter her home, prying off burglar bars and forcing open her door, during a "no-knock" drug raid."
The entire thing is extremely fishy. I mean would the police seriously try to cover up a botched up operation as the informant claims:
""I'm telling them, I never went to the house," the informant told the station. "The police can't say I ever went to the house.""
His last statement is particularly interesting. Next:
"The informant then said police called him and told him "you need to cover our ass."
"It's all on you -- have to tell them about this Sam dude," the informant said police told him."
HUH? Dumb informant or dumb cops, you tell me.(tbh his story seems a bit farfetched, no cops could be THAT stupid, could they?)
Last edited by Sorcerer0513 (2006-11-28 17:33:03)
the cops did the right thing, good that she killed her
http://www.ajc.com/news/content/metro/a … _html.html
Somebody fucked up.Many questions and conflicting accounts have surfaced since police shot the woman, described by neighbors as feeble and afraid to open her door after dark. At first police said that the drug buy was made by undercover police, but later they said the purchase was made by an informant. Early on, police said narcotics were found at the house after the shooting, but on Sunday investigators said they had found only a small amount of marijuana, which police don't consider a narcotic.
[...]
From the beginning, it has been unclear why police targeted the woman's house, and the affidavit and warrant documents shed little light. The documents do not suggest that police had been keeping the house under surveillance and provide no rationale for entering it other than the informant's alleged buy earlier in the afternoon. The raid did not produce the cocaine, money, computers and other equipment related to the drug business alleged in the affidavit. The documents listed the only resident as Sam, who was described as at least 6 feet tall and 250 to 260 pounds. Johnston's family said she lived alone.
Court officials initially refused to release the affidavits and search warrant even though state law requires that such records be made available immediately. The documents were made public Monday, nearly a week after the incident.
WTF i don't care if she is 92 holy fuck her gun can still kill me... yea man shoot the bitch... WTF is she doing with a gun at 92 years old anyway...heck at that age she could shoot her own son because of memory loss lol...
sounds to me like a nice combination of cop fuckupery(because cops are fuckups), bad luck, bad timing. It makes an all around shitty situation.
-Why were plain clothes officers participating in a raid. Seems like if you're assaulting a house, you should be decked out in tactical gear. In ghetto Atlanta does plain clothes mean baggy pants hanging off your ass and an oversized basketball jersey?
-No-knock warrant. haven't thoroughly researched the subject. what I've read basically says that it involves forcibly entering a space without knocking or announcing your presence and authority. Useful in hostage situations and stand-offs.
-I don't wanna get into a second amendment debate. If she was legally eligable to own a firearm, it's her right, regardless of age. If I lived in the ghetto, I'd be ready with a gun too.
-assuming the cops attempted to enter the house in a "no-knock" fashion, I cant blame the woman for what she did. Those cops obviously weren't very good at their job seeing as an 88 year old woman got the drop on them. Was she justified in attempting to blowing them all to hell? probably. Were the cops justified in blowing her to hell? probably. We'll have to see what the internal investigation turns up.
-If the cops fucked up with their informant or undercover and then tried to B&E this womans house. oops, they get to be shot at. they can shoot back because they're cops, but they should have to deal with possibly manslaughter charges and a big fat wrongful death suit.
-If drugs were being sold from her house then tough luck lady, that's the shit end of the stick for ya. don't know if the cops should have used this no-knock bullshit but you got what was coming.
-Why were plain clothes officers participating in a raid. Seems like if you're assaulting a house, you should be decked out in tactical gear. In ghetto Atlanta does plain clothes mean baggy pants hanging off your ass and an oversized basketball jersey?
-No-knock warrant. haven't thoroughly researched the subject. what I've read basically says that it involves forcibly entering a space without knocking or announcing your presence and authority. Useful in hostage situations and stand-offs.
-I don't wanna get into a second amendment debate. If she was legally eligable to own a firearm, it's her right, regardless of age. If I lived in the ghetto, I'd be ready with a gun too.
-assuming the cops attempted to enter the house in a "no-knock" fashion, I cant blame the woman for what she did. Those cops obviously weren't very good at their job seeing as an 88 year old woman got the drop on them. Was she justified in attempting to blowing them all to hell? probably. Were the cops justified in blowing her to hell? probably. We'll have to see what the internal investigation turns up.
-If the cops fucked up with their informant or undercover and then tried to B&E this womans house. oops, they get to be shot at. they can shoot back because they're cops, but they should have to deal with possibly manslaughter charges and a big fat wrongful death suit.
-If drugs were being sold from her house then tough luck lady, that's the shit end of the stick for ya. don't know if the cops should have used this no-knock bullshit but you got what was coming.
Exactly, That and the Fact that police dont just sneak in and rummage around, They Knock down doors and yell POLICE, Its SOP in search and seasure warrents no matter where. They dont rummage around in the dark in the hopes someone with a weapon might shoot them.CameronPoe wrote:
There is something decidedly suspicious about that story. There isn't enough hard information about what happened to throw light on the whys and wherefores of what happened. It strikes me that if she was killed unjustly or in a botched manner the police would try to clear up the place and report the matter in whatever way pleased them, given that the only witness to events was dead. The jury is out until further notice...
Well she sure was Proficient with a firearm now wasnt she? Wonder where she learned how to use it so well? Maybe from someone wanting her to protect there assets or stash? HmmmmmmmmShadovve wrote:
I think that 92 year olds have just as much right to own a firearm, and drive as the rest of us do... I would like however to see a demonstration of weapon proficiency and knowledge of firearm safety be a requirement for firearm ownership. I also think that you should have to retake your road test for your drivers lic periodically as well.HURLEY wrote:
Thats funny!!!
im sorry but wtf is a 92 year old lady doing with a gun? if you cant drive, i dont think you should have a gun ethier.
there are a lot of great ederly drivers out there, but there are also a lot of drivers (young and old) that have no business behind the wheel of a riding lawnmower much less a car.
ok so what ive gathered so far is they were in essence breaking into her home unannounced?
of course she couldn't possibly be involved with drug sales if you're 92, the union forces dealers to retire at 65
this sounds like a case of bad luck AND partial over-reaction. also, it looks like a) the 92 year old was in a drug house, it's 50-50 that she knew the drugs were there, and so was either a dealer or accessory before the fact ( providing somewhere to store the drugs/ a venue for selling them) or even a co-conspirator, if she provided the venue, and shot at police, what do you expect the police to do? it became an officer down case, and ANY cop would then shoot back. simply to stop other cops being shot, and to prevent anyone else getting hurt. and how the $%&* did she manage to hit 3 COPS? a 92 Yearold woman hitting 3 trained members of law enforcement, what the $%&*.
usmarine2007 wrote:
Approaching the house means setting up for entry. They could have been by the windows, backyard, etc.Mason4Assassin444 wrote:
Ok. They announced themselves, forced open the door, but were shot coming across the yard? THis whole story is screwed up. I wonder what the warrant was for?
A 90 year old dealing narcotics? I guess social security isn't what it used to be.
Sounds to me that they weren't approaching the door. Read the fucking story first.Alone in her home, she was waiting with her gun on Tuesday night when a group of plainclothes officers with a warrant knocked down her door in a search for drugs, police said.
Last edited by Jenkinsbball (2006-11-30 05:51:36)
the autopsy found it in her system as well. this is not a nice place to be, i've had to work there several times, at the jail no less. the only buildings without bars on the windows are burnt down or will be soon. make sure you got plenty of gas before you go cuz you sure as hell don't want to stop.samfink wrote:
this sounds like a case of bad luck AND partial over-reaction. also, it looks like a) the 92 year old was in a drug house, it's 50-50 that she knew the drugs were there, and so was either a dealer or accessory before the fact ( providing somewhere to store the drugs/ a venue for selling them) or even a co-conspirator, if she provided the venue, and shot at police, what do you expect the police to do? it became an officer down case, and ANY cop would then shoot back. simply to stop other cops being shot, and to prevent anyone else getting hurt. and how the $%&* did she manage to hit 3 COPS? a 92 Yearold woman hitting 3 trained members of law enforcement, what the $%&*.
I have read enough of this story to know that we know nothing.Jenkinsbball wrote:
usmarine2007 wrote:
Approaching the house means setting up for entry. They could have been by the windows, backyard, etc.Mason4Assassin444 wrote:
Ok. They announced themselves, forced open the door, but were shot coming across the yard? THis whole story is screwed up. I wonder what the warrant was for?
A 90 year old dealing narcotics? I guess social security isn't what it used to be.Sounds to me that they weren't approaching the door. Read the fucking story first.Alone in her home, she was waiting with her gun on Tuesday night when a group of plainclothes officers with a warrant knocked down her door in a search for drugs, police said.
Also, read which story? The link there now is to an updated version, not the version I read when it was posted.
Last edited by usmarine2007 (2006-11-30 06:12:47)
in her defense it was a no knock warrant, they just bust in yelling "police", of course if a half dozen guys run into your house yelling at the top of their lungs there's a good chance you won't be able to understand them if your 92 and hard of hearing
QFE.Masques wrote:
http://www.ajc.com/news/content/metro/atlanta/stories/2006/11/27/1127metshoot_html.htmlSomebody fucked up.Many questions and conflicting accounts have surfaced since police shot the woman, described by neighbors as feeble and afraid to open her door after dark. At first police said that the drug buy was made by undercover police, but later they said the purchase was made by an informant. Early on, police said narcotics were found at the house after the shooting, but on Sunday investigators said they had found only a small amount of marijuana, which police don't consider a narcotic.
[...]
From the beginning, it has been unclear why police targeted the woman's house, and the affidavit and warrant documents shed little light. The documents do not suggest that police had been keeping the house under surveillance and provide no rationale for entering it other than the informant's alleged buy earlier in the afternoon. The raid did not produce the cocaine, money, computers and other equipment related to the drug business alleged in the affidavit. The documents listed the only resident as Sam, who was described as at least 6 feet tall and 250 to 260 pounds. Johnston's family said she lived alone.
Court officials initially refused to release the affidavits and search warrant even though state law requires that such records be made available immediately. The documents were made public Monday, nearly a week after the incident.
How can any judge issue a search warrant for a house that has not even been under surveillance and without even knowing who lives there ? The information this "raid" was based on seems questionable at least.
sure, the police had the right to fire back when being fired upon, but what do you expect to happen when you break into a house in that neighbourhood ? Why wasn't SWAT there to handle it ?
We don't have all the information, but it stinks...