BF2S Forums Within 20 Years, Muslims Will Be Majority in Europe

Braddock wrote:

lowing wrote:

Braddock wrote:

I thought you knew the Qu'ran quite well lowing, you have argued with me on numerous occasions that you know exactly what the Qu'ran teaches.

No, I have argued with you as to what I have read about the Koran and what it says. I left the research to those that actually read the thing and wrote articles and papers on the topic. Not ot mention the actions of those that have used the Koran to justify their actions against us...Sue me.

And yet when counter arguments by other respected scholars are offered back to you you simply negate them and claim that you know what the truth is.

And don't try and use the actions of extremists as a means of interpreting the Qu'ran. For God's sake you've used the argument yourself in this thread that 'Christian' extremists don't actually represent the Christian faith, why have another rule for Islam.

I simply have an opinion Braddock, I base it on what I see, read and hear. I do not negate anything scholars have to say, the fact just as many of them think Islam is a fucked up religion as well.

I do not have a separate rule, by following Christ you are following a message of peace love and tolerance, by following Muhammad you are following a message of intolerance and death or convertion to your enemies. If you do not follow Christ, and kill, you are not following his message, if you do not follow Muhammad, and love infidels you are not following his message. My beliefs are quite consistant.

I

usmarine wrote:

why is this such a stretch?  you think 50 years ago people in the US thought mexicans would come close to outnumbering them?

The EU never said 'give us your huddled masses'. It is not as easy for illegals to find gainful employment over here as it is in the US - we fine/jail those caught doing it, ye know.

lowing wrote:

IG-Calibre wrote:

lowing wrote:

No braddock, what I am doing is telling you Christians do not follow the Old Testament...

HAHAHA good luck telling that to all the fundamental Christian brethren that I share my homeland with lol.. you're great entertainment Lowing they preach from little else... Leviticus this... Leviticus that..

I see so you are a follower of Christ's message tha twas written 2000 years before Christ was born huh?

I said in its full context, that Christians adhere to the word and teachings of Christ ( the NEW Covenant) for their guidance, and basically acknowledge the old testament as what the word of God was before. Christianity could stand alone with the New Covenant if the old testament never exisited.

Ha-ha dear God no I am not a fundamental Christian Protestant, Lowing though my brethren are and would very much consider themselves Christian and would very much follow the old testament.  Now this is all really pointless, there is no point debating with you Lowing, you're  hermetically sealed in a paradigm of ignorance, it's an impregnable fortress!! and I give up because it's pointless..  i'll just snigger form the sidelines I think..

Last edited by IG-Calibre (2008-07-31 16:32:20)

lowing wrote:

Braddock wrote:

lowing wrote:

No, I have argued with you as to what I have read about the Koran and what it says. I left the research to those that actually read the thing and wrote articles and papers on the topic. Not ot mention the actions of those that have used the Koran to justify their actions against us...Sue me.

And yet when counter arguments by other respected scholars are offered back to you you simply negate them and claim that you know what the truth is.

And don't try and use the actions of extremists as a means of interpreting the Qu'ran. For God's sake you've used the argument yourself in this thread that 'Christian' extremists don't actually represent the Christian faith, why have another rule for Islam.

I simply have an opinion Braddock, I base it on what I see, read and hear. I do not negate anything scholars have to say, the fact just as many of them think Islam is a fucked up religion as well.

I do not have a separate rule, by following Christ you are following a message of peace love and tolerance, by following Muhammad you are following a message of intolerance and death or convertion to your enemies. If you do not follow Christ, and kill, you are not following his message, if you do not follow Muhammad, and love infidels you are not following his message. My beliefs are quite consistant.

I

And why are you so worried about people not following these religions to the letter when such a thing is often positive for society?

You really believe in the idea of being a sheep when it comes to religion. That's the main reason I don't like organised religion of any kind.

IG-Calibre wrote:

lowing wrote:

IG-Calibre wrote:

HAHAHA good luck telling that to all the fundamental Christian brethren that I share my homeland with lol.. you're great entertainment Lowing they preach from little else... Leviticus this... Leviticus that..

I see so you are a follower of Christ's message tha twas written 2000 years before Christ was born huh?

I said in its full context, that Christians adhere to the word and teachings of Christ ( the NEW Covenant) for their guidance, and basically acknowledge the old testament as what the word of God was before. Christianity could stand alone with the New Covenant if the old testament never exisited.

Ha-ha dear God no I am not a fundamental Christian Protestant, Lowing though my brethren are and would very much consider themselves Christian and would very much follow the old testament.  Now this is all really pointless, there is no point debating with you Lowing, you're  hermetically sealed in a paradigm of ignorance, it's an impregnable fortress!! and I give up because it's pointless..  i'll just snigger form the sidelines I think..

very well, jump in whenever you feel the need to do so.

lowing wrote:

Who on this planet is REALLY qualified to say what the truth really is about life after death?

Dead people.

jesus

Braddock wrote:

lowing wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:

I'm willing to bet that not a single fucking soul on this forum has fully read either the Bible, Torah or Q'uran and yet we're all fucking theologians on the evidence of our posts. This is nonsense. How people can make 'expert' comments on three documents that contradict themselves every ten paragraphs I'll never know.

I am not a nexpert on anything, I simply know enough as to what is really happening when we want to "interpret" shit. It is not to seek truth, it is to bend and or justify the word to satisfy our own agendas. There is only one word of Jesus, or Muhammad. Follow it or do not follow it. You need not be an expert to understand that. Even theologians will "interpret" to satisfy their own agendas. So are they any more crediable than anyone else?

Who on this planet is REALLY qualified to say what the truth really is about life after death?

Okay lowing take theologians out of the equation...you are still left with wiggle room when it comes to interpreting ancient texts. The minute you look outside the text and get help from external references (for example trying to infer meaning from cultural factors) you are forming an interpretation and hence there is no such thing as a pure form of any ancient religion. I mean for fuck's sake neither the new testament nor the Qu'ran were written by the prophets themselves...religion is ALL about interpretation.

The Koran was dictated by the angel Gabriel wasn't it?

Bertster7 wrote:

Braddock wrote:

lowing wrote:

I am not a nexpert on anything, I simply know enough as to what is really happening when we want to "interpret" shit. It is not to seek truth, it is to bend and or justify the word to satisfy our own agendas. There is only one word of Jesus, or Muhammad. Follow it or do not follow it. You need not be an expert to understand that. Even theologians will "interpret" to satisfy their own agendas. So are they any more crediable than anyone else?

Who on this planet is REALLY qualified to say what the truth really is about life after death?

Okay lowing take theologians out of the equation...you are still left with wiggle room when it comes to interpreting ancient texts. The minute you look outside the text and get help from external references (for example trying to infer meaning from cultural factors) you are forming an interpretation and hence there is no such thing as a pure form of any ancient religion. I mean for fuck's sake neither the new testament nor the Qu'ran were written by the prophets themselves...religion is ALL about interpretation.

The Koran was dictated by the angel Gabriel wasn't it?

Mohamed had visions in which old Gabriel channeled through him, other people supposedly documented what came out of Mohamed's mouth. Old Mo himself couldn't read or write if I'm not mistaken*.

*I may be mistaken!

Braddock wrote:

lowing wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:

I'm willing to bet that not a single fucking soul on this forum has fully read either the Bible, Torah or Q'uran and yet we're all fucking theologians on the evidence of our posts. This is nonsense. How people can make 'expert' comments on three documents that contradict themselves every ten paragraphs I'll never know.

I am not a nexpert on anything, I simply know enough as to what is really happening when we want to "interpret" shit. It is not to seek truth, it is to bend and or justify the word to satisfy our own agendas. There is only one word of Jesus, or Muhammad. Follow it or do not follow it. You need not be an expert to understand that. Even theologians will "interpret" to satisfy their own agendas. So are they any more crediable than anyone else?

Who on this planet is REALLY qualified to say what the truth really is about life after death?

Okay lowing take theologians out of the equation...you are still left with wiggle room when it comes to interpreting ancient texts. The minute you look outside the text and get help from external references (for example trying to infer meaning from cultural factors) you are forming an interpretation and hence there is no such thing as a pure form of any ancient religion. I mean for fuck's sake neither the new testament nor the Qu'ran were even written by the prophets themselves...religion is ALL about interpretation.

Ok so now what, we are gunna agrre that no one is following anything, therefore everyone is fulla shit? So be it, I can live with that. then Islam, for the lack of a better term, is 180 degrees out from where western society is trying to go. Christianity, or whatever you wanna call it, seems to follow a path of tolerance which is in the same direction western society wants to go.

lowing wrote:

Braddock wrote:

lowing wrote:

I am not a nexpert on anything, I simply know enough as to what is really happening when we want to "interpret" shit. It is not to seek truth, it is to bend and or justify the word to satisfy our own agendas. There is only one word of Jesus, or Muhammad. Follow it or do not follow it. You need not be an expert to understand that. Even theologians will "interpret" to satisfy their own agendas. So are they any more crediable than anyone else?

Who on this planet is REALLY qualified to say what the truth really is about life after death?

Okay lowing take theologians out of the equation...you are still left with wiggle room when it comes to interpreting ancient texts. The minute you look outside the text and get help from external references (for example trying to infer meaning from cultural factors) you are forming an interpretation and hence there is no such thing as a pure form of any ancient religion. I mean for fuck's sake neither the new testament nor the Qu'ran were even written by the prophets themselves...religion is ALL about interpretation.

Ok so now what, we are gunna agrre that no one is following anything, therefore everyone is fulla shit? So be it, I can live with that. then Islam, for the lack of a better term, is 180 degrees out from where western society is trying to go. Christianity, or whatever you wanna call it, seems to follow a path of tolerance which is in the same direction western society wants to go.

That's fairly close to my opinion on the matter. Christianity has undergone more evolution, due to the more modern nature of the centres of Christianity. Islam still has a good way to go, but is progressing.

usmarine wrote:

can we get back on topic?

hahaha I know thats what I was thinking