He was an anarchist. Don't let the romanticism of the film blind you to that.Poseidon wrote:
Actually, it's funny you would even be responding to it, seeing as you'd like an entire religion wiped off the face of the earth.David.P wrote:
Funny you would be posting that.Poseidon wrote:
http://c.myspace.com/Groups/00015/81/24/15684218_l.jpg
I support free speech and everything V (hypothetically) stood for. Freedom.
Who's exactly supporting this? As far as I know, there isn't yet a group of people who are so scared that they will jump at the sound of a door closing that is shouting from the rooftops how much they endorse this research. It's the government people and scientists, from what I gather.B.Schuss wrote:
isn't it ironic how our fellow US board members are always telling us europeans that personal freedoms are held in such high regard in the US, and that it is the job of the government to ensure that those are not being infringed upon; and yet, they support research that is directly opposed to that idea ?
My thoughts are my most private possession. I would not want any government agency to be able to read them. It seems it's only a small step from a democracy to a police state after all...
by "they", I was refering to the US government, not to any US member of the forums. I am pretty sure every decent democrat here would be opposed to these plans. With the government, however, I am not so sure.DesertFox- wrote:
Who's exactly supporting this? As far as I know, there isn't yet a group of people who are so scared that they will jump at the sound of a door closing that is shouting from the rooftops how much they endorse this research. It's the government people and scientists, from what I gather.B.Schuss wrote:
isn't it ironic how our fellow US board members are always telling us europeans that personal freedoms are held in such high regard in the US, and that it is the job of the government to ensure that those are not being infringed upon; and yet, they support research that is directly opposed to that idea ?
My thoughts are my most private possession. I would not want any government agency to be able to read them. It seems it's only a small step from a democracy to a police state after all...
sorry for the confusion, english ain't my first language, it seems.
Americans talk about their guns and all that shit, but they're the ones that are the most willing to give up their freedom for security. IMO, that's what I think from reading posts on this site. Americans are the one's that are always fucking shit scared about XYZ, warning everyone etc.. Americans are the ones that largely support the big government controlling many aspects of life for their own good. That's just my own consensus from reading alot of posts in this section.
Personally, we have to watch ourselves from Islamic Terrorists and the Gov. Both are probably just as bad, infact the Gov have damaged this place more than any Islamic Terrorist could have wished for.
Personally, we have to watch ourselves from Islamic Terrorists and the Gov. Both are probably just as bad, infact the Gov have damaged this place more than any Islamic Terrorist could have wished for.
Freedom of Speech also involves hearing things you dont want to be heard.Poseidon wrote:
Actually, it's funny you would even be responding to it, seeing as you'd like an entire religion wiped off the face of the earth.David.P wrote:
Funny you would be posting that.Poseidon wrote:
http://c.myspace.com/Groups/00015/81/24/15684218_l.jpg
I support free speech and everything V (hypothetically) stood for. Freedom.
Interesting, have a read... http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11945100/David.P wrote:
Freedom of Speech also involves hearing things you dont want to be heard.Poseidon wrote:
Actually, it's funny you would even be responding to it, seeing as you'd like an entire religion wiped off the face of the earth.David.P wrote:
Funny you would be posting that.
I support free speech and everything V (hypothetically) stood for. Freedom.
It's funny how people have interpreted this film in a number of ways. I myself thought of it as an attack on Bush era America and Blair era Britain.
I also thought it wasn't that good.
It's a fucking UNIVERSITY! What the fuck else do they expect people are going to do?It uses algorithms to analyze streaming video and detect suspicious activities, such as people loitering in a secure area, a group converging or someone leaving a package unattended.
I wouldn't say he was an anarchist as much as a freedom fighter. It wasn't that he didn't want a government at all, just not a fascist one.Flaming_Maniac wrote:
He was an anarchist. Don't let the romanticism of the film blind you to that.Poseidon wrote:
Actually, it's funny you would even be responding to it, seeing as you'd like an entire religion wiped off the face of the earth.David.P wrote:
Funny you would be posting that.
I support free speech and everything V (hypothetically) stood for. Freedom.
You're right, he did such a good job of setting up a new government after tearing the old one down. Freedom is many times a euphemism for anarchy.ghettoperson wrote:
I wouldn't say he was an anarchist as much as a freedom fighter. It wasn't that he didn't want a government at all, just not a fascist one.Flaming_Maniac wrote:
He was an anarchist. Don't let the romanticism of the film blind you to that.Poseidon wrote:
Actually, it's funny you would even be responding to it, seeing as you'd like an entire religion wiped off the face of the earth.
I support free speech and everything V (hypothetically) stood for. Freedom.
Any government is better than no government at all.
It's called 'The UK'.Pubic wrote:
By Nita Farahany
Sunday, April 13, 2008; Page B03
Imagine a world of streets lined with video cameras that alert authorities to any suspicious activity. A world where police officers can read the minds of potential criminals and arrest them before they commit any crimes. A world in which a suspect who lies under questioning gets nabbed immediately because his brain has given him away.
Did you actually watch the movie? From what I remember it didn't end up with 'and they all lived happily ever after without a government'. Personally, I'd much rather not have a government than be ruled by the British 1984-esque version of the Nazi's.Flaming_Maniac wrote:
You're right, he did such a good job of setting up a new government after tearing the old one down. Freedom is many times a euphemism for anarchy.ghettoperson wrote:
I wouldn't say he was an anarchist as much as a freedom fighter. It wasn't that he didn't want a government at all, just not a fascist one.Flaming_Maniac wrote:
He was an anarchist. Don't let the romanticism of the film blind you to that.
Any government is better than no government at all.
...God, you really need to be banned from either posting in this specific forum or from BF2s in general. You can never make a serious point, and when you try to, you fail miserably.David.P wrote:
Freedom of Speech also involves hearing things you dont want to be heard.Poseidon wrote:
Actually, it's funny you would even be responding to it, seeing as you'd like an entire religion wiped off the face of the earth.David.P wrote:
Funny you would be posting that.Poseidon wrote:
http://c.myspace.com/Groups/00015/81/24/15684218_l.jpg
I support free speech and everything V (hypothetically) stood for. Freedom.
Exactly. They leave it for interpretation. I'm pretty sure V knew that an anarchistic government would lead to even more death and destruction. He knew that the people would set up their own government.ghettoperson wrote:
Did you actually watch the movie? From what I remember it didn't end up with 'and they all lived happily ever after without a government'. Personally, I'd much rather not have a government than be ruled by the British 1984-esque version of the Nazi's.Flaming_Maniac wrote:
You're right, he did such a good job of setting up a new government after tearing the old one down. Freedom is many times a euphemism for anarchy.ghettoperson wrote:
I wouldn't say he was an anarchist as much as a freedom fighter. It wasn't that he didn't want a government at all, just not a fascist one.
Any government is better than no government at all.
Inciting a massive demonstration (and probably rioting) and blowing up a building is by today's standards terrorism. People cannot go around blowing things up whenever they do not agree with the government, it doesn't lend itself to anything productive.
So, in keeping with recent DAST times, is V a patriot?
So, in keeping with recent DAST times, is V a patriot?
Perhaps you missed his most famous quote.Flaming_Maniac wrote:
Inciting a massive demonstration (and probably rioting) and blowing up a building is by today's standards terrorism. People cannot go around blowing things up whenever they do not agree with the government, it doesn't lend itself to anything productive.
So, in keeping with recent DAST times, is V a patriot?
"...A building is a symbol, as is the act of destroying it. Symbols are given power by people. A symbol, in and of itself is powerless, but with enough people behind it, blowing up a building can change the world. "
And yes, I view him as a patriot. He'd do whatever it took to ensure that his country became free once again.
1) McVeigh is (moar like was amirite) real, V is a fictional characterFlaming_Maniac wrote:
DAST Disagrees
2) McVeigh lived in the US... V lived in a fictional totalitarian police state where even the slightest thought of dissent would result in ass-rape by men in riot gear
3) AFAIK, V only killed the baddies and the puppets of the baddies. McVeigh killed innocents... he killed babies.
I don't even know why we're arguing this. V's a freakin movie character.
also FM, ATG would have a word with you
Last edited by HurricaИe (2008-04-15 18:41:45)
As Hurrocon said, and;HurricaИe wrote:
1) McVeigh is (moar like was amirite) real, V is a fictional characterFlaming_Maniac wrote:
DAST Disagrees
2) McVeigh lived in the US... V lived in a fictional totalitarian police state where even the slightest thought of dissent would result in ass-rape by men in riot gear
3) AFAIK, V only killed the baddies and the puppets of the baddies. McVeigh killed innocents... he killed babies.
I don't even know why we're arguing this. V's a freakin movie character.
also FM, ATG would have a word with you
McVeigh killed innocent people. Children. You'd never see V do that. Ever. Not in the comic books, not in the movie. If I went and killed Bush (brbfbi) on my own saying I did it for the better of my country, would I be seen as a patriot? Hell no. If 95% of the USA went to D.C., stormed the white house and killed Bush, would it be considered Heroic and patriotic? Yep. That's what V was saying. Alone, blowing up a building is just a symbol. But when they blew up parliament...he did it with the help of everyone.
V is different in the actual comic. The movie V is much more user friendly to appeal to the masses.
Well of course. But the basic message is still brought out.DesertFox- wrote:
V is different in the actual comic. The movie V is much more user friendly to appeal to the masses.
When you say help, you mean stood there and watched right?
V wasn't there in that sceneFlaming_Maniac wrote:
http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g44/F … iecook.jpg
When you say help, you mean stood there and watched right?
I've seen this like a trillion times don't argue The girl was shot by one of the secret police. So then the townspeople who saw him do that ganged up on him and presumably killed him... with a large metal pipe.
Flinch wrote:
No, it was a feeling. But I can guess. With so much chaos, someone will do something stupid. And when they do, things will turn nasty. And then Sutler will be forced to do the only thing he knows how to do. At which point, all V needs to do is keep his word. And then...
it's "finch" ya nabFlaming_Maniac wrote:
Flinch wrote:
No, it was a feeling. But I can guess. With so much chaos, someone will do something stupid. And when they do, things will turn nasty. And then Sutler will be forced to do the only thing he knows how to do. At which point, all V needs to do is keep his word. And then...
The "stupid" part was the secret police killing that girl. Then things got nasty, aka people started rioting. So then Sutler was like "no u" and sent out the entire fuckin British Army. So then V was like "lulz" and bombed Parliament.
Whats the Matter cant take criticism and disagreement? So you need to Eliminate the 'threat.'Poseidon wrote:
...God, you really need to be banned from either posting in this specific forum or from BF2s in general. You can never make a serious point, and when you try to, you fail miserably.
let me spell it out for youHurricaИe wrote:
it's "finch" ya nabFlaming_Maniac wrote:
Flinch wrote:
No, it was a feeling. But I can guess. With so much chaos, someone will do something stupid. And when they do, things will turn nasty. And then Sutler will be forced to do the only thing he knows how to do. At which point, all V needs to do is keep his word. And then...
The "stupid" part was the secret police killing that girl. Then things got nasty, aka people started rioting. So then Sutler was like "no u" and sent out the entire fuckin British Army. So then V was like "lulz" and bombed Parliament.
V knew people were going to get hurt. That was his entire intention when he sent out the boxes and boxes of costumes and masks. He was inciting the people as a whole to push the boundaries across the nation like he, as one person, couldn't do, in a subtle fashion. Individually nothing radically different than normal, but as a whole a visible movement. Someone would do something stupid, and the guard shot the girl as you said. V set that up. He didn't know exactly how or where it was going to happen, but he knew somewhere the state and the mob would collide, and things would turn ugly. After that incident he could escalate the people as a whole easily, for they will have turned completely from their government to V to look for guidance.
V was completely negligent from any moral responsibility he had to keep the people he was leading to a revolution safe. That negligence manifested itself in a child's death.