Poll
Manmade Global Warming or Bad Luck?
| We are to blame | 58% | 58% - 21 | ||||
| Evacuate Europe | 41% | 41% - 15 | ||||
| Total: 36 | ||||||
who gives a shit? I've given up. Even if it is our fault no one will ever do anything about it because we're an ignorant species and need catastrophe to even think about changing our daily routines.
I agree, but its no reason to give up. You can atleast poluteless thus helping the local enviroment. Eg recycle, save energy/money.CommieChipmunk wrote:
who gives a shit? I've given up. Even if it is our fault no one will ever do anything about it because we're an ignorant species and need catastrophe to even think about changing our daily routines.
I can't find a reason why polluting less is a bad thing, regardless of global warming. If we could stop all mechanical CO2 production tomorrow, I doubt we would be able to reverse/halt the warming trend fast enough for it to matter. The real danger, as most of us know, is an ice-age. If enough fresh water melts to shut down the north Atlantic current, then goodbye to the good old days.
Fires, eh. Wouldn't it help if countries cleared out their fucking underbrush? Doesn't have to be all gone, but carve some breaks ffs.
Last edited by unnamednewbie13 (2007-08-02 21:47:34)
Seemingly easy, but a lot of these places don't have a historical need for such things. Furthermore, places like Greece don't have the enormous land area that we are lucky to have. America has many gigantic wildfires raging as we speak, but we are lucky enough to have far less dense of a population where the human cost is far less.unnamednewbie13 wrote:
Fires, eh. Wouldn't it help if countries cleared out their fucking underbrush? Doesn't have to be all gone, but carve some breaks ffs.
blame U.S. and China we are the top 2 nations who produce most carbon dioxide.
China produces it more in on overall value, but U.S. produces more per person value.
China produces it more in on overall value, but U.S. produces more per person value.
Last edited by blademaster (2007-08-02 22:03:29)
Righto!CommieChipmunk wrote:
who gives a shit? I've given up. Even if it is our fault no one will ever do anything about it because we're an ignorant species and need catastrophe to even think about changing our daily routines.
thats kind of true lol good pointweerdfoo1 wrote:
Righto!CommieChipmunk wrote:
who gives a shit? I've given up. Even if it is our fault no one will ever do anything about it because we're an ignorant species and need catastrophe to even think about changing our daily routines.
The only thing I'm worried about Global Warming is whether the Atlantic warms up enough for all the Methane stored on the sea floor to bubble up to the surface.
We should be mining that right now to depleate the reserves.
Getting warmer, to me, is actually good.
Also I believe that human influence is lower than we think (1 volcano puts most stuff in the ozone than we do for years). The cycles of the sun, with the slightly elliptical orbit of the earth around the sun matter more.
We should be mining that right now to depleate the reserves.
Getting warmer, to me, is actually good.
Also I believe that human influence is lower than we think (1 volcano puts most stuff in the ozone than we do for years). The cycles of the sun, with the slightly elliptical orbit of the earth around the sun matter more.
In 2006, a team of scientists from the United States, Germany, and Switzerland presented results showing no net increase of brightness over the last thousand years. Solar cycles lead to a small increase of 0.07% in brightness over the last 30 years. This effect is far too minute to contribute significantly to global warming. A 2007 paper by Lockwood and Fröhlich further confirms the lack of a correlation between solar output and global warming for the time since 1985. Source.Harmor wrote:
The cycles of the sun, with the slightly elliptical orbit of the earth around the sun matter more.
Sure, the Earth's orbit has been elliptical while global warming has occurred, it has also been elliptical for a very long time. Be careful drawing those sorts of conclusions-- it is bad science. Clearly the number of pirates on the planet is correlated with global temperature.
Correlation != Causation.
While I believe that a lot of global warming is fear mongering, there is truth to it.
Much of our wildfires are carried on the backs of our own mismanaged brush. I'm not saying we're better than Europe in that regard.liquix wrote:
Seemingly easy, but a lot of these places don't have a historical need for such things. Furthermore, places like Greece don't have the enormous land area that we are lucky to have. America has many gigantic wildfires raging as we speak, but we are lucky enough to have far less dense of a population where the human cost is far less.unnamednewbie13 wrote:
Fires, eh. Wouldn't it help if countries cleared out their fucking underbrush? Doesn't have to be all gone, but carve some breaks ffs.
In the same article your used as a Source it says:SenorToenails wrote:
Correlation != Causation.
While I believe that a lot of global warming is fear mongering, there is truth to it.
However the researchers concluded this:However, some research has suggested that the Sun's contribution may have been underestimated. Two researchers at Duke University have estimated that the Sun may have contributed about 40–50% of the global surface temperature warming over the period 1900–2000, and about 25–35% between 1980 and 2000.[27] Stott and coauthors suggest that climate models overestimate the relative effect of greenhouse gases compared to solar forcing; they also suggest that the cooling effects of volcanic dust and sulfate aerosols have been underestimated.[28]
Which contradicts what they just said.Nevertheless, they conclude that even with an enhanced climate sensitivity to solar forcing, most of the warming during the latest decades is attributable to the increases in greenhouse gases.
Confusing.
Null vote.
It happens pretty much every summer.
It happens pretty much every summer.
lol!Scorpion0x17 wrote:
Null vote.
It happens pretty much every summer.
Actually, I was being serious.CommieChipmunk wrote:
lol!Scorpion0x17 wrote:
Null vote.
It happens pretty much every summer.
The flooding in the UK is a little unusual, though not completely unprecedented, and droughts and fires happen in Europe just about every year. We have much warmer summers than places in the US at the same latitude. It's all to do with the Gulf Stream.
(And the flooding in the UK is due to the Jet Stream being slightly further south than 'normal')
Ireland broke a new record this year. We've racked up more days of continuous rain than we did last winter. This has been the worst summer ever - it has rained every single goddamned day - EVERY ONE! Apparently it's because the jet stream has shifted from passing to the north of Ireland to cutting right through Northern France.
Heading to Prague this evening which is apparently hot and sunny...hooray!
Heading to Prague this evening which is apparently hot and sunny...hooray!
Last edited by CameronPoe (2007-08-03 01:34:00)
The volcanos thing is just a weird myth that seems to be going around, it's a complete load of crap. Volcanos put a grand total of a hundreth of the amount of CO2 in the atmosphere that we do. http://www.bgs.ac.uk/programmes/landres … utions.pdfHarmor wrote:
Also I believe that human influence is lower than we think (1 volcano puts most stuff in the ozone than we do for years). The cycles of the sun, with the slightly elliptical orbit of the earth around the sun matter more.
Ok, as we're doing another global warming thread could all man made global warming sceptics please read this website, it shows the falacy of most of the popular arguments against man-made global warming using lots of science, data and links to sources. It's not the sun, it's not a natural cycle, warming won't make the planet nicer and there never was a global cooling theory. http://environment.newscientist.com/cha … th/dn11462
I know, I just think it's funny how things get blown out of proportion whenever the weather guys say something..Scorpion0x17 wrote:
Actually, I was being serious.CommieChipmunk wrote:
lol!Scorpion0x17 wrote:
Null vote.
It happens pretty much every summer.
The flooding in the UK is a little unusual, though not completely unprecedented, and droughts and fires happen in Europe just about every year. We have much warmer summers than places in the US at the same latitude. It's all to do with the Gulf Stream.
(And the flooding in the UK is due to the Jet Stream being slightly further south than 'normal')
If you read the referenced paper, it is much clearer.Harmor wrote:
Which contradicts what they just said.
Confusing.
Essentially, they say that the effect of the sun's cycles is probably underestimated in the current climate models.
Then they go on to say that the current models themselves are inherently inaccurate because the various factors in play are not fully understood, and that their proposed model is better. Note: TSI = total solar irradianceThese findings would confirm that anthropogenic-added climate forcing might have progressively played a dominant role in climate change during the last century and, in particular, during the last decades. The sun played a dominant role in climate change in the early past, as several empirical studies would suggest [Hoyt and Schatten, 1997; Eddy, 1976; Crowley and Kim, 1996; Lassen and Friis-Christensen, 1995], and is still playing a significant, even if not a predominant role, during the last decades.
Conclusion: The sun plays a larger role than thought at the time (2005). But, man still has blame.The significant discrepancy between empirical and theoretical model estimates might arise because the secular TSI proxy reconstructions are disputed and/or because the empirical evidence deriving from the deconstruction of the surface temperature is deceptive for reasons unknown to us. Alternatively, the models might be inadequate because of the difficulty of modeling climate in general and a lack of knowledge of climate sensitivity to solar variations in particular. In fact, theoretical models usually acknowledge as solar forcing only the direct TSI forcing while empirical estimates would include all direct and indirect climate effects induced by solar variation. These solar effects might be embedded in several climate forcings because, for example, a TSI increase might indirectly induce a change in the chemistry of the atmosphere by increasing and modulating its greenhouse gas (H2O, CO2, CH4, etc.) concentration because of the warmer ocean, reduce the earth albedo by melting the glaciers and change the cloud cover patterns. In particular, the models might be inadequate [Lean, 2005]: (a) in their parameterizations of climate feedbacks and atmosphere-ocean coupling; (b) in their neglect of indirect response by the stratosphere and of possible additional climate effects linked to solar magnetic field, UV radiation, solar flares and cosmic ray intensity modulations; (c) there might be other possible natural amplification mechanisms deriving from internal modes of climate variability which are not included in the models. All the above mechanisms would be automatically considered and indirectly included in the phenomenological approach presented herein.
Meh, we had super hot summers and bad weather decades ago, that's why the say it was the worst flood since 1956 or something, in other words where was the global warming catastrophe during that time? Global warming is an inevitable natural process that has always happened, its not manmade, it is possibly accelerated by man but the whole system of global heating and cooling is natural.
Well think about it, that plus the stuff we put out, damn, thats a lot of stuff in our atmosphere.Harmor wrote:
1 volcano puts most stuff in the ozone than we do for years.
Where is the 'select both' option?
I know that where i am its been the worst 3 months for rain since records began in about 1756 (round about there anyway its 1750something). as it is there's not much we can do apart from try to become greener and stop pumping out so much greenhouse gases so hopefully the global warming will not cause those massive methane pockets under the north sea to rise as if they rise into the atmosphere then nothing we do will make any difference. oh and we also need to secure the land there is for floods in places like holland and other low lying countries and just plain leave new orleans alone as its going to go tits up (more so than usual anyway) if the sea level does rise due to it being below sea level and the large river.
volcanoes don't produce that much carbon dioxide its more the fact that they release huge amounts of sulphur dioxide when the erupt thats the problem.
focus magazine and the national geographic are both great learning tools.
volcanoes don't produce that much carbon dioxide its more the fact that they release huge amounts of sulphur dioxide when the erupt thats the problem.
focus magazine and the national geographic are both great learning tools.
WRONG! 1 volcano DOES NOT! put more co2 into the atmosphere than humans in a year. Seriously you guys just get fed this bullshit and swallow it down. How about you go and read a god damn book about the subject before you try to comment on it.Harmor wrote:
The only thing I'm worried about Global Warming is whether the Atlantic warms up enough for all the Methane stored on the sea floor to bubble up to the surface.
We should be mining that right now to depleate the reserves.
Getting warmer, to me, is actually good.
Also I believe that human influence is lower than we think (1 volcano puts most stuff in the ozone than we do for years). The cycles of the sun, with the slightly elliptical orbit of the earth around the sun matter more.
This kind of ignorance realy pisses me off and is the reason for this attitude in the first place.
Last edited by Vilham (2007-08-03 08:06:03)