Announcement

Join us on Discord: https://discord.gg/nf43FxS
Discuss.
coke
Aye up duck!
+436|5000|England. Stoke
Maybe by the time it ends we will have "evolved" to tolerate all drugs completely, sad times...
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+1,747|5063|USA

By then, Dilbert will still be reporting bags of catnip to the authorities.
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,611|4397|eXtreme to the maX
Pretty sure cats and catnip have been around for a while now.
Your virus system is infected with windows. Please to be giving me your credit card details urgently
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+1,747|5063|USA

They must've evolved that healthy adaptation like humans did with beer. Makes perfect sense to me.
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,611|4397|eXtreme to the maX
Most likely
Your virus system is infected with windows. Please to be giving me your credit card details urgently
uziq
Member
+160|1744
apparently catnip has no metabolic or neurological effect on a cat. dilbert knows what he’s talking about.
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,611|4397|eXtreme to the maX
I have no idea, I guess you'd have to ask a cat.

https://amp.insider.com/images/5b2cf4cf5e48ec5a008b4577-750-563.jpg
Your virus system is infected with windows. Please to be giving me your credit card details urgently
uziq
Member
+160|1744
looks a lot like a harmless stoner to me. do you have any commentary on how irritable and jumpy a cat is after their catnip fix dilbert?
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,611|4397|eXtreme to the maX
Well clearly catnip and other drugs are completely comparable,
Whats a proper dose of LSD for a cat?
Should I be micro-dosing the furry fellow with MDMA to boost his IQ?
I know he doesn't like being shaved for injections so I'm going to skip heroin - BUT ITS HIS RIGHT TO USE IF HE WANTS TO BECAUSE ALL DRUGS ARE THE SAME
Your virus system is infected with windows. Please to be giving me your credit card details urgently
uziq
Member
+160|1744
you really seem to struggle with nuanced and qualified arguments. it’s a wonder you consider yourself a man of scientific rigour. no one has ever claimed that all drugs are equal, or equally harmful. only that, by all reasonable accounting, alcohol is much more harmful for the individual and society than many ‘illegal’ drugs. i never claimed heroin was good for you or that crystal meth and cocaine should be legalised and promoted like fruit and vegetables.

alcohol is mostly pretty bad for you, and the fact that in the west we have culturally sanctioned the social rite of getting drunk doesn’t mean that getting drunk isn’t a terribly unhealthy thing to do. as a society we have just weighed the balance and accepted, as with all drugs, that there are costs and attendant risks. that we use alcohol in our ritual of intoxication rather then, say, chewing khat or going forth on a weekly trip with the village elders, and regard someone getting extremely drunk with wry amusement rather than concern, is an accident of history and geography, not an objective and scientific endorsement for alcohol’s safety. on the contrary, all the evidence would indicate that as a society we tolerate and allow alcohol use to great cost and social detriment.

the whole topic of a ‘scientific’ and medically sound approach to drug classification has been argued tirelessly by people like your old imperial chum, david nutt. it’s not fringe science.

Last edited by uziq (2019-07-20 05:36:59)

Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,611|4397|eXtreme to the maX
What if I told you.....

Not everyone drinks to get drunk
Your virus system is infected with windows. Please to be giving me your credit card details urgently
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+1,747|5063|USA

Sounds like a good excuse if you're an alcoholic.
uziq
Member
+160|1744

Dilbert_X wrote:

What if I told you.....

Not everyone drinks to get drunk
and not everyone rails cocaine 4 times a week into an early grave and early-onset alzheimer's?

most people only take LSD once, and feel much enriched by it?

'not everyone drinks to get drunk', sure, but it's still one of the top causes of morbidity in the west. the statistics somewhat contravene your view of alcohol as a harmless drug that is only taken with a meal.
Lancer_MiG
Member
+0|28
Yeah, drunks drink themselves to death, nothing new under the sun, and apart from that, water is wet.
And then, tell me, what's the issue when a person drinks one glass of beer or wine, per week, in the evening, with their dinner?
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,611|4397|eXtreme to the maX
There's no issue, as long as you accept beer is exactly the same as cocaine.
Your virus system is infected with windows. Please to be giving me your credit card details urgently
coke
Aye up duck!
+436|5000|England. Stoke
There's no issue unless you're an obtuse bore like Dilbert.
uziq
Member
+160|1744

Dilbert_X wrote:

There's no issue, as long as you accept beer is exactly the same as cocaine.
yes, there is no issue, so long as you can appreciate that both drugs can be (very) deleterious to your health and are addictive substances.

people can enjoy a few glasses of wine a week with a meal, and not go out and binge, and others can have a few lines of cocaine at a dinner party.

surprisingly, it's hard to make blanket and absolute statements. which is why you are an idiot.
uziq
Member
+160|1744
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr … h-drinking

https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 … ajor-study

Even the occasional drink is harmful to health, according to the largest and most detailed research carried out on the effects of alcohol, which suggests governments should think of advising people to abstain completely.

The uncompromising message comes from the authors of the Global Burden of Diseases study, a rolling project based at the University of Washington, in Seattle, which produces the most comprehensive data on the causes of illness and death in the world.

Alcohol, says their report published in the Lancet medical journal, led to 2.8 million deaths in 2016. It was the leading risk factor for premature mortality and disability in the 15 to 49 age group, accounting for 20% of deaths.

Current alcohol drinking habits pose “dire ramifications for future population health in the absence of policy action today”, says the paper. “Alcohol use contributes to health loss from many causes and exacts its toll across the lifespan, particularly among men.”

Most national guidelines suggest there are health benefits to one or two glasses of wine or beer a day, they say. “Our results show that the safest level of drinking is none.”
https://www.smh.com.au/national/alcohol … 51zo3.html

Alcohol causes the most overall harm to the Australian community, surpassing crystal methamphetamine (ice) and heroin, a new national study suggests.

The Australia-first study, funded by St Vincent’s Hospital in Melbourne, examined 22 drugs and measured the risk to an individual and the damage to society as a whole.

As part of the study, 25 drug-harm experts – including frontline emergency service workers, police, addiction specialists, doctors and those working in the welfare and homeless sectors – ranked the drugs on a score of zero to 100, based on the damage they caused to users, including illness, injury and death.

They also examined the effects drugs have on users' families and the wider community, such as through  violence, crime, unemployment, economic costs and relationship breakdowns.

Alcohol was ranked by far the most damaging drug to the Australian community, scoring 77 out of 100, followed by crystal meth (66), heroin (58) and fentanyls (51).
consider a spot of cocaine, dilbert?

Last edited by uziq (2019-08-02 02:14:25)

Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,611|4397|eXtreme to the maX
the whole topic of a ‘scientific’ and medically sound approach to drug classification has been argued tirelessly by people like your old imperial chum, david nutt. it’s not fringe science.
Science of microdosing psychedelics 'remains patchy and anecdotal', says review
http://www.imperial.ac.uk/news/192046/s … iebulletin

From my alma mater, in uh peeyah-reyvood acardumic paypa rittern by a proppah Pruhfessar - seems there's exactly no evidence whatsoever theres any positive effect at all.

Last edited by Dilbert_X (2019-08-02 02:49:55)

Your virus system is infected with windows. Please to be giving me your credit card details urgently
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,611|4397|eXtreme to the maX

uziq wrote:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/aug/02/everything-is-better-without-alcohol-and-i-really-do-mean-everything-reader-relationships-with-drinking

https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 … ajor-study

Even the occasional drink is harmful to health, according to the largest and most detailed research carried out on the effects of alcohol, which suggests governments should think of advising people to abstain completely.

The uncompromising message comes from the authors of the Global Burden of Diseases study, a rolling project based at the University of Washington, in Seattle, which produces the most comprehensive data on the causes of illness and death in the world.

Alcohol, says their report published in the Lancet medical journal, led to 2.8 million deaths in 2016. It was the leading risk factor for premature mortality and disability in the 15 to 49 age group, accounting for 20% of deaths.

Current alcohol drinking habits pose “dire ramifications for future population health in the absence of policy action today”, says the paper. “Alcohol use contributes to health loss from many causes and exacts its toll across the lifespan, particularly among men.”

Most national guidelines suggest there are health benefits to one or two glasses of wine or beer a day, they say. “Our results show that the safest level of drinking is none.”
https://www.smh.com.au/national/alcohol … 51zo3.html

Alcohol causes the most overall harm to the Australian community, surpassing crystal methamphetamine (ice) and heroin, a new national study suggests.

The Australia-first study, funded by St Vincent’s Hospital in Melbourne, examined 22 drugs and measured the risk to an individual and the damage to society as a whole.

As part of the study, 25 drug-harm experts – including frontline emergency service workers, police, addiction specialists, doctors and those working in the welfare and homeless sectors – ranked the drugs on a score of zero to 100, based on the damage they caused to users, including illness, injury and death.

They also examined the effects drugs have on users' families and the wider community, such as through  violence, crime, unemployment, economic costs and relationship breakdowns.

Alcohol was ranked by far the most damaging drug to the Australian community, scoring 77 out of 100, followed by crystal meth (66), heroin (58) and fentanyls (51).
consider a spot of cocaine, dilbert?
OK, you win, I'm going over to crystal meth.
https://www.findrehabcenters.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/12/crystal-meth-face-810x540.png

As well as consuming about 23 standards drinks a day, Mr Reichmann would smoke cannabis and regularly use crystal meth and heroin. But alcohol was always the easiest drug to get.
Well that clinches it, we should make it easier to get hold of meth and heroin and harder to get hold of alcohol.

Obviously people with substance abuse problems are going to kill themselves with whatever is most easily available, dur.
In the absence of substances they'll kill themselves with auto-erotic asphyxia, what do you do, ban air?

Last edited by Dilbert_X (2019-08-02 02:44:57)

Your virus system is infected with windows. Please to be giving me your credit card details urgently
uziq
Member
+160|1744

Dilbert_X wrote:

the whole topic of a ‘scientific’ and medically sound approach to drug classification has been argued tirelessly by people like your old imperial chum, david nutt. it’s not fringe science.
Science of microdosing psychedelics 'remains patchy and anecdotal', says review
http://www.imperial.ac.uk/news/192046/s … iebulletin

From my alma mater, in uh peeyah-reyvood acardumic paypa rittern by a proppah Pruhfessar - seems there's exactly no evidence whatsoever theres any positive effect at all.
microdosing hasn't been researched because the model of therapy currently being investigated is based around one or several 'big' trips in a therapeutic setting. it's far easier to research and devise proper controls, for one. note that the 'small dose every day for a long period' model for anti-depressants has produced 'patchy' research for years, too.

there is plenty of good and interesting research coming out of psychedelic research. trials are being rolled out and the results are good. ketamine is being considered as a depression treatment, too, with similarly good results.

is that picture of the lead singer from the pogues? the alcoholic?

and i'm not debating the reasons why the alcohol figures are so high -- yes, it's the most easily available substance. though i would add that it's not really like anyone who wants to take ecstasy/MDMA or weed is really going to have real barriers to procuring them. these things are easy to get for anyone who is so inclined. not the convenience of a corner store, i'll give you that much.

what i am debating is your view of alcohol as benign and harmless, when evidently it is addictive and toxic to the human body. none of this is controversial but you seem to think any illicit drug is an addictive portal into hell but alcohol is safe and manageable. you consume a harmful substance in moderation, because the harm/pleasure ratio is more or less acceptable to you. that's what people do on the other side of the legal tracks, dumkopf.

Last edited by uziq (2019-08-02 03:33:39)

Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,611|4397|eXtreme to the maX
So basically the cutting edge of academic theory is  people on LSD think they're cleverer?
Whats next for the IC dept of Recreational Drugs?

"Does cannabis use turn people into intellectual and amusing conversationalists or giggling morons with hunger pangs and distorted self-perception?"
Your virus system is infected with windows. Please to be giving me your credit card details urgently
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,611|4397|eXtreme to the maX

uziq wrote:

what i am debating is your view of alcohol as benign and harmless,
Have I said alcohol use is benign and harmless?
Your virus system is infected with windows. Please to be giving me your credit card details urgently
uziq
Member
+160|1744
what are you actually talking about? nobody has claimed LSD makes you more intelligent.

also from imperial ... ?

In the last decade a number of research groups in Europe and the Americas have conducted studies into the safety and effectiveness of psychedelics for conditions such as depression and post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD), but the new Imperial centre is the first to gain this level of stature within a major academic institution.

Imperial’s Psychedelic Research Group was the first in the world to investigate the brain effects of LSD using modern brain imaging and the first to study psilocybin – the active compound in magic mushrooms – for treating severe depression. These studies have laid the groundwork for larger trials that are now taking place around the world.
https://www.imperial.ac.uk/news/190994/ … chedelics/

https://hopkinspsychedelic.org

For over 15 years the Johns Hopkins Psychedelic Research Unit has been the preeminent and most productive research team in the United States conducting human research with psychedelics. They have shown breathtaking scientific productivity, having published more than 50 peer-reviewed manuscripts on psychedelics, including 15 published laboratory studies.
hopkins has established LSD/psilocybin as effective in treating depression and in cessation from addictive substances, such as alcohol, cocaine and tobacco.

in the journal of psychopharmacology:
https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/1 … 1116675512

Prior to the crossover, psilocybin produced immediate, substantial, and sustained improvements in anxiety and depression and led to decreases in cancer-related demoralization and hopelessness, improved spiritual wellbeing, and increased quality of life. At the 6.5-month follow-up, psilocybin was associated with enduring anxiolytic and anti-depressant effects (approximately 60–80% of participants continued with clinically significant reductions in depression or anxiety), sustained benefits in existential distress and quality of life, as well as improved attitudes towards death. The psilocybin-induced mystical experience mediated the therapeutic effect of psilocybin on anxiety and depression.

[...]

In conjunction with psychotherapy, single moderate-dose psilocybin produced rapid, robust and enduring anxiolytic and anti-depressant effects in patients with cancer-related psychological distress.
no one has claimed anything so facile as 'LSD makes you cleverer'. i mentioned there's a culture of microdosing in silicon valley to show that it's fairly mainstream and evidently not disastrous to one's health and sanity, not that tech-wonks in silicon valley are making scientific breakthroughs. it's a fad there like any number of other silly fads.
uziq
Member
+160|1744

Dilbert_X wrote:

uziq wrote:

what i am debating is your view of alcohol as benign and harmless,
Have I said alcohol use is benign and harmless?
you have literally been saying for the last several pages that alcohol use is GOOD for you in the quantities you imbibe! and prattling on and on about cocaine psychosis and alzheimer's, as if heavy alcohol use doesn't rot your liver and brain.

Board footer

Privacy Policy - © 2019 Jeff Minard