Pages: 1 2 3

 

2007-07-25 15:22:24
Dersmikner
Member
+147|6507|Texas
The thread on foreign aid, and the one that degenerated into a North/South thing got me to thinking about the whole idealogical debate that goes on around here every damned day between the "we work hard for our money and aren't interested in you taking it for your social programs" crowd and the "the rich greedy fucks in the world are holding the rest of us down" crowd.

All you "we need more taxes", "the rich are greedy and they don't help anyone but themselves" and "why aren't you for free lunches for the poor" cry-babies do me a favor.

Scan and post (or fax me) all your receipts for charitable donations for the 2006 tax year. If you fake em, you're a shitbag, and I'll be sure to have my accountant or someone proof all of them. I'll expect that you'll allow me to contact the organizations and verify. Anyone who can hack BF2 can surely fake receipts. First person who fakes receipts voids the deal for everyone.

All you "Barak Obama / Hillary Clinton / free health care for everyone / raise taxes on the rich" bitches just post your donations to Nothing But Nets, or Feed The Children, or the State Troopers' Fund, or similar (my call on legitimacy), and let's see if you just piss and fucking moan about everything, or if you DO anything. I don't want to know about how you stood in a fucking crowd of whiners and protested to take money from ME, I want to know what YOU sacrificed yourself. I guaran-fucking-tee you didn't touch what was given by the Republicans/Libertarians (fiscal conservatives / social liberals) here.

If just two of you consistently whiny "we need to do more for the poor" motherfuckers gave more of your cash to charity in fiscal '06 than I gave of mine (and I'll post or fax you my receipts for proof) then I'll match the board's donations to a charity of the board's choosing that is to my liking (but I'll be pretty broad about it and not just make it one of mine) up to $500 and submit proof to the board.

If not you need to lay the hell off those of us who are in higher tax brackets and aren't interested in YOU or YOUR SOCIAL BUREAUCRACY telling us how to spend OUR money.

And as long as we're at it, if everyone here donated just $10 to some charity for the families of fallen military personnel we could raise a few grand in a hurry for some family that really needs it. We should think about it.

Last edited by Dersmikner (2007-07-25 15:23:36)

2007-07-25 15:25:09
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6564
I ain't faxing you any receipts but I can tell you I give upwards of $70 (€50) a month to charity. I earn a lot of money. I'm not asking for a hand-out. I am a deep end liberal. I believe in community and in a healthy level of enforced social justice.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2007-07-25 15:25:42)

2007-07-25 15:31:47
Dersmikner
Member
+147|6507|Texas
70 dollars a month? And you earn a "lot of money". That doesn't seem like a strong commitment.

Dude, I'm glad that you give of yourself but that amount of money in a year's time (under $1,000) is far less than I gave one charity out of the dozen or better that I support.

Y'all will have to do far better.

Last edited by Dersmikner (2007-07-25 15:34:39)

2007-07-25 15:31:52
Ratzinger
Member
+43|6400|Wollongong, NSW, Australia
I give to many charities on an occasional basis, and the Heart Foundation regularly.

I ALWAYS tip taxi drivers, hospitality staff, and other poorly paid service staff to do my bit against Howard's draconian IR laws.

With respect, surely these soldiers earn a decent wage, and families are looked after if something happens to them?

I don't have to justify my existence or prove my generosity to anyone, I'm comfortable with my efforts........

As long as the corporations run your country you'll have a large underclass.....welcome to extreme capitalism!
2007-07-25 15:35:30
topal63
. . .
+533|6727

Dersmikner wrote:

70 dollars a month?

Dude, I'm glad that you give of yourself but that amount of money in a year's time (under $1,000) is far less than I gave one charity out of the dozen or better that I support.

Y'all will have to do far better.
So how much taxes do you pay? And how much money do you give to charities? Totals please - and thanks.
2007-07-25 15:37:19
Skruples
Mod Incarnate
+234|6709
My mod senses are tingling. I doubt this is going to lead anywhere constructive.
2007-07-25 15:41:04
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6564

Dersmikner wrote:

70 dollars a month? And you earn a "lot of money". That doesn't seem like a strong commitment.

Dude, I'm glad that you give of yourself but that amount of money in a year's time (under $1,000) is far less than I gave one charity out of the dozen or better that I support.

Y'all will have to do far better.
Wow. Big man. You must remember that far more of my tax money goes towards aid than the measly amount that goes towards aid in the states. But to be honest, I couldn't care less how much you or anyone else gives to charity. For every one generous well off person there is likely to be 10 greedy little Midas' who got to the top by being ruthless and showing no mercy. Perhaps you are the exception to the rule.

I never realised this was a dick-measuring contest. Frankly my post fucks up your moronic generalisation, regardless of how generous you think I might be.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2007-07-25 15:43:41)

2007-07-25 16:26:22
BN
smells like wee wee
+159|6776
I sponsor 3 World Vision Children. Which is roughly $58 each per month. i get stiffed even worse as i am a member of WV in the UK and I pay in AUS $.

$603 last financial year to Greenpeace
$40 to MS read a thon. - to help children with MS
$100 Royal Children's hospital appeal
$10 for Anzac day badge
$10 last night in a raffle to help underprivileged children in the western suburbs of Melbourne

plus my $703 per tax year that covers me and other peoples socialised medicine.

all that I am a deep end liberal
2007-07-25 16:29:07
weerdfoo1
Banned
+26|6173|California
I would post something up, but i'm an 18 year old guy working part time weekends about ready to go into college, i have no money, even for myself.
When I become a doctor about 10 years from now, i'll get back to this.
2007-07-25 16:36:09
Schwarzelungen
drunklenglungen
+133|6305|Bloomington Indiana
i give away my old clothes to charities that will give them out to the under privileged, i have volunteered at food drives and soup kitchens and regularly give money to good causes when i have the spare money after rent and gas money.  ive delivered bags of food to poor families on christmas and easter with some friends.

im a poor college student..i dont have a huge expendable income...but i do whatever i can to help at least a few people out every year.

once i graduate and start making more money next year, ill be able to do alot more.
2007-07-25 16:43:53
Lotta_Drool
Spit
+350|6192|Ireland
I pay taxes, it is a forced charity to liberal morons everywhere.
2007-07-25 17:08:48
konfusion
mostly afk
+480|6559|CH/BR - in UK

I'm 17, and when I go study, I'll still have no money. I donate 10% of my 'income', which so far is 6 measly pounds per month. I wish I could donate more, but frankly, I need that money. I'll give you more details when I have to start paying taxes, if you wish. I am no big fan of charity, I think we should not have to think about it

-konfusion
2007-07-25 18:50:02
HunterOfSkulls
Rated EC-10
+246|6288
Shorter version of the OP:

"Hey all you liberals, tell me what you donated to charity or gave to your community and I'll tell you why it's woefully inadequate compared to what's given by rich people looking to buy good PR for themselves and their companies!"

Not original, not intellectually honest and not worth any response but for pointing out the obvious intent behind it. But hey, you wanna drop to your knees and give the wealthy a little unsolicited spit-n-polish in the hopes that maybe someday your obsequious toadying for them will pay off, don't let me stop ya.
2007-07-25 19:14:36
san4
The Mas
+311|6697|NYC, a place to live
The OP clearly does not understand the Liberal position on taxes. The fact is yes, the government can spend some of your money better than you can. Individual charitable donations lack the key characteristic of tax money: tax money is pooled and can be used to create hugely expensive infrastructure that generates wealth for society. In contrast, every individual decides which charity to support, so charitable donations are diffused among thousands of charities and are not spent in any coordinated fashion. That is why tax money can be used more effectively than charitable donations and why charitable donations are irrelevant to the Liberal viewpoint.

Here are a couple of examples: How many people donate money to build roads? If governments didn't build roads, would people pool their money and build big interstate highways? I don't think so. But roads are pretty damned important for economic productivity. Tax money builds roads, individual charitable donations will never do so.

Another example: Public transportation is critical for many local economies where it is impractical or too expensive for workers to drive to work. No one donates money to pay for public transportation and no one would even if government didn't pay for it. It can actually make you money to build a public transportation system that you don't use because the system allows the local economy to function.

Because every individual makes an independent decision about which charity to support, charitable donations can't be as effective as tax money. Charitable donations are irrelevant to the Liberal viewpoint.
2007-07-25 19:14:58
Dersmikner
Member
+147|6507|Texas
Sweet. So what we have here is the usual. It's "I can call Republicans greedy bastards who are the reason the world sucks, and I can say they should pay more taxes, and I can call you all a bunch of resource raping lucky bastards who don't care about anything or anyone but themselves and who stepped on the honest and hard-working in order to get where they are, but I will fail to mention that over and above the fact that you pay WAY more in taxes than I do, you give more to the causes I pretend to care more about.".

As far as my taxes, that's really nobody's business, and God only knows what the real total is when you count the fact that I have to match my employees' social security (that sucks my ass - why is YOUR retirement MY responsibility?), and that I have to pay property tax on my inventory and everything in my offices down to the computers and desks, and that I pay something called the franchise tax even though I'm not a franchise, and on and on and on and blah, blah, blah, but I'll tell you that I have to pay income tax quarterly, and last quarter's nauseating check was over 25k, and that's with every bullshit deduction I can reasonably fake past my accountant.

My point is simply this: A lot of people who are in the upper middle class or whatever you want to call it, doctors, lawyers, business owners, et al, who make more than say 200,000 a year, worked their fucking asses off to get there, and still work their asses off, and on top of paying outrageous taxes give a fucking ton of money to various charities, and a lot of do-nothing give-little types still have the audacity to piss and fucking moan about what evil greedy bastards the well-off are. Let me tell you, if we had a socialist system you'd all look back when the amount of wealth generated in this country was zilch and wish you had the well-off back. Then you'd see who the real "working class" is, or "was" I suppose it would be at that point, since we'd all be working 9 to 5 for no money and there wouldn't be shit in the community coffers.

Sell your fabulous computer with all the hot new cards and shit, that is in every sense of the word complete debauchery compared to what is REQUIRED in life, and feed a homeless family with the proceeds, or get the hell off everyone else's ass.

I'm not saying you're all evil people for your socialist views, or that the well off are all good people, but I am saying you're a bunch of damned hypocrites. Simply owning a computer and fucking around on BF2S when you could have given the thousand you spent on that computer away and spent the time you piss off here building houses for Habitat For Humanity says you're the same as us, but deluding yourself to grandeur. Drop your bullshit as it regards people of means, or go live in a grass hut in Africa and carry water from the stream to the village.

You aren't any better than the wealthy Republican, and I'd argue you do less for the rest of the world.
2007-07-25 19:19:34
Bubbalo
The Lizzard
+541|6570
Except that most of those who want better welfare feel it should come out of military spending, or politicians wages.
2007-07-25 20:57:49
jonsimon
Member
+224|6504

Dersmikner wrote:

As far as my taxes, that's really nobody's business
Oh, but what others give to charity is your business?

Dersmikner wrote:

and that's with every bullshit deduction I can reasonably fake past my accountant.

Dersmikner wrote:

I'm not saying you're all evil people for your socialist views, or that the well off are all good people, but I am saying you're a bunch of damned hypocrites.
COUGH COUGH

Oh, and:

konfusion wrote:

I'm 17, and when I go study, I'll still have no money. I donate 10% of my 'income', which so far is 6 measly pounds per month. I wish I could donate more, but frankly, I need that money. I'll give you more details when I have to start paying taxes, if you wish. I am no big fan of charity, I think we should not have to think about it

-konfusion
OWNED.

Last edited by jonsimon (2007-07-25 20:59:22)

2007-07-25 21:22:17
san4
The Mas
+311|6697|NYC, a place to live

Dersmikner wrote:

Sweet. So what we have here is the usual. It's "I can call Republicans greedy bastards who are the reason the world sucks, and I can say they should pay more taxes, and I can call you all a bunch of resource raping lucky bastards who don't care about anything or anyone but themselves and who stepped on the honest and hard-working in order to get where they are, but I will fail to mention that over and above the fact that you pay WAY more in taxes than I do, you give more to the causes I pretend to care more about.".

As far as my taxes, that's really nobody's business, and God only knows what the real total is when you count the fact that I have to match my employees' social security (that sucks my ass - why is YOUR retirement MY responsibility?), and that I have to pay property tax on my inventory and everything in my offices down to the computers and desks, and that I pay something called the franchise tax even though I'm not a franchise, and on and on and on and blah, blah, blah, but I'll tell you that I have to pay income tax quarterly, and last quarter's nauseating check was over 25k, and that's with every bullshit deduction I can reasonably fake past my accountant.

My point is simply this: A lot of people who are in the upper middle class or whatever you want to call it, doctors, lawyers, business owners, et al, who make more than say 200,000 a year, worked their fucking asses off to get there, and still work their asses off, and on top of paying outrageous taxes give a fucking ton of money to various charities, and a lot of do-nothing give-little types still have the audacity to piss and fucking moan about what evil greedy bastards the well-off are. Let me tell you, if we had a socialist system you'd all look back when the amount of wealth generated in this country was zilch and wish you had the well-off back. Then you'd see who the real "working class" is, or "was" I suppose it would be at that point, since we'd all be working 9 to 5 for no money and there wouldn't be shit in the community coffers.

Sell your fabulous computer with all the hot new cards and shit, that is in every sense of the word complete debauchery compared to what is REQUIRED in life, and feed a homeless family with the proceeds, or get the hell off everyone else's ass.

I'm not saying you're all evil people for your socialist views, or that the well off are all good people, but I am saying you're a bunch of damned hypocrites. Simply owning a computer and fucking around on BF2S when you could have given the thousand you spent on that computer away and spent the time you piss off here building houses for Habitat For Humanity says you're the same as us, but deluding yourself to grandeur. Drop your bullshit as it regards people of means, or go live in a grass hut in Africa and carry water from the stream to the village.

You aren't any better than the wealthy Republican, and I'd argue you do less for the rest of the world.
I can't tell if this contains a response to my point that charitable donations are irrelevant to the Liberal viewpoint on taxes. It doesn't appear to.
2007-07-25 21:31:21
HunterOfSkulls
Rated EC-10
+246|6288
LOL, so now he's gone full-bore into the next false premise "You should do what I say you should do or you're no true Scotsman Liberal!" Sure, I'll go right ahead and give away everything I have to the poor. As soon as the wealthy fuckers you love so much give away all they own to the poor instead of what's essentially their pocket change.

The difference between us and them is, most of us give what we can without completely screwing ourselves. The wealthy give what is essentially a drop in the bucket compared to their overall worth or their income. For me that means the choice between steak for a day or ramen noodles for a week. For them it's a few extra days between the purchase of a Ferrari and the purchase of another summer home on the French Riviera.

Sure, someone like Bill Gates can easily out-donate me or anyone else on this board. Unfortunately for your premise here, it's got nothing to do with him being a wonderful and giving human being and everything to do with the fact that he owns a company that generates so much profit he couldn't spend it all if he lived for several hundred years. I'm supposed to be all impressed when some guy donates a million dollars when the company he runs generates billions in profits? I'm supposed to be ashamed when some company looking to clean up its reputation, like Philip Morris, throws some money at charity in the hopes that people will remember drinking water to flooded towns instead of medical research on cancer and addiction being buried?

I guess that's the essential flaw in your reasoning here. Unlike the wealthy you seem to worship so much, those of us down here in the really real world don't donate to charity because we need a tax write-off or good PR or to generally impress people. So naturally nobody's bothered to go through this nonsense you're demanding because, well, we're not doing it to impress you.

I think a better question is, why do people like you defend the wealthy and deride us so much? Do you think they actually care about an upper-middle-class schlub like you, beyond what money and time you're willing to invest in making them wealthier? Do you think someday you might be treated to a few scraps from the Master's table? Keep shilling for them, I'm sure someday if you work really hard and keep standing up for people who buy and sell people like you every day, they'll send you an invitation to join them up in the lofty heights above all of us unworthy, unwashed and ungrateful liberals.
2007-07-25 21:51:24
Moo? Si!
Tall, Dark, Antlered
+39|6137|817---->907
I may be off base and missed his point, but I think he was defending the hard working not the wealthy. 
Taking a step back and viewing the forest and the trees, we all need to do more for humanity regardless if you write checks or not.  If that means grabbing a hammer and heading out to Habitat for Humanity, or grilling burgers in the backyard for your neighbor that just got home from serving their country.
Lastly, "All religion is a crime against humanity."  Religion isn't the crime, the idiot human who misuses religion is the crime along with the human that blames religion.

Last edited by Moo? Si! (2007-07-25 21:52:25)

2007-07-25 22:45:58
golgoj4
Member
+51|6783|North Hollywood

Dersmikner wrote:

The thread on foreign aid, and the one that degenerated into a North/South thing got me to thinking about the whole idealogical debate that goes on around here every damned day between the "we work hard for our money and aren't interested in you taking it for your social programs" crowd and the "the rich greedy fucks in the world are holding the rest of us down" crowd. ...
Yeah I cut that out because I can only listen to so much bullshit from one person.

Do me this favor, come back when you actually want to have a level headed discussion as opposed to just piss and moan. Running a business is hard. Go cry elsewhere. I don't know wtf it is you do, nor do I really care. You got yourself into that position, so deal.

As far as hating liberals and the like because they want to assist the lower end of the populace so it doesn't degenerate in to complete anarchy...you draw the conclusion.

Why are you tax liability breakdown? What percentage of the taxes are local, state and federal? If you really don't like the taxes, use your vote, not the 'submit' button on bf2s.  Better ideas can be put forth than 'you stinking libs show some reciepts'. I challenge you to come up with one. Are you a Christian as you alluded to in the other thread? Because if you are, it really just makes your post that much more worthless.
2007-07-25 22:48:13
Moo? Si!
Tall, Dark, Antlered
+39|6137|817---->907

golgoj4 wrote:

Dersmikner wrote:

The thread on foreign aid, and the one that degenerated into a North/South thing got me to thinking about the whole idealogical debate that goes on around here every damned day between the "we work hard for our money and aren't interested in you taking it for your social programs" crowd and the "the rich greedy fucks in the world are holding the rest of us down" crowd. ...
Yeah I cut that out because I can only listen to so much bullshit from one person.

Do me this favor, come back when you actually want to have a level headed discussion as opposed to just piss and moan. Running a business is hard. Go cry elsewhere. I don't know wtf it is you do, nor do I really care. You got yourself into that position, so deal.

As far as hating liberals and the like because they want to assist the lower end of the populace so it doesn't degenerate in to complete anarchy...you draw the conclusion.

Why are you tax liability breakdown? What percentage of the taxes are local, state and federal? If you really don't like the taxes, use your vote, not the 'submit' button on bf2s.  Better ideas can be put forth than 'you stinking libs show some reciepts'. I challenge you to come up with one. Are you a Christian as you alluded to in the other thread? Because if you are, it really just makes your post that much more worthless.
I would assume he is using his "Soap" Box first
2007-07-25 23:35:32
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6780|PNW

CameronPoe wrote:

I ain't faxing you any receipts but I can tell you I give upwards of $70 (€50) a month to charity. I earn a lot of money. I'm not asking for a hand-out. I am a deep end liberal. I believe in community and in a healthy level of enforced social justice.
10% income to charity, where it can be spared. Little old conservative me.

Bubbalo wrote:

Except that most of those who want better welfare feel it should come out of military spending.
...because people on welfare do so much to defend their country.

Last edited by unnamednewbie13 (2007-07-25 23:37:36)

2007-07-26 00:00:35
Bubbalo
The Lizzard
+541|6570

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

...because people on welfare do so much to defend their country.
No, because we waste a shitload of money on wars we don't need to.
2007-07-26 00:07:11
Vilham
Say wat!?
+580|6775|UK
Charity is hardly the top of my list atm. Paying my dad back the 600 quid i owe him is.

 

Pages: 1 2 3

Board footer

Privacy Policy - © 2024 Jeff Minard