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2006-12-07 15:33:47
KylieTastic
Games, Girls, Guinness
+85|6762|Cambridge, UK

A lot of religious people re-defining 'Atheist' again and again I see....

Its so simple: Atheist = does not believe in a god (and it means nothing else)

Its not a choice, to me God is no more a possibility than the existence of there being a Bogey man under my bed! If you don't believe you don't believe - and wont until you are given a reason too. Religion is complex but Atheism isn't. Science doesn't have to prove anything to discount god, its not science vs the bible... god/religion has to convince people its true and cant just claim any validity due to no 'proof' against it.
2006-12-07 15:34:08
jarhedch
Member
+12|6980|Aberdeen, Uk, SF Bay Area 1st

usmarine2007 wrote:

jarhedch wrote:

Spark wrote:


Then fuck off. If you can't take the heat, then why the fuck did you enter the kitchen in the first place?
just because I don't believe in casting my pearls before swine doesn't mean I can't take the heat. Your misinterpretation of why I won't discuss this thread is the exact reason why I won't say more than that. I've been in far more enlightening and deeper discussions than what might come up here.
Then go to a Harvard message board if you want to act like an elitist douche bag.
wow, i'm an elitist, first time i've been called that. Your rebuttal to what i said is very deep. Sorta like Sparks. What's funny is you're reacting to my posts in the exact way I expected. Once I find some people I can have a proper convo with that doesn't involve serious flaming and close minded name calling that devolves to nothing more than my opinions are > than yours, I'm more than happy to open up. Until then, the bait will continue and I'll see you for what you really are. It's a shame, too. 'Cause i used to have respect for you usmarine.
2006-12-07 15:36:45
Psycho
Member since 2005
+44|7087|Kansas, USA

Stingray24 wrote:

Psycho wrote:

For this he was tried and convicted of heresy and excommunicated from the church. It wasn't until 1992 that Pope John Paul II formally declared that the church made a mistake - just a mere 300 years.
Please don't label all Christianity with the dogma of the Catholic Church.
The original post concerned why people are atheist. I think my point is valid. Religions propose to know the "truth". I find it interesting that there are so many religions proposing to be the correct religion.
2006-12-07 15:39:51
KylieTastic
Games, Girls, Guinness
+85|6762|Cambridge, UK

Paco_the_Insane wrote:

hey, its better to believe and be wrong, than to not believe and be wrong. Because if a religious person is wrong, nothing will happen, but if an athiest is wrong, then gods gonna be pissed.
Isnt that the wrong way arround?

If an Atheist is wrong but has lived their life as a moral person without the threat of gods wrath - then I would expect an all-knowing, caring god to understand.

However if you 'believe' for not true reasons to true to play the odds - expect to be judge by the rules you said you subscribed too.
2006-12-07 15:40:53
IG-Calibre
comhalta
+226|7053|Tír Eoghan, Tuaisceart Éireann

Bertster7 wrote:

There is an undeniable link between high levels of education and Atheism.
And yet the Father of modern Physics and arguable one of the greatest thinkers of recent times Albert Einstein had faith and believed in God.
2006-12-07 15:40:58
zeidmaan
Member
+234|6725|Vienna

IG-Calibre wrote:

Nothing wrong with "Pascal's wager" very acceptable in the philosophical debate on the existence of "God"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal's_Wager
Well that was rather interesting mate. Never read about it before. +1
2006-12-07 15:41:13
jonsimon
Member
+224|6805

KylieTastic wrote:

A lot of religious people re-defining 'Atheist' again and again I see....

Its so simple: Atheist = does not believe in a god (and it means nothing else)

Its not a choice, to me God is no more a possibility than the existence of there being a Bogey man under my bed! If you don't believe you don't believe - and wont until you are given a reason too. Religion is complex but Atheism isn't. Science doesn't have to prove anything to discount god, its not science vs the bible... god/religion has to convince people its true and cant just claim any validity due to no 'proof' against it.
QFT Exactly.
2006-12-07 15:42:56
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|6892|SE London

IG-Calibre wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:

There is an undeniable link between high levels of education and Atheism.
And yet the Father of modern Physics and arguable one of the greatest thinkers of recent times Albert Einstein had faith and believed in God.
Doesn't stop the correlation from being true.
2006-12-07 15:45:06
IG-Calibre
comhalta
+226|7053|Tír Eoghan, Tuaisceart Éireann

Bertster7 wrote:

IG-Calibre wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:

There is an undeniable link between high levels of education and Atheism.
And yet the Father of modern Physics and arguable one of the greatest thinkers of recent times Albert Einstein had faith and believed in God.
Doesn't stop the correlation from being true.
nor does it give it any currency of being correct
2006-12-07 15:46:46
Volatile
Member
+252|7015|Sextupling in Empire

I saw my asshole in the mirror today.....It blew my fucking mind!
2006-12-07 15:47:24
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|6892|SE London

KylieTastic wrote:

Paco_the_Insane wrote:

hey, its better to believe and be wrong, than to not believe and be wrong. Because if a religious person is wrong, nothing will happen, but if an athiest is wrong, then gods gonna be pissed.
Isnt that the wrong way arround?

If an Atheist is wrong but has lived their life as a moral person without the threat of gods wrath - then I would expect an all-knowing, caring god to understand.

However if you 'believe' for not true reasons to true to play the odds - expect to be judge by the rules you said you subscribed too.
No, of course not!

God's first priority (the Christian/Jewish/Islamic God anyway, they're all the same) is to be worshipped. Look at the first two commandments, 'you shall have no other gods before me' and 'you shall not make for yourself an idol' and of course who could forget that He is: 'I the Lord your God am a jealous God, punishing children for the iniquity of parents, to the third and fourth generation of those who reject me'.

Sounds like a right cunt to me.
2006-12-07 15:49:37
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|6892|SE London

IG-Calibre wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:

IG-Calibre wrote:


And yet the Father of modern Physics and arguable one of the greatest thinkers of recent times Albert Einstein had faith and believed in God.
Doesn't stop the correlation from being true.
nor does it give it any currency of being correct
But it is correct. There are exceptions, but overall there is an undeniable correlation. That can't be argued against, not effectively anyway because it's so easily provable.
2006-12-07 15:50:11
DesertFox-
The very model of a modern major general
+796|6995|United States of America

Bertster7 wrote:

There is an undeniable link between high levels of education and Atheism.
Where, may I ask?

KylieTastic wrote:

A lot of religious people re-defining 'Atheist' again and again I see....

Its so simple: Atheist = does not believe in a god (and it means nothing else)

Its not a choice, to me God is no more a possibility than the existence of there being a Bogey man under my bed! If you don't believe you don't believe - and wont until you are given a reason too. Religion is complex but Atheism isn't. Science doesn't have to prove anything to discount god, its not science vs the bible... god/religion has to convince people its true and cant just claim any validity due to no 'proof' against it.
The burden of proof is on you. Good luck.
2006-12-07 15:52:48
IG-Calibre
comhalta
+226|7053|Tír Eoghan, Tuaisceart Éireann

Bertster7 wrote:

KylieTastic wrote:

Paco_the_Insane wrote:

hey, its better to believe and be wrong, than to not believe and be wrong. Because if a religious person is wrong, nothing will happen, but if an athiest is wrong, then gods gonna be pissed.
Isnt that the wrong way arround?

If an Atheist is wrong but has lived their life as a moral person without the threat of gods wrath - then I would expect an all-knowing, caring god to understand.

However if you 'believe' for not true reasons to true to play the odds - expect to be judge by the rules you said you subscribed too.
No, of course not!

God's first priority (the Christian/Jewish/Islamic God anyway, they're all the same) is to be worshipped. Look at the first two commandments, 'you shall have no other gods before me' and 'you shall not make for yourself an idol' and of course who could forget that He is: 'I the Lord your God am a jealous God, punishing children for the iniquity of parents, to the third and fourth generation of those who reject me'.

Sounds like a right cunt to me.
Aye i'd agree completely but I don't hold with all that shite & i'm very suspect of it and any organised religion, I aint no alter rail licker, but I still believe in "god"
2006-12-07 15:56:09
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|6892|SE London

DesertFox423 wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:

There is an undeniable link between high levels of education and Atheism.
Where, may I ask?
If you look at the demographics of where Atheism is most prevalent. That's where.

You get far fewer Atheists (if any) in regions with a lack of education. Also, university graduates are more likely to be Atheists than non-graduates.
2006-12-07 15:56:40
usmarine2007
Banned
+374|6677|Columbus, Ohio

jarhedch wrote:

usmarine2007 wrote:

jarhedch wrote:

just because I don't believe in casting my pearls before swine doesn't mean I can't take the heat. Your misinterpretation of why I won't discuss this thread is the exact reason why I won't say more than that. I've been in far more enlightening and deeper discussions than what might come up here.
Then go to a Harvard message board if you want to act like an elitist douche bag.
wow, i'm an elitist, first time i've been called that. Your rebuttal to what i said is very deep. Sorta like Sparks. What's funny is you're reacting to my posts in the exact way I expected. Once I find some people I can have a proper convo with that doesn't involve serious flaming and close minded name calling that devolves to nothing more than my opinions are > than yours, I'm more than happy to open up. Until then, the bait will continue and I'll see you for what you really are. It's a shame, too. 'Cause i used to have respect for you usmarine.
Well, when you talk down to all of us here, what do you expect?  Maybe it is a language thing, but referring to us as "swine," would suggest we are not good enough for you.  And saying you have had better discussions than anything on here would indicate you think we are below you in a discussion forum.  I could be wrong, but that is the way I took it.

Last edited by usmarine2007 (2006-12-07 15:57:01)

2006-12-07 15:57:58
IG-Calibre
comhalta
+226|7053|Tír Eoghan, Tuaisceart Éireann

Bertster7 wrote:

IG-Calibre wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:


Doesn't stop the correlation from being true.
nor does it give it any currency of being correct
But it is correct. There are exceptions, but overall there is an undeniable correlation. That can't be argued against, not effectively anyway because it's so easily provable.
You believe it to be true and that's your prerogative that's the joy of freewill, the point i'm making is while you seek solace and hold that as a firm ground to base your atheism on. My point is Einstein, did not sacrifice his Faith on the alter of science like you do, he understood you cannot hold up a measuring tape to God or, your soul.  That's why it all comes down to "faith"
2006-12-07 15:58:14
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|6892|SE London

IG-Calibre wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:

KylieTastic wrote:


Isnt that the wrong way arround?

If an Atheist is wrong but has lived their life as a moral person without the threat of gods wrath - then I would expect an all-knowing, caring god to understand.

However if you 'believe' for not true reasons to true to play the odds - expect to be judge by the rules you said you subscribed too.
No, of course not!

God's first priority (the Christian/Jewish/Islamic God anyway, they're all the same) is to be worshipped. Look at the first two commandments, 'you shall have no other gods before me' and 'you shall not make for yourself an idol' and of course who could forget that He is: 'I the Lord your God am a jealous God, punishing children for the iniquity of parents, to the third and fourth generation of those who reject me'.

Sounds like a right cunt to me.
Aye i'd agree completely but I don't hold with all that shite & i'm very suspect of it and any organised religion, I aint no alter rail licker, but I still believe in "god"
A God? Or a specific personalised Christian God?

To me believing in some sort of God seems perfectly understandable. Believing in someone elses exact interpretation of something they could not possibly comprehend seems silly to me.
2006-12-07 15:59:24
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|6892|SE London

IG-Calibre wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:

IG-Calibre wrote:


nor does it give it any currency of being correct
But it is correct. There are exceptions, but overall there is an undeniable correlation. That can't be argued against, not effectively anyway because it's so easily provable.
You believe it to be true and that's your prerogative that's the joy of freewill, the point i'm making is while you seek solace and hold that as a firm ground to base your atheism on. My point is Einstein, did not sacrifice his Faith on the alter of science like you do, he understood you cannot hold up a measuring tape to God or, your soul.  That's why it all comes down to "faith"
Look at the demographics. Statistics don't lie as much as opinions.
2006-12-07 16:04:11
DesertFox-
The very model of a modern major general
+796|6995|United States of America

Bertster7 wrote:

DesertFox423 wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:

There is an undeniable link between high levels of education and Atheism.
Where, may I ask?
If you look at the demographics of where Atheism is most prevalent. That's where.

You get far fewer Atheists (if any) in regions with a lack of education. Also, university graduates are more likely to be Atheists than non-graduates.
The demographics seem to be true in Europe, at least.

I don't find any information relevant to the second part, though. If any, it was one of those on the level with "Yodeling Can Prolong Life" type studies.
2006-12-07 16:09:54
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|6892|SE London

DesertFox423 wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:

DesertFox423 wrote:


Where, may I ask?
If you look at the demographics of where Atheism is most prevalent. That's where.

You get far fewer Atheists (if any) in regions with a lack of education. Also, university graduates are more likely to be Atheists than non-graduates.
The demographics seem to be true in Europe, at least.

I don't find any information relevant to the second part, though. If any, it was one of those on the level with "Yodeling Can Prolong Life" type studies.
True for the UK at least. There was a report published on the findings of censuses. A considerably higher percentage of graduates were Atheists than than non-graduates. I'll see if I can find the report. I think it was originally published in the Times.
2006-12-07 16:10:06
IG-Calibre
comhalta
+226|7053|Tír Eoghan, Tuaisceart Éireann

Bertster7 wrote:

IG-Calibre wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:


But it is correct. There are exceptions, but overall there is an undeniable correlation. That can't be argued against, not effectively anyway because it's so easily provable.
You believe it to be true and that's your prerogative that's the joy of freewill, the point i'm making is while you seek solace and hold that as a firm ground to base your atheism on. My point is Einstein, did not sacrifice his Faith on the alter of science like you do, he understood you cannot hold up a measuring tape to God or, your soul.  That's why it all comes down to "faith"
Look at the demographics. Statistics don't lie as much as opinions.
there are lies damn lies and statitics

i've no problem at all with you being an athiest man, we exist in different philosophical paradigms and that's super cool with me, ye godless heathen
2006-12-07 16:11:19
IG-Calibre
comhalta
+226|7053|Tír Eoghan, Tuaisceart Éireann

Bertster7 wrote:

DesertFox423 wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:


If you look at the demographics of where Atheism is most prevalent. That's where.

You get far fewer Atheists (if any) in regions with a lack of education. Also, university graduates are more likely to be Atheists than non-graduates.
The demographics seem to be true in Europe, at least.

I don't find any information relevant to the second part, though. If any, it was one of those on the level with "Yodeling Can Prolong Life" type studies.
True for the UK at least. There was a report published on the findings of censuses. A considerably higher percentage of graduates were Atheists than than non-graduates. I'll see if I can find the report. I think it was originally published in the Times.
A for fuck sake man, something like 21% were Jedi's too
2006-12-07 16:13:43
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|6892|SE London

IG-Calibre wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:

DesertFox423 wrote:


The demographics seem to be true in Europe, at least.

I don't find any information relevant to the second part, though. If any, it was one of those on the level with "Yodeling Can Prolong Life" type studies.
True for the UK at least. There was a report published on the findings of censuses. A considerably higher percentage of graduates were Atheists than than non-graduates. I'll see if I can find the report. I think it was originally published in the Times.
A for fuck sake man, something like 21% were Jedi's too
So?

If anything that reinforces the point. Almost everyone who put Jedi would probably otherwise have put Atheist. You're not going to get devout Christians just renouncing their faith like that.
2006-12-07 16:25:48
DesertFox-
The very model of a modern major general
+796|6995|United States of America

Bertster7 wrote:

IG-Calibre wrote:

Bertster7 wrote:


True for the UK at least. There was a report published on the findings of censuses. A considerably higher percentage of graduates were Atheists than than non-graduates. I'll see if I can find the report. I think it was originally published in the Times.
A for fuck sake man, something like 21% were Jedi's too
So?

If anything that reinforces the point. Almost everyone who put Jedi would probably otherwise have put Atheist. You're not going to get devout Christians just renouncing their faith like that.
Well, not everybody is devout. You've got Chreasters and fair-weather followers.

 

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