BF2S Forums How responsible is the US for winning WWII?

spray_and_pray wrote:

arabeater wrote:

commissargizz wrote:

I still do not believe that  The British Empire (remember we are not talking about just the UK but Canada, Australia, New Zealand, South Africa, Nepal, India etc.) would have negotiated a peace. As you rightly pointed out the Empire had a vastly superior air force and a huge Navy. So why negotiate when the German land forces couldn't touch us? Yet with air superiority we could have run riot in the air. A stalemate but no peace.

I would also like those that think the Americans did all the work, just look at the forces massed for the D-Day landings.

Battleships Six battleships took part: three British and three US:
Cruisers Twenty-three cruisers (17 British and Commonwealth, 3 US, 2 Free French and 1 Polish)
Destroyers & escorts 135 ships (eighty-five British and Dominion, 39 US, 7 Free French and 7 other Allied):
Other warships 508 ships (352 British, 154 US and 2 other Allied):


In total, 47 divisions would be committed to the Battle of Normandy: 19 British, 5 Canadian and 1 Polish divisions under overall British command, and 21 American divisions with 1 Free French division, totaling 140,000 troops.

Now please tell me after you look at the facts that if the other allies were not fighting along side the US do you honestly think that the US would have won this operation on it's own.

If you want I can provide information for almost all the major battles fought during the war. I will give to the Americans they did win the Pacific sea war. I do not know the exact composition but I think about 90% of the forces there were American.

I think the Germans wouldve finally realized that the Brits were never gonna be able to invade Europe by themselves, and in such case Germany wouldve started to make an Air Force that would challenge the Brits for air superiority over England. Remember Germany did have jet fighter aircraft and if they couldve mass produced them and had ample time to train the pilots, they wouldve been able to beat England. England had alot of pilots that were very well trained with good planes. Germany had alot of pilots that were'nt as good with awseome planes. Basically what i'm saying is it all came down to quality of the pilots in which case England had. Germany, by far had better planes but not enough well trained men to fly them.

As far as the D-day landings, yea England supplied most of the vessels for the battle but i'm sure the US sold them alot of those (correct me if i'm wrong). Not to mention almost half of the invading forces were American.
Does your 140,000 factor in the Airborne guys? We had kinda of a large part in that too along with the Brits.
Not saying that the US couldve pulled the D-day landings on their own but you cant honestly tell me that the Brits wouldve been able to invade and liberate Europe by themselves either.

Another thing is that during the Battle of the Bulge pretty much if not all of the forces defending against the German offensive were American. Ummm...the US helped end the war in North Africa and Italy much sooner than England wouldve been able to do by themselves. I'm not saying that England couldnt have done it without US help but creating a second front from the West  in Africa certainly helped the Brits in defeating Rommel quicker.

As far as the war in the Pacific goes, it was pretty much an all US war with the exception of some Aussie units and a couple Brits as well.

The brits had dehavviland comets or aircraft of the sort and the US was working on the P80 while Germany had Me262's air supperiority is just the air you might be able to keep down the armour etc but troops can hide  everywhere. Even though "AS" is very important you cant win a war over just that. This can be argued with the use of nukes but that is still an in effective way to fight a war.

"Its funny watching a bunch of 9th graders fight over the same topic again and again" QFT

Maybe some of the older people should help me to help educate these people. So they have correct facts and a small amount of background knowledge.

cyborg_ninja-117 wrote:

sfarrar33 wrote:

small point, but you say 'save Europe' from nazi occupation, but it was 'save the world'
The nazi's were in Africa and were trying to push east into Russia and probably then continue into Asia.
America did play a crucial role but so did Britain and France (yes even France) and Russia and China etc

IMHO the main point that looses the US its claim is that they clearly did not put all the effort they claimed to into winning the war
I mean just look up IBM and the holocaust for a start

China didn't do much. Civil war going on where the nationalist fucks were fighting the commies while the commies actually fought against the Japanese.

sfarrar33 wrote:

OpsChief wrote:

adam1503 wrote:

Take note people: that is how to answer a thread constructively.  Maybe you are right, without American help, we might not have won.  But who knows?  Personally, I think it might have taken us longer, but we would have got there eventualy.  My opinion.

And yeah, youre right,  I cant really expect to get this cleared up ever lol.

That kinda makes sense. But actually I can clear it up.



Can anyone show a predominance of current bonafide documents from an official US Government source(s) wherein the US claims sole responsibility for VE Day? or WWII in its entirety?

No?

OK then - it's cleared up.  In the absence of any credible source speaking to the contrary I can safely assert "THE ALLIES WON!!!"  no more nonsense please.

*pimpslap*
no the US government does not state that anywhere
but this threads on about the US people

sfarrar33 wrote:

OpsChief wrote:

sfarrar33 wrote:

*pimpslap*
no the US government does not state that anywhere
but this threads on about the US people

looks with curiosity at farrar slapping empty air

the Offer still goes with or without US Gov't backing - who talked to the "American People" and documented them in saying they won WWII? Any recognized sources? Any scientifically documented sources? Anyone over the age of 18?

lol  someone asked a question at the beginning of this thread and based it on a fallacy and here is this intense debate that follows...I am one of those "American People" who has been around several decades and I have never heard anyone seriously say "the US won WWII by itself". I do however remember people born and raised in other countries saying that "Amercians believe it" (this thread for ex) on more than one occasion so my question now is "Why do people in other countries think the 'American People' believe the US won WWII on its own?"

there was a fly there
true I havn't lived in the US at all
but i have met and talked to more than a few american people and a few of them have said it
I did think of something, noone might have documented it but who actually asked "so what won the war in your opinion?"

Last edited by OpsChief (2006-12-21 14:05:52)

Mackaronen wrote:

arabeater wrote:

Mackaronen wrote:

Oh! The topic that never gonna get old. I belive that the war probably would have ended the same as it did without the americans aid. But it would not been resolved so quick as it did.  But i am very gratefull to the american soldiers who fought i WW2, they saved the world from many years of suffering.  But i am a bit pissed of with them for not taking on the Soviet union in the moment of weakness just after taking europe.

Oh i'm sorry that the big bad US didnt take care of them for you. As if helping defeat the Nazis wasnt enough for you. This is exactly my point of Europe only calling us allies whenever they need military help. I do agree that we shouldve pushed the Soviets back to their own border at least though instead of letting them have all of Eastern Europe.

I was trying to be ironic, no need to be upset. As i said, i am very grateful to all the American and Canadian soldiers who put their ass on the line for us.  I am sorry you did not see the irony, and I'm sorry you think i was bashing the US. Because that was not the idea.

OpsChief wrote:

Farrar,

Two US teachers said the US won WWII by itself??? What were their names? I'm gonna make sure they are teaching Kindergarten next semster where they can't do any harm.

My kid came home from High School last week and said her Geography teacher stated "Japan was stupid to start a war with the US in WWII because we had the atomic bomb" !!!!!!   I guess they slip through the cracks now and then.

Keep making conversation we are all the better for it (hopefully you set those people straight on WWII)

Last edited by sfarrar33 (2006-12-22 08:55:31)

CyrusTheVirus wrote:

What ingratitude. Next time you're whining out in desperation for our help you can go fuck yourselves.

Last edited by SoC./Omega (2006-12-22 16:42:47)

arabeater wrote:

You sound like you a 9th grader. I could barely read that shit.

adam1503 wrote:

Okay, so this is a pretty big question.  A lot of Americans seem to believe that their country was solely responsible for saving Europe from Nazi occupation during WWII.  They claim to have single-handedly won the war and to have saved everyone.

On the other hand, many Europeans (infact, most of the rest of the world) believe that America didn't play as crucial a role as they lay claim to.  America joined the war more than half-way through, and only after they were bombed at Pearl Harbour.  They also were responsible for introducing the fission bomb to the world, and for using two on Japan.

Is it just me, or are many Americans full of crap?  How can they claim to have won the war and to have saved Europe from the Nazis?  Who liberated much of mainland Europe from Nazi occupation? Who was able to fend off the Nazi war machine from invasion during the Blitz years?

We should clear this up once and for all: the US cannot claim to have saved Europe from the Nazis.  The US did not win the war alone.

(EDIT: I wanted to add a poll here, but there doesn't seem to be an option for it...)

[zulu]steviep831 wrote:

adam1503 wrote:

Okay, so this is a pretty big question.  A lot of Americans seem to believe that their country was solely responsible for saving Europe from Nazi occupation during WWII.  They claim to have single-handedly won the war and to have saved everyone.

On the other hand, many Europeans (infact, most of the rest of the world) believe that America didn't play as crucial a role as they lay claim to.  America joined the war more than half-way through, and only after they were bombed at Pearl Harbour.  They also were responsible for introducing the fission bomb to the world, and for using two on Japan.

Is it just me, or are many Americans full of crap?  How can they claim to have won the war and to have saved Europe from the Nazis?  Who liberated much of mainland Europe from Nazi occupation? Who was able to fend off the Nazi war machine from invasion during the Blitz years?

We should clear this up once and for all: the US cannot claim to have saved Europe from the Nazis.  The US did not win the war alone.

(EDIT: I wanted to add a poll here, but there doesn't seem to be an option for it...)

How about doing a little research on your own before asking a retarded question like that. It's commonly believed that the Germans could have overtaken most of Western Europe... Really they only had Great Britain left as any sort of threat to their dominance. Hitler was literally on the other side of the English Channel ready to invade.

In your opening thread, you state that "A lot of Americans seem to believe that their country was solely responsible for saving Europe from Nazi occupation during WWII.  They claim to have single-handedly won the war and to have saved everyone." Well I don't know who you are talking to, but I can't think of one historian that would say such a phrase. It's pretty well known that the Germans were close to developing their own atomic bomb and were poised to take much of Europe even though they were stretched pretty thin. Some say they were just months away from completing a bomb. WWII had many fronts, but in many of the important fronts... the Pacific and in Europe, if it hadn't been for the US, the map would look a lot different today. The US tipped the bucket in the other direction.