blademaster
I'm moving to Brazil
+2,075|6637
https://img191.imageshack.us/img191/8061/civilwarsoldiersunionco.gif

Based on the hundreds of e-mails, Facebook comments and Tweets I've read in response to my denunciation of Virginia Gov. Bob McDonnell's decision to honor Confederates for their involvement in the Civil War -- which was based on the desire to continue slavery -- the one consistent thing that supporters of the proclamation offer up as a defense is that these individuals were fighting for what they believed in and defending their homeland.In criticizing me for saying that celebrating the Confederates was akin to honoring Nazi soldiers for killing of Jews during the Holocaust, Rob Wagner said, "I am simply defending the honor and dignity of men who were given no choice other than to fight, some as young as thirteen."Sherry Callahan said that supporting the Confederacy is "our history. Not hate; it's about heritage and history."

Javier Ramirez called slavery evil, but prefaced his remarks by saying that "Confederate soldiers were never seen as terrorists by [President Abraham] Lincoln or U.S. generals on the battlefield. They were accorded POW status, they were never tried for war crimes. Not once did Confederate soldiers do any damage to civilians or their property in their invasion of the north. The same is not true of Union soldiers."Slavery is appalling, but was not the only reason for the CW [Civil War]. Those men, while misguided on some fronts stood up for what they felt was right. They embodied that American ideal that the states have a right to govern themselves. THAT is what a confederate soldier stood for."If you take all of these comments, don't they sound eerily similar to what we hear today from Muslim extremists who have pledged their lives to defend the honor of Allah and to defeat the infidels in the West?When you make the argument that the South was angry with the North for "invading" its "homeland," Osama bin Laden has said the same about U.S. soldiers being on Arab soil. He has objected to our bases in Saudi Arabia, and that's one of the reasons he has launched his jihad against us. Is there really that much of a difference between him and the Confederates? Same language; same cause; same effect.

If a Confederate soldier was merely doing his job in defending his homeland, honor and heritage, what are we to say about young Muslim radicals who say the exact same thing as their rationale for strapping bombs on their bodies and blowing up cafes and buildings?If the Sons of Confederate Veterans use as a talking point the vicious manner in which people in the South were treated by the North, doesn't that sound exactly like the Taliban saying they want to kill Americans for the slaughter of innocent people in Afghanistan?Defenders of the Confederacy say that innocent people were killed in the Civil War; hasn't the same argument been presented by Muslim radicals in Iraq, Afghanistan and other places where the U.S. has tangled with terrorists?We can't on the one hand justify the actions of Confederates as being their duty as valiant men of the South, and then condemn the Muslim extremists who want to see Americans die a brutal death. These men are held up as honorable by their brethren, so why do Americans see them as different from our homegrown terrorists?

The fundamental problem with extremism is that when you're on the side that is fanatical, all of your actions make sense to you, and you are fluent in trying to justify every action. Every position of those you oppose is a personal affront that calls for you to do what you think is necessary to protect yourself and your family.Just as radical Muslims have a warped sense of religion, Confederate supporters have a delusional view of what is honorable. The terrorists are willing to kill their own to prove their point, and the Confederates were just as willing in the Civil War to take up arms against their fellow Americans to justify their point.Even if you're a relative of one of the 9/11 hijackers, that man was an out-and-out terrorist, and nothing you can say will change that. And if your great-great-great-granddaddy was a Confederate who stood up for Southern ideals, he too was a terrorist.They are the same.As a matter of conscience, I will not justify, understand or accept the atrocious view of Muslim terrorists that their actions represent a just war. They are reprehensible, and their actions a sin against humanity.And I will never, under any circumstances, cast Confederates as heroic figures who should be honored and revered. No -- they were, and forever will be, domestic terrorists.

source

"When you make the argument that the South was angry with the North for "invading" its "homeland," Osama bin Laden has said the same about U.S. soldiers being on Arab soil." Same concept can be applied to any invaded country... media it twists things... propaganda is a powerful tool... all they have to do is provide some faulty evidence, fool the people, gain support then attack the country.... plus any disorganized army can be viewed as terrorists.  During U.S. independence, U.S. soldiers fought in unconventional style warfare, so the British Empire could have considered them terrorists by today's standards...
eleven bravo
Member
+1,399|5251|foggy bottom
no
Tu Stultus Es
RTHKI
mmmf mmmf mmmf
+1,736|6729|Oxferd Ohire
I don't think the Confederates were. They were allowed to break off from the US by the Constitution werent they? the north just didnt want them to.

about terrorism today, they dont just attack the us, they attack other countries. how much did spain do to deserve the subway bombings?
https://i.imgur.com/tMvdWFG.png
Hurricane2k9
Pendulous Sweaty Balls
+1,538|5694|College Park, MD
Pretty sure the Confederates didn't target civilians.
https://static.bf2s.com/files/user/36793/marylandsig.jpg
mtb0minime
minimember
+2,418|6647

No, I don't think they were.

I remember discussing something similar in history class (in high school). When retaliation and rebellion occurred after the Boston Massacre, those involved (in the uprising) are considered patriots. If something like that happened today, they'd likely be considered terrorists.
=NHB=Shadow
hi
+322|6358|California
yes
Cybargs
Moderated
+2,285|6708
Lol and ignore the shit the Union did... Sherman's total war.
https://cache.www.gametracker.com/server_info/203.46.105.23:21300/b_350_20_692108_381007_FFFFFF_000000.png
Reciprocity
Member
+721|6573|the dank(super) side of Oregon
terrorists? no.  losers? yes.
Flaming_Maniac
prince of insufficient light
+2,490|6699|67.222.138.85
What kind of retard compares a regular army in a civil war to religious zealots? This is the equivalent of calling Confederate soldiers Communists 20 years ago.
Jaekus
I'm the matchstick that you'll never lose
+957|5171|Sydney

Hurricane2k9 wrote:

Pretty sure the Confederates didn't target civilians.
Just denied them cilvilian status by making them slaves.
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6764|PNW

Scorched earth was utilized by the north. Were Yankees terrorists?

Jaekus wrote:

Hurricane2k9 wrote:

Pretty sure the Confederates didn't target civilians.
Just denied them cilvilian status by making them slaves.
So did the north, at one point. I think too many people envision the Confederates as cloned force of stereotypical slave owners, but a great deal of the front liners were too poor to afford socks, boots and a jacket.

In those days, your state was considered more your country than the United States. See, if your state went to war against another state, what do you do? Betray your own state to fight for the north against your own friends and family? Civil wars are especially brutal.

Anyway:



just lol
(/ragequit)

Last edited by unnamednewbie13 (2010-04-12 00:53:52)

13rin
Member
+977|6471

Jaekus wrote:

Hurricane2k9 wrote:

Pretty sure the Confederates didn't target civilians.
Just denied them cilvilian status by making them slaves.
Just like the North did.
I stood in line for four hours. They better give me a Wal-Mart gift card, or something.  - Rodney Booker, Job Fair attendee.
jsnipy
...
+3,276|6515|...

lol @ the term "terrorist". You have been trained well westerner.
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6098|eXtreme to the maX
I guess there's a difference between a civil war in your own country and travelling half way around the world to invade countries for reasons which still aren't clear.
Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!
LostFate
Same shit, Different Arsehole
+95|6478|England
Terrorist lol
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6643|USA
It was not a civil war, it was a war for Independence. Southern states were fighting for their Independence from the federal govt.

They were not terrorists ( can't even believe the comparison was made). They were a new nation in battle with another nation for their Independence.

based on his criteria, anyone dumb enough to make the comparison in the OP, has to also claim that the Continental soldiers were also terrorists. Terrorists attacking England...The freedom to start a new nation built on slavery etc.... Wonder if he is prepared to call our founding fathers terrorists now, just like radical muslims and jihadists. What a dumb fuck
Cybargs
Moderated
+2,285|6708

lowing wrote:

It was not a civil war, it was a war for Independence. Southern states were fighting for their Independence from the federal govt.

They were not terrorists ( can't even believe the comparison was made). They were a new nation in battle with another nation for their Independence.

based on his criteria, anyone dumb enough to make the comparison in the OP, has to also claim that the Continental soldiers were also terrorists. Terrorists attacking England...The freedom to start a new nation built on slavery etc.... Wonder if he is prepared to call our founding fathers terrorists now, just like radical muslims and jihadists. What a dumb fuck
Boston Tea Party boys did act a bit like terrorists by destroying shops of known loyalists... Now that's a jackass move.

Confederates weren't the ones who killed every single live stock, burned down every farm and used blacks as cannon fodder while saying "hey were not racist guys were the good guys lolz."

This is one of the very few posts that I COMPLETELY agree with lowing.

The issue was more about state rights than anything, but would not have happened if Slavery was an issue.

If you think "omg American soldiers are terrible and kill civies and destroy their lively hood..." Hate to break it to you, the Union did A LOT OF FUCKED UP SHIT.
https://cache.www.gametracker.com/server_info/203.46.105.23:21300/b_350_20_692108_381007_FFFFFF_000000.png
Flaming_Maniac
prince of insufficient light
+2,490|6699|67.222.138.85

lowing wrote:

It was not a civil war, it was a war for Independence. Southern states were fighting for their Independence from the federal govt.

They were not terrorists ( can't even believe the comparison was made). They were a new nation in battle with another nation for their Independence.

based on his criteria, anyone dumb enough to make the comparison in the OP, has to also claim that the Continental soldiers were also terrorists. Terrorists attacking England...The freedom to start a new nation built on slavery etc.... Wonder if he is prepared to call our founding fathers terrorists now, just like radical muslims and jihadists. What a dumb fuck
If they won it would have been a war for independence, but they didn't. Civil War.
eleven bravo
Member
+1,399|5251|foggy bottom

lowing wrote:

based on his criteria, anyone dumb enough to make the comparison in the OP, has to also claim that the Continental soldiers were also terrorists. Terrorists attacking England...The freedom to start a new nation built on slavery etc.... Wonder if he is prepared to call our founding fathers terrorists now, just like radical muslims and jihadists. What a dumb fuck
no, they were mostly slave owners, your kind of people.
Tu Stultus Es
Cybargs
Moderated
+2,285|6708

eleven bravo wrote:

lowing wrote:

based on his criteria, anyone dumb enough to make the comparison in the OP, has to also claim that the Continental soldiers were also terrorists. Terrorists attacking England...The freedom to start a new nation built on slavery etc.... Wonder if he is prepared to call our founding fathers terrorists now, just like radical muslims and jihadists. What a dumb fuck
no, they were mostly slave owners, your kind of people.
One in maybe 25 whites owned slaves. Most people didn't have the money to afford slaves. Kinda like how many people today own business' of their own.
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eleven bravo
Member
+1,399|5251|foggy bottom

Cybargs wrote:

eleven bravo wrote:

lowing wrote:

based on his criteria, anyone dumb enough to make the comparison in the OP, has to also claim that the Continental soldiers were also terrorists. Terrorists attacking England...The freedom to start a new nation built on slavery etc.... Wonder if he is prepared to call our founding fathers terrorists now, just like radical muslims and jihadists. What a dumb fuck
no, they were mostly slave owners, your kind of people.
One in maybe 25 whites owned slaves. Most people didn't have the money to afford slaves. Kinda like how many people today own business' of their own.
talking about the founding fathers.
Tu Stultus Es
Cybargs
Moderated
+2,285|6708

eleven bravo wrote:

Cybargs wrote:

eleven bravo wrote:


no, they were mostly slave owners, your kind of people.
One in maybe 25 whites owned slaves. Most people didn't have the money to afford slaves. Kinda like how many people today own business' of their own.
talking about the founding fathers.
Jefferson loved black booty. Washington had a pretty successful plantation. The irony about the "freedom" fought in the war of independence.
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eleven bravo
Member
+1,399|5251|foggy bottom
people need to realize exactly who it is they are deifying
I got into an argument with a really really really fat white girl with bleach blond hair who took issue with a comment I made about how some of actions committed during the revolutionary war would certainly be considered acts of terror. She was all like "So youre saying our founding fathers were terrorist?"...

"sure"

https://profile.ak.fbcdn.net/v222/719/48/n1640305851_2905.jpg

she's much much fatter in real life

Last edited by eleven bravo (2010-04-12 09:28:38)

Tu Stultus Es
eleven bravo
Member
+1,399|5251|foggy bottom
anybody claiming that terrorist acts werent committed on some ocassions by yankees in the revolutionary war better not complain one bit about a car bomb going off killing civilians or people getting beheaded in afghanistan or iraq.
Tu Stultus Es
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6643|USA

eleven bravo wrote:

anybody claiming that terrorist acts werent committed on some ocassions by yankees in the revolutionary war better not complain one bit about a car bomb going off killing civilians or people getting beheaded in afghanistan or iraq.
We will then also label all gang members today as terrorists, and the Black Panthers, they were also terrorists. You would have no problem labeling the KKK as such, then you must label all groups the same.

Kinda like the word racist, you are diluting the word terrorist so much it has no meaning anymore.

Racist now includes all people that disagree with the black president or speaks out against him. Terrorist now includes all people that ever picked up a gun.

Sorry I will keep both words in their proper perspectives and contexts.

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