BF2S Forums Where are all the whiny peaceful "Enlightened" European now?

and yet I don't think we're nearly there yet. Yes, the cracks in the system are obvious, but during the pandemic the structure of the states and democracy has remained remarkably intact. Markets aren't doing anything but going up, with no forecast really predicting its impending demise. Employment numbers have remained more or less healthy. The migration crisis and concept of cultural war that dominated 2000-2016 appears mostly abated. The public's priorities in politics have shifted more towards issues like the environment, housing, healthcare, EU policies. Brexit stopped most '-exit' movements in their tracks. Don't get me wrong, there's still significant segments voting identity politics across the board, but their voices aren't as dominating as before esp. without the massive perceived 'outsider threat' in the form of refugees and terrorism that motivated people before. Identity debates now are more about national emancipation of minorities or LHBT.

Truth be told I don't necessarily see that crisis coming, not yet and not for a few more decades if things remain as they are. There will be some rumbles in the financial system when the ECB inevitably ups the interest rates and stops all the borrowing. There will be growing income inequality, as there is nothing stopping this development nationally or globally. There may be protests. But as long as most people retain their jobs & a semi-comfortable existence, revolution isn't necessarily on our doorstep.

re; I was referring to the foucauldian epistèmè <-> paradigm. Not epistemology.

Last edited by Larssen (2022-01-14 11:09:14)

As far as the continent goes the only real immediate worries I see are the positions of Hungary and Poland politically and the south financially still. Though neither issue appears to be in the realm that I could conscionably say that the existing system can't figure out a solution of sorts that allows it to plod along for a while longer.

As for income inequality, lately I've been considering it possible that we're seeing the creation of a new semi-aristocracy than that this development will be stopped or overturned somehow, sadly. It's worth looking at the times when great income inequality really caused societal upheaval; usually it meant a sizeable part of the population literally living in squalor and poverty. Despite the ginormous wealth gap, I'm not seeing that, and most of all the worst manifestations of that inequality are not within but outside the west's borders.

Last edited by Larssen (2022-01-14 11:23:29)

a high percentage of the poor american underclass support storming the capitol building, armed insurrection, and otherwise believe in completely reality-denying conspiracy theories. i wouldn’t be so sure. these people are still going to be a very large voting bloc in 2024.

e: in response to larssen.

Last edited by uziq (2022-01-14 11:24:56)

Another factor to consider by the way is that the controlling power of the state over its population has increased manyfold as compared to other historical moments. The realistic possibility of violent insurrection in states with strong bureaucracies and a high level of digital development is tiny. Our technological advancements of recent decades especially favour authoritarianism. I've never read Harari but I heard he's of the same opinion.

Not to say the west will devolve into authoritarian dictatorship, not at all. But attempts at using physical violence as a means to enact systemic change is highly unlikely to succeed. The government system will hit back immediately, and its communicative and intelligence gathering abilities will (a) sway public opinion, (b) probably destroy any attempt at insurrection before it even occurs.

well yeah I've noticed that economic logic of the past has been thrown out the window by the professionals. Not sure if the political class is ready to face that reality yet and some might still press on the logic of austerity as though state finances are the same as one's personal finances.

I don't know. I've look at some ECB info and they don't see any problem in the rising inflation as of now and believe it will stabilise this year to healthier levels with barely any change in policy from their part. I don't understand how it works, but I choose to trust their judgment.

Having said so another external gamechanger might be Turkey. Their inflation hit a whopping 33% over a year. That's worrisome.

Last edited by Larssen (2022-01-14 12:02:50)

I don't think either of us will be sad to see it go away/evolve. What's next though?

I reckon Johnson is done. Its crystal clear he doesn't give a shit about anyone but himself, the nation, following the same rules as everyone else etc.
His fellow Tories, who don't give a shit either, have twigged that the population has twigged and hence their gravy-train could well dry up so they'll get rid of him pronto, very likely before whatever elections are coming up.

The minutiae doesn't even matter, today we learned despite lockdown he was commuting between Chequers and Downing street because his latest pregnant strumpet liked it better there, he's finished and the only question is who will replace him.
There's more to come, the billions handed to chums is just starting to unravel with the 'VIP lane' for contracts being ruled unlawful.

Britain is now proper fucked, Brexit and Covid would be bad enough if handled adeptly, this could easily take a generation to recover from and the economy had already had 10 years of austerity.

I'm just not seeing anyone on either side of govt who isn't a fucking idiot with even the smallest chance of fixing this. Rishi Sunak or Liz Truss? LMAO.
On top of that its a mystery how Britain even has an economy - what does Britain produce which anyone wants? Brexit has fucked the City of London leaving, er, nothing.

Probably time to convert my last pounds, sit tight for five years then go back and live like a king.

Dilbert_X wrote:

uziq wrote:

As a man of science yourself presumably you can see the solid correlation between studying humanities at university, esp Oxford, and being a party-obsessed idiot with an undeveloped brain.

I'm sure I can find a plethora of peer reviewed papers on the subject.

how many people who study humanities at oxford belong to johnson’s caste? you do realise the majority of undergrads at oxford now are state-educated, right?

the eton->baliol->parliament fast track of yore applies to 1% of students. it applies to a tiny subset of a specific few colleges, even. do you think the oxford english or classics departments are all full of partying, braying public schoolboys from the same 2-3 schools? whilst also managing to be world-leading in reputation and assessment???

i’m sure you can use your impressive imperial degree to run the math, dipshit.

Last edited by uziq (2022-01-14 21:35:03)

Applies to the PM and half of govt though eh? Dipshit?

How can someone get a 'top level' degree with honours and still be a total fuckwit?

It does call into question the quality no?

That explains how people get in, it doesn't explain how they get a degree.

Er, Oxford and Cambridge were exclusively for the tiny minority, the remainder weren't, not even IC

in other news, the report which sue gray is compiling about the downing st parties, and on which bojo keeps hiding and deferring … is expected to make broad sweeping criticisms of ‘the drinking culture’ in government.

but i thought alcohol was harmless and could only be good?

reports have it that every friday bojo encouraged his staff at no 10 to let off steam. a junior lackey would be sent to the nearest store with a suitcase to fill with wine bottles. they had a cooler installed in downing street that was weekly stocked with 30-40 bottles.

so whilst everyone else couldn’t even attend their loved one’s funerals, much less have a drink even with members of their own family from without the household, this lot were getting steamed on a weekly basis.

alcohol good !

Putting on a deliberate show of being an idiot for your idiot voters, but you still suck sort of deal. #partygate like the tip of the iceberg