Pages: 1 2

 

2007-03-25 06:45:20
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6984
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6492851.stm

It's shocking how naive and seemingly stupid Condi is with this latest pointless press release. She might as well have ended her statement with the words 'Pretty Please?'.

It's quite clear - the Saudis have laid out the requirements on Israel for peace:

- Normalisation of ties with all Arab states if it pulls out of all Arab land it occupied in 1967 and allows Palestinian refugees to return to their homes in Israel.

It's really very simple. No amount of grovelling devoid of understanding of the issues is gonna change this.

Israelis - your call...

Last edited by CameronPoe (2007-03-25 06:52:37)

2007-03-25 06:50:31
Varegg
Support fanatic :-)
+2,206|7239|Nårvei

As long as Hamas is only looked at as a terrorist organisastion there will never be peace in Israel/Palestine.
Wait behind the line ..............................................................
2007-03-25 07:06:25
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7030|132 and Bush

We will see what happens Wednesday.

Varegg a good portion of the world views Hamas as a terrorist organization. Of course many see Israel as the same, just unofficially. Hamas has publicly called for attacks on American targets within the last year (which was quickly refuted by the political portion of Hamas). If they had better control of their own organization it might be easier to run out and shake their hands.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
2007-03-25 07:45:44
Liberal-Sl@yer
Certified BF2S Asshole
+131|6885|The edge of sanity

Varegg wrote:

As long as Hamas is only looked at as a terrorist organisastion there will never be peace in Israel/Palestine.
well its hard to see someone who only targets civilians as anything but a terrorist organization. personally i would've like to see isreal cared outta germany. that would've been more humiliating to the germans and more easy to regulate as well.
2007-03-25 08:16:22
ATG
Banned
+5,233|6958|Global Command
And the problem if Hamas negotiated a deal with Israel one of two things would happen:

A suicide bomber would target Israel right at the crucial hour or
A Israeli extremist would murder Omert or commit an atrocity against Muslims.
2007-03-25 08:24:52
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6984

ATG wrote:

And the problem if Hamas negotiated a deal with Israel one of two things would happen:

A suicide bomber would target Israel right at the crucial hour or
A Israeli extremist would murder Omert or commit an atrocity against Muslims.
QFT
2007-03-25 08:27:52
ATG
Banned
+5,233|6958|Global Command
Which is why I just don't get that excited about either of them anymore.
They are hopeless.
2007-03-25 08:34:14
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|7010|SE London

Varegg wrote:

As long as Hamas is only looked at as a terrorist organisastion there will never be peace in Israel/Palestine.
They're not. Most governments don't class Hamas as a terrorist organisation, only Europe, America, Australia and Israel do.

Gotta agree with ATG, it all seems pretty futile. But pessimism never got anyone anywhere.
2007-03-25 10:51:22
san4
The Mas
+311|7117|NYC, a place to live

Bertster7 wrote:

Varegg wrote:

As long as Hamas is only looked at as a terrorist organisastion there will never be peace in Israel/Palestine.
They're not. Most governments don't class Hamas as a terrorist organisation, only Europe, America, Australia and Israel do.
Don't forget Canada. Everyone always forgets Canada.
2007-03-25 11:01:18
Fen321
Member
+54|6926|Singularity

Liberal-Sl@yer wrote:

Varegg wrote:

As long as Hamas is only looked at as a terrorist organisastion there will never be peace in Israel/Palestine.
well its hard to see someone who only targets civilians as anything but a terrorist organization. personally i would've like to see isreal cared outta germany. that would've been more humiliating to the germans and more easy to regulate as well.
Are you referring to the Israelis or the Palestinians because both sides attack civilian populations .
2007-03-25 11:19:27
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7030|132 and Bush

I don't see this as pointless.

"Rice said she would meet twice with both Abbas and Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert during her fourth trip to the region in as many months. "It's extremely important to establish a common agenda to move forward toward the establishment" of a Palestinian state, she said.

Abbas said he was satisfied with the renewed U.S. mediation efforts, which have not produced tangible results. Abbas said he talked with Rice about holding more meetings with Olmert. "All these meetings are part of the bilateral relations with Israel and the future vision that we are all seeking and working toward," Abbas said."
Xbone Stormsurgezz
2007-03-25 11:31:24
Varegg
Support fanatic :-)
+2,206|7239|Nårvei

Both sides in the conflict targets civilians !
Both sides have fractions that don`t want peace !
Both sides have fractions that want peace !
Both sides are classified as terrorists by fractions from the other side !
Both sides are using religion as a fact when it comes to territorial claims !

If diplomacy solves this tricky situation then nothing is impossible !
Wait behind the line ..............................................................
2007-03-25 11:33:13
sergeriver
Cowboy from Hell
+1,928|7186|Argentina

Kmarion wrote:

I don't see this as pointless.

"Rice said she would meet twice with both Abbas and Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert during her fourth trip to the region in as many months. "It's extremely important to establish a common agenda to move forward toward the establishment" of a Palestinian state, she said.

Abbas said he was satisfied with the renewed U.S. mediation efforts, which have not produced tangible results. Abbas said he talked with Rice about holding more meetings with Olmert. "All these meetings are part of the bilateral relations with Israel and the future vision that we are all seeking and working toward," Abbas said."
This is a job for someone like Bill Clinton not this wo-man.
2007-03-25 11:39:49
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7030|132 and Bush

sergeriver wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

I don't see this as pointless.

"Rice said she would meet twice with both Abbas and Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert during her fourth trip to the region in as many months. "It's extremely important to establish a common agenda to move forward toward the establishment" of a Palestinian state, she said.

Abbas said he was satisfied with the renewed U.S. mediation efforts, which have not produced tangible results. Abbas said he talked with Rice about holding more meetings with Olmert. "All these meetings are part of the bilateral relations with Israel and the future vision that we are all seeking and working toward," Abbas said."
This is a job for someone like Bill Clinton not this wo-man.
Bill already had his try. He was unable to accomplish anything permanent. Just pretentious photo ops.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
2007-03-25 13:04:45
UGADawgs
Member
+13|6750|South Carolina, US

CameronPoe wrote:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6492851.stm

It's shocking how naive and seemingly stupid Condi is with this latest pointless press release. She might as well have ended her statement with the words 'Pretty Please?'.

It's quite clear - the Saudis have laid out the requirements on Israel for peace:

- Normalisation of ties with all Arab states if it pulls out of all Arab land it occupied in 1967 and allows Palestinian refugees to return to their homes in Israel.

It's really very simple. No amount of grovelling devoid of understanding of the issues is gonna change this.

Israelis - your call...
Do you really have to spit on everything the Bush Administration does? Bush could be photographed with a puppy and you'd criticize him for alienating cat lovers. Empty press releases are staples of governments; I really doubt that anyone thinks that this statement is going to be that one element needed to fix the Middle East crisis.
2007-03-25 13:28:51
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6984

UGADawgs wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/6492851.stm

It's shocking how naive and seemingly stupid Condi is with this latest pointless press release. She might as well have ended her statement with the words 'Pretty Please?'.

It's quite clear - the Saudis have laid out the requirements on Israel for peace:

- Normalisation of ties with all Arab states if it pulls out of all Arab land it occupied in 1967 and allows Palestinian refugees to return to their homes in Israel.

It's really very simple. No amount of grovelling devoid of understanding of the issues is gonna change this.

Israelis - your call...
Do you really have to spit on everything the Bush Administration does? Bush could be photographed with a puppy and you'd criticize him for alienating cat lovers. Empty press releases are staples of governments; I really doubt that anyone thinks that this statement is going to be that one element needed to fix the Middle East crisis.
I criticise this empty posturing because it just shows that the current US administration are not committed to the so called 'Road Map' at all. They are the only country that can put meaningful pressure on Israel and steadfastly and stubbornly refuse to do so. Until that changes Bush can go choke on his own empty, badly delivered rhetoric.
2007-03-25 14:07:55
sergeriver
Cowboy from Hell
+1,928|7186|Argentina

Kmarion wrote:

sergeriver wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

I don't see this as pointless.

"Rice said she would meet twice with both Abbas and Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert during her fourth trip to the region in as many months. "It's extremely important to establish a common agenda to move forward toward the establishment" of a Palestinian state, she said.

Abbas said he was satisfied with the renewed U.S. mediation efforts, which have not produced tangible results. Abbas said he talked with Rice about holding more meetings with Olmert. "All these meetings are part of the bilateral relations with Israel and the future vision that we are all seeking and working toward," Abbas said."
This is a job for someone like Bill Clinton not this wo-man.
Bill already had his try. He was unable to accomplish anything permanent. Just pretentious photo ops.
He did his part, he didn't fail if that's what you suggest.  He was closer than everyone in history to fix this conflict.
2007-03-25 14:17:20
Stingray24
Proud member of the vast right-wing conspiracy
+1,060|6874|The Land of Scott Walker

sergeriver wrote:

Kmarion wrote:

sergeriver wrote:

This is a job for someone like Bill Clinton not this wo-man.
Bill already had his try. He was unable to accomplish anything permanent. Just pretentious photo ops.
He did his part, he didn't fail if that's what you suggest.  He was closer than everyone in history to fix this conflict.
Closer really counts in this situation? Well, I got closer to "almost peace" than anyone else.  Pfffft.

Last edited by Stingray24 (2007-03-25 14:17:56)

2007-03-25 14:24:11
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6984

Stingray24 wrote:

sergeriver wrote:

Kmarion wrote:


Bill already had his try. He was unable to accomplish anything permanent. Just pretentious photo ops.
He did his part, he didn't fail if that's what you suggest.  He was closer than everyone in history to fix this conflict.
Closer really counts in this situation? Well, I got closer to "almost peace" than anyone else.  Pfffft.
LOL. Neo-cons always with the absolutism. Clinton got the middle east process to 'within 5%' of an agreement. Bush administration are 100% away from one. GG.
2007-03-25 14:29:19
Stingray24
Proud member of the vast right-wing conspiracy
+1,060|6874|The Land of Scott Walker

CameronPoe wrote:

Stingray24 wrote:

sergeriver wrote:

He did his part, he didn't fail if that's what you suggest.  He was closer than everyone in history to fix this conflict.
Closer really counts in this situation? Well, I got closer to "almost peace" than anyone else.  Pfffft.
LOL. Neo-cons always with the absolutism. Clinton got the middle east process to 'within 5%' of an agreement. Bush administration are 100% away from one. GG.
Close to peace is still no peace.  Seems quite obvious it's absolute.  Dems and Reps FTL in this case.

Last edited by Stingray24 (2007-03-25 14:30:32)

2007-03-25 14:30:20
fadedsteve
GOP Sympathizer
+266|6919|Menlo Park, CA
First of all. . . . . .

Why do we (USA) keep sending Condi Rice to negotiate with a culture that views her (women in general) as inferior and servants to men?? Honestly, does anyone think Hamas/Egypt/Syria etc. give a fuck what she says, and take any of her threats seriously? 

Why not send a special envoy like Colin Powell etc. someone who is a man, has experience, and is an imposing character?

Bottom line is, not even Colin Powell could do a damn thing to fix that shitty situation they have going over there!! The mid east needs a massive full scale war to get shaped up unfortunatly. . . .

negotiations work for most problems around the world, they just dont in that part of it .  .  .

p.s. Bill Clinton put on "show" of peace, a photo op if you will, nothing more. . . .

Last edited by fadedsteve (2007-03-25 14:32:14)

2007-03-25 14:54:07
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7030|132 and Bush

CameronPoe wrote:

Stingray24 wrote:

sergeriver wrote:

He did his part, he didn't fail if that's what you suggest.  He was closer than everyone in history to fix this conflict.
Closer really counts in this situation? Well, I got closer to "almost peace" than anyone else.  Pfffft.
LOL. Neo-cons always with the absolutism. Clinton got the middle east process to 'within 5%' of an agreement. Bush administration are 100% away from one. GG.
I'm not saying this administration has accomplished anything near as much. War's, scandals, and hurricanes have been on their plate. But I think what Stingray is trying to say is if he had been successful we would not be debating this right now. The United States has differed from Israel in agreeing to meet with some members of the Palestinian government. I know this is nothing to have a parade over but it is a departure from the norm. A small step in the right direction is time well wasted in my book. Ultimately the US can only support the process. They should not be pressuring either side.

I do have a question though. If Bill Clinton was so close to a utopia in that region how is it that under his administration western hatred was allowed to build the point it did? We all know what happened next.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
2007-03-25 15:55:56
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6984

Kmarion wrote:

CameronPoe wrote:

Stingray24 wrote:


Closer really counts in this situation? Well, I got closer to "almost peace" than anyone else.  Pfffft.
LOL. Neo-cons always with the absolutism. Clinton got the middle east process to 'within 5%' of an agreement. Bush administration are 100% away from one. GG.
I'm not saying this administration has accomplished anything near as much. War's, scandals, and hurricanes have been on their plate. But I think what Stingray is trying to say is if he had been successful we would not be debating this right now. The United States has differed from Israel in agreeing to meet with some members of the Palestinian government. I know this is nothing to have a parade over but it is a departure from the norm. A small step in the right direction is time well wasted in my book. Ultimately the US can only support the process. They should not be pressuring either side.

I do have a question though. If Bill Clinton was so close to a utopia in that region how is it that under his administration western hatred was allowed to build the point it did? We all know what happened next.
Palestinian issue != Islamic fundamentalism

The fundamentalists use Palestine as a popular bandwagon.
2007-03-25 16:07:34
Kmar
Truth is my Bitch
+5,695|7030|132 and Bush

So am I to understand the the fundamentalist will not be satisfied with a complete and peaceful agreement between the two? You sound as if your are suggesting it is more religious than political for them. (tread carefully Cam, I think you see where I am going )
Xbone Stormsurgezz
2007-03-25 16:24:11
CameronPoe
Member
+2,925|6984

Kmarion wrote:

So am I to understand the the fundamentalist will not be satisfied with a complete and peaceful agreement between the two? You sound as if your are suggesting it is more religious than political for them. (tread carefully Cam, I think you see where I am going )
A significant proportion of Islamic fundamentalists that do not hail from Palestine care little for Palestinians. They wish to rid the entire middle east of western and Israeli influence - meaning Saudi Arabia and all the other US client states have to go, in their eyes. As such, fixing Palestine does not mean an end to Islamic fundamentalist terrorism.

 

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