Chemical and biological weapons have been banned with reasonable success. Mines have been banned with reasonable success. Most weapons that are potentially dangerous over long periods of times and likely to harm civilians long after fighting has ceased have been banned with reasonable success. Any nation using weapons known to leave volatile residue dangerous to civilians should revise the morality of their views on warfare. There's no excuse for this.
Poll
Should cluster munitions be banned?
| Yes | 32% | 32% - 39 | ||||
| No | 57% | 57% - 70 | ||||
| Don't care | 9% | 9% - 12 | ||||
| Total: 121 | ||||||
They should be banned until they can get the number of them that don't explode, which battlefield research has shown to be a way higher number than the manufacturers claim, right down. If having unexploded cluster bomb munitions was not an issue then I'd have no problem with their use.
The issue is not with them being a big dangerous indiscriminate weapon. It is because unexploded ones lie around for ages and can end up randomly killing civilians.
The issue is not with them being a big dangerous indiscriminate weapon. It is because unexploded ones lie around for ages and can end up randomly killing civilians.
I think weapon control should be more focused on civilians rather than military, frankly.
cluster bombs are good against military target but they are useless against insurgents and unfortunately that is the kind of war the US is bound to fight for the up coming decades
No ban, just better submunitions.
Yes, UXOs are bad. However, you don't ban weapons out of the fear that they won't work.
Yes, UXOs are bad. However, you don't ban weapons out of the fear that they won't work.
/howiinterpretthisDUBLIN: UN chief Ban Ki-moon called yesterday for a "visionary" global deal to ban claywhoring noobs.
My state was founded by Batman. Your opinion is invalid.
Bound their acceptable use, but don't ban them.
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
No one is talking about banning people out of fear that they don't work. People are talking about banning weapons out of fear that they can kill civilians many years after they've been dropped.RAIMIUS wrote:
No ban, just better submunitions.
Yes, UXOs are bad. However, you don't ban weapons out of the fear that they won't work.
HUH?mikkel wrote:
No one is talking about banning people out of fear that they don't work. People are talking about banning weapons out of fear that they can kill civilians many years after they've been dropped.RAIMIUS wrote:
No ban, just better submunitions.
Yes, UXOs are bad. However, you don't ban weapons out of the fear that they won't work.
I perfectly understand what is being promoted. I am of the opinion that more reliable submunitions should be used to reduce the UXO problem.
Shut the fuck up k? You clearly have no idea of the damage these things can do.iamangry wrote:
Yeah, we should definitely ban cluster bombs. And stealth planes. And TV missiles, satellite imagery, and anything else that America uses to generate a strategic and tactical advantage over it's adversaries. Because that's what the UN is all about... leveling the playing field so wars last extra long. Oh, and giving people food in exchange for oil, which is really a way of saying "bribing tyrants with access to valuable natural resources while making your own people think you're doing it for the starving children... and getting a little kick back for yourself."
You have to consider what kind of weapon this is. A weapon that kills, months after the conflict is over? Hmmm...
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
~ Richard Feynman
Everything can do that, and who the fuck gave you the right to tell him to shut the fuck up? Everyone is entitled to their opinion.Spark wrote:
Shut the fuck up k? You clearly have no idea of the damage these things can do.iamangry wrote:
Yeah, we should definitely ban cluster bombs. And stealth planes. And TV missiles, satellite imagery, and anything else that America uses to generate a strategic and tactical advantage over it's adversaries. Because that's what the UN is all about... leveling the playing field so wars last extra long. Oh, and giving people food in exchange for oil, which is really a way of saying "bribing tyrants with access to valuable natural resources while making your own people think you're doing it for the starving children... and getting a little kick back for yourself."
You have to consider what kind of weapon this is. A weapon that kills, months after the conflict is over? Hmmm...
I give you the authority to tell him to STFU. Git 'er done!Commie Killer wrote:
Everything can do that, and who the fuck gave you the right to tell him to shut the fuck up? Everyone is entitled to their opinion.Spark wrote:
Shut the fuck up k? You clearly have no idea of the damage these things can do.iamangry wrote:
Yeah, we should definitely ban cluster bombs. And stealth planes. And TV missiles, satellite imagery, and anything else that America uses to generate a strategic and tactical advantage over it's adversaries. Because that's what the UN is all about... leveling the playing field so wars last extra long. Oh, and giving people food in exchange for oil, which is really a way of saying "bribing tyrants with access to valuable natural resources while making your own people think you're doing it for the starving children... and getting a little kick back for yourself."
You have to consider what kind of weapon this is. A weapon that kills, months after the conflict is over? Hmmm...
I think he may have confused UXO with XO or something; unexploded ordnance vs. executive officer? just a guess! lol
quit being wimps
i think we should still have napalm and flame throwers
war is fucking war im tired of this "Humane war"
what the fuck is that shit.
especially when they use crazy shit like that on us, lets do it to them.
i think we should still have napalm and flame throwers
war is fucking war im tired of this "Humane war"
what the fuck is that shit.
especially when they use crazy shit like that on us, lets do it to them.
Fire/Napalm is cool and all, but we don't need it when we got THIS!SealXo wrote:
quit being wimps
i think we should still have napalm and flame throwers
war is fucking war im tired of this "Humane war"
what the fuck is that shit.
especially when they use crazy shit like that on us, lets do it to them.
Imagine a spectre gunship using metal storm...
Last edited by IRONCHEF (2008-05-23 16:10:46)
Can it? Can other weapons just lie around in the millions, looking like anything else, waiting for some kid to pick it up and get blasted?Commie Killer wrote:
Everything can do that, and who the fuck gave you the right to tell him to shut the fuck up? Everyone is entitled to their opinion.Spark wrote:
Shut the fuck up k? You clearly have no idea of the damage these things can do.iamangry wrote:
Yeah, we should definitely ban cluster bombs. And stealth planes. And TV missiles, satellite imagery, and anything else that America uses to generate a strategic and tactical advantage over it's adversaries. Because that's what the UN is all about... leveling the playing field so wars last extra long. Oh, and giving people food in exchange for oil, which is really a way of saying "bribing tyrants with access to valuable natural resources while making your own people think you're doing it for the starving children... and getting a little kick back for yourself."
You have to consider what kind of weapon this is. A weapon that kills, months after the conflict is over? Hmmm...
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
~ Richard Feynman
yeah but you cant run up to a bunker and burn em out.IRONCHEF wrote:
Fire/Napalm is cool and all, but we don't need it when we got THIS!SealXo wrote:
quit being wimps
i think we should still have napalm and flame throwers
war is fucking war im tired of this "Humane war"
what the fuck is that shit.
especially when they use crazy shit like that on us, lets do it to them.
Imagine a spectre gunship using metal storm...
Pretty much, yeah. Though being kids, no matter wtf it is, if its laying in a field chances are theyll be curious, and go jump on it, or somethingSpark wrote:
Can it? Can other weapons just lie around in the millions, looking like anything else, waiting for some kid to pick it up and get blasted?Commie Killer wrote:
Everything can do that, and who the fuck gave you the right to tell him to shut the fuck up? Everyone is entitled to their opinion.Spark wrote:
Shut the fuck up k? You clearly have no idea of the damage these things can do.
You have to consider what kind of weapon this is. A weapon that kills, months after the conflict is over? Hmmm...
EDIT: For the OP, hell no they shouldnt be banned.
Last edited by Wallpaper (2008-05-23 22:11:40)
Long Live Cluster Bombs...
I liked what IRONCHEF said about keeping war as nasty as possible, so that way people aren't inclined to resort to war so quickly.
However, the fact that the cluster bombs are killing people after the conflict is over makes me think it would be better to ban them. We can always use other weapons.
However, the fact that the cluster bombs are killing people after the conflict is over makes me think it would be better to ban them. We can always use other weapons.
But thats just the thing. Nothing is guaranteed to explode. Why dont we just ban everything else until only the other side has the weapons, and only the other side uses them. Seriously, like someone else said, wtf is this with humane war, what are you guys trying to do, make it easier to understand, to partake in? What happened to scaring the shit outta the other guy so bad that there isnt a war?Ataronchronon wrote:
I liked what IRONCHEF said about keeping war as nasty as possible, so that way people aren't inclined to resort to war so quickly.
However, the fact that the cluster bombs are killing people after the conflict is over makes me think it would be better to ban them. We can always use other weapons.
All weapons have a certain number of UXOs (ie, "duds"). So should we ban ALL weapons? I think not.
If you're talking about the GATOR system (aerial dispersed mines), then your argument should be about anti-personnel/materiel mines, not CBUs.
If you're talking about the GATOR system (aerial dispersed mines), then your argument should be about anti-personnel/materiel mines, not CBUs.
Last edited by FEOS (2008-05-25 10:22:11)
“Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid.”
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
― Albert Einstein
Doing the popular thing is not always right. Doing the right thing is not always popular
We should at least try to minimize UXOs.
Im pretty sure thats already being tried. I think the military prefers shit that explodes, its not like they want them to be duds.HurricaИe wrote:
We should at least try to minimize UXOs.
Somewhere, something incredible is waiting to be known.
That was scary. Live from Washington on the news today - Cluster bombs banned.