Support Kit Madness

2006-03-10 16:13:27

#1

XstrangerdangerX: conversation is combat; +36|6637|Tasmania

I had been hoping and praying that the support kit would be fixed with 1.21. It seems it's not the case.

And nor, on a wide search of these forums do I find many people who have a problem with it.

A support gun like the pkm is NOT an accurate weapon. It is meant to be used for suppressing fire, not sniping.

This whole prone and shoot thing is madness. Firstly, you shouldn't be able to accurately fire while going prone. Far too many times I'm firing a barrage of single rounds into this persons head while they drop and I end up dead along with the two squaddies trvelling with me.

It's insanely calibrated, and far too many people take advantage of this physics glitch. Just last night I played on a server where the entire USMC team seemed to be comprised of support with one or two medics.

Sure, as a support gunner you get some very easy points and extremely easy kills, but is it fair? It's like that teamgod SOB with his 1 kilometer knife kills.

Forgive my noobness but knowin how the weapon operates in the real world, my jaw drops when I get taken out for the fifth time by the one guy next to my spawn with a pkm. I haven't even got time to change to the grenade launcher (which I know will cure what ails him). I've only been playing for four days so maybe I'm just yet to create a strategy to deal with it>

If you can direct me to somewhere else this has been discussed or move my post, that would be great. But I really had believed it would be fixed with this patch as it's such a massive gameplay obstacle.

2006-03-10 16:16:51

#2

F.Rabshaw: Member; +37|6690

you've only been playing 4 days. when you get good you will understand that you can shoot these guys down very easily.

2006-03-10 16:23:25

#3

XstrangerdangerX: conversation is combat; +36|6637|Tasmania

That's good, I'm glad there's a workaround for it, however...

The idea of suppressing fire is a spray of bullets (in a fairly wide arc) that force an enemy force to keep its head down. Now, if one of those bullets hit you OH BOY do they pack a punch.

You cannot in real life use a pkm to snipe someone in the head for a one shot kill.

So thank you for giving me hope, but don't focus on how long I've been playing, focus on the fact that pkm is a bullshit weapon and proning while firing is a bullshit option.

Does anyone else agree?

Last edited by XstrangerdangerX (2006-03-10 16:38:29)

2006-03-10 16:46:12

#4

Harmony: Member; +0|6630

From somebody that fires a SAW occasionally, let me express my frustration of how it was before.
At a SAW range most soldiers with a little practice can cut down 4x4 posts at 100m. The saw is relatively accurate, more so than my M16 but a little harder to tell, since after you pull the trigger everything blurs for a bit. For that reason we train a gunner to fire with this mantra "aim, pull and release, aim, pull and release". Once the weapon fires the cone gets a little wide.

In real life you hide when a saw is firing in your direction. You would never get up and run across an open area at a saw gunner. At a few feet a saw gunner does not need to aim, merely depress the trigger and wave in your general direction. You will be cut in half.

In BF2 before the patch I watched guys run up alleyways at me when I am firing a saw. Now it is a little more realistic. The initial (IE first two or three rounds) accuracy comes from the longer and heavier barrel. Unfortunately the real SAQ can not be put on burst, and your biggest problem is how fast it burns ammunition. Also BTW the 50Cal can be used as a sniper weapon, it was in Vietnam. Automatic weapons are used for longer distance shooting.

Last edited by Harmony (2006-03-10 16:48:47)

2006-03-10 16:55:54

#5

XstrangerdangerX: conversation is combat; +36|6637|Tasmania

Fairly succint and reasonable answer. I wasn't aware of the accuracy it could offer.

How about going prone while shooting; can you maintain any accuracy at all with what must be a rather heavy weapon.... possible?

Last edited by XstrangerdangerX (2006-03-10 16:56:37)

2006-03-10 16:59:04

#6

Chaos81: Member; +5|6696

XstrangerdangerX wrote:
How about going prone while shooting; can you maintain any accuracy at all with what must be a rather heavy weapon.... possible?

Can you do it with any weapon?

2006-03-10 17:02:39

#7

MooseRyder: Member; +37|6663|Montréal, Canada

lol ur funny with supressing fire...if u supress fire on me im just gonna stand up and kill u. Seriously cmon now, its a game supressing fire its worthless in bf2 unless ur shooting with a chopper or a APC.

If u were looking foward for a rea life first person shooter game with BF2 well i got bad news for u. theres A LOT of things in bf2 but most of them are unrealistics. So suck it up and play or quit. and poeple using PKM are as easy as other player using other kits, just learn how to play.

2006-03-10 17:10:27

#8

Stubbee: Religions Hate Facts, Questions and Doubts; +223|6751|Reality

XstrangerdangerX wrote:
That's good, I'm glad there's a workaround for it, however...

The idea of suppressing fire is a spray of bullets (in a fairly wide arc) that force an enemy force to keep its head down. Now, if one of those bullets hit you OH BOY do they pack a punch.

You cannot in real life use a pkm to snipe someone in the head for a one shot kill.

So thank you for giving me hope, but don't focus on how long I've been playing, focus on the fact that pkm is a bullshit weapon and proning while firing is a bullshit option.

Does anyone else agree?

That is all weel and good in RL, because nobody wants to die. In this game however, you are back in 15 seconds, so the support guy is more aggressive. The animation is missleading. it looks like a barrelroll and shooting on the way down, but from the player's perspective it make sense.

The US economy is a giant Ponzi scheme. And 'to big to fail' is code speak for 'niahnahniahniahnah 99 percenters'

2006-03-10 17:15:36

#9

Citizen One: 한국 공주; +338|6657|South Korea.

It is way too powerfull, as soon as i see a supoert soldier dive in front of me, I let myself die.

2006-03-10 18:08:17

#10

Empathy: Member; +12|6708

God you tards its a bugfix patch not a balancefix patch.

2006-03-10 18:34:43

#11

XstrangerdangerX: conversation is combat; +36|6637|Tasmania

Some good responses, some youthful wankers.

Thanks Stubbee, probably best that I try it for myself I guess.

MosseRyder, I daresay if you don't use suppressing fire then you've never played in a proper squad. I've been there when fire is laid down so teammates can flank unseen, nail two tanks, four infantrymen and then cap the flag.

Far too many lone-wolfers in this game. There should be some squad-only servers made available.

Anyway, mods could either delete this or move it. Moving it means that when the next person like me comes along they don't start another braindead thread like this one.

Thanks all.

Last edited by XstrangerdangerX (2006-03-10 18:37:11)

2006-03-10 18:37:11

#12

masculata: Member; +24|6684|45° 30',North by 73° 35',West

Empathy wrote:
God you tards its a bugfix patch not a balancefix patch.

LMFAO, thats like a forum teabagging .......... thx Empathy

Last edited by masculata (2006-03-10 18:38:12)

2006-03-10 19:15:06

#13

Empathy: Member; +12|6708

KillerYaNk wrote:
y

right on, and poster above this one quoted, thx!

support is FINE

Learn2Counter!

2006-03-10 19:21:17

#14

xX[Elangbam]Xx: Member; +107|6705

F.Rabshaw wrote:
you've only been playing 4 days. when you get good you will understand that you can shoot these guys down very easily.

pffff, you obviously haven't gone up against my uber noob pkm sniping skills ;P

2006-03-10 19:24:43

#15

.-=5TON3R=-.: Member; +0|6730

about the going prone being accurate,your in the perfect positon to hold & aim a weapon so prone should & is the best positon for firing,ive been using pkm constantly last few days cause i need the kit time for expert as ive only got 3 more kits to work on,also agree with harmony about the 50cal in real life used for sniping,i seen a vid on google video showing someone take out snipers on a hill with a 50cal & it was funny as hell to watch,bodys just got obliterated & launched into the air in pieces lol.
ive just been testing 1.21 patch for few hrs & i'm loving it,no lag & hav'nt come across any bugs yet,plus battlerecorder works again .

2006-03-10 20:33:33

#16

Flecco: iPod is broken.; +1,048|6672|NT, like Mick Dundee

I have no problem with the accuracy of any support guns being improved, it has helped the balance of the game. I just think it sucks that I spent so much time playing support before 1.2 and doing resonably well just to have so many doing it now.

I haven't played support for more than 2 hours since patch 1.2, I dont plan on using the PKM ever again....

Whoa... Can't believe these forums are still kicking.

2006-03-10 20:45:00

#17

blacksheepcannibal: Member; +24|6760

i agree with the original poster. given the information on BF2S, i crunched some numbers, and figured out the most accruate weapon in the game, hands down, on every shot past the second til the 10th.

MG36.

They have made the PKM a sniping weapon. I have seen people short burst people on top of the TV station on Sharqi from the hilltop. *short* bursts, sometimes 1-2 shots at a time.

That is BS. I think that they have made support a little *too* accurate. i agree it needed a little more accuracy standing unzoomed, but still....

2006-03-10 21:02:03

#18

imdead: Death StatPadder; +228|6776|Human Meat Shield

Yeah, don't tell them tho, let 'em brag about it when everyone else is using it, like the PKM; I used it alot and I don't find any difference in the PKM, except long range maybe, but thats it. You guys just now must've figured out the power of the PKM, too me it's nothing new even before 1.12, the reason all you boneheads didn't know I figured out is that you all were too busy in tanks/planes/dolphin-diving/GL launching/ and chucking C4 to notice.

2006-03-10 21:06:35

#19

Poofy: Member; +0|6680|Pennsylvania

G3 can decimate the PKM at short-to-mid ranges if you know how to go about it. At mid, just toss a grenade so the PKMer HAS to stand-up (And run), and then waste him with 4 well placed shots. At short, just crotch and unload, he'll be dead before he can finish going prone.

Longer ranges are kind of a problem, but what can you do...

Last edited by Poofy (2006-03-10 21:07:01)

2006-03-10 21:17:22

#20

imdead: Death StatPadder; +228|6776|Human Meat Shield

Well the G3 can take out a full Health in 3 shots according to the wiki stats, the only assault rifle to do so. I also have no problem taking out the tons of PKMers with the G3, but you have to have a PKMer around you because you'll need ammo in about 10 seconds. It's really fun when you throw a flash and then 'head in' and they are running into walls or shooting at them. The G3 takes out snipers with no problem either, matter of fact the G3 is an all around great weapon, the reason why people don't play assault is that there isn't any 'benefit' on playing assault (like ammo, health, C4, Clays, Mines). They are the most Underrated Class imo. Just wait you'll see alot more G3 people running around after this post, when they find out how powerful the G3 is. But it is true I pick the class (like everyone else) that has that ... benefit...

2006-03-11 02:06:40

#21

PapaTango69: Member; +1|6797|NoneYA

.-=5TON3R=-. wrote:
about the going prone being accurate,your in the perfect positon to hold & aim a weapon so prone should & is the best positon for firing,ive been using pkm constantly last few days cause i need the kit time for expert as ive only got 3 more kits to work on,also agree with harmony about the 50cal in real life used for sniping,i seen a vid on google video showing someone take out snipers on a hill with a 50cal & it was funny as hell to watch,bodys just got obliterated & launched into the air in pieces lol.
ive just been testing 1.21 patch for few hrs & i'm loving it,no lag & hav'nt come across any bugs yet,plus battlerecorder works again .

Dude I Don't Mean to bust you're bubble or anything But Do a search on some Varmit Hunting videos and I'm sure you'll Find the same one you are talking about ,only in focus :]

2006-03-11 09:00:27

#22

MrE`158: Member; +103|6631

On the whole prone/accuracy thing:

Lying down is by far the best way to fire any gun that's rifle size or larger. the extra stability of having the weapon and/or your body resting on the ground is a fantastic advantage. Target shooting with rifles is almost always done from a prone position, and for firing anything in the 'machine gun' category it's pretty much a requirement, if for no other reason than the sheer weight of the weapon.

On the PKM and it's balance... I think that overall it's alright. It does seem very powerful if you're already down and ready to use it, and have a decent field of fire. But that's kinda the point of the gun. On the other hand if I'm clearing a building or trying to get through alleyways, I'd much rather have an assault rifle or submachine gun for fire-on-the-move capability. The thing that annoys me is that the PKM is light-years ahead of the basic LMGs in the game, in terms of power and accuracy. I'm all for unlocks being cool, but they shouldn't be clearly better than their other options. (i.e. the G3 is amazing for power and accuracy, but you've got to be really careful with it's little clip. The DAO-12 is awesome up close, but even the pitiful MP5 is more useful beyond a certain range).

2006-03-11 09:47:58

#23

blacksheepcannibal: Member; +24|6760

Have you guys seen the video of the guy sniping at near-max-range on mashtuur with the PKM? watch that video and *try* and tell me that the MG's in the game arent too accurate...

2006-03-11 10:38:07

#24

Umibozu_IT: Member; +15|6655|Italy

support weapons are way too overpowered. the game has become simply ridicolous. snipers should be hunted down by other snipers or by people sneaking around them, not by a guy with a pkm 200m away. i was playing ghost town this morning, it was full of people with pkms on the rooftops. they were shooting each other down from 200 - 250 meters. i've tried it myself: well i felt like i was cheating. you don't even need to lay down, you can simply stand up, look down the sights and fire. the only trick is to fire single shots and not bursts. every noob with 1 or 2 hours of experience can own.

and now tell me if weapons like m249 and pkm are meant to shoot down snipers 250 meters away. it's simply getting boring. and look how many people in a round are support now. before 1.2 patch it was hard to find an ammo bag, now there's more ammo bags than first aid bags. i think that on a 32 people server at least 25 are running aorund with pkms. now that's what the game needed... snipers laying claymores, supports sniping down ppl and some engy just to spam mines everywhere. i swear it's a week i don't kill some specops or assault. they just vanished, i'm the only moron running around with ak101 or g3...

2006-03-11 11:48:53

#25

Lucien: Fantasma Parastasie; +1,451|6661

Yes, because any random newbie can grab a PKM and rack up insane scores with it, aim perfectly, and play like a pro

BF2S Forums Support Kit Madness

XstrangerdangerX wrote:

XstrangerdangerX wrote:

Empathy wrote:

KillerYaNk wrote:

F.Rabshaw wrote:

.-=5TON3R=-. wrote:

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