BF2S Forums Should you need an ID to vote?!

Jaekus wrote:

RAIMIUS wrote:

Jaekus wrote:

This isn't a racial issue either. Some people would find it incredibly difficult to supply proper ID due to their circumstances. It's not like everyone has access to their birth certificate. For some it could prove to be a difficult, costly and time consuming process, especially those with disabilities.

It's not like a birth certificate is the ONLY document you can use.  Heck, a lot of places will accept a gas and electric bills as a way to get an ID.

Wow, really? Here you absolutely need a birth certificate.

No you don't.

Jaekus wrote:

We have pretty much the same system.

No we don't.

You have to show your ID to buy cigarettes or alcohol, cash a check, or board a plane, and there's no big uproar over that.

If you want to vote, show proof of identity and eligibility.
You need to be a US citizen, of adult age, and a non-felon.
NONE of those qualifications are going to disenfranchise anyone except those too lazy to get an ID card, or those ineligible to vote. 

Hell, I have to show ID and use a unique electronic key to get into work every day. 
Then unique login/password for my work computer.
Then unique login/passwords for work databases.
Then unique login/passwords for various trivial websites (bf2s, facebook, etc).
Every little minor activity I do, I am asked to authenticate that I'm actually me - it's not a big deal, it's modern society.

DrunkFace wrote:

FEOS wrote:

Voting is not a right--it is a privilege. If it were a right, there wouldn't be groups who are not allowed to vote (ie, felons and a handful of others). It is (and should be) a wide-spread, easily attainable privilege, but a privilege nonetheless. Requiring voters to present an ID to prove they are who they claim to be and are eligible to vote is no more discriminatory than requiring someone to present an ID at a bank to prove they are eligible to do business there.

Bit off topic, but does this mean guns are really just a privilege and not a 'right' as well?


We don't need ID here, but I wouldn't be against requiring ID if (and only if) the government were to 100% fund the IDs distribution. Put one of those microchips in them and vehicle licences and change of addresses can be update electronically. issue a new one every 5 or so year and the only cost to the citizens are when they lose or destroy the free one given to them (or renew licences etc).

You and Jaek both make excellent points WRT privilege vs right. I'll concede on that.

As for the government funding the IDs...that's exactly what has been offered, but those protesting it have still said it's racist and too difficult. In the US, you have to provide ID for nearly everything. Except voting, apparently.

So to prevent ten literal cases of voter fraud it's fine to spend that much tax payer's time and money across fifteen states to change law? I'm only going on the OP here. It just smacks of political benefit at the cost of economy. And I don't condone whatever happened in the 60s.

Jaekus wrote:

So to prevent ten literal cases of voter fraud it's fine to spend that much tax payer's time and money across fifteen states to change law? I'm only going on the OP here. It just smacks of political benefit at the cost of economy. And I don't condone whatever happened in the 60s.

It's not about 10 cases of voter fraud.

It's about confidence in the system.

If the election goes for Romney, but the Democratic voters think the voting machines are rigged - you have problems.
If the election goes for Obama, but the Republican voters think there were illegal votes made - you have problems.

In the 1960 election, there was quite a bit of questionable activity regarding voter fraud, dead people showing up as having voted, and "Chicago politics".
Rather than cause further unrest with a Supreme Court case questioning the validity of the election, the Republican party (Nixon IIRC) decided not to contest the vote.

In an election as bitterly contested as the current Presidential election, every reasonable measure should be taken to ensure confidence in the final vote.
We don't need more Florida "hanging chads", or dead people voting in Chicago, or glitchy Diebolds machines this year...

Bertster7 wrote:

Felons can't vote? WTF

Nope.  I think the idea is that if you are willing to so blatantly disregard the rule of law, you shouldn't have the right to decide on the laws.  Can't play nice within society, you don't get to decide how society runs. You wanna be an outlaw, you don't decide the laws.

Last edited by rdx-fx (2012-10-06 11:45:23)

Hurricane2k9 wrote:

It's all actually a pretty interesting case of constitutional law. Apparently there's nothing that explicitly states the right to vote, hence why some states prohibit felons from voting while others don't.

Where are you from originally?

rdx-fx wrote:

I think the idea is that if you are willing to so blatantly disregard the rule of law, you shouldn't have the right to decide on the laws.  Can't play nice within society, you don't get to decide how society runs. You wanna be an outlaw, you don't decide the laws.

Uzi wrote:

and you're surprised criminals in america spend most of their time in prisons, career recidivists? lol -uzi

Maintaining a security clearance is a pain in the ass, but not difficult.
Maintaining a decent credit rating isn't terribly difficult either.
Maintaining professional certification in engineering or medical fields is, at times, a little stressful but not difficult.

Not being a felon is brick-stupid simple.
If you're irrational and/or dumb enough to be a felon, you really aren't competent to vote.

Jay wrote:

It's just a matter of the rules not being enforced very efficiently.

Cute article.
Misdirection and semantics, but still cute.

It's like legal fan-fiction, by a blogger.

I've pissed in public a couple times whilst drunk, out of plain sight and nowhere near a thoroughfare. I hardly think that means I should lose my right to vote (or be on a sex offender registry for that matter).

Last edited by Jaekus (2012-10-06 17:32:56)

Jay wrote:

Camm wrote:

Hurricane2k9 wrote:

It's all actually a pretty interesting case of constitutional law. Apparently there's nothing that explicitly states the right to vote, hence why some states prohibit felons from voting while others don't.

Where are you from originally?

Chile by way of Canada if I recall correctly.

Close. Mom's from Chile, Dad's from Canada, but I was born in Argentina (they were both working there when they met).

-Sh1fty- wrote:

I didn't take the time to read everybody else's posts so I apologize if I'm a broken record here or if I missed some information.

I think the right thing is to have people show their ID. It's not a big deal, it takes all of 30 seconds tops (if you're really slow) and removes the possibility of foreigners voting in our elections. They have no right to vote in our country, so lets put this measure in place to force them to.

well that only works if the ID has some sort of designation on it to indicate citizenship. My Maryland driver's license looks no different from a US citizen's.

rdx-fx wrote:

-Sh1fty- wrote:

I didn't take the time to read everybody else's posts so I apologize if I'm a broken record here or if I missed some information.

I think the right thing is to have people show their ID. It's not a big deal, it takes all of 30 seconds tops (if you're really slow) and removes the possibility of foreigners voting in our elections. They have no right to vote in our country, so lets put this measure in place to force them to.

Hurricane2k9 wrote:

well that only works if the ID has some sort of designation on it to indicate citizenship. My Maryland driver's license looks no different from a US citizen's.

When the little old lady at the voting center uses your driver's license to cross reference you with her registered voter list, it's rather effective.
If, for some reason, you're not on the registered voter list, you need further ID to prove your eligibility.

And it's always a bunch of little old ladies running the voter registration desk...

Really? You have to register here months in advance. If you aren't on the list they won't hand you a ballot no matter how many proofs of ID you produce.

Name, address, DOB, and your driver ID #. If you don't have a driver ID you can provide the last four numbers of you social security.