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2007-03-17 19:17:56
ATG
Banned
+5,233|6957|Global Command
Iraqis: life is getting better:   http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/w … 530762.ece

Times online wrote:

MOST Iraqis believe life is better for them now than it was under Saddam Hussein, according to a British opinion poll published today.

The survey of more than 5,000 Iraqis found the majority optimistic despite their suffering in sectarian violence since the American-led invasion four years ago this week.
Thank the Gods, some positive press!

Hopefully this was not all in vain.
http://apnews.myway.com/article/20070317/D8NTSS3O0.html

Last edited by ATG (2007-03-17 20:09:02)

2007-03-17 19:21:20
blademaster
I'm moving to Brazil
+2,075|7073
this is close to where I live have not seen it on local news let me turn on the TV lol

by the way do u have an myway e-mail account

Last edited by blademaster (2007-03-17 19:23:23)

2007-03-17 19:24:09
Havok
Nymphomaniac Treatment Specialist
+302|7103|Florida, United States

Were those 5,000 Iraqi's at gunpoint when questioned?
2007-03-17 19:24:23
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6833|North Carolina
That smallpox thing is scary....

As for Iraq, I'm glad the people are optimistic, because they're gonna need a lot of hope over the next decade or so....

Invading Iraq was not necessarily in vain for the Iraqi people, but I'd suggest that it had very little relevance to America.
2007-03-17 19:32:37
Bubbalo
The Lizzard
+541|6989

Havok wrote:

Were those 5,000 Iraqi's at gunpoint when questioned?
Nice sig......................
2007-03-17 19:34:50
ATG
Banned
+5,233|6957|Global Command

Bubbalo wrote:

Havok wrote:

Were those 5,000 Iraqi's at gunpoint when questioned?
Nice sig......................
Stay on topic and don't spam my thread or I will offer karma for a week to the first mod that bans you.
https://i18.tinypic.com/2w68fug.gif
2007-03-17 19:36:23
Bubbalo
The Lizzard
+541|6989

ATG wrote:

Bubbalo wrote:

Havok wrote:

Were those 5,000 Iraqi's at gunpoint when questioned?
Nice sig......................
Stay on topic and don't spam my thread or I will offer karma for a week to the first mod that bans you.
http://i18.tinypic.com/2w68fug.gif
Yes, because I wasn't at all pointing out the hypocrisy of his statement.


The first thing I say in weeks that doesn't take a diametrically opposite stance to you, and you try to get me banned.
2007-03-17 19:41:03
ATG
Banned
+5,233|6957|Global Command

Bubbalo wrote:

ATG wrote:

Bubbalo wrote:


Nice sig......................
Stay on topic and don't spam my thread or I will offer karma for a week to the first mod that bans you.
http://i18.tinypic.com/2w68fug.gif
Yes, because I wasn't at all pointing out the hypocrisy of his statement.


The first thing I say in weeks that doesn't take a diametrically opposite stance to you, and you try to get me banned.
I wouldn't do that Lizard.
What would the forums be without your diametrically opposite from everybodies viewpoint.
2007-03-17 19:44:03
Havok
Nymphomaniac Treatment Specialist
+302|7103|Florida, United States

Bubbalo wrote:

ATG wrote:

Bubbalo wrote:

Nice sig......................
Stay on topic and don't spam my thread or I will offer karma for a week to the first mod that bans you.
http://i18.tinypic.com/2w68fug.gif
Yes, because I wasn't at all pointing out the hypocrisy of his statement.


The first thing I say in weeks that doesn't take a diametrically opposite stance to you, and you try to get me banned.
I wouldn't call it hypocritical, because it actually supports my statement. (even though I did that on accident)  I highly doubt that the majority of Iraqi's think their lives are better now that Saddam is gone.  There's the same amount if not more violence in Baghdad, the only differences are the people who are causing it.  I believe there are some variables in this poll that aren't being publicized.

Last edited by Havok (2007-03-17 19:45:33)

2007-03-17 19:44:45
ATG
Banned
+5,233|6957|Global Command

Havok wrote:

Bubbalo wrote:

ATG wrote:


Stay on topic and don't spam my thread or I will offer karma for a week to the first mod that bans you.
http://i18.tinypic.com/2w68fug.gif
Yes, because I wasn't at all pointing out the hypocrisy of his statement.


The first thing I say in weeks that doesn't take a diametrically opposite stance to you, and you try to get me banned.
I wouldn't call it hypocritical, because it actually supports my statement. (even though I did that on accident)  I highly doubt that the majority of Iraqi's think their lives are better now that Saddam is gone.  There's the same amount if not more violence in Baghdad, the only difference is the persons who are causing it.  I believe there are some variables in this poll that aren't being publicized.
So you are saying that the story is a lie?
2007-03-17 19:48:56
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7029|132 and Bush

Bad link in OP?
Xbone Stormsurgezz
2007-03-17 19:49:53
Havok
Nymphomaniac Treatment Specialist
+302|7103|Florida, United States

ATG wrote:

Havok wrote:

Bubbalo wrote:


Yes, because I wasn't at all pointing out the hypocrisy of his statement.


The first thing I say in weeks that doesn't take a diametrically opposite stance to you, and you try to get me banned.
I wouldn't call it hypocritical, because it actually supports my statement. (even though I did that on accident)  I highly doubt that the majority of Iraqi's think their lives are better now that Saddam is gone.  There's the same amount if not more violence in Baghdad, the only difference is the persons who are causing it.  I believe there are some variables in this poll that aren't being publicized.
So you are saying that the story is a lie?
I'm saying that there was some incentive for the polled Iraqi's to vote that way.  Or so I believe anyway.  I just can't see how they would vote this way.  When Saddam had power, he killed thousands.  We know that, but I'd assume that the majority of Iraqi's were not directly affected by Saddam's tortures unless they defied the government.  Now that we've taken over, suicide bombings are destroying much of Baghdad.  I recall reading in an article a while back that most of the stores in Baghdad don't even open for business anymore for fear of suicide bombers blowing them up.  Blowing up stores directly affects the lives of the people who own them and who shop there.  Therefore, I believe their lives are worse.

But that's all my opinion.  Take it for what it's worth.
2007-03-17 19:51:05
{M5}Sniper3
Typical white person.
+389|7188|San Antonio, Texas

Kmarion wrote:

Bad link in OP?
Probably.


Havok wrote:

I'm saying that there was some incentive for the polled Iraqi's to vote that way.  Or so I believe anyway.  I just can't see how they would vote this way.  When Saddam had power, he killed thousands.  We know that, but I'd assume that the majority of Iraqi's were not directly affected by Saddam's tortures unless they defied the government.  Now that we've taken over, suicide bombings are destroying much of Baghdad.  I recall reading in an article a while back that most of the stores in Baghdad don't even open for business anymore for fear of suicide bombers blowing them up.  Blowing up stores directly affects the lives of the people who own them and who shop there.  Therefore, I believe their lives are worse.

But that's all my opinion.  Take it for what it's worth.
You just have to think which is better. Your own dictator killing you and noone doing anything about it, or your own people killing you with someone there trying to stop the violence.

Last edited by {M5}Sniper3 (2007-03-17 19:54:03)

2007-03-17 19:56:10
Havok
Nymphomaniac Treatment Specialist
+302|7103|Florida, United States

{M5}Sniper3 wrote:

Havok wrote:

I'm saying that there was some incentive for the polled Iraqi's to vote that way.  Or so I believe anyway.  I just can't see how they would vote this way.  When Saddam had power, he killed thousands.  We know that, but I'd assume that the majority of Iraqi's were not directly affected by Saddam's tortures unless they defied the government.  Now that we've taken over, suicide bombings are destroying much of Baghdad.  I recall reading in an article a while back that most of the stores in Baghdad don't even open for business anymore for fear of suicide bombers blowing them up.  Blowing up stores directly affects the lives of the people who own them and who shop there.  Therefore, I believe their lives are worse.

But that's all my opinion.  Take it for what it's worth.
You just have to think which is better. Your own dictator killing you and noone doing anything about it, or your own people killing you with someone there trying to stop the violence.
That's a good point and I will concede my argument.  I still wouldn't call it better by any noticeable stretch, though.
2007-03-17 19:58:44
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6833|North Carolina

{M5}Sniper3 wrote:

Havok wrote:

I'm saying that there was some incentive for the polled Iraqi's to vote that way.  Or so I believe anyway.  I just can't see how they would vote this way.  When Saddam had power, he killed thousands.  We know that, but I'd assume that the majority of Iraqi's were not directly affected by Saddam's tortures unless they defied the government.  Now that we've taken over, suicide bombings are destroying much of Baghdad.  I recall reading in an article a while back that most of the stores in Baghdad don't even open for business anymore for fear of suicide bombers blowing them up.  Blowing up stores directly affects the lives of the people who own them and who shop there.  Therefore, I believe their lives are worse.

But that's all my opinion.  Take it for what it's worth.
You just have to think which is better. Your own dictator killing you and noone doing anything about it, or your own people killing you with someone there trying to stop the violence.
I'll take the dictator, personally...

Nevertheless, some good points are being made by both of you.
2007-03-17 20:02:48
Blehm98
conservative hatemonger
+150|6891|meh-land
What you have to look at is that although you are still at risk of death every day in Iraq, this is not what the poll is about.  The poll is saying that the average person is better off, even if they have a higher chance of dying than before...

you guys tie the idea that how well off you are is how high of a chance you will die for whatever reason...


sorry if this post makes no sense, i need to get warmed up...
2007-03-17 20:09:02
{M5}Sniper3
Typical white person.
+389|7188|San Antonio, Texas

Blehm98 wrote:

What you have to look at is that although you are still at risk of death every day in Iraq, this is not what the poll is about.  The poll is saying that the average person is better off, even if they have a higher chance of dying than before...

you guys tie the idea that how well off you are is how high of a chance you will die for whatever reason...


sorry if this post makes no sense, i need to get warmed up...
I see what you mean, but it would be better if re-phased.

I have not seen many numbers comparing how many more deaths of Iraqi citizens there were with Saddam out of power then how many were killed when he was in power. If someone could find that I think it will help the debate in this thread.
2007-03-17 20:09:19
ATG
Banned
+5,233|6957|Global Command

Kmarion wrote:

Bad link in OP?
Whoops.


Fixed.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/w … 530762.ece
2007-03-17 21:58:51
Spearhead
Gulf coast redneck hippy
+731|7118|Tampa Bay Florida
What's even more astonishing is the fact that not one American has been killed in Kurdistan since the invasion.  (or some other ridiculously small number).  The Kurds have their own defense forces, their own little economy, and I've heard there are only 50 or so Americans stationed in Kurdistan.

If only all the Iraqis could live like the Kurds.
2007-03-17 22:36:33
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6833|North Carolina
No kidding...  The Kurds should have their own country.  Fuck what Turkey says...
2007-03-17 22:48:44
Spearhead
Gulf coast redneck hippy
+731|7118|Tampa Bay Florida

Turquoise wrote:

No kidding...  The Kurds should have their own country.  Fuck what Turkey says...
Fuck Turkey, hell yeah. 

IMO it's time for the EU and USA to tell Turkey "The Kurds get their own state, or you get no membership"
2007-03-17 22:52:11
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6833|North Carolina

Spearhead wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

No kidding...  The Kurds should have their own country.  Fuck what Turkey says...
Fuck Turkey, hell yeah. 

IMO it's time for the EU and USA to tell Turkey "The Kurds get their own state, or you get no membership"
I totally agree....
2007-03-17 23:10:15
Commie Killer
Member
+192|6815

Turquoise wrote:

Spearhead wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

No kidding...  The Kurds should have their own country.  Fuck what Turkey says...
Fuck Turkey, hell yeah. 

IMO it's time for the EU and USA to tell Turkey "The Kurds get their own state, or you get no membership"
I totally agree....
Yeah, the Kurds up North in Iraq are doing extremely well, I kinda admire them for how good they are doing and how they can live off themselves almost.
2007-03-17 23:12:19
ATG
Banned
+5,233|6957|Global Command

Commie Killer wrote:

Turquoise wrote:

Spearhead wrote:


Fuck Turkey, hell yeah. 

IMO it's time for the EU and USA to tell Turkey "The Kurds get their own state, or you get no membership"
I totally agree....
Yeah, the Kurds up North in Iraq are doing extremely well, I kinda admire them for how good they are doing and how they can live off themselves almost.
Too bad turkey will not let them live in peace. You watch, one of the first things that will happen when we pullout, as per the dems demands, is that Turkey will invade.
2007-03-17 23:16:16
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6833|North Carolina

ATG wrote:

Commie Killer wrote:

Turquoise wrote:


I totally agree....
Yeah, the Kurds up North in Iraq are doing extremely well, I kinda admire them for how good they are doing and how they can live off themselves almost.
Too bad turkey will not let them live in peace. You watch, one of the first things that will happen when we pullout, as per the dems demands, is that Turkey will invade.
I doubt that...  Iran is the one most likely to invade Iraq.  Turkey would likely have to make some kind of agreement with Iran to invade Northern Iraq, and doing so would guarantee that they wouldn't be allowed into the EU.  Whether Turkey wants to admit it or not, losing the ability to enter EU would be a major blow to their economic potential.

 

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