im kinda surprised that nobody went on an anti-gun tirade yet... you know what im still confused by, why do these people go and kill people who have nothing to do with them? if its from work related stress, then why doesnt he go kill his co-workers? strange strange people in the world today
That's an interesting point. I guess the lack of logic in going on a rampage in the first place doesn't lend itself to rationally selecting victims.krazed wrote:
im kinda surprised that nobody went on an anti-gun tirade yet... you know what im still confused by, why do these people go and kill people who have nothing to do with them? if its from work related stress, then why doesnt he go kill his co-workers? strange strange people in the world today
On the other hand, what I've read on this Utah mall killer is that he killed mostly people inside one particular store in the mall. Maybe he used to work there....
http://www.edicionnacional.com/edicion/ … culo/21084sergeriver wrote:
Armed Man Kills 5 at Mall in Utah
This episode and the one in Philadelphia, took the lives of 8 people.
Why do these shootings happen so often in the US? Would they happen without the Right to Bear Arms? Is it safe a civilian carrying a gun? I'm asking, not making a judgement. I want to know your opinion about these cases, because they happen frequently.
Do these happen frequently? Because it's amazing how people ignore their problems so often in favor of heaping verbal dung on the US and our rights. Not saying you are, in this instance, but still...
(my Spanish is sloppy, so correct me if it's just an article about Big Macs and heart attacks)
1. You say there's no difference between shooting and bombing, then say we should be glad shooting occurs rather than bombing.silo1180 wrote:
True these shootings seem to be happening a lot in the US, but is it any different than a suicide bomber detonating himself in a market, or the recent incident in Iran?
http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/02/ … index.html
IMO... we Americans should probably be glad these people shooting others here in the US are too stupid/lazy to figure out how to build bombs.
2. Sad is the day when an American compares his country to Iran in an attempt to defend its reputation. And not all of us are lazy, as TV networks would lead many to believe.
Truly scary people would pass without difficulty. They're called sociopaths.Tompie913 wrote:
They need to have psychology tests for people to have concealed weapons
We could be blaming the horse, if it weren't for the car! Death to horses!nem420hunter wrote:
I blame the guns and the fucked up way of thinking / living....but hey...that´s just me
ya and when there are so many drunk drivers killing people ... i blame the car!
Last edited by unnamednewbie13 (2007-02-14 17:03:58)
Nah not explosives. Scary amount of stabbings in this country. In fact there's a thread in the D&ST about a 14 year old who was stabbed recently simply for arguing with a woman he didn't know.Turquoise wrote:
Good points... Being an actual citizen of the U.K., you obviously know more about this than me, but I have to ask.... Despite how violent and bad these hooligans can be, do they usually kill anyone or use explosives in their mayhem? This is a serious question, and I'm honestly not being flippant.crimson_grunt wrote:
Not true in the slightest. I've seen more CCTV footage of football hooligans, binge drinkers beating the shit out of each other purely cause its the weekend or armys of teenage yobs who take over their neighbourhoods and destroy everything in their site.
I've seen what I've just described on tv tonnes more times time than I've seen any angry radicals. Try to find any of this footage online tho and it's bloody impossible.
I can imagine why people say you should fear terrorists more but they take a while to plan attacks and the police are doing a damn fine job at the moment catching these guys. However very little is done about estates where hooligans rule. In many cases the home owners are having to try and gather their own evidence of abuse and violence from these neighbours before anything is done. And of course the thugs know this is happening and so make peoples life hell for years.
A year or 2 ago in my town a teen walked up to a mother in the street and for no reason punched her 10 month year old baby in the head.
To be perfectly honest I think I'm more likely to die at the hand of yobs than terrorists.
They need to have psychology tests for people to have concealed weapons
Statistically, you're probably correct. I'm always reluctant to suggest a more aggressive state, but maybe your law enforcement isn't being aggressive enough. Maybe a little less focus on terrorists and a little more on felons or soon-to-be felons would help things some.crimson_grunt wrote:
Nah not explosives. Scary amount of stabbings in this country. In fact there's a thread in the D&ST about a 14 year old who was stabbed recently simply for arguing with a woman he didn't know.Turquoise wrote:
Good points... Being an actual citizen of the U.K., you obviously know more about this than me, but I have to ask.... Despite how violent and bad these hooligans can be, do they usually kill anyone or use explosives in their mayhem? This is a serious question, and I'm honestly not being flippant.crimson_grunt wrote:
Not true in the slightest. I've seen more CCTV footage of football hooligans, binge drinkers beating the shit out of each other purely cause its the weekend or armys of teenage yobs who take over their neighbourhoods and destroy everything in their site.
I've seen what I've just described on tv tonnes more times time than I've seen any angry radicals. Try to find any of this footage online tho and it's bloody impossible.
I can imagine why people say you should fear terrorists more but they take a while to plan attacks and the police are doing a damn fine job at the moment catching these guys. However very little is done about estates where hooligans rule. In many cases the home owners are having to try and gather their own evidence of abuse and violence from these neighbours before anything is done. And of course the thugs know this is happening and so make peoples life hell for years.
A year or 2 ago in my town a teen walked up to a mother in the street and for no reason punched her 10 month year old baby in the head.
To be perfectly honest I think I'm more likely to die at the hand of yobs than terrorists.
Again, this is a topic where my knowledge is limited, but it sounds like a sad state of affairs... In America, we have similar cases spread throughout the country, but the crimes usually involve guns instead of knives.
I guess it shows that guns or weapons in general aren't the problem -- it's human nature.
Last edited by Turquoise (2007-02-14 16:49:16)
cause people are crazy in the mind.
Most states that offer concealed permits do a background check. I'm not aware of any true psychological tests for permits, but assumedly, if the person has done no violent crimes, he/she isn't usually a threat.Tompie913 wrote:
They need to have psychology tests for people to have concealed weapons
Sulejmen Talovic is the exception, not the rule.
Taking away firearms wouldnt change too much. Yes it would reduce the amount of murders because its easier to shoot someone than to stab them, but it will still happen, ie. Japan. Not to mention its unfair to say its an American thing. Look at Ireland before the ceasefire, look at the majority of the countries in Africa, look at SE Asia.
Id rather be shot then knifed. I have had both happen to me, same place, 2 years. Anyways thats a really shitty argument but....dont forget to compare crime rates and the population sizes.doctastrangelove1964 wrote:
But still less total crime.Fancy_Pollux wrote:
Lower gun crime = higher knife crime. Keep that in mind.
Yeah we have various things like ASBO's (Anti Social behaviour Orders) which feel more like a stop gap thing to me. The idea is if someone has a load of complaints (abusive behaviour, stealing, etc) they give them this order that says they are banned from the streets where they caused the trouble and arent allowed to hang around with certain people.Turquoise wrote:
Statistically, you're probably correct. I'm always reluctant to suggest a more aggressive state, but maybe your law enforcement isn't being aggressive enough. Maybe a little less focus on terrorists and a little more on felons or soon-to-be felons would help things some.
Again, this is a topic where my knowledge is limited, but it sounds like a sad state of affairs... In America, we have similar cases spread throughout the country, but the crimes usually involve guns instead of knives.
I guess it shows that guns or weapons aren't the problem -- it's human nature.
Simple truth is our prisons are full to the brim, and there's still a huge number of people on the outside with no regard for human life and no intention of contributing to society. I think the police do a good job but get sick of seeing judges let people of with minuscule sentences.
In the last few years in the town where i live scheme has been operating to to strip criminals of stuff gained illegally (houses, cars etc) and put it back in the public fund. Its a good start and has claimed back millions but i don't think it's enough. For most of tony blairs stint he's ignored the uk crime and mainly focused on foreign policies.
Last edited by crimson_grunt (2007-02-14 16:59:40)
I blame the guns and the fucked up way of thinking / living....but hey...that´s just me
ya and when there are so many drunk drivers killing people ... i blame the car!
ya and when there are so many drunk drivers killing people ... i blame the car!
It`s just a funny theory of mine.Turquoise wrote:
I see what you're saying, but if that was the real reason, then London would have rampages all the time.Fredrik wrote:
Because you have to many rules, to many security guards, to much Police and Government involvement in general. A lot of people need to feel free, like they can do and say what they want without being watched and controlled all the time, and if they dont: snap
London has more cameras per square mile than any other place on Earth. THAT'S Big Brother right there.
Yet, the only people who typically rampage over there are Islamists.
I agree that it is a lot more complex than this, but i do believe that this is a part of it. Also security cams are one thing, but take a trip to The UK and see for yourself: They have the most welcoming atmosfare and friendly people you can imagine, hell even The Policemen over there are nice!
There are parts of America that are the same, but yeah, I need to visit the U.K. some day -- and Norway for that matter...Fredrik wrote:
It`s just a funny theory of mine.Turquoise wrote:
I see what you're saying, but if that was the real reason, then London would have rampages all the time.Fredrik wrote:
Because you have to many rules, to many security guards, to much Police and Government involvement in general. A lot of people need to feel free, like they can do and say what they want without being watched and controlled all the time, and if they dont: snap
London has more cameras per square mile than any other place on Earth. THAT'S Big Brother right there.
Yet, the only people who typically rampage over there are Islamists.
I agree that it is a lot more complex than this, but i do believe that this is a part of it. Also security cams are one thing, but take a trip to The UK and see for yourself: They have the most welcoming atmosfare and friendly people you can imagine, hell even The Policemen over there are nice!
Fancy_Pollux wrote:
Rap music.
mmhmm, goldie lookin chains says so.
- Superior Mind
- (not macbeth)
- +1,755|6982
To OP: Why did I see two small children trying to sell me a bare leafed plant in front of a hotel where this plant grew wildly, while in Argentina?
Last edited by Superior Mind (2007-02-14 17:43:28)
two words to describe this:
Human Nature
or
four words:
"Man's inhumanity to man"
(look at my sig )
Human Nature
or
four words:
"Man's inhumanity to man"
(look at my sig )
Last edited by The_Mob_Returns (2007-02-14 17:42:27)
I call it efficiency.topal63 wrote:
Put the "work" back into murder... guns are for lazy people.
The Utah shooting was performed by an 18 year old Bosnian Refugee...
Do you recon a suitable punishment after getting like 3 asbos would be to lose British Citizenship and be removed from the country? Just pondering that after you brought up asbos and their total ineffectiveness.crimson_grunt wrote:
Yeah we have various things like ASBO's (Anti Social behaviour Orders) which feel more like a stop gap thing to me. The idea is if someone has a load of complaints (abusive behaviour, stealing, etc) they give them this order that says they are banned from the streets where they caused the trouble and arent allowed to hang around with certain people.Turquoise wrote:
Statistically, you're probably correct. I'm always reluctant to suggest a more aggressive state, but maybe your law enforcement isn't being aggressive enough. Maybe a little less focus on terrorists and a little more on felons or soon-to-be felons would help things some.
Again, this is a topic where my knowledge is limited, but it sounds like a sad state of affairs... In America, we have similar cases spread throughout the country, but the crimes usually involve guns instead of knives.
I guess it shows that guns or weapons aren't the problem -- it's human nature.
Simple truth is our prisons are full to the brim, and there's still a huge number of people on the outside with no regard for human life and no intention of contributing to society. I think the police do a good job but get sick of seeing judges let people of with minuscule sentences.
In the last few years in the town where i live scheme has been operating to to strip criminals of stuff gained illegally (houses, cars etc) and put it back in the public fund. Its a good start and has claimed back millions but i don't think it's enough. For most of tony blairs stint he's ignored the uk crime and mainly focused on foreign policies.
Might be good but I don't think any other country would accept our chavs. I think ASBO's were a good start we just need stronger punishments. Right now Chavs see ASBO's like trophies.Vilham wrote:
Do you recon a suitable punishment after getting like 3 asbos would be to lose British Citizenship and be removed from the country? Just pondering that after you brought up asbos and their total ineffectiveness.
How about the old chain gang thing where groups of young offenders are forced to do unpaid hard labour. Give them an idea of what it's like to earn a living.
Hard labor for repeat offenders - but our liberal "friends" would scream bloody murder - and our judges and magistrates would bloody well let the f&^%$ers go free anyway - poor dears are victims you know (black potty or some such crap).
I don't know if they are 50 or 51, but read it. Perhaps you can find an argument there.Pug wrote:
So is that a complete list? That's like 50 shootings since 1996 worldwide. Plus there has been exactly 50? Not like 51 or 49 or 47 or something...a nice round 50?sergeriver wrote:
A Time Line of Recent Worldwide School Shootings
This is a report about school shootings around the World. I know the SL City episode was in a mall, but look at the stats. They mention 50 shootings, and 90% happened in the US.
I posted the chance of getting shot in the US. You posted a list of 50 incidents worldwide...which is not a complete list. Is there an argument in there?
I remember that case, the guy killed his gf and then shot himself. He knew the victim. This is different. A guy coming into a mall and killing unknown people.unnamednewbie13 wrote:
http://www.edicionnacional.com/edicion/ … culo/21084sergeriver wrote:
Armed Man Kills 5 at Mall in Utah
This episode and the one in Philadelphia, took the lives of 8 people.
Why do these shootings happen so often in the US? Would they happen without the Right to Bear Arms? Is it safe a civilian carrying a gun? I'm asking, not making a judgement. I want to know your opinion about these cases, because they happen frequently.
Do these happen frequently? Because it's amazing how people ignore their problems so often in favor of heaping verbal dung on the US and our rights. Not saying you are, in this instance, but still...
(my Spanish is sloppy, so correct me if it's just an article about Big Macs and heart attacks)1. You say there's no difference between shooting and bombing, then say we should be glad shooting occurs rather than bombing.silo1180 wrote:
True these shootings seem to be happening a lot in the US, but is it any different than a suicide bomber detonating himself in a market, or the recent incident in Iran?
http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/02/ … index.html
IMO... we Americans should probably be glad these people shooting others here in the US are too stupid/lazy to figure out how to build bombs.
2. Sad is the day when an American compares his country to Iran in an attempt to defend its reputation. And not all of us are lazy, as TV networks would lead many to believe.Truly scary people would pass without difficulty. They're called sociopaths.Tompie913 wrote:
They need to have psychology tests for people to have concealed weaponsWe could be blaming the horse, if it weren't for the car! Death to horses!nem420hunter wrote:
I blame the guns and the fucked up way of thinking / living....but hey...that´s just me
ya and when there are so many drunk drivers killing people ... i blame the car!
Your point?Superior Mind wrote:
To OP: Why did I see two small children trying to sell me a bare leafed plant in front of a hotel where this plant grew wildly, while in Argentina?