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Poll

Should us Brits have the right to own all types of Guns like the USA

YES - without any controls apart from a simple licence14%14% - 27
YES - But only for people aged 25 or over plus licence14%14% - 27
YES - as above - but NO handguns/pistols1%1% - 2
YES - but NO machine guns9%9% - 17
NO - Ban the lot including farmers shotguns3%3% - 6
NO - keep the law as it is19%19% - 35
NO - Plus stricter laws in Europe13%13% - 24
USA - should have stricter gun laws10%10% - 19
USA - Gun laws fine as thay are8%8% - 16
USA - to ban all privately owned guns5%5% - 10
Total: 183
2007-02-11 06:10:12
Vilham
Say wat!?
+580|6775|UK

lowing wrote:

PureFodder wrote:

lowing wrote:


But it is on the rise right? So your crime stats go up and down like everyone else's? and this makes England special how??
What makes England so special is that gun crime is so low in the first place. Even with a small increase in gun crime it's still way lower than, say the US for example. Can't imagine why.
maybe it is the 300,000,000 people in the US not counting the 20,000,000 criminals that pour over our borders with 500,000 more criminals arriving each year to the 60,000,000 people in the UK.

Or maybe it is because the UK is about the size of 1 of our states.

Or maybe it is because the UK has every square inch of their major cities covered with surveillance cameras so the govt. can watch every little move you make and when you make it. I know  Villam can't like that, he hates that we have terrorists and suspected terrorists under surveillance without letting everyone know, let alone every swinging dick in the city. http://www.notbored.org/england-history.html

maybe it is because yo are so over crowded that you don't have room to raise your arm and actually shoot a gun.
Do you have a knife problem?
LOWING!!!

RATES IGNORE POPULATION. YOUR ARGUMENT IS SHIT. OUR RATES ARE 6x LOWER FOR HOMICIDE AND PROBABLY GUN RELATED CRIME IS A RATE OF 10x LOWER.

Sorry for caps people but it seems somethings dont get into Lowings head very easily. He is 20+ and still doesnt understand rates.
2007-02-11 06:12:51
Vilham
Say wat!?
+580|6775|UK
Lowing. YOU LOSE. Get some sleep. Stop arguing a point that has no relevance. Our gun related crime is 0.04% of all our crime. YOU LOSE.
2007-02-11 06:14:27
usmarine2007
Banned
+374|6376|Columbus, Ohio

Vilham wrote:

Lowing. YOU LOSE. Get some sleep. Stop arguing a point that has no relevance. Our gun related crime is 0.04% of all our crime. YOU LOSE.
Nice double post.

/fail
2007-02-11 06:18:39
Vilham
Say wat!?
+580|6775|UK

usmarine2007 wrote:

Vilham wrote:

Lowing. YOU LOSE. Get some sleep. Stop arguing a point that has no relevance. Our gun related crime is 0.04% of all our crime. YOU LOSE.
Nice double post.

/fail
It was a purpose double post. My first post was relating to a single post he made, my second was to all of his posts.

/fail
2007-02-11 06:22:39
BallisticallyYours
Member
+23|6640|Chicago, IL

Volatile_Squirrel wrote:

From what I have read on these forums, you apparently have a knife problem now. There will always be a replacement for what has been taken away, so I say- give the people their rights to bust caps again!!

usmarine2007 wrote:

US citizen cannot own ALL types of guns.
You can in a class 3 state, like here in Arizona.
Yes but class 3 states who give citizens class 3 gun licenses.. open that citizen up for unwarranted search and seizures. The Feds got your name and number.

No matter what you take from the law abiding people of a country... the criminals will still get it and use it... bans seem a little hipocritical to me. Treat the innocent as if their guilty...

If the Brits give up their arms... there can be no revolution to over throw if anything an oppressive government...
Guns are tools, only weapons to those who use them with ill intent. I own guns, and never dreamed of targeting another human, but give up my right to protect my family.. rather not.

Last edited by BallisticallyYours (2007-02-11 06:33:52)

2007-02-11 06:30:52
crimson_grunt
Shitty Disposition (apparently)
+214|6663|Teesside, UK

lowing wrote:

I haven't said a word as to what anyone needs to do in their countries. I made an observation to the irony that in the US we are "being stripped of our freedom" by constant survaillance against suspected terrorists, and in the UK the same people support "big brother" recording their every move. Seems alittle incinsistant is all. I have no problem with anyone disagreeing with me, as a matter of fact, those are the people that I want to hear from. Just don't get pissed off if you can not convince me you are right. By the way, of course I think I am right, or why would I argue it. Do most people on here argue points they think are wrong?

If you have a knife problem then you have the same underlying problem the US has........criminals. guns really isn't the issue then is it? Or is it fair to say the US is more angelic because we don't have a knife problem compared to England? If all of a sudden criminals start using baseball bats, are you prepared to outlaw them as well? Where exactly do you draw the line from govt. control and holding individuals responsibile for their own actions, without punishing the masses?

The people that are making false calls are criminals, trat them as such I would say
I guess its that the US and UK was pushed CCTV for different reasons.  CCTV has been useful with terror acts but we were mostly already using to them as the UK has a fucking scary amount of binge drinkers and thats what the main focus of the CCTV was for.  I guess we've had more chance to get used to it and just ignored it .

I don't believe that America is any more angelic than us i think every country has probably the same level of decency and scum.  I'm just happy that the scum over here have less chance of getting dangerous weaponry than else were.

Actually I've heard that it is possible for the police to stop you if you are carry a baseball bat.  The police tried to arrest some guy for burglary with a baseball bat then realized he was climbing in to someones garden to get his ball back

Yeah the guys making the false calls are criminals but the problem is often its an army of 20 - 30 teens who set an ambush, they need to start sending in the armed response units on those fuckers but it's mostly kids and I bet that would cause outrage with all the dead beat parents in this country.  Probably the same kind of sick fuckers who throw paving slabs off motorway bridges at cars.  I truly believe that if people of this kind of mentally can easily get hold of guns then I'm packing up an emigrating.
2007-02-11 06:32:37
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6660|USA

Vilham wrote:

Lowing. YOU LOSE. Get some sleep. Stop arguing a point that has no relevance. Our gun related crime is 0.04% of all our crime. YOU LOSE.
What exactly did I "lose"? I don't give a shit if the UK outlaws rubber-bands because someone may hit someone in the eye with it. I don't live there.

You are constantly aggressive in your posts, and you have on several occasions insinuated that Americans are afraid and paranoid and that this is the reason why we want our second amendment rights to bear arms. If anyone is wrong in this discussion it is you.

But please, keep being agitated and aggressive toward me and my posts. I love the entertainment.
2007-02-11 06:33:42
ShowMeTheMonkey
Member
+125|6711

Smitty5613 wrote:

(i havent read all the posts, so sorry if anything i say has been said before) US citizens should be able to own any guns that they want, its the 2nd ammendment in the constitution..... i think the UK should allow guns too........ i heard that since they banned guns there, the crime rate has doubled, can anyone from UK tell me if thats true?
That is completely wrong. Whoever told you that is an idiot.
2007-02-11 06:36:58
Vilham
Say wat!?
+580|6775|UK

lowing wrote:

Vilham wrote:

Lowing. YOU LOSE. Get some sleep. Stop arguing a point that has no relevance. Our gun related crime is 0.04% of all our crime. YOU LOSE.
What exactly did I "lose"? I don't give a shit if the UK outlaws rubber-bands because someone may hit someone in the eye with it. I don't live there.

You are constantly aggressive in your posts, and you have on several occasions insinuated that Americans are afraid and paranoid and that this is the reason why we want our second amendment rights to bear arms. If anyone is wrong in this discussion it is you.

But please, keep being agitated and aggressive toward me and my posts. I love the entertainment.
lol great come back, not even relevant to the topic on discussion. I have only made that insinuation on Americans that think they are safer with guns when infact the stats show the opposite, you might want to actually go back and read that other long post on gun ownership.

But then again no matter what is true or better you wont change your opinion, because lowing is always right (btw you aren't actually right your just big headed).

Question but how can i be aggressive over the internet? What is an insult now "aggressive" so when im joking with my mates insults flying we are being "aggressive"?

Last edited by Vilham (2007-02-11 06:39:14)

2007-02-11 06:37:43
BallisticallyYours
Member
+23|6640|Chicago, IL

lowing wrote:

Vilham wrote:

Lowing. YOU LOSE. Get some sleep. Stop arguing a point that has no relevance. Our gun related crime is 0.04% of all our crime. YOU LOSE.
What exactly did I "lose"? I don't give a shit if the UK outlaws rubber-bands because someone may hit someone in the eye with it. I don't live there.

You are constantly aggressive in your posts, and you have on several occasions insinuated that Americans are afraid and paranoid and that this is the reason why we want our second amendment rights to bear arms. If anyone is wrong in this discussion it is you.

But please, keep being agitated and aggressive toward me and my posts. I love the entertainment.
Agreed... much aggression... tisk tisk.
2007-02-11 06:39:03
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6660|USA

crimson_grunt wrote:

lowing wrote:

I haven't said a word as to what anyone needs to do in their countries. I made an observation to the irony that in the US we are "being stripped of our freedom" by constant survaillance against suspected terrorists, and in the UK the same people support "big brother" recording their every move. Seems alittle inconsistent is all. I have no problem with anyone disagreeing with me, as a matter of fact, those are the people that I want to hear from. Just don't get pissed off if you can not convince me you are right. By the way, of course I think I am right, or why would I argue it. Do most people on here argue points they think are wrong?

If you have a knife problem then you have the same underlying problem the US has........criminals. guns really isn't the issue then is it? Or is it fair to say the US is more angelic because we don't have a knife problem compared to England? If all of a sudden criminals start using baseball bats, are you prepared to outlaw them as well? Where exactly do you draw the line from govt. control and holding individuals responsible for their own actions, without punishing the masses?

The people that are making false calls are criminals, treat them as such I would say
I guess its that the US and UK was pushed CCTV for different reasons.  CCTV has been useful with terror acts but we were mostly already using to them as the UK has a fucking scary amount of binge drinkers and thats what the main focus of the CCTV was for.  I guess we've had more chance to get used to it and just ignored it .

I don't believe that America is any more angelic than us i think every country has probably the same level of decency and scum.  I'm just happy that the scum over here have less chance of getting dangerous weaponry than else were.

Actually I've heard that it is possible for the police to stop you if you are carry a baseball bat.  The police tried to arrest some guy for burglary with a baseball bat then realized he was climbing in to someones garden to get his ball back

Yeah the guys making the false calls are criminals but the problem is often its an army of 20 - 30 teens who set an ambush, they need to start sending in the armed response units on those fuckers but it's mostly kids and I bet that would cause outrage with all the dead beat parents in this country.  Probably the same kind of sick fuckers who throw paving slabs off motorway bridges at cars.  I truly believe that if people of this kind of mentally can easily get hold of guns then I'm packing up an emigrating.
good post!,

but now that I asked in the previous post, I think I really would like to know where do you draw the line at govt control and legislation over our lives, and actually enforcing existing laws to take care of the irresponsible people in the world, instead of blanket punishing the masses.
2007-02-11 06:39:35
Vilham
Say wat!?
+580|6775|UK
0.04%... lowing
2007-02-11 06:47:10
ShowMeTheMonkey
Member
+125|6711
So far I'm thinking that Lowing hasn't been to the UK. Which is fine, but don't claim to know our country and our crime by reading "The Sun", "The Mirror" and "The Independant". Their stories are very sensationalist and not very accurate.

The same goes for me, I don't think I have said anything about the US social society as I have never been there and haven't a clue to what it is like. The only similar country I can draw parallels to is South Africa as I used to live there. There guns were WAY out of control. And it really was scary.

In the UK majority of crime is done late at night by TEENAGERS this is due to they feel safe to be out this late. Maybe this has something to do with the lack of guns I don't know. But in South Africa you will never ever ever see anybody outside after 10:00pm because the amount of guns is just too damn prominant.

This is about firearm ownage. Not CCTV.
2007-02-11 06:47:34
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6660|USA

Vilham wrote:

lowing wrote:

Vilham wrote:

Lowing. YOU LOSE. Get some sleep. Stop arguing a point that has no relevance. Our gun related crime is 0.04% of all our crime. YOU LOSE.
What exactly did I "lose"? I don't give a shit if the UK outlaws rubber-bands because someone may hit someone in the eye with it. I don't live there.

You are constantly aggressive in your posts, and you have on several occasions insinuated that Americans are afraid and paranoid and that this is the reason why we want our second amendment rights to bear arms. If anyone is wrong in this discussion it is you.

But please, keep being agitated and aggressive toward me and my posts. I love the entertainment.
lol great come back, not even relevant to the topic on discussion. I have only made that insinuation on Americans that think they are safer with guns when infact the stats show the opposite, you might want to actually go back and read that other long post on gun ownership.

But then again no matter what is true or better you wont change your opinion, because lowing is always right (btw you aren't actually right your just big headed).

Question but how can i be aggressive over the internet? What is an insult now "aggressive" so when im joking with my mates insults flying we are being "aggressive"?
Actually what I posted wasn't supposed to be relevant to the thread, just to your specific post.

Your posts toward me are agressive and agitated, please don't take that as me caring though. You have posted more personal attacks on me than any other poster I can think of. No worries though, I love it.
2007-02-11 06:53:09
lowing
Banned
+1,662|6660|USA

ShowMeTheMonkey wrote:

So far I'm thinking that Lowing hasn't been to the UK. Which is fine, but don't claim to know our country and our crime by reading "The Sun", "The Mirror" and "The Independant". Their stories are very sensationalist and not very accurate.

The same goes for me, I don't think I have said anything about the US social society as I have never been there and haven't a clue to what it is like. The only similar country I can draw parallels to is South Africa as I used to live there. There guns were WAY out of control. And it really was scary.

In the UK majority of crime is done late at night by TEENAGERS this is due to they feel safe to be out this late. Maybe this has something to do with the lack of guns I don't know. But in South Africa you will never ever ever see anybody outside after 10:00pm because the amount of guns is just too damn prominant.

This is about firearm ownage. Not CCTV.
Yer right never been to the UK, I suspect though, when I go, I won't be invited to Villam's house.

I made the connection to your CCTV and small crime because everyone knows "big brother" is watching. A concept not well recieved in the US. We are pissed off that there are cameras in our stop lights to photo people running red lights. So you can imagine how we are going to feel if the govt. is watching and tracking every citizen in every city.
2007-02-11 07:00:03
ShowMeTheMonkey
Member
+125|6711
Well. Soooooooooort of they are. Though it's mostly just to track muggings and stuff. It doesn't make me feel any safer and I don't really care about being video taped going to the shops to get some milk. It's not really a prevention. It sometimes catches the culprits and can also act as a deturence.
2007-02-11 07:22:07
Vilham
Say wat!?
+580|6775|UK

lowing wrote:

Vilham wrote:

lowing wrote:


What exactly did I "lose"? I don't give a shit if the UK outlaws rubber-bands because someone may hit someone in the eye with it. I don't live there.

You are constantly aggressive in your posts, and you have on several occasions insinuated that Americans are afraid and paranoid and that this is the reason why we want our second amendment rights to bear arms. If anyone is wrong in this discussion it is you.

But please, keep being agitated and aggressive toward me and my posts. I love the entertainment.
lol great come back, not even relevant to the topic on discussion. I have only made that insinuation on Americans that think they are safer with guns when infact the stats show the opposite, you might want to actually go back and read that other long post on gun ownership.

But then again no matter what is true or better you wont change your opinion, because lowing is always right (btw you aren't actually right your just big headed).

Question but how can i be aggressive over the internet? What is an insult now "aggressive" so when im joking with my mates insults flying we are being "aggressive"?
Actually what I posted wasn't supposed to be relevant to the thread, just to your specific post.

Your posts toward me are agressive and agitated, please don't take that as me caring though. You have posted more personal attacks on me than any other poster I can think of. No worries though, I love it.
lol so telling you that you are losing the argument is now considered a personal attack? You are more pussy than i thought (Now that is called a personal attack!).
2007-02-11 07:29:34
Vilham
Say wat!?
+580|6775|UK

lowing wrote:

ShowMeTheMonkey wrote:

So far I'm thinking that Lowing hasn't been to the UK. Which is fine, but don't claim to know our country and our crime by reading "The Sun", "The Mirror" and "The Independant". Their stories are very sensationalist and not very accurate.

The same goes for me, I don't think I have said anything about the US social society as I have never been there and haven't a clue to what it is like. The only similar country I can draw parallels to is South Africa as I used to live there. There guns were WAY out of control. And it really was scary.

In the UK majority of crime is done late at night by TEENAGERS this is due to they feel safe to be out this late. Maybe this has something to do with the lack of guns I don't know. But in South Africa you will never ever ever see anybody outside after 10:00pm because the amount of guns is just too damn prominant.

This is about firearm ownage. Not CCTV.
Yer right never been to the UK, I suspect though, when I go, I won't be invited to Villam's house.

I made the connection to your CCTV and small crime because everyone knows "big brother" is watching. A concept not well recieved in the US. We are pissed off that there are cameras in our stop lights to photo people running red lights. So you can imagine how we are going to feel if the govt. is watching and tracking every citizen in every city.
I think you are confusing two issues. Our crime isnt that low, mostly because lots of things are crimes and we have chavs who like breaking the law, however guns are involved in 0.04% of all crimes I think most Brits want to keep it that way. You arent even a Brit so why are you even debating something that doesnt effect you? I stopped debating in the American gun laws thread for that exact reason it didnt involve me.
2007-02-11 07:31:06
usmarine2007
Banned
+374|6376|Columbus, Ohio

Vilham wrote:

You arent even a Brit so why are you even debating something that doesnt effect you?
Tell that to the rest of this forum.
2007-02-11 07:35:51
Vilham
Say wat!?
+580|6775|UK

usmarine2007 wrote:

Vilham wrote:

You arent even a Brit so why are you even debating something that doesnt effect you?
Tell that to the rest of this forum.
Your personal laws dont effect anyone else, i stay out of those posts however your foreign policy does effect others, to even deny that is pure ignorance.
2007-02-11 07:36:48
commissargizz
Member
+123|6472| Heaven

lowing wrote:

maybe it is because yo are so over crowded that you don't have room to raise your arm and actually shoot a gun.

lowing wrote:

I don't give a shit if the UK outlaws rubber-bands because someone may hit someone in the eye with it
ROFL that's so fuuunnnnyyy, nice one. I'm so tempted to give you karma for both those remarks. And I think I will.

This is turning into a Lowing v UK thread. hehehehehehe

Guns are bad, guns are in bad peoples hands will do bad things, for me ban them. To Lowing I will agree to disagree our cultures are so different.

But I will agree with him, our country is turning into a police state. Cameras everywhere, speed cameras, bugs in our bins, councilors that can enter our houses to see if we have done nice things to our house, biometric ID cards etc. Health and Safety gone made. The latest is spy on all motorists with satellites, WTF is next, chips in the back of the head soon. Watch out for the thought police. I may immigrate to Iraq, more freedom there (joke)
2007-02-11 07:37:28
usmarine2007
Banned
+374|6376|Columbus, Ohio

Vilham wrote:

usmarine2007 wrote:

Vilham wrote:

You arent even a Brit so why are you even debating something that doesnt effect you?
Tell that to the rest of this forum.
Your personal laws dont effect anyone else, i stay out of those posts however your foreign policy does effect others, to even deny that is pure ignorance.
People talk about immigration in the US...how does that affect them?

You know what I mean and you understand my point.
2007-02-11 07:38:47
commissargizz
Member
+123|6472| Heaven
It doesn't matter if our criminals have a gun or not, our courts will let them out because we have no more in our prisons.
2007-02-11 07:39:51
usmarine2007
Banned
+374|6376|Columbus, Ohio
You guys need guns so you could have shot the spice girls.
2007-02-11 07:41:44
Vilham
Say wat!?
+580|6775|UK

commissargizz wrote:

It doesn't matter if our criminals have a gun or not, our courts will let them out because we have no more in our prisons.
That is due to poor judgements in the 80s and 90s, people shouldnt be sent to jail for minor crimes but given community service.

 

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