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2007-07-17 08:09:57
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6907|USA

[pt] KEIOS wrote:

i would try another strategy:

win their hearts and minds, instead of kill them all.

drop presents and candys, instead of bombs and rockets.

build schools and hospitals, instead of armor.



what every elder german remembers, when he thinks of post war time is: the nice u.s. soldier who gave him chocolate, chewing gums and cigarettes.

what every young iraqi will keep in mind is, the aggressive ignorant u.s. monster, who kicked his fathers ass.


you can not win against terrorism by terrorizing.
We are building hospitals, schools, water treatment, power grids communication grids.

n dealing with "EXTREMISM" of any kind, the probelm is. Their rationale is so fucked up, compromise is not acceptable to them. Do you really think there is a compromise to Islamic extremism that will bring peace to us all? Hell, even IF we were all to convert to Islam we would be killed because of the different takes on it? So bottom line is, even TOTAL appeasement to these groups would still not bring peace, and I am not willing to appease these groups even a fraction for it.
2007-07-17 08:12:40
MAGUIRE93
High Angle Hell
+182|6450|Schofield Barracks

GunSlinger OIF II wrote:

invade Iraq

we should pull out and re-invade it.
why would you do that?
so the terrorists would come out of hiding?
2007-07-17 08:21:21
Tjasso
the "Commander"
+102|6779|the Netherlands
paint the white house ...darkish green ,invite my friends ,have a beer , smoke marijuana ,bbq in front of the green house

only joking

oh yeah wipe out the entire radicale muslim population AND the christian radicales , KKK(they still alive ??? )catholic priest be castrated

Last edited by Tjasso (2007-07-17 08:22:56)

2007-07-17 08:26:48
Noobeater
Northern numpty
+194|6703|Boulder, CO
Spend all the money we have on alternate fuel research, tell the oil lobbies in politics to GTFO out of politics. hopefully it would result in nre power sources so that the middle east is no longer needed for its fuel, thus we could send assassination squads out to exterminate terrorist leaders in the US and middle east then fly them back home and pardon them, repeat.
2007-07-17 08:35:46
[pt] KEIOS
srs bsns
+231|6909|pimelteror.de

lowing wrote:

n dealing with "EXTREMISM" of any kind, the probelm is. Their rationale is so fucked up, compromise is not acceptable to them. Do you really think there is a compromise to Islamic extremism that will bring peace to us all? Hell, even IF we were all to convert to Islam we would be killed because of the different takes on it? So bottom line is, even TOTAL appeasement to these groups would still not bring peace, and I am not willing to appease these groups even a fraction for it.
there will always be extremists - but the majority just wants to live in peace. treat the extremists minority like criminals deserve it and give the rest a chance to prosper.
the problem is, that the military actions in iraq are more present in the minds, than those few humanitarian actions.
2007-07-17 08:45:48
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6907|USA

[pt] KEIOS wrote:

lowing wrote:

n dealing with "EXTREMISM" of any kind, the probelm is. Their rationale is so fucked up, compromise is not acceptable to them. Do you really think there is a compromise to Islamic extremism that will bring peace to us all? Hell, even IF we were all to convert to Islam we would be killed because of the different takes on it? So bottom line is, even TOTAL appeasement to these groups would still not bring peace, and I am not willing to appease these groups even a fraction for it.
there will always be extremists - but the majority just wants to live in peace. treat the extremists minority like criminals deserve it and give the rest a chance to prosper.
the problem is, that the military actions in iraq are more present in the minds, than those few humanitarian actions.
Not really sure where you get the notion that the people of the ME "just want to live in peace". That region has been in turmoil long before the US even existed let alone our military presence there. The reason we are there is precisely because they CAN NOT or WILL NOT live in peace. They could have peace, look at the quality of life countries like Kuwait enjoy. THe ME has all the money in the world below their feet yet they refuse to get past their insignificant little differences that make them unique. They do not tolerate EACH OTHER, let alone western life styles, so I do not think we will ever be safe as long as they have a reach.
2007-07-17 08:53:38
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6811

IG-Calibre wrote:

lowing wrote:

First, bomb the fuck outta Ireland!!
We've survived 800 years of war lowing, our Culture has already tried to be destroyed & eradicated by imperial  Protestantism, we have survived Famine / War and our culture prevails through the millennia !!!! bring it on!!
https://content.answers.com/main/content/wp/en/thumb/d/de/300px-Undefeated.jpg

This image springs to mind.
2007-07-17 09:07:51
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6907|USA

CameronPoe wrote:

IG-Calibre wrote:

lowing wrote:

First, bomb the fuck outta Ireland!!
We've survived 800 years of war lowing, our Culture has already tried to be destroyed & eradicated by imperial  Protestantism, we have survived Famine / War and our culture prevails through the millennia !!!! bring it on!!
http://content.answers.com/main/content … feated.jpg

This image springs to mind.
Actually, even though I asked "who said I was joking?" I really was only joking. Read up to the next page Cam, I have a more down to earth comment that I would like you to comment on
2007-07-17 09:09:33
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6811

lowing wrote:

To Cam,

           I think the fundamental difference between the you and I ( I will speak for myself ) is this.

You think all of the terrorism the west is threatened with stems from the ME. You even stated in another thread that the terrorists "Stated reason" for bombing London was involvement in Iraq.

I have an opinion that the terrorism that is threatening the world is because of Islamic extremism and the "Stated reason" of a Muslim dominated world. To convert or kill the infidels. The Islamic extremists do not tolerate our way of life, and " God Willing " will destroy it. They have ZERO TOLERANCE for western society and our values. We were not in Iraq or Afghanistan before 911 or in 93 or in 98 or in 88 etc. This would be a threat to us regardless of Iraq.
That's where you're wrong lowing. I understand that there are different groups of 'terrorists' with different ideologies. There are those who delude themselves into thinking they can bring down western civilisation - the whackjobs, real terrorists - and then there are those who are fighting to protect their Shi'a brethren from Sunni/Kurdish attacks, their Sunni brethren from Shi'a/Kurdish attacks, their Kurdish brethren from Sunni/Shi'a attacks, their Sunni/Shi'a/Kurdish brethren from Al Qaeda attacks. A lot of the terrorism internal to Iraq is simply civil warfare aimed at establishing control over the country or parts thereof. A lot of the terrorism is also mindless barbarism aimed at stirring up ethnic and religious tensions in the knowledge that it is easier to 'divide and conquer'.

Very little genuine Islamic extremist terror has made it as far as Europe let alone America. The war in Iraq is not keeping them at bay either if that's what you think. They're not stupid. They can phone their buddies at the madrasa in Pakistan or Saudi Arabia to fly to Mexico and be over the Rio Grande before you can say 'hey muchacho!'. There is a growing element in countries with sizeable Islamic minorities, like Germany, France and the UK for instance, that are what you say: islamic fundamentalist nutjobs bent on western destruction. They're a fringe movement that could easily be stamped out if we made the right decisions. Offering them excuses - like going into Iraq, which was wrong - that make recruitment easier is obviously counter-productive, not least because you lose countrymen out there fighting for nothing/godknowswhat. The invasion of Iraq was unjust, supporting the Saudi regime is unjust, supporting Saddam was unjust, undermining Iran is unjust, arming Israel is unjust: don't give me the 'pre-9/11 we we're saints' bullshit.

The people of which you speak do exist but your combatting them the wrong way and they don't pose nearly as much of a threat to the west as you would like to have us believe.

Answer me this: why don't Islamic extremists attack any of the following countries?

- Japan
- South Korea
- South Africa
- Brazil
- Chile
- Argentina
- Panama
- Ireland
- China
- Romania
- Bulgaria
- Latvia
- Lithuania
- Sweden
- Norway
- Finland
- Iceland
- Portugal
- Costa Rica
- Mexico
- Belize
- Cuba
- Venezuela
- Nicaragua
- Paraguay
- Uruguay
- Ecuador
- Bolivia
- El Salvador
- Jamaica
2007-07-17 09:15:21
CaptainSpaulding71
Member
+119|6613|CA, USA

CameronPoe wrote:

lowing wrote:

To Cam,

           I think the fundamental difference between the you and I ( I will speak for myself ) is this.

You think all of the terrorism the west is threatened with stems from the ME. You even stated in another thread that the terrorists "Stated reason" for bombing London was involvement in Iraq.

I have an opinion that the terrorism that is threatening the world is because of Islamic extremism and the "Stated reason" of a Muslim dominated world. To convert or kill the infidels. The Islamic extremists do not tolerate our way of life, and " God Willing " will destroy it. They have ZERO TOLERANCE for western society and our values. We were not in Iraq or Afghanistan before 911 or in 93 or in 98 or in 88 etc. This would be a threat to us regardless of Iraq.
That's where you're wrong lowing. I understand that there are different groups of 'terrorists' with different ideologies. There are those who delude themselves into thinking they can bring down western civilisation - the whackjobs, real terrorists - and then there are those who are fighting to protect their Shi'a brethren from Sunni/Kurdish attacks, their Sunni brethren from Shi'a/Kurdish attacks, their Kurdish brethren from Sunni/Shi'a attacks, their Sunni/Shi'a/Kurdish brethren from Al Qaeda attacks. A lot of the terrorism internal to Iraq is simply civil warfare aimed at establishing control over the country or parts thereof. A lot of the terrorism is also mindless barbarism aimed at stirring up ethnic and religious tensions in the knowledge that it is easier to 'divide and conquer'.

Very little genuine Islamic extremist terror has made it as far as Europe let alone America. The war in Iraq is not keeping them at bay either if that's what you think. They're not stupid. They can phone their buddies at the madrasa in Pakistan or Saudi Arabia to fly to Mexico and be over the Rio Grande before you can say 'hey muchacho!'. There is a growing element in countries with sizeable Islamic minorities, like Germany, France and the UK for instance, that are what you say: islamic fundamentalist nutjobs bent on western destruction. They're a fringe movement that could easily be stamped out if we made the right decisions. Offering them excuses - like going into Iraq, which was wrong - that make recruitment easier is obviously counter-productive, not least because you lose countrymen out there fighting for nothing/godknowswhat. The invasion of Iraq was unjust, supporting the Saudi regime is unjust, supporting Saddam was unjust, undermining Iran is unjust, arming Israel is unjust: don't give me the 'pre-9/11 we we're saints' bullshit.

The people of which you speak do exist but your combatting them the wrong way and they don't pose nearly as much of a threat to the west as you would like to have us believe.

Answer me this: why don't Islamic extremists attack any of the following countries?

- Japan
- South Korea
- South Africa
- Brazil
- Chile
- Argentina
- Panama
- Ireland
- China
- Romania
- Bulgaria
- Latvia
- Lithuania
- Sweden
- Norway
- Finland
- Iceland
- Portugal
- Costa Rica
- Mexico
- Belize
- Cuba
- Venezuela
- Nicaragua
- Paraguay
- Uruguay
- Ecuador
- Bolivia
- El Salvador
- Jamaica
probably all of those countries don't like Israel either so they get the free pass.

plus, if they tried attacking Jamaica, they'd be too high to pull it off.  or think they were in paradise already.  Jah man!
2007-07-17 09:21:56
AAFCptKabbom
Member
+127|6914|WPB, FL. USA
What I would do...

If it was in another country I would reach out an offer any assistance possible and partner with their Intel and offer military assistance.

If it were in U.S. (my top ten):
1) Consult with every nation and gather all Intel.  Partner with select governments, when possible, and strike valid targets.
2) Secure border, notice I did not say "close border", on both sides.
3) Remind the U.N. of our resolve and start the political process of condemnation (wouldn't expect full support on resolution or any direct action).
4) Turn on the propaganda machine and show the difference between the few and psychopathic Islamic extremest vs. the true Muslim people.
5) Not say a fucking word to not one damn anti-self-defense Dem.  Just let the events speak for themselves and protect their whinny asses again.
6) Stand firm in preventing them from getting a government and/or country of operation like is being done in Iraq.
7) Call in that favor to my bud in Pakistan and head for a camping trip in the tribal regions on the border with Afghanistan.
8) If Iran was involved in any way I would give the Iranian people and the world the facts and order the destruction of their Nuke program.
9) On the second day I would go to ground zero and be with my people.
...and lastly and not leastly...
10) Ban CameronPooh from "Debate and Serious Talk" and create a new topic just for him "For Those With Head's Up Ass & Need Oxygen" 

IMHO - You can not give these psychopaths one single psychological win or glimmer of hope.  They have to be put down on every front and anytime they show their presence.  It's not about the individual psychopathic extremest; it's about the people who they are going to slaughter and the ones they are trying to convert through psychological and physical torture.  Remember that they are psychopaths who rule with a gangster mentality.
2007-07-17 09:29:40
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6907|USA

CameronPoe wrote:

lowing wrote:

To Cam,

           I think the fundamental difference between the you and I ( I will speak for myself ) is this.

You think all of the terrorism the west is threatened with stems from the ME. You even stated in another thread that the terrorists "Stated reason" for bombing London was involvement in Iraq.

I have an opinion that the terrorism that is threatening the world is because of Islamic extremism and the "Stated reason" of a Muslim dominated world. To convert or kill the infidels. The Islamic extremists do not tolerate our way of life, and " God Willing " will destroy it. They have ZERO TOLERANCE for western society and our values. We were not in Iraq or Afghanistan before 911 or in 93 or in 98 or in 88 etc. This would be a threat to us regardless of Iraq.
That's where you're wrong lowing. I understand that there are different groups of 'terrorists' with different ideologies. There are those who delude themselves into thinking they can bring down western civilisation - the whackjobs, real terrorists - and then there are those who are fighting to protect their Shi'a brethren from Sunni/Kurdish attacks, their Sunni brethren from Shi'a/Kurdish attacks, their Kurdish brethren from Sunni/Shi'a attacks, their Sunni/Shi'a/Kurdish brethren from Al Qaeda attacks. A lot of the terrorism internal to Iraq is simply civil warfare aimed at establishing control over the country or parts thereof. A lot of the terrorism is also mindless barbarism aimed at stirring up ethnic and religious tensions in the knowledge that it is easier to 'divide and conquer'.

Very little genuine Islamic extremist terror has made it as far as Europe let alone America. The war in Iraq is not keeping them at bay either if that's what you think. They're not stupid. They can phone their buddies at the madrasa in Pakistan or Saudi Arabia to fly to Mexico and be over the Rio Grande before you can say 'hey muchacho!'. There is a growing element in countries with sizeable Islamic minorities, like Germany, France and the UK for instance, that are what you say: islamic fundamentalist nutjobs bent on western destruction. They're a fringe movement that could easily be stamped out if we made the right decisions. Offering them excuses - like going into Iraq, which was wrong - that make recruitment easier is obviously counter-productive, not least because you lose countrymen out there fighting for nothing/godknowswhat. The invasion of Iraq was unjust, supporting the Saudi regime is unjust, supporting Saddam was unjust, undermining Iran is unjust, arming Israel is unjust: don't give me the 'pre-9/11 we we're saints' bullshit.

The people of which you speak do exist but your combatting them the wrong way and they don't pose nearly as much of a threat to the west as you would like to have us believe.

Answer me this: why don't Islamic extremists attack any of the following countries?

- Japan
- South Korea
- South Africa
- Brazil
- Chile
- Argentina
- Panama
- Ireland
- China
- Romania
- Bulgaria
- Latvia
- Lithuania
- Sweden
- Norway
- Finland
- Iceland
- Portugal
- Costa Rica
- Mexico
- Belize
- Cuba
- Venezuela
- Nicaragua
- Paraguay
- Uruguay
- Ecuador
- Bolivia
- El Salvador
- Jamaica
Good response Cam, I will answer your question with this: I do not think any of the countries listed has gotten in the way of the Islamic extremists.................................................YET!

Of all the countries listed, do you think they would not be attacked as soon as they did something that went outside the beliefs of the extremists or hindered their march in any way?

Do you condone Spain's solution to terrorism by simply cowering to them and appease their every wish? Should Spain be proud of their actions? Would Ireland do the samething for peace?  Would you condone such kneeling? If not, then your only solution would be to fight, since rational reasoning is pretty much out the window with such groups.


I will also add that another reason these other countries has not been attacked even with their wesrten societies is because they are not the big kids on the block. Picking a fight and beating up a little kid is hardly a way to prove how tough you are. Punching his big brother in the nose will get you noticed and taken seriously.

Last edited by lowing (2007-07-17 09:42:48)

2007-07-17 10:25:57
sergeriver
Cowboy from Hell
+1,928|7013|Argentina

CameronPoe wrote:

Answer me this: why don't Islamic extremists attack any of the following countries?

- Argentina
1992 Israeli Embassy attack in Buenos Aires

1994 AMIA bombing
2007-07-17 12:29:43
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6811

sergeriver wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:

Answer me this: why don't Islamic extremists attack any of the following countries?

- Argentina
1992 Israeli Embassy attack in Buenos Aires

1994 AMIA bombing
Not the Islamic fundamentalism, bring-down-the-west type terrorism lowing was talking about. Just attacks on Israel basically.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2007-07-17 12:29:58)

2007-07-17 12:31:08
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6811

AAFCptKabbom wrote:

What I would do...

If it was in another country I would reach out an offer any assistance possible and partner with their Intel and offer military assistance.

If it were in U.S. (my top ten):
1) Consult with every nation and gather all Intel.  Partner with select governments, when possible, and strike valid targets.
2) Secure border, notice I did not say "close border", on both sides.
3) Remind the U.N. of our resolve and start the political process of condemnation (wouldn't expect full support on resolution or any direct action).
4) Turn on the propaganda machine and show the difference between the few and psychopathic Islamic extremest vs. the true Muslim people.
5) Not say a fucking word to not one damn anti-self-defense Dem.  Just let the events speak for themselves and protect their whinny asses again.
6) Stand firm in preventing them from getting a government and/or country of operation like is being done in Iraq.
7) Call in that favor to my bud in Pakistan and head for a camping trip in the tribal regions on the border with Afghanistan.
8) If Iran was involved in any way I would give the Iranian people and the world the facts and order the destruction of their Nuke program.
9) On the second day I would go to ground zero and be with my people.
...and lastly and not leastly...
10) Ban CameronPooh from "Debate and Serious Talk" and create a new topic just for him "For Those With Head's Up Ass & Need Oxygen" 

IMHO - You can not give these psychopaths one single psychological win or glimmer of hope.  They have to be put down on every front and anytime they show their presence.  It's not about the individual psychopathic extremest; it's about the people who they are going to slaughter and the ones they are trying to convert through psychological and physical torture.  Remember that they are psychopaths who rule with a gangster mentality.
Geeeeorge - is that you? I thought you were politically dead?

Last edited by CameronPoe (2007-07-17 12:31:41)

2007-07-17 12:31:25
M.O.A.B
'Light 'em up!'
+1,220|6479|Escea

CameronPoe wrote:

sergeriver wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:

Answer me this: why don't Islamic extremists attack any of the following countries?

- Argentina
1992 Israeli Embassy attack in Buenos Aires

1994 AMIA bombing
Not the Islamic fundamentalism, bring-down-the-west type terrorism lowing was talking about. Just attacks on Israel basically.
Now that's splittin hairs
2007-07-17 12:40:59
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6811

lowing wrote:

Do you condone Spain's solution to terrorism by simply cowering to them and appease their every wish? Should Spain be proud of their actions? Would Ireland do the samething for peace?  Would you condone such kneeling? If not, then your only solution would be to fight, since rational reasoning is pretty much out the window with such groups.
I didn't see it as cowering. I saw it as doing the right thing, the government responding to the will of the people as any good democracy should. Spain had one of the most vocal anti-war movements in the whole of Europe before and during their dalliance in Iraq. They knew it was wrong. But José Maria Aznar, with the ETA-bee in his bonnet, decided to ignore them and it cost him his political career. I don't see the two things as being related at all. Spain wanted out of the war irrespective of any extremist attack. It was fortuitous timing for the Bush administration as they could then paint Spain as pansies, instead of the bastion of democracy they actually were.

As for Ireland: if I get hit by John Doe I don't walk across the street and punch anyone who looks like him and anyone who ever had anything to do with him. That doesn't serve any purpose whatsoever. I make damn sure I go after John Doe himself and if I can't find him then I make damn sure he can't come and punch me on the nose again. I buy a nice big lock for my front door and check my back every five seconds when I'm in the street.

lowing wrote:

I will also add that another reason these other countries has not been attacked even with their wesrten societies is because they are not the big kids on the block. Picking a fight and beating up a little kid is hardly a way to prove how tough you are. Punching his big brother in the nose will get you noticed and taken seriously.
The more astute thing to do would be to bring down smaller weaker nations and build from there. There has been zero Islamic militancy in Albania - the only muslim country in Europe. Why so? Because Islam as a whole isn't the problem and this 'Islam takes over the world' bullshit movement is miniscule inside the west and is destined to burn out.

Lowing: the Brits couldn't beat the little old Irish over the course of 800 years, including 30 years of modern warfare - how on earth could you possibly imagine that the comparatively muslim-free United States of America, the greatest military force on earth, faces an existential threat from a fringe muslim movement?

Last edited by CameronPoe (2007-07-17 12:41:11)

2007-07-17 13:27:29
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|7028|PNW

IG-Calibre wrote:

lowing wrote:

First, bomb the fuck outta Ireland!!
We've survived 800 years of war lowing, our Culture has already tried to be destroyed & eradicated by imperial  Protestantism, we have survived Famine / War and our culture prevails through the millennia !!!! bring it on!!
There would be some pretty angry Irish over here if we attacked Ireland...
2007-07-17 13:29:53
sergeriver
Cowboy from Hell
+1,928|7013|Argentina

CameronPoe wrote:

sergeriver wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:

Answer me this: why don't Islamic extremists attack any of the following countries?

- Argentina
1992 Israeli Embassy attack in Buenos Aires

1994 AMIA bombing
Not the Islamic fundamentalism, bring-down-the-west type terrorism lowing was talking about. Just attacks on Israel basically.
4 Iranians driving a van with 100kg of C4 isn't Islamic fundamentalism?  My fault then.

Last edited by sergeriver (2007-07-17 13:36:46)

2007-07-17 14:01:51
DeathBecomesYu
Member
+171|6435

lowing wrote:

DeathBecomesYu wrote:

First off...It was a little joke that I was commenting on by lowing.....RELAX and I even said that I shouldn't judge based on a few people here...so READ next time. Now for your double standard, thanks for generalizing me and thinking that I am Republican. I am not affiliated with any party. Actually I think the 2 party system needs to be abolished and get regular people back into government. As it sits now, we have a small group of people that are going to spend millions upon millions upon millions to be president. The media will spend millions upon millions more to televise debates set up just so that only the two parties are heard and the smaller voice is not. It is a damn shame that all that money is wasted...there are tons of better things that money could be used for. Basically only rich people can be leaders of our country and that is sad.

Next, I posted this thread to see how other people would deal with what an American president has to deal with since a lot of foreign people here have nothing good to say about the president or this country, but as I see not many are saying much. The presidency, in my opinion, is a thankless job and pretty much a lose, lose proposition. In this day and age, it won't matter if you are Republican, Democratic..you will get derailed either by the other party, the public pressure at home or elements internationally.

Finally, I don't have the answers and don't claim to have them. That is the difference between you and I. I won't be obnoxious enough to believe that I do and make someone else feel like an ass if they don't feel like I do. The only thing that I would say is that I would definitely be open minded and to get people working together instead of always trying to bring down "the other guy". So many things don't get done or are not done properly because politicians only worry about their power, party or themselves. That needs to change but I don't know how unless there was a true revolt to take our government back in some way.

Honestly Poe, you would be one of the most difficult people to work with in resolving an issue because you only believe you are right. I can imagine if you were in government that you would be one of the guys throwing chairs at someone else (as seen on TV) because you aren't getting your way. This is just my opinion but I don't see compromise in your behavior, I don't see an open mind, I don't see someone who could cooperate in the best interest of everyone because from reading almost every post you make, you feel that you have ALL the answers and everyone else is a complete IDIOT if they can't see what you want them to see and that my friend would never make a good leader....NEVER.
Who said I was joking?


To Cam,

           I think the fundamental difference between the you and I ( I will speak for myself ) is this.

You think all of the terrorism the west is threatened with stems from the ME. You even stated in another thread that the terrorists "Stated reason" for bombing London was involvement in Iraq.

I have an opinion that the terrorism that is threatening the world is because of Islamic extremism and the "Stated reason" of a Muslim dominated world. To convert or kill the infidels. The Islamic extremists do not tolerate our way of life, and " God Willing " will destroy it. They have ZERO TOLERANCE for western society and our values. We were not in Iraq or Afghanistan before 911 or in 93 or in 98 or in 88 etc. This would be a threat to us regardless of Iraq.
Wow...good job lowing.....see everyone...this is looking beyond tunnel vision. Realizing what the big picture is instead of focusing strictly what the media wants you to hear. This has been one of points all along. It is and always has been bigger than Iraq or the Palestinian cause or any legitimate cause around the world. This is a new war of ideology that DOES threaten the west and it is at the door step of Europe as we speak. I just hope this time Europe will realize this before it is too late and we have another world war played out in your back yard.
2007-07-17 16:20:20
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6811

DeathBecomesYu wrote:

lowing wrote:

To Cam,

           I think the fundamental difference between the you and I ( I will speak for myself ) is this.

You think all of the terrorism the west is threatened with stems from the ME. You even stated in another thread that the terrorists "Stated reason" for bombing London was involvement in Iraq.

I have an opinion that the terrorism that is threatening the world is because of Islamic extremism and the "Stated reason" of a Muslim dominated world. To convert or kill the infidels. The Islamic extremists do not tolerate our way of life, and " God Willing " will destroy it. They have ZERO TOLERANCE for western society and our values. We were not in Iraq or Afghanistan before 911 or in 93 or in 98 or in 88 etc. This would be a threat to us regardless of Iraq.
Wow...good job lowing.....see everyone...this is looking beyond tunnel vision. Realizing what the big picture is instead of focusing strictly what the media wants you to hear. This has been one of points all along. It is and always has been bigger than Iraq or the Palestinian cause or any legitimate cause around the world. This is a new war of ideology that DOES threaten the west and it is at the door step of Europe as we speak. I just hope this time Europe will realize this before it is too late and we have another world war played out in your back yard.
DBY - where does he offer up a solution or an answer to the question you posed? He doesn't. First you lambast people for dragging Iraq/Afghanistan into your thread and then you laud lowing despite his mention of it!

As a subsequent post of mine outlines: we pretty much all realise that there is a fringe Islamic movement bent on biting at the heels of the west. A fringe movement. Realisation of this is not some kind of higher level of thinking that transcends the 'tunnel vision thinking' you appear to accuse anyone whose opinion you dislike of. WHERE IS HIS PROPOSED SOLUTION? WHERE IS YOURS FOR THAT MATTER? I'm still waiting.
2007-07-17 16:25:06
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6661|North Carolina

DeathBecomesYu wrote:

My question is this. As some of you may know by listening to the news and/ or reading the news that threats from Al-qaida are becoming more and more threatening. There was a recent intelligence report stating that this AQ has the people in place and have access to nuclear/ dirty bomb material and the know how to put it to use. Now, no one knows how close they are to actually pulling something off but I do believe that this will happen in Europe or if AQ's wish were to come true...in America. Now here is my question. If a nuclear bomb does go off (big, small or dirty), let's say in the heart of Chicago or some other major city and AQ claims responsibility, if you were the American president....What would you do?

Since AQ does not have a conventional army, does not have borders of any kind....how should America respond, especially if YOU were president.
Locate the cells connected and eliminate them covertly.

Failing that, present the evidence to the U.N., call for attacks on the cells involved, and mount a multinational invasion.

If no one wants to help, then a unilateral invasion should be the last resort.

I would think the first choice would be effective in most cases though.  Al Quida is a small group that can, in some areas, be dealt with in a secretive manner.
2007-07-17 16:44:11
DeathBecomesYu
Member
+171|6435
Response to Poe

First, it is not a "fringe", that is pretty naive that what is happening around the world in MANY places is considered fringe. I feel that we are in a war of ideology in which someone is trying to turn the world into the way they feel the world should be. It will be there after Iraq and Europe is feeling it right now. Secondly, lowing was pointing out that Iraq and Afghanistan are not the sole reasons for our problems and is trying to keep it separate. He understands.

Now about my "solutions". Apparently, you haven't read what I have written SEVERAL times here. I DON'T have proposed solutions. I simply posted my thread to see what other people of other nationalities would say. Since our presidency is the subject of so much negativity here, I wanted to see what others would do as the American president. Would I make a good president?..I think so. I have won awards in debating, I have won awards for leadership and I have been a captain of various sports teams. What I am saying that in general, I have a very good relationship with people, I don't follow the crowd, I lead by example, I don't take BS from anyone and I am very, very open minded.

As an example. I have owned my own business since 1995. I started with nothing but a desk, some paper and pencils. I built a client base solely on my contacts with people, I have NEVER advertised. To this day, I have never lost a client because of my work. I have lost clients because THEY went out of business and I have been paid for every single project I have ever done in the last 20 years. Late last week, I had one of my first clients (commercial developer) contact me because they wanted me to be involved in a series of medical buildings. They trust me so much that they insisted I be involved. That doesn't happen if you are a close minded jerk. It happens because I do the right thing for people i know and care about. I feel I lead by example and I work my ass off for people. I am proud of what I have accomplished at my age, I am proud of how I have treated people and people trust me to do what is right. That is what I would take to a presidency.....Decency, Moral obligation, Trust and an open mind.

Do I have solutions....NO. But what I would do is gather people from all sides and find those solutions. I am not a "know-it-all" and don't begin to have answers for everything as the American Presidency. Honestly, it would suck to be the president in this day and age and the way our system is set up...I wouldn't fit in, because I am not one sided or "loyal" to a party. I doubt, in the current system, that I would be able to get anything done.....why? Because I would have both sides against me. As far as lowing goes......he will have to answer for himself.

Last edited by DeathBecomesYu (2007-07-17 16:47:19)

2007-07-17 16:48:36
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6811

DeathBecomesYu wrote:

... and I am very, very open minded.
So open-minded that you won't even begin to entertain my suggestion as to how the problem might be tackled. Nice job bringing me into the 'all-inclusive' fray.

At least tell me what the flaws in my plan are so I can either agree, disagree or modify the plan where appropriate....

PS In the west it is a fringe movement. In countries like Pakistan and Afghanistan it is more than that.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2007-07-17 16:50:12)

2007-07-17 17:15:37
M.O.A.B
'Light 'em up!'
+1,220|6479|Escea

If I were the President, I'd be one of those kick-ass movie presidents who takes on terrorists single handly like Harrison Ford. Then I would use covert forces to locate any training facilities remotely linked to terror cells and annhiliate them with aerial strikes and such. Find and cut off any source of terrorist funding and then do something after that, haven't thought that far yet.

 

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