Thinking about getting some glass for my LaRue Stealth.
Looking at the NightForce NXS 1-4x24 with LaRue mount.
Looking at the NightForce NXS 1-4x24 with LaRue mount.
Baba Booey
Baba Booey
That is Gods Must Be Crazy. Recognize the characters and the title even admits it.
one coke bottle causing so much consternation
Imagine if space aliens dropped a cold fusion engine in Europe during the 40's, how much consternation that would cause.
Ordered these Military Brown Simonich Gunner Grips G10 for the Kimber Tac Entry II. I'm also replacing the ambi safety with a single, installing Novak sights, and switching out the trigger.
Here are the new grips.
Here are the new grips.
Baba Booey
they don't let you use those in the field, right?1stSFOD-Delta wrote:
Ordered these Military Brown Simonich Gunner Grips G10 for the Kimber Tac Entry II. I'm also replacing the ambi safety with a single, installing Novak sights, and switching out the trigger.
Here are the new grips.
No. Only Delta guys and MARSOC dudes use 1911s.Trotskygrad wrote:
they don't let you use those in the field, right?1stSFOD-Delta wrote:
Ordered these Military Brown Simonich Gunner Grips G10 for the Kimber Tac Entry II. I'm also replacing the ambi safety with a single, installing Novak sights, and switching out the trigger.
Here are the new grips.
This is for my personal 1911.
Last edited by 1stSFOD-Delta (2011-12-20 06:43:56)
Baba Booey
What 1204 yards looks like.
Target is in the red circle, in the middle of the cluster of trees, center short tree between two tallest trees
Zoomed in and cropped.
Tried to take a picture through my 32x scope with my iPhone - didn't work.
So, here's the previous picture, zoomed and cropped.
Picture of the target, mostly freshly painted.
1/2" plate steel, 8"x10" roughly
Drop forged(?) - so the formed face is much harder than the back.
Holes are from the target being at 100 yards, painted over craters are from hits at 300 yards and 600 yards.
Hits at 1200 yards just lightly mark the target. blasts paint, barely dents the metal.
Hits at 100 yards will generally punch through 1/2" to 5/8" of plate steel (!).
300 WSM, 230gr Berger Hybrids, 2772 fps
(H4831sc/Norma brass/Fed 210m/230 Berger Hybrids)
Load is eerie consistent (±2 fps), very accurate (15 rounds through a ¼" center-to-center group at 100 yards. ½ base of a 300 WSM case covered whole group)
But a touch hard on the brass, so I'll probably back it down to 2700 or thereabouts
Target is in the red circle, in the middle of the cluster of trees, center short tree between two tallest trees
Zoomed in and cropped.
Tried to take a picture through my 32x scope with my iPhone - didn't work.
So, here's the previous picture, zoomed and cropped.
Picture of the target, mostly freshly painted.
1/2" plate steel, 8"x10" roughly
Drop forged(?) - so the formed face is much harder than the back.
Holes are from the target being at 100 yards, painted over craters are from hits at 300 yards and 600 yards.
Hits at 1200 yards just lightly mark the target. blasts paint, barely dents the metal.
Hits at 100 yards will generally punch through 1/2" to 5/8" of plate steel (!).
300 WSM, 230gr Berger Hybrids, 2772 fps
(H4831sc/Norma brass/Fed 210m/230 Berger Hybrids)
Load is eerie consistent (±2 fps), very accurate (15 rounds through a ¼" center-to-center group at 100 yards. ½ base of a 300 WSM case covered whole group)
But a touch hard on the brass, so I'll probably back it down to 2700 or thereabouts
Last edited by rdx-fx (2011-12-20 07:56:05)
Whats up with the square holes in the plate?
air holes to make it go faster
Tu Stultus Es
or lighter for carrying 1204 yards
Square bullets, man!west-phoenix-az wrote:
Whats up with the square holes in the plate?
Kidding.
It's an old railroad plate. Square holes are where the railroad spikes go in.
Rail Fastening System
Notice the daylight in the long range photos, and the darkness in the target picture...west-phoenix-az wrote:
or lighter for carrying 1204 yards
Last edited by rdx-fx (2011-12-20 08:05:10)
I was thinking a piece of equipment, but couldn't imagine what it would be.
Nice shooting spot you have there, is it private land?
Nice shooting spot you have there, is it private land?
if you tag me square center mass at that distance id probably just break a rib at the most right
Tu Stultus Es
That round has 1025 ft·lbs of energy at 1200 yards, compared to 1225 ft·lbs at the muzzle for the 5.56x45 (M-16 "green tip" 62 grain ammo)eleven bravo wrote:
if you tag me square center mass at that distance id probably just break a rib at the most right
Center mass with body armor at 1200 yards, you'd probably walk away from it - but you'd know you got hit.
Coyotes, fortunately for me, don't generally wear body armor.
Private land, yes.west-phoenix-az wrote:
Nice shooting spot you have there, is it private land?
Much better hilltop to shoot coyotes from about 1000 yards to the right of that spot.
light body, just vest no plates?
Tu Stultus Es
I'd guess my 300 WSM round at 1200 yards has about the same energy as a factory ammo AK-47 round at 200 yards.eleven bravo wrote:
light body, just vest no plates?
AK-47 round has about 1500 ft·lbs at the muzzle, according to Wikipedia.
My 300 WSM (with the above ammo) has 1500 ft·lbs at 1100 yards, and a much more aerodynamic bullet (G7 ballistic coefficient of 0.368).
Again, I'm shooting four legged animals with this rifle.
If I happen to see a four legged animal with body armor on, I'm probably not going to shoot it anyways, as it's probably some government working dog.
On a deer at 250+ yards, half turned towards me, it punched completely through.
½" entry, ½" exit, 2" diameter blood shot damage.
Heart was shredded (was my point of aim), right lung was turned into jelly.
Last edited by rdx-fx (2011-12-20 08:47:10)
I've shot the 300 Mag in the Remington 2010 and Mk13. Different round though, I think. Makes me want to get a bolt gun.
Not too familiar with long rifles.
Not too familiar with long rifles.
Baba Booey
300 WSM generally looks like a 300 Winchester Magnum, squished down to the length of a 7.62x51 (.308).1stSFOD-Delta wrote:
I've shot the 300 Mag in the Remington 2010 and Mk13. Different round though, I think. Makes me want to get a bolt gun.
Not too familiar with long rifles.
Shorter and fatter, same velocities as a 300 win mag but burning 10% less powder more efficiently.
300 WSM just seems to be more consistent in velocities and accuracy. Definitely much more consistent burn characteristics.
The short/fat cartridges seem to burn the powder in the chamber more - where the old school long/skinny rounds (300 win mag) push the powder into the barrel as it burns.
Pushing a random amount of powder down the barrel with the bullet = inconsistent velocities, inconsistent burns, and less efficient use of powder charge.
Instead of just pushing a 230 grain round down the barrel, the 300 win mag is probably pushing about 30 grains of burning powder (1/2 the total powder) and the 230 grain bullet too.
Takes energy to push that extra 30 grains of weight = better efficiency of a short/fat case.
The original match-winning 6mm PPC was the grandfather of all the modern "short magnum" short/fat/efficient designs.
Or, you could think of the 300 WSM as a fatter case 7.62x51.
Same lengths, uses same bullets and primers, uses many of the same powders.
From left to right: .300 Winchester Magnum, .300 WSM, .308 Winchester, .223 Remington
Downside of the short magnums is that they're easier to jam in a stressful situation.
Long skinny rounds feed better in semi-autos, or rapidly working a bolt in a two-way shooting match.
Hence, military favors the long/skinny 5.56, 7.62, 300 win mag, and .338 Lapuas
For a generic bolt action rifle, a Remington 700 is the default "everybody has one, everybody stocks parts for it" rifle.1stSFOD-Delta wrote:
Not too familiar with long rifles.
For an almost-as-common but arguably more reliable rifle, the Winchester 70 "pre-64 style controlled-round-feed" would be my choice for a starting bolt rifle.
If you don't mind being a little different, Savage makes a pretty decent rifle too, as of recently.
.338 Lapua for $1000 to $1400. It's not a custom $3500 rifle, but it's supposedly pretty damned good for the price, and for being a factory rifle.
.308 is considered a little weak for hunting in the western US, but it's easy to get ammo for (Federal's civilian brand, American Eagle sells all the military overproduction)
.223 is decent for target practice and varmints, and it works in your AR-15
30-06 is the American default "huntin' raffle" round, but it doesn't do much more than a .308, really.
300 Winchester Magnum is a good all-around caliber for a bolt gun - but can be a little abusive if you shoot many rounds without a muzzle brake.
A highly regarded round is the 7mm Magnum
(162gr bullets launched at 2950, about the same flight path as my 300 WSM shooting 210gr rounds).
Essentially a 300 Winchester Mag, necked down to shoot smaller bullets.
Last edited by rdx-fx (2011-12-20 09:12:44)
Are you using a magnum primer in your 300wsm?
Yeah I've been wanting to get into long range shooting for a while. That's why I'm building a LaRue Stealth and at some point will pick up a LaRue OBR in 308.
But I have always wanted a good quality bolt gun. I've looked at Remington 700s before but there's so many different models.
What kind of set up do you have?
But I have always wanted a good quality bolt gun. I've looked at Remington 700s before but there's so many different models.
What kind of set up do you have?
Baba Booey
No, Federal 210M. Large rifle (match) primer.west-phoenix-az wrote:
Are you using a magnum primer in your 300wsm?
Gives me a lower spread in velocities, and more overall velocity within a safe max pressure.
Seems like the 215M (Large rifle magnum primer) has too much energy for the 300 WSM.
215M is designed to ignite the long, thin, compacted powder charges of the large magnums (300 RUM, 338 Lapua, anything Weatherby).
The 210M is designed for igniting a powder column about the length of the .308 (7.62x51), which the 300 WSM matches the length of the powder column.
If you visualize the primer ignition as a flame spike shooting through the flash hole, through the center of the powder column, and just touching the base of the (still seated) bullet, it makes more sense.
Shorter flame spike of the 210M, designed to be the right "length" for the .308 or 300 WSM.
Long flame spike of the 215M, would hit the base of the bullet, unseat it, and (inconsistently) pre-burn the front of the powder charge.
Secondly, the 215M, being so energetic, overignites the powder charge, causing the peak pressure curve to occur earlier.
Earlier peak pressure curve results in a lower max powder charge.
210M:
more consistent ignition (lower velocity deviations) = less vertical error at range,
less energetic = pressure max happens when the bullet is slightly further down the barrel = more powder capacity overall = more "area under the curve" = more energy & speed total
Short version; I use large rifle primers in the 300WSM. 215M (magnum) is too energetic for the short mags.
Mine is a heavily modified Remington 700 short action (short mag version), trued and blueprinted, Sako extractor machined in,1stSFOD-Delta wrote:
But I have always wanted a good quality bolt gun. I've looked at Remington 700s before but there's so many different models.
What kind of set up do you have?
(Action may get replaced with a Surgeon WSM action w/ M-16 style extractor)
Jewell 4.5# trigger,
Krieger 25.5" stainless steel barrel (1:10 twist, #8 Standard Target profile)
JP Rifles "Bennie Cooley" large diameter brake,
Accuracy International AICS 1.5 SA stock,
Alpha Industries 10 round AICS compatible magazines (no front spacer-plate in the magazine = longer 2.95" max cartridge length),
Harris bipod,
Nightforce rings (or Badger Ordnance, don't recall. Have Badger, Nightforce, and Leupold "tacticool" rings),
20 MOA m1913/Picatinny mounting rail,
Nightforce NXS 8-32x56 scope (MOA reticle NPR1 (?), MOA turrets). MOA adjustments and ranging are exact at x22 power.
and Army surplus machine gun sling
I'm thinking of building a new rifle, with the 'lessons learned' from this one.
This short action stock will either get sold, or reused in a 6.5x47 Lapua rifle (7.62x51 necked down to 6.5mm, and using a small rifle primer).
Then I'll either build another 300 WSM rifle exactly the same, except I'd go with a Surgeon action and (most importantly) a better gunsmith.
Or, perhaps, try the new 338 Norma, a short-magnumized 338 Lapua designed to launch 300 grain rounds at 2800 fps.
(In other words, it out-ranges the 250 grain 338 Lapua, is more accurate, more efficient, but overall length is the same)
From .338 Norma Magnum - Wikipedia
Nice thing about the 300 WSM is that it nicely covers everything from coyotes to elk to bear, and I can do all that with one all-around go-to load.
Makes it easier to remember holdovers and drop for quick shots.
If I had to pick one boxed standard off-the-shelf rifle to use, it'd be the FN A5 M SPR in 300 WSM, or .308.
Or, a Winchester Model 70 (essentially the same as the FN SPR, but in hunter trim rather than tactical/military trim. FN is Winchester)
If I had money to spare, and I wanted just one really good rifle, I'd order a Surgeon Rifle in .338 Norma Magnum (or 300 WSM), wearing a Hensoldt 6-24x72 or old reliable Nightforce NXS 8-32x56
Nice. I'll definitely build a nice bolt gun when I'm done with the LaRue SPRs.
How do you like the NightForce scopes? I'm looking at those for my SPR.
The NXS compacts with the mil-dot reticule and LaRue mount. I even think SOCOM issues them with the Mk12 Mod 1 SPRs
How do you like the NightForce scopes? I'm looking at those for my SPR.
The NXS compacts with the mil-dot reticule and LaRue mount. I even think SOCOM issues them with the Mk12 Mod 1 SPRs
Last edited by 1stSFOD-Delta (2011-12-20 11:32:52)
Baba Booey