Dersmikner
Member
+147|6497|Texas
I've read a lot here about sniping and medic and how sniping is an individual deal, as opposed to a team kit.

SNIPER and TEAM aren't mutually exclusive. When I'm sniper I ALWAYS make sure my contribution does something for the team. There's no other reason to play. I'm in it to win it, and I think the way I play is VERY positive for the team.

If I'm MEC I always spawn at hotel. I do one of three things:

1. I run like hell to the East Wall, dropping a claymore at the alleyway nearest the hill, and another on the outside run of the East Wall, then I settle in behind the third palm tree, and try to block the USMC passage to Cement Factory / Train Accident down the East Wall and Hotel through the alleyways. The claymores give me some coverage if anyone gets past me, and I can pick off runners and control one entire third of the map.

I consider that an important team goal. I'm protecting three CPs at one time, and shutting off one front of the battle.

2. I run towards the West hills, dropping 2 claymores along the tin wall, one at either entrance. Then I lie up against the wall targeting the hill behind the trash dumpster, and the entrance farthest South. That gives me a chance to keep USMC from hitting Hotel from the West side.

3. The last thing I might sometimes do is drop one claymore at the North opening in the West side tin wall, and continue through that entrance to the Western hills. I drop one claymore in the hills, then backup and try to snipe the run at Suburbs/Square.

I try to make sure that USMC can't run past Hotel down that Western run and give MEC two fronts.

If USMC has made a run at the island, I'll often get on the roof at Factory and try to protect that CP so no matter what else happens my guys have a spawn point on the island. Sometimes I'll get between the railroad ties between Gatehouse and Cement and cover my guys who are going for Train.

So, in conclusion  ;-)  I really feel like even when I'm sniping I'm doing what I can to help the team win. I think abunch of guys standing around hotel lobbing grenades and reviving people to grab a shitton of points aren't doing anything more for the team than I am. I'd argue they aren't doing as much.

Last edited by Dersmikner (2007-04-22 10:46:54)

Rickard.Jarl-
Member
+7|6218|Sweden, Norrbotten, LuleƄ.
but you would do better if medic/assault/AT
Jameseyy
Banned
+108|6227|Scotland!
I vote we don't get into yet another "are snipers useful" "are medics better" 20 page spam flame fest so soon after the last one
Snake
Missing, Presumed Dead
+1,046|6565|England

Another flame thread for all the revive muppets.

Ive just completed the 100hours and requirements for the sniper awards. In doing that, Ive spent as much time on the ground as possible, using the class and I'll tell you what, it is the most under-appreciated kit in the game. Yes, including Anti-Tank.

I cannot tell you how - you just have to play and realise it. Not just claywhore and nade spam like a fucking retard, disregarding the rifle as something of a mystery.

Quite frankly, it depends on:

1) The user/player
2) The "level" of the user/player

(going by rank) A Corporal will tend to sit on a hill, shooting at the stray person who passes through their scope. A higher rank (not being big headed, but me) - I run around and act like most other infantry classes, however I tend to stay behind the lines a lil. Hell, I even go surging forward at times. I act the SL, issue orders, capture flags, defend flags, engage enemies at close range and all the rest of it.
On the 24/7 MD/Surge server Venom saw that earlier. To devastation. Top of the leaderboard above all the medics.

Applied to a squad, on a map outside of city maps they are VERY useful. Taking out those enemies on tops of hills is where its useful. If other classes can do that on the ranges that are presented on Surge, then thats either very impressive or hacks.

To speak the language of most players - I agree, on city maps they are not very useful due to the constant, fierce close range battles that dominate the game. Although in the right hands, it can be very effective. Apart from their claymores - however, thats more for twats who dont know how to shoot a gun.
David.P
Banned
+649|6273
I snipe with non sniper weapons for my squad. Actually i act more like a marksman to tell ya the truth, When my squad is capping something i usually stay back with my G3,L85, or Pkm and take out the targets heading for them.(I especially love it when some guy thinks he's gonne be sneaky and nade my whole team while i just let loose and he drops down.)

I remember once i had a type 85 on wake and i sniped three guys with at at 50m while my squad was capping the village.
cowami
OY, BITCHTITS!
+1,106|6288|Noo Yawk, Noo Yawk

Jameseyy wrote:

I vote we don't get into yet another "are snipers useful" "are medics better" 20 page spam flame fest so soon after the last one
But they're so fun! j/k, let's not get into another one of those.

Personally, if I do play sniper, and assuming my squad is moving around, I do what Russian military doctrine says and serve as the squad's marksman. It's particularly useful if someone tries to swim across the river at Karkand, you can sit on one side and cover your man, while he swims across.
https://i.imgur.com/PfIpcdn.gif
Drunk_Musketeer
To be honest I don't care anyway..
+57|6737|Great Wall
I'm on my own and play for myself.. The only goal for me is to kill many and don't let anyone to kill me.. My goal is a priority for me. When I achieve my goal I help to my team anyway.
Only when I see that my team sucks badly and loses flags quickly I start thinking about helping it (caping some flags, even switching kit etc) but only because if my team gets raped it's harder for me to do my sniping.. But then when situation is balanced or my team is winning I can switch to sniper and enjoy my private hunt again

That's the sniper way.. lonely and very selfish.. but it's the only way it works very well
Bratwurstschnecke
Member
+77|6675|respawn screen
Sniper is along with Medic and Support the most useful kit for Squad-Leaders. A Sniper that does his job good stays near but behind the action and dies rare making him the perfect spawnpoint. But Snipers don't win the game.
Since I got all the Sniper Awards (exp. kit + explosives), I don't play it anymore. One of the things I hate most in this game is being shot holding my G3 and getting revived with an SVD in my hands.
Drunk_Musketeer
To be honest I don't care anyway..
+57|6737|Great Wall

Bratwurstschnecke wrote:

One of the things I hate most in this game is being shot holding my G3 and getting revived with an SVD in my hands.
I feel exactly opposite
genius_man16
Platinum Star whore
+365|6677|Middle of nowhere

Jameseyy wrote:

I vote we don't get into yet another "are snipers useful" "are medics better" 20 page spam flame fest so soon after the last one
w00t for smart people!

If i play sniper i don't contribute to my team, i'll be honest, i mean, i just can't run around and make snap head-shots like a lot of people can, idk why, it just doesn't work for me

i can make real long range head-shots, but idk

oh well, sniper is fun sometimes, but i'd rather be something that can charge the front lines

i'm a grunt, always have been, and always will be
Jim_Bred
Member
+15|6501
Snipers have their place.

I hate claymores.
Sniper-UK-Ghost
Ice Lolly Maniac
+30|6234|Bristol
If im a sniper, if pfff when im a sniper i ALWAYS feel that i play as part of a team, i always cover people when running/reloading/capping/when getting revived i feel i always help, it really does show you help when someone is capping a base and a enemy runs in and starts shooting the capper and you snipe off his head with your rifle, the guy taking the base thanks you loads, it makes me feel proud
Vonlefteye
Member
+4|6537
Snipers can be the last line of defence to the all important flag capture for the opposition, personally its the most tactical kit against lone flag cappers and also good for capturing directly after losing a flag.... sneeky as fuck, silent & deadly
Doctor Strangelove
Real Battlefield Veterinarian.
+1,758|6467
It is possible to use the Sniper to help your team. However sniper's don't help their team more often than any other kit.
Sniper-UK-Ghost
Ice Lolly Maniac
+30|6234|Bristol

doctastrangelove1964 wrote:

It is possible to use the Sniper to help your team. However sniper's don't help their team more often than any other kit.
your so wrong
cowami
OY, BITCHTITS!
+1,106|6288|Noo Yawk, Noo Yawk

Need I remind you guys again?

Jameseyy wrote:

I vote we don't get into yet another "are snipers useful" "are medics better" 20 page spam flame fest so soon after the last one
https://i.imgur.com/PfIpcdn.gif
Todd_Angelo
Leukocyte
+336|6626|Warlord
@Dersmikner, yes.

As sniper I play to help my team win as a primary goal. On some maps that means travelling with a squad, on other maps (SF especially) I'll be in a squad but I won't move with them because it's more effective for me to be moving around independently. As squad leader in particular taking an alternate route can mean you don't die in a fight that kills everyone else so you're still around to provide a spawn spot closer to the squad's goal.

In SF which I now play most I normally work as a team player and that means, if I'm squad leader, even of a squad that's just me, and the commander orders me from wherever I am to defend or assault a flag at the other end of the map I'll go and do it a lot of the time (depending on whether the commander seems to know his stuff). In no-vehicle mode the ziplines allow you to move around a lot faster than those on foot so I can often be behind the assaulter(s) but still make it there in time to try to stop him/them. If I'm late then I can always try to cap it once they move on; I've tagged behind a pair doing this for five minutes when the entire of the rest of both teams is obliviously battling it out at Palace.


Rickard.Jarl- wrote:

but you would do better if medic/assault/AT
That depends on a lot of factors: map size, the specific map, quality of the player and their skill with each kit, quality of the others players on both sides + teamwork (good player + bad team = loss, most of the time), IO or normal, a bit of luck.

BTW, I can't believe you mentioned assault in there. For a start why go assault when you can go medic? I'd prefer the ability to heal myself and be able to move fast for longer most any day (with the possible exception of SF where the grapple might be tactically useful, again depending on map). Anyway as regards them v. sniper, most games a decent sniper wipes assault's ass in terms of effectiveness (making a difference in the outcome of the game) especially today with IFF for claymores being common so they no longer have to be reserved for personal defence only.

I was playing a game last night where the leading scorer on the enemy team was assault and he was owning it up, noob toobing his ass off (good fighter clearly). Didn't do his team one bit of good. We had them bottled up in the palace and they lost by a huge margin, despite the heavy losses on the British side... now if he'd been a good player, then he would have used his kit to its full advantage and left the palace, with a squad ideally (5 medics wouldn't be bad, but 4 medics and 1 sniper could be better), gone over the wall in the rear (where he's outside the visible range of even covering snipers) and they could have made a really decent stab at taking the mosque, splitting the attackers and then going on to rally the round.

Since flags can be the thing that determines a round's outcome it sometimes doesn't matter how much you kill, or how many tickets you save as a valiant medic, you may still lose. I've seen it a few times where all the top scorers (and judging from the team points that includes a couple/few medics) were on the team that lost, sometimes by a big margin.
Marinejuana
local
+415|6584|Seattle
snipers can help, medics can help more, dont listen to todd angelo, he will snipe because he likes it, not because of how especially useful it is. he will tell u stories of how all the medics and flag fighters didnt win and how rounds were won by lone snipers on roofs, but its only because his attention to detail is as selective in game as it is in these forums.

u cant control territory unless you are near it. the reason being that at any moderately large distance, it becomes easy to take cover and ignore "defense." it is only possible to view one very restricted angle when u attempt to fight at a distance. to move 90 degrees to some cover on a sniper takes a second, whereas the sniper would have to walk 30 seconds to acquire the 90 degree-different view. rapid fire eases close range fighting because it encourages shooting before, and while, positively aiming. the ability to revive in close combat wins almost every single fight when one team uses it and the other doesnt. health packs play a similarly important role. every kit except anti tank carries grenades, which are also critical for clearing areas like flags.

with these facts of bf2 combat in mind, u can see why snipers are not fit well for the team. However you can be useful with any kit, your affect obviously has to do with how good you are, and if you are as good as, for example, Todd_Angelo, you should be able to overcome the snipers inherent weaknesses and come through for the team anyway.
Snipingruven
The Anti-Sniper
+12|6535|Las Vegas
snipers suck, meds rule
cowami
OY, BITCHTITS!
+1,106|6288|Noo Yawk, Noo Yawk

Snipingruven wrote:

snipers suck, meds rule
Which I find ironic, considering your name has the word "sniping" in it.
https://i.imgur.com/PfIpcdn.gif
Todd_Angelo
Leukocyte
+336|6626|Warlord

Marinejuana wrote:

snipers can help...
Yes they can.

Marinejuana wrote:

medics can help more...
As a rule, yes. But not to the exclusion of all other kits all of the time, which is what you initially stated.

Marinejuana wrote:

dont listen to todd angelo, he will snipe because he likes it, not because of how especially useful it is.
I snipe because, as I told you, it's how I'm most use to the team most of the time. As I asked in the other thread: 18-25 flag defends in a game isn't useful?

I also mentioned in the other thread I wasn't talking about just me, or just about the sniper kit; I repeatedly emphasised that I was including other kits in how they can make enough of a difference, or the difference, in individual games in public servers.

I also said that I'd want more medics than any other kit on the team I'm on if I had the choice.
Todd_Angelo
Leukocyte
+336|6626|Warlord
Remember Sturgeon's Law guys, it applies to just about everything, including people using the medic kit... check your scoreboards and look at the kits of the guys in the bottom half during the game.

Or to put it another way: how many of you regularly play with guys with an assault-rifle KDR above 4?
Jemme101
M24 Abuser
+99|6499|Valley of the Dragons

Marinejuana wrote:

u cant control territory unless you are near it
I did it 4600+ times with the Sniper kit alone not using vehicles. Thats just one account.

Sniper Rifle , Silenced Pistol , Grenade , Claymore or Knife. They each get the job done.

Especially Clay + Nade is an effective combo against Medics. Clay goes of, in comes the revive muppet, boem goes the nade. Txs for another +3 to my kill list and points towards my CP Defense.
ethrion
Member
+25|6392|Hong Kong @ the moment
I play agressively as a sniper too. Always stick with my squad and get in amongst the action. Attacking and defending flags etc. Sitting and camping might get you a few kills but on the whole its best to go looking for them. Obviously dont be a fool and charge around aimlessly, think about where your going but dont wait for the fight to come to you, go to it. And besides, if the enemy has a good commander then you camping under that perfect bush means squat because everyone has been alerted to your location.
horseshat
Member
+4|6245
nothing defends a flag better than a good old claymore

claymore spamming ftw

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