Turquise, you are indeed a master fence sitter.Turquoise wrote:
Some Christians hold a similar view.lowing wrote:
Islam goes against everything western society strives to achive. Islam believes that world wide peace is attainable and desirable, and can be accomplished as soon as the world converts to it.Turquoise wrote:
I don't have a problem with Muslims becoming more religious. I also don't have a problem with them becoming more significant as an immigrant group in America or Europe. The only cause for concern here should be one regarding conservative policies. The thing that both America and Europe must continually fight is any attempt by Muslims to restrict the behaviors of all of society (like banning alcohol or pork, for example). I'm not saying that conservative Muslims will necessarily try this, but there is a tendency for religiously conservative people to try to control the personal lives of others. We've already seen this agenda among certain conservative Christians. The last thing we need is a second religious group to push the same agenda.
So basically, if people want to become more religious (Christian, Muslim, or otherwise), that's fine as long as they respect the freedoms of others.
The point is, Muslims and Christians really aren't that different. There are fanatics and there are sensible people. The only problem right now is that there is a higher percentage of fanatics among the Muslims, and their fanatics are usually a lot more violent.
Still, that's not the same thing as saying all or even the majority of Muslims are terrorists. Likewise, we shouldn't treat Islam overall as an enemy to the West.
However, certain sects of Islam are certainly an enemy to the West and freedom in general (like Wahhabism).
How do you counter stupidity?lowing wrote:
This I love, here is a guy calling me names and throwing insults, about how idiotic I am, yet posts nothing to counter my points. He just calls me names and leaves. Guys like this make me laugh.KEN-JENNINGS wrote:
Lowing, you are an idiot. I can't believe some people in this thread actually bother arguing with you or Davey P.
I often think of a mental picture I have of Major Spittle when he was here - grunting and getting physically upset while reading this type of article, then foaming around the mouth as you pound out your neanderthalic responses on the keyboard.
To be honest, your delusion is not worth my time.
Anyway, I guess I am no longer on your Christmas Card list then?
I thought I countered enough. Read Marinejuana's post, because he stated it much more eloquently than I. I wonder if your brain can comprehend...let me summarize -
You could add a qualifier such as race, gender, religion to just about any activity, whether it is a postive or a negative. The reason most people don't attach qualifiers is because it is a broad generalization - lumping people together when it is undeserved. We don't call the KKK Christian terrorists, despite the fact that they are Christian and commit terrorist acts. In the end, you can find more differences between a particular religion and race than within groups as a whole.
People have argued that same argument throughout this thread, you are just too ignorant (yes I said it) to realize it.
I don't celebrate Christmas, I celebrate the Pagan Winter Festival.
Last edited by KEN-JENNINGS (2008-01-19 15:44:31)
I already made my point. GB is so concerned that the Muslim community will get upset that they are no longer going to call a war on terror, A WAR ON TERROR and they are no longer going to call the Islamic terrorists who are comitting terror in the name of Islam, ISLAMIC TERRORISTS.FatherTed wrote:
QFT.paranoid101 wrote:
Last time I check our solders were fighting and dieing side by side with the US, Enough of your Euro-Weenie shit, got a point lay off the insultslowing wrote:
Nope, I would rather take a stand and say enough is enough. But it is painfully apparent you and your Euro-weenie counter parts choose another path. Lets make them happy before they hurt us.....Good stuff.
The truth must hurt apparently.
Now this add made me really lol
Don't be daft calling us Brits Appeasers, we have stood by you shoulder to shoulder with the US in Iraq and Afghanistan, neck deep in the blood and gore that goes on over there.
Calling us that is an Insult to us and our Solders.
Calling us that is an Insult to us and our Solders.
Think about it though... Doesn't it make more sense to target certain sects of Islam rather than just write off the whole religion? Letting all types of Muslims enter your country except for Wahhabists would be a good way to keep your country safer without actually being prejudiced against an entire culture.lowing wrote:
Turquise, you are indeed a master fence sitter.
The idea is that we want to show Muslims that we don't have a problem with their religion overall -- we just have to fight their fanatics, and we need the help of the moderate majority among them in order to effectively do it. They know their own community better than anyone else.
I would agree with you that politically correct terminology doesn't change anything for the better, but the fact remains that we do need Muslims themselves to help us weed out the extremists.
Ideally, we could set up a system where only the West-friendly Muslims immigrate to our countries, and when it comes to America, that's usually the case anyway. When Muslims go to the trouble of making it all the way over to America, they usually are the more liberal ones who appreciate our way of life and freedoms. In many cases, they are even Muslims who are looking for more than economic opportunity -- they are fleeing the oppression caused by their more conservative brethren (like the people currently running Saudi Arabia and Iran).
It's to show all the ignorant people, like you. That not all Muslims are terrorists.
Nope, I understand completely, it is simply that the KKK did not have a global reach or a global impact, they are isolated to the US and have been reduced to almost nothing by guess what............Moderate Christians.....If our KKK eleiment affected Europe or the ME they would be labeled as a religious fanatical group and addressed as such. But I do not think I am tell you something you do not already know.KEN-JENNINGS wrote:
How do you counter stupidity?lowing wrote:
This I love, here is a guy calling me names and throwing insults, about how idiotic I am, yet posts nothing to counter my points. He just calls me names and leaves. Guys like this make me laugh.KEN-JENNINGS wrote:
Lowing, you are an idiot. I can't believe some people in this thread actually bother arguing with you or Davey P.
I often think of a mental picture I have of Major Spittle when he was here - grunting and getting physically upset while reading this type of article, then foaming around the mouth as you pound out your neanderthalic responses on the keyboard.
To be honest, your delusion is not worth my time.
Anyway, I guess I am no longer on your Christmas Card list then?
I thought I countered enough. Read Marinejuana's post, because he stated it much more eloquently than I. I wonder if your brain can comprehend...let me summarize -
You could add a qualifier such as race, gender, religion to just about any activity, whether it is a postive or a negative. The reason most people don't attach qualifiers is because it is a broad generalization - lumping people together when it is undeserved. We don't call the KKK Christian terrorists, despite the fact that they are Christian and commit terrorist acts. In the end, you can find more differences between a particular religion and race than within groups as a whole.
People have argued that same argument throughout this thread, you are just too ignorant (yes I said it) to realize it.
I don't celebrate Christmas, I celebrate the Pagan Winter Festival.
Well, you weren't appeasers until you pulled this stunt. It is a sign of changes sweeping Europe....I think they call it the Islamisation of Europe. It just looks like GB has gotten on board.paranoid101 wrote:
Don't be daft calling us Brits Appeasers, we have stood by you shoulder to shoulder with the US in Iraq and Afghanistan, neck deep in the blood and gore that goes on over there.
Calling us that is an Insult to us and our Solders.
Just a question: Is there anything wrong with a country becoming more Islamic if all the same freedoms remain intact?lowing wrote:
Well, you weren't appeasers until you pulled this stunt. It is a sign of changes sweeping Europe....I think they call it the Islamisation of Europe. It just looks like GB has gotten on board.paranoid101 wrote:
Don't be daft calling us Brits Appeasers, we have stood by you shoulder to shoulder with the US in Iraq and Afghanistan, neck deep in the blood and gore that goes on over there.
Calling us that is an Insult to us and our Solders.
Bullshit and you know it, very quick to insult an friendly country (one of the last few I might add) and if we were appeasers as you call us, then I guess we would have left your sorry ass to fight on you own, but no we haven't and we wont.lowing wrote:
Well, you weren't appeasers until you pulled this stunt. It is a sign of changes sweeping Europe....I think they call it the Islamisation of Europe. It just looks like GB has gotten on board.paranoid101 wrote:
Don't be daft calling us Brits Appeasers, we have stood by you shoulder to shoulder with the US in Iraq and Afghanistan, neck deep in the blood and gore that goes on over there.
Calling us that is an Insult to us and our Solders.
My user username is Paranoid, but you are the definition of the word, Islamisation of Europe don't make me laugh.
Lowing, you are a good guy, but this thread sux big time. Appeasement and PC are two different things, and this is not appeasement.
Last edited by sergeriver (2008-01-19 16:02:12)
No one has labeled all Muslims as terrorists. It is either the guilty consciences of the Muslims or they are too defensive to the facts.Turquoise wrote:
Think about it though... Doesn't it make more sense to target certain sects of Islam rather than just write off the whole religion? Letting all types of Muslims enter your country except for Wahhabists would be a good way to keep your country safer without actually being prejudiced against an entire culture.lowing wrote:
Turquise, you are indeed a master fence sitter.
The idea is that we want to show Muslims that we don't have a problem with their religion overall -- we just have to fight their fanatics, and we need the help of the moderate majority among them in order to effectively do it. They know their own community better than anyone else.
I would agree with you that politically correct terminology doesn't change anything for the better, but the fact remains that we do need Muslims themselves to help us weed out the extremists.
Ideally, we could set up a system where only the West-friendly Muslims immigrate to our countries, and when it comes to America, that's usually the case anyway. When Muslims go to the trouble of making it all the way over to America, they usually are the more liberal ones who appreciate our way of life and freedoms. In many cases, they are even Muslims who are looking for more than economic opportunity -- they are fleeing the oppression caused by their more conservative brethren (like the people currently running Saudi Arabia and Iran).
It is akin to calling me a racist because I hate gangstas and saggers. well the fact it is, neither gangstas or saggers is a race. But those of you that get upset and defensive spout off shit like Ken and read what they want into a post instead of reading what is written. Never said I think all Muslims are terrorists, unless you can quote me. Muslims that have nothing to with Islamic terrorism have n oreason to be defensive about those of us that beleive in combating it. I simply see no reason to dress up what we are fighting to make it something it is not.
Fair enough. I think we can agree that we must fight extremism and terrorism. I think we can also agree that gangstas and thugs are the dregs of our society.lowing wrote:
No one has labeled all Muslims as terrorists. It is either the guilty consciences of the Muslims or they are too defensive to the facts.
It is akin to calling me a racist because I hate gangstas and saggers. well the fact it is, neither gangstas or saggers is a race. But those of you that get upset and defensive spout off shit like Ken and read what they want into a post instead of reading what is written. Never said I think all Muslims are terrorists, unless you can quote me. Muslims that have nothing to with Islamic terrorism have n oreason to be defensive about those of us that beleive in combating it. I simply see no reason to dress up what we are fighting to make it something it is not.
Very few things in this world are as simple as we try to make them. If we are to have a chance at defeating the hate that breeds terrorism we will need the help of moderate Muslims. They will be our strongest ally in the fight against militant Islam.lowing wrote:
Turquise, you are indeed a master fence sitter.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
I totally agree that this is PC bullshit we get alot of it in the UK from Middle class folk in committees who seem to think they know minority's want and need in this country.sergeriver wrote:
Lowing, you are a good guy, but this thread sux big time. Appeasement and PC are two different things, and this is not appeasement.
And yes I also agree that Lowings a good guy and does post some fantastic stuff on here, but this thread is just insulting and baiting.
Exactly, and calling terrorism anti-Islamic activity is a good start to get them into the fight.Kmarion wrote:
Very few things in this world are as simple as we try to make them. If we are to have a chance at defeating the hate that breeds terrorism we will need the help of moderate Muslims. They will be our strongest ally in the fight against militant Islam.lowing wrote:
Turquise, you are indeed a master fence sitter.
That is impossible. freedom and diversity do not go hand in hand with IslamTurquoise wrote:
Just a question: Is there anything wrong with a country becoming more Islamic if all the same freedoms remain intact?lowing wrote:
Well, you weren't appeasers until you pulled this stunt. It is a sign of changes sweeping Europe....I think they call it the Islamisation of Europe. It just looks like GB has gotten on board.paranoid101 wrote:
Don't be daft calling us Brits Appeasers, we have stood by you shoulder to shoulder with the US in Iraq and Afghanistan, neck deep in the blood and gore that goes on over there.
Calling us that is an Insult to us and our Solders.
One thing I find interesting about Britain is that the average person would appear to be very politically correct, whereas the average person here seems to be traditional and maybe a bit prejudiced.paranoid101 wrote:
I totally agree that this is PC bullshit we get alot of it in the UK from Middle class folk in committees who seem to think they know minority's want and need in this country.sergeriver wrote:
Lowing, you are a good guy, but this thread sux big time. Appeasement and PC are two different things, and this is not appeasement.
And yes I also agree that Lowings a good guy and does post some fantastic stuff on here, but this thread is just insulting and baiting.
It gives the impression that the U.K. is sometimes too liberal for its own good while America is sometimes too conservative. I suppose Canada would fit somewhere in between us when it comes to politics.
Yes they are, and with this OP, GB is accomplishing both in one swoop.sergeriver wrote:
Lowing, you are a good guy, but this thread sux big time. Appeasement and PC are two different things, and this is not appeasement.
CAIR and organizations like them ARE NOT our strongest ally. Google them if you want.Kmarion wrote:
Very few things in this world are as simple as we try to make them. If we are to have a chance at defeating the hate that breeds terrorism we will need the help of moderate Muslims. They will be our strongest ally in the fight against militant Islam.lowing wrote:
Turquise, you are indeed a master fence sitter.
I don't see any appeasement from UK here.lowing wrote:
Yes they are, and with this OP, GB is accomplishing both in one swoop.sergeriver wrote:
Lowing, you are a good guy, but this thread sux big time. Appeasement and PC are two different things, and this is not appeasement.
Never said that they were. I don't agree with CAIR on issues. I'm speaking more to the moderates who are not driven by a political agenda. Believe it or not there are Muslims who don't enjoy car bombs exploding in their marketplaces.lowing wrote:
CAIR and organizations like them ARE NOT our strongest ally. Google them if you want.Kmarion wrote:
Very few things in this world are as simple as we try to make them. If we are to have a chance at defeating the hate that breeds terrorism we will need the help of moderate Muslims. They will be our strongest ally in the fight against militant Islam.lowing wrote:
Turquise, you are indeed a master fence sitter.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
So you also have a problem with calling a spade a spade??sergeriver wrote:
Exactly, and calling terrorism anti-Islamic activity is a good start to get them into the fight.Kmarion wrote:
Very few things in this world are as simple as we try to make them. If we are to have a chance at defeating the hate that breeds terrorism we will need the help of moderate Muslims. They will be our strongest ally in the fight against militant Islam.lowing wrote:
Turquise, you are indeed a master fence sitter.
Last edited by lowing (2008-01-19 16:20:00)
Moderate Muslims? No way man. Source?Kmarion wrote:
Never said that they were. I don't agree with CAIR on issues. I'm speaking more to the moderates who are not driven by a political agenda. Believe it or not there are Muslims who don't enjoy car bombs exploding in their marketplaces.lowing wrote:
CAIR and organizations like them ARE NOT our strongest ally. Google them if you want.Kmarion wrote:
Very few things in this world are as simple as we try to make them. If we are to have a chance at defeating the hate that breeds terrorism we will need the help of moderate Muslims. They will be our strongest ally in the fight against militant Islam.