Sci-fi: Israel decides to pull out of the occupied territories. What do you think would happen?
Poll
What Would Happen if Israel Decided to Pull Out of Palestine?
| There would be Peace | 16% | 16% - 9 | ||||
| Palestine would attack Israel anyway | 54% | 54% - 29 | ||||
| Israel would wipe Palestine off the World | 3% | 3% - 2 | ||||
| Which one did you smoke? | 11% | 11% - 6 | ||||
| Other | 13% | 13% - 7 | ||||
| Total: 53 | ||||||
Israel continues to be attacked, Israel continues to react. I think that "occupied territory" is any land in the Middle East.
At this point I don't see it making any difference. The radicals want Israel gone, and they don't ask permission from the government to attack Israel.
Other: These tiresome and done-to-death threads would stop showing up every 30 seconds.
If Isreal pulled out of Palestine, then Palestine would statistically have a less chance of getting pregnant.
Malloy must go
Unfortunately to me it seems it's not so much the place that is hated rather than the people. So my opinion is nothing would change. Jews would continue to be blamed for the failed Muslim civilization. Muslims rarely look to themselves for accountability in anything. Just think logically for a minute. How can a few million Jews outperform 1.3 billion Muslims? Let that sink in for a bit.
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It's clearly a buttsecks scene, deez. Not much chance of pregnancy, pulling out or not.deeznutz1245 wrote:
If Isreal pulled out of Palestine, then Palestine would statistically have a less chance of getting pregnant.
Yes. There is no hope for a society that continues to base itself on the concept of revenge.Kmarion wrote:
Unfortunately to me it seems it's not so much the place that is hated rather than the people. So my opinion is nothing would change. Jews would continue to be blamed for the failed Muslim civilization. Muslims rarely look to themselves for accountability in anything. Just think logically for a minute. How can a few million Jews outperform 1.3 billion Muslims? Let that sink in for a bit.
QFTFancy_Pollux wrote:
Yes. There is no hope for a society that continues to base itself on the concept of revenge.Kmarion wrote:
Unfortunately to me it seems it's not so much the place that is hated rather than the people. So my opinion is nothing would change. Jews would continue to be blamed for the failed Muslim civilization. Muslims rarely look to themselves for accountability in anything. Just think logically for a minute. How can a few million Jews outperform 1.3 billion Muslims? Let that sink in for a bit.
Nothing. As long as israel and palestine, syria, the lebanon, and everything else around there still exist, there will be rampant anti-semitism. The only way to stop it is to completely wipe out one side down to the last man, woman, and child.
So until Israel gets really pissed or they get nuked, we will have arguments.
It's like asking brits to apologise to the French, the Russians to stop shouting at Japan, or North and South Korea to reunify. Never gonna happen.
Perhaps Israel should change their borders to a nice uniform shape, carve it out the bedrock, and head for orbit, tossing everyone unlikeable off the edge on the way up.
So until Israel gets really pissed or they get nuked, we will have arguments.
It's like asking brits to apologise to the French, the Russians to stop shouting at Japan, or North and South Korea to reunify. Never gonna happen.
Perhaps Israel should change their borders to a nice uniform shape, carve it out the bedrock, and head for orbit, tossing everyone unlikeable off the edge on the way up.
Kmarion wrote:
How can a few million Jews outperform 1.3 billion Muslims? Let that sink in for a bit.
Economist wrote:
Since 1973, Israel has cost the United States about $1.6 trillion. If divided by today's population, that is more than $5,700 per person.
There are always going to be a group of radical Palestinians who will not rest until Israel is destroyed. The only hope for peace is if the Palestinian government can divorce itself from the militias and stop the once and for all. Once the terrorist attacks cease in Israel, then negotiations can begin on a Palestinian state.
Lol , it takes much more than cash to run a society. Besides thats pennies compared to the amount of oil money Israel's Muslim neighbors has raked in since 1973.JahManRed wrote:
Kmarion wrote:
How can a few million Jews outperform 1.3 billion Muslims? Let that sink in for a bit.Economist wrote:
Since 1973, Israel has cost the United States about $1.6 trillion. If divided by today's population, that is more than $5,700 per person.
Last edited by Kmarion (2007-02-14 14:22:45)
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I voted other. If Israel were to leave, then fighting between Hamas and Fatah would resume.
I vote FUCK THEM BOTH!
If Israel pulled out of Palestine the whole country would drown in the ocean.
Jews are not blamed for the failed Muslim civilization for two reasons: 1. the Muslims do not consider their civilization as a failure (and why would they?) and 2. Supposing that I never mentioned reason 1, what the hell do Jews have to do with Muslim civilization?Kmarion wrote:
Unfortunately to me it seems it's not so much the place that is hated rather than the people. So my opinion is nothing would change. Jews would continue to be blamed for the failed Muslim civilization.
Actually what you said there is (in my opinion) indicative of the distorted view of the whole matter many people have, primarily due to the Israeli propaganda machine. First off, you assume that Muslims have failed in some way that us westerners have not, naturally basing your argument on mere cultural differences between the two sides which in no way constitute neither failure or success. Then you assume that they blame that failure on the Jews, which is a concept I have never before come across in all the years I've been interested in the problems of the Middle East.
Please don't take this as a mockery, I'm really interested to see where you base your argument.
On the OP, they would all live happily ever after
Last edited by oug (2007-02-14 17:04:32)
ƒ³
Maybe it's more accurate to say that Jews would continue to be blamed for whatever goes wrong anywhere Jews are.oug wrote:
Jews are not blamed for the failed Muslim civilization for two reasons: 1. the Muslims do not consider their civilization as a failure (and why would they?) and 2. Supposing that I never mentioned reason 1, what the hell do Jews have to do with Muslim civilization?Kmarion wrote:
Unfortunately to me it seems it's not so much the place that is hated rather than the people. So my opinion is nothing would change. Jews would continue to be blamed for the failed Muslim civilization.
Actually what you said there is (in my opinion) indicative of the distorted view of the whole matter many people have, primarily due to the Israeli propaganda machine. First off, you assume that Muslims have failed in some way that us westerners have not, naturally basing your argument on mere cultural differences between the two sides which in no way constitute neither failure or success. Then you assume that they blame that failure on the Jews, which is a concept I have never before come across in all the years I've been interested in the problems of the Middle East.
Please don't take this as a mockery, I'm really interested to see where you base your argument.
On the OP, they would all live happily ever after
Which, BTW is way less than was spent Liberating Kuwait from Iraq, in less than 1 years time.JahManRed wrote:
Kmarion wrote:
How can a few million Jews outperform 1.3 billion Muslims? Let that sink in for a bit.Economist wrote:
Since 1973, Israel has cost the United States about $1.6 trillion. If divided by today's population, that is more than $5,700 per person.
One of the shared values of all Islamic extremists is the destruction of the state of Israel. If Israel pulled out of the occupied territories, it would be seen as weakness to these extremists and they would pounce. I'm not saying all muslims are like that, I'm not even arguing that the Koran reads that way. That's just one of the things Islamic extremists stand for.
Well, looking back on their history, I can't argue with that... but I can guess that the Palestinians in particular would be very pleased to see them go... so much so that they wouldn't bother with them again...san4 wrote:
Maybe it's more accurate to say that Jews would continue to be blamed for whatever goes wrong anywhere Jews are.
The difference being that in this case its the Israelis who have the upper hand... unlike all other instances in their history where they were the outsiders sort of...
Last edited by oug (2007-02-14 17:56:20)
ƒ³
What do the Jews have to do with a failed civilization? Nothing but you don't need a reason to allocate blame you see. That is not the mentality of someone who has failed repeatedly and is trying to divert attention from themselves.oug wrote:
Jews are not blamed for the failed Muslim civilization for two reasons: 1. the Muslims do not consider their civilization as a failure (and why would they?) and 2. Supposing that I never mentioned reason 1, what the hell do Jews have to do with Muslim civilization?Kmarion wrote:
Unfortunately to me it seems it's not so much the place that is hated rather than the people. So my opinion is nothing would change. Jews would continue to be blamed for the failed Muslim civilization.
Actually what you said there is (in my opinion) indicative of the distorted view of the whole matter many people have, primarily due to the Israeli propaganda machine. First off, you assume that Muslims have failed in some way that us westerners have not, naturally basing your argument on mere cultural differences between the two sides which in no way constitute neither failure or success. Then you assume that they blame that failure on the Jews, which is a concept I have never before come across in all the years I've been interested in the problems of the Middle East.
Please don't take this as a mockery, I'm really interested to see where you base your argument.
On the OP, they would all live happily ever after
Now let me help you to understand why their civilization has failed.
Freedom and and human rights are superior to oppression. The culture of the middle east is decayed, dysfunctional, and unable to compete in the modern world. Can you imagine where they would be with out oil? They only want excuses for the the inadequacy of their social, political, and economic regimes. None of it's values like religious intolerance, economic blood ties, and the subjugation of women work anymore. Arab civilization has backed itself into a corner. It's humiliating to them and they are looking for someone to blame.
Comforting lies are humanity's favorite narcotic.
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I think that's why Israel was created in the first place.oug wrote:
The difference being that in this case its the Israelis who have the upper hand... unlike all other instances in their history where they were the outsiders sort of...
That's a value judgment. I wholeheartedly agree with it, but reasonable people can disagree with it if they have different values. Is "compet[ing] in the modern world" more important than obeying god's commands? I am personally repulsed by some of god's alleged commands (e.g., the subjugation of women), but, seen in their best light, even some of today's corrupt Muslim societies could conceivably be considered successes on their own terms. I have to admit I don't know enough about any Muslim society to evaluate them on their own terms, but I don't think Muslim societies evaluate themselves in terms of our values.Kmarion wrote:
Freedom and and human rights are superior to oppression. The culture of the middle east is decayed, dysfunctional, and unable to compete in the modern world. Can you imagine where they would be with out oil?
Muslim nutjobs would still blow up a coffee house.
There is much despair in the Muslim world right now. In terms of their values they are struggling, even amongst each other. I am not just talking about West/Arab conflicts. I am talking about the internal ones as well.san4 wrote:
I think that's why Israel was created in the first place.oug wrote:
The difference being that in this case its the Israelis who have the upper hand... unlike all other instances in their history where they were the outsiders sort of...That's a value judgment. I wholeheartedly agree with it, but reasonable people can disagree with it if they have different values. Is "compet[ing] in the modern world" more important than obeying god's commands? I am personally repulsed by some of god's alleged commands (e.g., the subjugation of women), but, seen in their best light, even some of today's corrupt Muslim societies could conceivably be considered successes on their own terms. I have to admit I don't know enough about any Muslim society to evaluate them on their own terms, but I don't think Muslim societies evaluate themselves in terms of our values.Kmarion wrote:
Now let me help you to understand why their civilization has failed.
Freedom and and human rights are superior to oppression. The culture of the middle east is decayed, dysfunctional, and unable to compete in the modern world. Can you imagine where they would be with out oil? They only want excuses for the the inadequacy of their social, political, and economic regimes. None of it's values like religious intolerance, economic blood ties, and the subjugation of women work anymore. Arab civilization has backed itself into a corner. It's humiliating to them and they are looking for someone to blame.
Comforting lies are humanity's favorite narcotic.
PS: Will Jordan and Eygpt also give back the land seized from the Palestinians after the war?
Last edited by Kmarion (2007-02-14 19:06:50)
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