So does the word black mean nothing?
No, it's a descriptor. So is Liberal.
No, it's a descriptor. So is Liberal.
Basically I'm saying a vote for a republican is a vote for a democrat. The are the same nest of snakes.Commie Killer wrote:
Ok thats something that is rather contradictory to what you normal would say. I thought you voted for the principles the man(or woman) had and his experience, etc, NOT his political affiliation, bad ATG.ATG wrote:
Turns out, he is. Thats why I will never vote for a Republican president as long as I live again.sergeriver wrote:
Dis-interest in international borders? Bush must be a liberal.
I lost whatever faith I had in the Republicans when I viewed Bushes non-discretionary spending. The reality is he has been better for the liberals cause than Clinton was. You vote for a conservative, you get a liberal spending asshole named Bush.
The proof that the Democrats really wanted bush to get reelected despite all their hot winded blatherings is the candidate they put up.
John Kerry?
They might as well have just cancelled the election. i felt the same way when the Republicans put up Bob Dole against Clinton; they had no intentions of winning. The two party system is a sham.
We live in a quasi-theocracy.
Those people holding power can only be displaced by sending them to the afterlife.
Two terms in elected office and your done, you have to go live under the laws you have helped enact. Thats the way our founding fathers wanted it, and the way it should be.
Until it is that way, we will spend money on freeways to nowhere, engage in ill-defined military adventures and continue to be the leper-pariah we have become.
I feel sad now having spoke the truth.
A Liberal is a hardcore Democrat. Similar to the way a conservative is a hardcore republican. I myself, am a conservative with a slight bit of liberatian in me (libertarian is NOT related to liberal but rather liberty. No connection with a liberal. they just sound alike) A libertarian believes there should be very little if any government, and if so, its for protection/security.
15 more years! 15 more years!
Not quite, the two term limit for the president didn't come about till after FDR died just after getting voted in for a 3rd term. He was the only president to be voted in for more than two terms. If I remember correctly the two term limit was mostly self imposed by each president who managed to get voted in for two terms, starting with Washington, he set the standard.ATG wrote:
Two terms in elected office and your done, you have to go live under the laws you have helped enact. Thats the way our founding fathers wanted it, and the way it should be.
I agree with you on our points about them having to live under the laws they enacted, but I just thought I'd clarify.
BTW, I'd love to start seeing term limits for senators and representatives.
"Liberal", is an extremely vague and, IMHO, meaningless title given to anyone who disagrees with any point, arguement, suggestion or explanation that a right wing, (mostly Republican) conservative gives.
For instance, I have been labeled a liberal here many times, although I am a registered Republican and the majority of my belief's are to the right of center, I am have been labeled "liberal" because I disagreed with a "neo-con".
It's basically an uneducated and poorly thought out title given by people who too blind to think for themselves or formulate a personal theory of thier own for any given situation, event or circumstance.
For instance, I have been labeled a liberal here many times, although I am a registered Republican and the majority of my belief's are to the right of center, I am have been labeled "liberal" because I disagreed with a "neo-con".
It's basically an uneducated and poorly thought out title given by people who too blind to think for themselves or formulate a personal theory of thier own for any given situation, event or circumstance.
I would say the same about the title " neo-con."
I never thought you'd see things the way I do... It's good to know you distrust the government to this degree. Too many Americans blindly follow its agendas....ATG wrote:
Basically I'm saying a vote for a republican is a vote for a democrat. The are the same nest of snakes.Commie Killer wrote:
Ok thats something that is rather contradictory to what you normal would say. I thought you voted for the principles the man(or woman) had and his experience, etc, NOT his political affiliation, bad ATG.ATG wrote:
Turns out, he is. Thats why I will never vote for a Republican president as long as I live again.
I lost whatever faith I had in the Republicans when I viewed Bushes non-discretionary spending. The reality is he has been better for the liberals cause than Clinton was. You vote for a conservative, you get a liberal spending asshole named Bush.
The proof that the Democrats really wanted bush to get reelected despite all their hot winded blatherings is the candidate they put up.
John Kerry?
They might as well have just cancelled the election. i felt the same way when the Republicans put up Bob Dole against Clinton; they had no intentions of winning. The two party system is a sham.
We live in a quasi-theocracy.
Those people holding power can only be displaced by sending them to the afterlife.
Two terms in elected office and your done, you have to go live under the laws you have helped enact. Thats the way our founding fathers wanted it, and the way it should be.
Until it is that way, we will spend money on freeways to nowhere, engage in ill-defined military adventures and continue to be the leper-pariah we have become.
I feel sad now having spoke the truth.
You can be a left-leaning Libertarian though. In certain ways, I fit this description....Dezerteagal5 wrote:
A Liberal is a hardcore Democrat. Similar to the way a conservative is a hardcore republican. I myself, am a conservative with a slight bit of liberatian in me (libertarian is NOT related to liberal but rather liberty. No connection with a liberal. they just sound alike) A libertarian believes there should be very little if any government, and if so, its for protection/security.
That pretty much sums it up.Cougar wrote:
"Liberal", is an extremely vague and, IMHO, meaningless title given to anyone who disagrees with any point, arguement, suggestion or explanation that a right wing, (mostly Republican) conservative gives.
For instance, I have been labeled a liberal here many times, although I am a registered Republican and the majority of my belief's are to the right of center, I am have been labeled "liberal" because I disagreed with a "neo-con".
It's basically an uneducated and poorly thought out title given by people who too blind to think for themselves or formulate a personal theory of thier own for any given situation, event or circumstance.
In these forums, if you're called a "liberal", it means that the person who you're debating with doesn't have anything else to come back with, so they resort to calling you names.
It's tight.
If i went around saying how I felt about the government the humorless guys in the back suits would show up.Turquoise wrote:
I never thought you'd see things the way I do... It's good to know you distrust the government to this degree. Too many Americans blindly follow its agendas....ATG wrote:
I feel sad now having spoke the truth.
Lets just say, I keep many of my most extreme opinions to myself.
Liberals & Conservatives are two sides of the same coin.
The only thing that will save this nation are ideas from "radicals for capitalism who fight for that philosophical base which capitalism did not have and without which it was doomed to perish."
The words in italics are taken from Capitalism : The Unknown Ideal by Ayn Rand.
The only thing that will save this nation are ideas from "radicals for capitalism who fight for that philosophical base which capitalism did not have and without which it was doomed to perish."
The words in italics are taken from Capitalism : The Unknown Ideal by Ayn Rand.
Last edited by TrollmeaT (2007-03-24 15:56:25)
You should see Switzerland...Turquoise wrote:
Liberal is much more moderate politically in America than it is in the U.K. I would guess that American liberalism would be considered the equivalent of British centrism. In some ways, Democrats would be seen as somewhat conservative by British standards.
As far as 1st World countries go, America is probably one of the most conservative ones.
But yeah, 'Liberal' is pretty much the label many Conservative give here if they don't agree with a persons views.
-konfusion
Switzerland is more conservative than the U.S.? How is that? Would you mind being more specific?Konfusion0 wrote:
You should see Switzerland...Turquoise wrote:
Liberal is much more moderate politically in America than it is in the U.K. I would guess that American liberalism would be considered the equivalent of British centrism. In some ways, Democrats would be seen as somewhat conservative by British standards.
As far as 1st World countries go, America is probably one of the most conservative ones.
But yeah, 'Liberal' is pretty much the label many Conservative give here if they don't agree with a persons views.
-konfusion
Well, since only people between 30 and 50 actually vote, we never really progress. Sure, we may be religiously liberal, but otherwise we're quite conservative. We want to preserve our individuality, we want to stay the way we were 700 years ago, we don't want to join the EU or NATO. We remain rigid like a rigid stone in the middle of a torrent.Turquoise wrote:
Switzerland is more conservative than the U.S.? How is that? Would you mind being more specific?
-konfusion
Oh... well, staying autonomous from the EU is not necessarily a bad thing. In fact, I support that despite being considered somewhat liberal.Konfusion0 wrote:
Well, since only people between 30 and 50 actually vote, we never really progress. Sure, we may be religiously liberal, but otherwise we're quite conservative. We want to preserve our individuality, we want to stay the way we were 700 years ago, we don't want to join the EU or NATO. We remain rigid like a rigid stone in the middle of a torrent.Turquoise wrote:
Switzerland is more conservative than the U.S.? How is that? Would you mind being more specific?
-konfusion
In America, there are certain political persuasions that run perpendicular to the liberal and conservative spectrum. One of them is the axis between federalism and anti-federalism. Anti-federalism is often referred to as the "states' rights" ideology. Those of us who favor this position (like myself) are advocates of decentralizing government down to state and local levels as much as possible. Likewise, we are totally against things like NAFTA and any EU-style continental governments. We believe the bigger government gets, the more corrupt it is. This is similar to the ideology of Libertarians.
So yeah, Switzerland's resistance to joining the EU wouldn't necessarily be a conservative viewpoint in American eyes. Although, many conservatives would support it. Then again, so would many liberals.
Individuality is, likewise, neither liberal nor conservative, but it can have traits involving both sides.
Liberals feel the govt. should provide all the necessities of life and that everyone should be equal and void of any personal responsibility for themselves and their choices. Achievement and hard work are not rewarded in a liberal world. Individuality must not be allowed. All of this so we do not take the risk of someone having something they earned, without sharing it with someone who didn't.
Liberals are not interested in earning anything for themselves, they are only interested in sharing what you have earned, with them.
Other than that I love them.
Liberals are not interested in earning anything for themselves, they are only interested in sharing what you have earned, with them.
Other than that I love them.
Last edited by lowing (2007-03-24 17:42:35)
The parties back then were quite different than they are now. The term Republican does not mean the same thing...DesertFox423 wrote:
Those damn liberals freed our slaves! Led by that Black Republican Lincoln!
Interesting thought I had though- Liberals are traditionally at least somewhat for reform, correct? I wonder how far you can go before you betray your own reforms to something else. Liberal and conservative views leapfrog depending on what your take of the status quo is.
Not true at all. If liberals were like that, they would be communists. That is just BS right there, lowing.lowing wrote:
Achievement and hard work are not rewarded in a liberal world.
A more accurate description of liberal beliefs is that "We're all in the same boat together, so we might as well help those who are drowning rather than letting them fend for themselves"
But whatever.
Actually, technically in a Communist world hard work would be rewarded more accurately, as initial ability would be taken into account.
Absolute nonsense.lowing wrote:
Achievement and hard work are not rewarded in a liberal world.
How do you know that? Sweden and Norway are some of the top developed countries, with some of the most successful people in the world, ridiculously high GDP(PPP)'s and so on - and they run systems which are decidedly liberal.lowing wrote:
Liberals feel the govt. should provide all the necessities of life and that everyone should be equal and void of any personal responsibility for themselves and their choices. Achievement and hard work are not rewarded in a liberal world. Individuality must not be allowed. All of this so we do not take the risk of someone having something they earned, without sharing it with someone who didn't.
Liberals are not interested in earning anything for themselves, they are only interested in sharing what you have earned, with them.
Other than that I love them.
The paradox is only a conflict between reality and your feeling what reality ought to be.
~ Richard Feynman
~ Richard Feynman
What do you mean, "If they were like that, they would be communists"?? That is exactly what they are!Spearhead wrote:
Not true at all. If liberals were like that, they would be communists. That is just BS right there, lowing.lowing wrote:
Achievement and hard work are not rewarded in a liberal world.
A more accurate description of liberal beliefs is that "We're all in the same boat together, so we might as well help those who are drowning rather than letting them fend for themselves"
But whatever.
Last edited by lowing (2007-03-26 14:13:36)
Oh well, I guess my post is non-sense because you said so, and not because you can offer any examples to the contrary. Good rebuttalBraddock wrote:
Absolute nonsense.lowing wrote:
Achievement and hard work are not rewarded in a liberal world.
Last edited by lowing (2007-03-26 14:16:37)
And their taxes areeeeeeeeeee.................????????Spark wrote:
How do you know that? Sweden and Norway are some of the top developed countries, with some of the most successful people in the world, ridiculously high GDP(PPP)'s and so on - and they run systems which are decidedly liberal.lowing wrote:
Liberals feel the govt. should provide all the necessities of life and that everyone should be equal and void of any personal responsibility for themselves and their choices. Achievement and hard work are not rewarded in a liberal world. Individuality must not be allowed. All of this so we do not take the risk of someone having something they earned, without sharing it with someone who didn't.
Liberals are not interested in earning anything for themselves, they are only interested in sharing what you have earned, with them.
Other than that I love them.
There's a great quote about that, from a visiting British diplomat in the early 20th century to the US. I can't find it, but it more or less goes:Turquoise wrote:
Liberal is much more moderate politically in America than it is in the U.K. I would guess that American liberalism would be considered the equivalent of British centrism. In some ways, Democrats would be seen as somewhat conservative by British standards.
As far as 1st World countries go, America is probably one of the most conservative ones.
"US politics are very similar to that of the UK, except for that they have two political parties. The first is the Republican Party, who are much like our Conservative Party. The second is the Democratic Party, who are much like our Conservative Party."
I found it quite funny anyway...