For fuck's sake... Look at the monster I've created! Someone trap this thread in a windmill and set it on fire! PLEASE!
no, its not becoming an atheist. it was a mistake you did when arguing.Havok wrote:
Please inform me what I have done. If you mean becoming an atheist, then I have no regrets.stef10 wrote:
and havoc you call that statement childish.
well, then you clearly dont understand what u did.
look into it.
take all your previous posts when you talked to me and then compare it to the post where you said you would play my game and proof that moses did not exist. its very hard to see but you will get it.
Damn, that was prophetic statement. Hail Chipmunk!CommieChipmunk from 7 months ago wrote:
Good Lord. We all know that this debate will go on forever.
Like I said uber-derailed. Even though I think the current discussion is a more interesting one than the original thread.RedTwizzler wrote:
For fuck's sake... Look at the monster I've created! Someone trap this thread in a windmill and set it on fire! PLEASE!
yeah, actually its commenly derailed by me starting a huge discussion with Cameronpoe.
Proving things doesn't really work like that. The burden of proof is upon the one making the claim.stef10 wrote:
no, its not becoming an atheist. it was a mistake you did when arguing.Havok wrote:
Please inform me what I have done. If you mean becoming an atheist, then I have no regrets.stef10 wrote:
and havoc you call that statement childish.
well, then you clearly dont understand what u did.
look into it.
take all your previous posts when you talked to me and then compare it to the post where you said you would play my game and proof that moses did not exist. its very hard to see but you will get it.
You've got it backwards - more or less - as you don't prove non-existent things don't exist with proof of non-existence. Proof of non-existence is a logical absurdity.
You need to form a dialectic first to establish what it is you are trying to demonstrate/prove.
As two hypothesis' are on the table:
1.) Moses is a mythical character.
2.) Moses is a historical character.
Then you assess the actual proof existing (textual analysis, archeology, comparative mythology, astrology, etc). And, you see which hypothesis does the proof support.
Last edited by topal63 (2007-08-06 12:06:05)
While I agree that Moses is more likely a mythical character than a historical one, it leads me to wonder, who wrote the Book of Genesis?topal63 wrote:
Proving things doesn't really work like that. The burden of proof is upon the one making the claim.stef10 wrote:
no, its not becoming an atheist. it was a mistake you did when arguing.Havok wrote:
Please inform me what I have done. If you mean becoming an atheist, then I have no regrets.
look into it.
take all your previous posts when you talked to me and then compare it to the post where you said you would play my game and proof that moses did not exist. its very hard to see but you will get it.
You've got it backwards - more or less - as you don't prove non-existent things don't exist with proof of non-existence. Proof of non-existence is a logical absurdity.
You need to form a dialectic first to establish what it is you are trying to demonstrate/prove.
As two hypothesis' are on the table:
1.) Moses is a mythical character.
2.) Moses is a historical character.
Then you assess the actual proof existing (textual analysis, archeology, comparative mythology, astrology, etc). And, you see which hypothesis does the proof support.
hmm, very interesting. its right. but i thought in a little other way but its very closetopal63 wrote:
Proving things doesn't really work like that. The burden of proof is upon the one making the claim.stef10 wrote:
no, its not becoming an atheist. it was a mistake you did when arguing.Havok wrote:
Please inform me what I have done. If you mean becoming an atheist, then I have no regrets.
look into it.
take all your previous posts when you talked to me and then compare it to the post where you said you would play my game and proof that moses did not exist. its very hard to see but you will get it.
You've got it backwards - more or less - as you don't prove non-existent things don't exist with proof of non-existence. Proof of non-existence is a logical absurdity.
You need to form a dialectic first to establish what it is you are trying to demonstrate/prove.
As two hypothesis' are on the table:
1.) Moses is a mythical character.
2.) Moses is a historical character.
Then you assess the actual proof existing (textual analysis, archeology, comparative mythology, astrology, etc). And, you see which hypothesis does the proof support.
Last edited by stef10 (2007-08-06 12:11:17)
HA! Doubtful that will happen...doctastrangelove1964 wrote:
This thread has been derailed beyond believe. Only God himself can turn this thread back into its original purpose.
Why do you believe in God? this is a good question... and everyone should have their own reasons for their beliefs... mine stem from the way I was brought up.... and maybe this is true for many.... but my belief was hardened from near death experiences... these experiences have brought me to the realization that someone is watching my behind... because it should be 6 feet under...
4 different people who wrote it during the time between the Babylonian Captivity and the fall of Israel to Rome. They where also Theologians and Story-tellers, not historians.Havok wrote:
While I agree that Moses is more likely a mythical character than a historical one, it leads me to wonder, who wrote the Book of Genesis?topal63 wrote:
Proving things doesn't really work like that. The burden of proof is upon the one making the claim.stef10 wrote:
no, its not becoming an atheist. it was a mistake you did when arguing.
look into it.
take all your previous posts when you talked to me and then compare it to the post where you said you would play my game and proof that moses did not exist. its very hard to see but you will get it.
You've got it backwards - more or less - as you don't prove non-existent things don't exist with proof of non-existence. Proof of non-existence is a logical absurdity.
You need to form a dialectic first to establish what it is you are trying to demonstrate/prove.
As two hypothesis' are on the table:
1.) Moses is a mythical character.
2.) Moses is a historical character.
Then you assess the actual proof existing (textual analysis, archeology, comparative mythology, astrology, etc). And, you see which hypothesis does the proof support.
It was compiled from myths - after the destruction of Israel (the Northern Kingdom, by the Assyrians) and Judah (the Southern Kingdom, by the Babylonians). After the the Jewish diaspora, the stories began to be collected by the Scribes to preserve Jewish Heritage (700-500 +/- BC). Then that was edited and further editing-compiling-canonizing occurred at least until (200 BCE until maybe 100 CE?).Havok wrote:
While I agree that Moses is more likely a mythical character than a historical one, it leads me to wonder, who wrote the Book of Genesis?topal63 wrote:
Proving things doesn't really work like that. The burden of proof is upon the one making the claim.stef10 wrote:
no, its not becoming an atheist. it was a mistake you did when arguing.
look into it.
take all your previous posts when you talked to me and then compare it to the post where you said you would play my game and proof that moses did not exist. its very hard to see but you will get it.
You've got it backwards - more or less - as you don't prove non-existent things don't exist with proof of non-existence. Proof of non-existence is a logical absurdity.
You need to form a dialectic first to establish what it is you are trying to demonstrate/prove.
As two hypothesis' are on the table:
1.) Moses is a mythical character.
2.) Moses is a historical character.
Then you assess the actual proof existing (textual analysis, archeology, comparative mythology, astrology, etc). And, you see which hypothesis does the proof support.
The 4 source hypothesis, JEPD-R (J=Yahwist, E=Elohimist, P=Priestly, D=Deuteronomist, R=Redactor/editor), does not actually limit the authorship to just 5 people - it just means the the 4 main sources bear some very clear leanings in style and content.
The origin of the actual myth of creation is Sumerian-Egyptian-Canaanite in origin. The Jewish tradition is basically a modified copy of pre-existing mythical tradition(s).
Last edited by topal63 (2007-08-06 12:29:35)
Because I do.
Something more powerful? I believe in science and the laws of nature. At least I can see real, reproducible proof of those.stef10 wrote:
well, i dont want to convert anybody, people must convert themself. and what I have said is what I think the world works. and of course nobody can tell you that you will be cast into hell. why do they know that. keep it for themselves.
yeah you are non-believers. not for not believing in the jewish-christian god, but for not believing in something more greater that us and which has more power in the universe, and imo that is foolish and ignorant.
around 2000 years ago? wouldnt that be somewhere around 1 B.C. ? I'm guessing your forgot all about the b.c. stuff..... 2007 thats A.D. and by the way.....Jesus was not the one who claimed to create earth, God did. Two Seperate figures.Mitch wrote:
Well its simple. It's scientifically impossible for god to have created everything around 2000 years ago because the half life of Carbon is 5730 years. Now i may be incorrect here about the god part, so i accept all flames but i couldn't find any place online that states how many years ago 'creation week' was so i had to assume it was a little before the jesus myth was createdDesertFox423 wrote:
Free will, it's the choice of someone to participate in that. I blame Zeus for all that.CameronPoe wrote:
Yeah it's great that we live in a world free from starvation, thirst, natural disaster, disease, war, debauchery, exploitation, slavery, brutality, bloodshed, social injustice, persecution and racism. God FTW![Joe Swanson] Bring it on! [/Joe Swanson]Dezerteagal5 wrote:
I dont believe in god because i have the 1 single FACT proving the bible wrong. But unleashing it would ruin the lives of billions forever.
so your THEORY has some holes in it.
Most people who hold that belief place the creation of the world at around 6000 years ago.jdno_7 wrote:
around 2000 years ago? wouldnt that be somewhere around 1 B.C. ? I'm guessing your forgot all about the b.c. stuff..... 2007 thats A.D. and by the way.....Jesus was not the one who claimed to create earth, God did. Two Seperate figures.Mitch wrote:
Well its simple. It's scientifically impossible for god to have created everything around 2000 years ago because the half life of Carbon is 5730 years. Now i may be incorrect here about the god part, so i accept all flames but i couldn't find any place online that states how many years ago 'creation week' was so i had to assume it was a little before the jesus myth was created
so your THEORY has some holes in it.
If I'm correct God is used for a man god and Goddess is used for a female god. So wouldn't this make the Christian god a man?
Why believe in god when we don't even know he exist or he doesn't take any action against us. We can do what the hell we want without getting his fear upon on. Only fear we get is the cops and the state but that's it. The other religions says you would be smited by god if you did something wrong, wouldn't a lot of people been smited allready? Christians says we have free will, while koran says we don't. How come the christian god is the true god and not the others? Ever though of that you people who believe in this so called god?
Why believe in god when we don't even know he exist or he doesn't take any action against us. We can do what the hell we want without getting his fear upon on. Only fear we get is the cops and the state but that's it. The other religions says you would be smited by god if you did something wrong, wouldn't a lot of people been smited allready? Christians says we have free will, while koran says we don't. How come the christian god is the true god and not the others? Ever though of that you people who believe in this so called god?
I see your point, but by that paradigm you must consider your own thinking. If humans didn't come from "nowhere," then where did God come from? Now if you answer by saying "he's always been there" you are then committing a logical fallacy by assuming God could have come from "nowhere" as well.d4rkst4r wrote:
this is all confusing, but there is clearly a god. Everything came from something, humans didn't just popped out of no where, someone, something out there must have created the earth. And the big bang theory is the biggest lie i have ever heard. The big bang theory is just an excuse so scientists can play with their chemistry sets.
Furthermore, I'd like to ask any religious person here why they think their chosen religion is the right one, over all the rest. Given the fact that there has been many thousands of religions that have come and gone, including monotheistic religions (thanks Akhenaten.)
For the record, I'm not religious. I do not believe in a higher consciousness, simply the observable forces of nature.
ps; premarital sex? I think so my friends. (prepare for "that version of that perfect book is wrong.")
Deuteronomy 22
22:28 If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found;
22:29 Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife; because he hath humbled her, he may not put her away all his days.
The Mormons have it that God was once mortal as well. Probably like a bazillion-gajillion years ago.liquix wrote:
I see your point, but by that paradigm you must consider your own thinking. If humans didn't come from "nowhere," then where did God come from? Now if you answer by saying "he's always been there" you are then committing a logical fallacy by assuming God could have come from "nowhere" as well.
OK. I admit up front...I haven't read all 16 pages of posts. I have to get some sleep and go to work tomorrow...but here's my answer to the original question:
Yes, I believe in God.
However, I'm not a fan of organized religion. As one poster said early on, faith and religion are not dependent upon one another. Organized religion is a creation of man, and therefore flawed from its inception, as man is imperfect in all things. Thus, there can be no "right" religion.
I also do not believe that science and faith are mutually exclusive. In fact, some would argue that some aspects of science are "faith-based"...ever seen some of the math behind quantum theory? That's faith-based if ever anything was! We have so many aspects of the scientific world that are completely contradictory (Newtonian and Quantum physics, for example)...yet everything still works. Until some unifying scientific theory comes out, the only thing that makes sense to me is a higher being setting everything in motion (no pun intended).
Without belief in a greater being judging our lives and our behaviors in it, what impetus does man have to adhere to the rule of law? If there are no consequences for your eternal soul, then you can do anything you damn well want with no worries about repercussion outside of this life. I think that some belief in that higher power judging how well we have lived our lives is what has helped to build civilization and the rule of law as we know it. Some could argue that it is an evolutionary response...could be. That does not exclude the existence of a higher being.
Belief in a God does not necessarily mean you are any specific denomination or sect. In fact, most monotheistic traditions are very similar in their basic tenets: do unto others as you would have done unto you, etc. It's the details (derived from man-made doctrine) that cause all the bloodshed in the name of God...not the existence or absence of a God.
Enough of the deep thoughts. Good discussion though!
Yes, I believe in God.
However, I'm not a fan of organized religion. As one poster said early on, faith and religion are not dependent upon one another. Organized religion is a creation of man, and therefore flawed from its inception, as man is imperfect in all things. Thus, there can be no "right" religion.
I also do not believe that science and faith are mutually exclusive. In fact, some would argue that some aspects of science are "faith-based"...ever seen some of the math behind quantum theory? That's faith-based if ever anything was! We have so many aspects of the scientific world that are completely contradictory (Newtonian and Quantum physics, for example)...yet everything still works. Until some unifying scientific theory comes out, the only thing that makes sense to me is a higher being setting everything in motion (no pun intended).
Without belief in a greater being judging our lives and our behaviors in it, what impetus does man have to adhere to the rule of law? If there are no consequences for your eternal soul, then you can do anything you damn well want with no worries about repercussion outside of this life. I think that some belief in that higher power judging how well we have lived our lives is what has helped to build civilization and the rule of law as we know it. Some could argue that it is an evolutionary response...could be. That does not exclude the existence of a higher being.
Belief in a God does not necessarily mean you are any specific denomination or sect. In fact, most monotheistic traditions are very similar in their basic tenets: do unto others as you would have done unto you, etc. It's the details (derived from man-made doctrine) that cause all the bloodshed in the name of God...not the existence or absence of a God.
Enough of the deep thoughts. Good discussion though!
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
To me they are. Without having faith in what we believe our religion is void and dead. If someone is just practicing a religion without really believing that it contains truth in regard to this life and the life to come then they are either part taking in it in the hope that it will work as an insurance policy (against an eternal sentence to hell) or they are just foolish.Kmarion wrote:
Faith and Religion are not dependent upon each other.
I've posted on why I believe in God on bf2s before, but I think its important to do it again. Initially, it was my upbringing as a child. My parents would take me to church and I would attend Sunday school. I was surrounding by Christian educators who would teach me the stories of the Old and New Testaments. However, as I became older, my faith in God "became my own," meaning I no longer simply believed in Him because others had told me that He exists. It boiled down to personal experience, certain pivotal situations in my life that would have only been made possible by the divine influence of the Lord.
The miraculous healing of my dad was one such event. He had been having high blood pressure for years. Even with medication he was never really relaxed and always seemed on edge. One day his blood pressure had gotten so out of control that a blood vessel had burst inside the bridge of his nose. He thought it was a simple nose bleed, but when he couldn't get it to stop bleeding after an hour we realized that something was wrong. Not long after that event, I had a dream that he had died of a heart attack right in front of me; it was the scariest dream I have ever had. I woke up in a panic. After calming down I began to pray. I prayed that God would heal my dad, that the events of my dream would not become a reality. About a week after praying that prayer my dad met up with his doctor to find out how he was doing after the blood vessel incident. The doctor informed him that his blood pressure was miraculously back to a healthy state. I was speechless! I knew it wasn't because of medicine because it had never really relieved him of high blood pressure before, and also because his blood pressure stayed (and has stayed) down after the appointment. Why all of a sudden was a potentially life-threatening ailment that he had been battling for years suddenly in check again?! I knew it had been an answer to prayer.
I know that God exists because of the situations that He has helped me through and the joy that I have in my own life in knowing Him by having a relationship with Him through Jesus Christ. I don't pretend to believe that God will answer all prayers, but He does hear them. They have to be in accordance will His will, and for whatever reason my dad still had/has a purpose to fulfill on this earth.
The rank arrogance of some people!
Gee you must be special J][gga, cos HE chose to save you, not just once, but numerous times! As opposed to all the children who were abused to death, but then they weren't SPECIAL. FFS.
Likewise Velker, your Dad is obviously more important to God than all those stillborn babies, cos HE saved him with a miracle!
You nasty little parasites, you're gonna die just like everyone else, and I hope its fucking PAINFUL!
Gee you must be special J][gga, cos HE chose to save you, not just once, but numerous times! As opposed to all the children who were abused to death, but then they weren't SPECIAL. FFS.
Likewise Velker, your Dad is obviously more important to God than all those stillborn babies, cos HE saved him with a miracle!
You nasty little parasites, you're gonna die just like everyone else, and I hope its fucking PAINFUL!
While i would love to read all 16 pages.. (cough cough) I dont really need to see all of us bickering if there is a (G)god (dependent on which higher being you may or may not believe in)
Im sure plenty of you have presented your arguments for and against the theory of creation and evolution.. or simply *BANG!* we here!...
Obviously to believe in a (G)god requires faith. I believe in (G)god. Why? At first yes.. it had a lot to do with my parents taking me to church every week.. and being the son of a preacher man kinda has its effects lolz. Why do i continue to believe or have faith. Because I choose too. Because I choose to believe that my life isnt in vain. That every decision I make in this life will have some affect after my death.
What I noticed before was a lot of scripture quoting when i quickly scanned some of the pages before. What gets me is that so many people who do not believe in (G)god or the bible will quote different parts of scripture to use against believers as myself. My question is this. Have any of you completely and utterly read the bible... from beginning to end? And understood its meaning and teaachings? Some of you may have already. Some of you may say you have but actually havent... going to church as a child doesnt count as reading the bible in its entirety either! If you have the read the bible.. no.. sorry, studied the bible ie cross referencing and what not a lot of truths will be made known to you. Now I know alot of you would be so ready to flame me and say why bother reading it.. its just a pack of myths, theories and lies... just like any other religious material that any other religious person will try to shove down your throats. I accept that believing the bible is hard. I accept that some people will outright refuse too read it for fear it may be right..? Others will just not read it all cause it won't fit in with their time scheduling. But most of the time it's these people that will sit in front of the television and believe everything that is thrown at them. These are the people that will pick up the morning newspaper and believe whats put in there. Now don't get me wrong.. I'm not saying that whats on television or whats in the papers is false... but have you ever thought it could all be made up.. I mean how many of you can testify to current news and events that you have actually seen with your own eyes? (I'm not being ignorant or coldhearted with my next statement) I have never seen the war on Iraq in person.. I havent seen the bodies coming back home to loved ones... I havent seen jets flying over and bombing the crap out of everything.. but i believe its really happening... BECAUSE I CHOOSE TOO. I don't really know if it really happening...
All I'm trying to say is that too believe in a higher being requires faith. How does one acquire said faith? Let's put it this way.. everyone has said faith. Yes everyone... even aethiests! yeah you heard me...
Think about it... you choose not to believe there is a (G)god. You set your whole mind into thinking and believing that you are here because it randomly happens.. and that requires a shitload of faith... and I admire that. I mean to believe that anything you do in this life has no consquences after death.. because there is no after death takes courage... How do you go around and make decisions all day? Because the law tells you what is right and what is wrong?
Who put the law into place? Which man was given the authority to define what is right and what is wrong? I have not heard of such a man? No where in my life have I heard that once upon a time a man.. fuck... even a group.. I couldn't care less was giving the right to tell us what is right and what is wrong. If you know I would love to know about said persons...
I would quote scripture now.. but then my argument would be flamed because using said scripture.. so I choose not too.. I have giving my little insight on faith.. and why I believe in a (G)god. Yes there is a plan for everyone and no not everyones plan if fucking brilliant. I do not have all the answers to everyone.. but if you only look at the negative side of the world and all the crap that is happening without looking at all the good things that are happening around you.. then I pity you alot. For if you are going to keep thinking negatively your life must be crap.
Im sure plenty of you have presented your arguments for and against the theory of creation and evolution.. or simply *BANG!* we here!...
Obviously to believe in a (G)god requires faith. I believe in (G)god. Why? At first yes.. it had a lot to do with my parents taking me to church every week.. and being the son of a preacher man kinda has its effects lolz. Why do i continue to believe or have faith. Because I choose too. Because I choose to believe that my life isnt in vain. That every decision I make in this life will have some affect after my death.
What I noticed before was a lot of scripture quoting when i quickly scanned some of the pages before. What gets me is that so many people who do not believe in (G)god or the bible will quote different parts of scripture to use against believers as myself. My question is this. Have any of you completely and utterly read the bible... from beginning to end? And understood its meaning and teaachings? Some of you may have already. Some of you may say you have but actually havent... going to church as a child doesnt count as reading the bible in its entirety either! If you have the read the bible.. no.. sorry, studied the bible ie cross referencing and what not a lot of truths will be made known to you. Now I know alot of you would be so ready to flame me and say why bother reading it.. its just a pack of myths, theories and lies... just like any other religious material that any other religious person will try to shove down your throats. I accept that believing the bible is hard. I accept that some people will outright refuse too read it for fear it may be right..? Others will just not read it all cause it won't fit in with their time scheduling. But most of the time it's these people that will sit in front of the television and believe everything that is thrown at them. These are the people that will pick up the morning newspaper and believe whats put in there. Now don't get me wrong.. I'm not saying that whats on television or whats in the papers is false... but have you ever thought it could all be made up.. I mean how many of you can testify to current news and events that you have actually seen with your own eyes? (I'm not being ignorant or coldhearted with my next statement) I have never seen the war on Iraq in person.. I havent seen the bodies coming back home to loved ones... I havent seen jets flying over and bombing the crap out of everything.. but i believe its really happening... BECAUSE I CHOOSE TOO. I don't really know if it really happening...
All I'm trying to say is that too believe in a higher being requires faith. How does one acquire said faith? Let's put it this way.. everyone has said faith. Yes everyone... even aethiests! yeah you heard me...
Think about it... you choose not to believe there is a (G)god. You set your whole mind into thinking and believing that you are here because it randomly happens.. and that requires a shitload of faith... and I admire that. I mean to believe that anything you do in this life has no consquences after death.. because there is no after death takes courage... How do you go around and make decisions all day? Because the law tells you what is right and what is wrong?
Who put the law into place? Which man was given the authority to define what is right and what is wrong? I have not heard of such a man? No where in my life have I heard that once upon a time a man.. fuck... even a group.. I couldn't care less was giving the right to tell us what is right and what is wrong. If you know I would love to know about said persons...
I would quote scripture now.. but then my argument would be flamed because using said scripture.. so I choose not too.. I have giving my little insight on faith.. and why I believe in a (G)god. Yes there is a plan for everyone and no not everyones plan if fucking brilliant. I do not have all the answers to everyone.. but if you only look at the negative side of the world and all the crap that is happening without looking at all the good things that are happening around you.. then I pity you alot. For if you are going to keep thinking negatively your life must be crap.
I...uh... think you got it the wrong way around. You're addessing how religion is dependent on faith.Velker wrote:
To me they are. Without having faith in what we believe our religion is void and dead. If someone is just practicing a religion without really believing that it contains truth in regard to this life and the life to come then they are either part taking in it in the hope that it will work as an insurance policy (against an eternal sentence to hell) or they are just foolish.Kmarion wrote:
Faith and Religion are not dependent upon each other.
I've posted on why I believe in God on bf2s before, but I think its important to do it again. Initially, it was my upbringing as a child. My parents would take me to church and I would attend Sunday school. I was surrounding by Christian educators who would teach me the stories of the Old and New Testaments. However, as I became older, my faith in God "became my own," meaning I no longer simply believed in Him because others had told me that He exists. It boiled down to personal experience, certain pivotal situations in my life that would have only been made possible by the divine influence of the Lord.
The miraculous healing of my dad was one such event. He had been having high blood pressure for years. Even with medication he was never really relaxed and always seemed on edge. One day his blood pressure had gotten so out of control that a blood vessel had burst inside the bridge of his nose. He thought it was a simple nose bleed, but when he couldn't get it to stop bleeding after an hour we realized that something was wrong. Not long after that event, I had a dream that he had died of a heart attack right in front of me; it was the scariest dream I have ever had. I woke up in a panic. After calming down I began to pray. I prayed that God would heal my dad, that the events of my dream would not become a reality. About a week after praying that prayer my dad met up with his doctor to find out how he was doing after the blood vessel incident. The doctor informed him that his blood pressure was miraculously back to a healthy state. I was speechless! I knew it wasn't because of medicine because it had never really relieved him of high blood pressure before, and also because his blood pressure stayed (and has stayed) down after the appointment. Why all of a sudden was a potentially life-threatening ailment that he had been battling for years suddenly in check again?! I knew it had been an answer to prayer.
I know that God exists because of the situations that He has helped me through and the joy that I have in my own life in knowing Him by having a relationship with Him through Jesus Christ. I don't pretend to believe that God will answer all prayers, but He does hear them. They have to be in accordance will His will, and for whatever reason my dad still had/has a purpose to fulfill on this earth.
But faith is not dependant on religion. I have faith in my bus driver every day, that he won't crash and send me throught the front window. Where religion comes into that, I don't know.
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
~ Richard Feynman
I'm glad your dad recovered mate but I'm sure medical science could explain it. Were the doctors lost for an explanation or did you choose not to listen to it? I'm a big fan of psycology and although I don't know the techinical term it sounds like a classic case of filtering to me. Let's say you prey for 10 things and 5 of them happen, you would qualify the ones that did come true and miracles and remember them and you would disregard any that don't come true and forget about them. Have you ever thought about someone and in the same space of time they have phoned you or knocked on your door? Initially it seems freaky but when you calculate how many times you think of people and how many times people come calling it is only a matter of time before it happens. It's the same principle, you'd remember that but not remember all the times you weren't thinking about people and they called or vice versa.Velker wrote:
I've posted on why I believe in God on bf2s before, but I think its important to do it again. Initially, it was my upbringing as a child. My parents would take me to church and I would attend Sunday school. I was surrounding by Christian educators who would teach me the stories of the Old and New Testaments. However, as I became older, my faith in God "became my own," meaning I no longer simply believed in Him because others had told me that He exists. It boiled down to personal experience, certain pivotal situations in my life that would have only been made possible by the divine influence of the Lord.
The miraculous healing of my dad was one such event. He had been having high blood pressure for years. Even with medication he was never really relaxed and always seemed on edge. One day his blood pressure had gotten so out of control that a blood vessel had burst inside the bridge of his nose. He thought it was a simple nose bleed, but when he couldn't get it to stop bleeding after an hour we realized that something was wrong. Not long after that event, I had a dream that he had died of a heart attack right in front of me; it was the scariest dream I have ever had. I woke up in a panic. After calming down I began to pray. I prayed that God would heal my dad, that the events of my dream would not become a reality. About a week after praying that prayer my dad met up with his doctor to find out how he was doing after the blood vessel incident. The doctor informed him that his blood pressure was miraculously back to a healthy state. I was speechless! I knew it wasn't because of medicine because it had never really relieved him of high blood pressure before, and also because his blood pressure stayed (and has stayed) down after the appointment. Why all of a sudden was a potentially life-threatening ailment that he had been battling for years suddenly in check again?! I knew it had been an answer to prayer.
I know that God exists because of the situations that He has helped me through and the joy that I have in my own life in knowing Him by having a relationship with Him through Jesus Christ. I don't pretend to believe that God will answer all prayers, but He does hear them. They have to be in accordance will His will, and for whatever reason my dad still had/has a purpose to fulfill on this earth.
Has every single prayer you've ever made been answered and if not, surely this tells you a lot about coincidence...