Yes they fough like the Irish did to end the oppression of there people and like us they had to agree to terms neither the Irish or Scots wanted just to get some type of Home rule....There in a position now to end the rule of a forgein nation and go there own way....give them back there land and see how they get on....and I'm sure if they need help the Irish will be there waiting to lend a hand !
Poll
Should Scotland become an independent republic?
| Freeeeeeeeeeedddddoooooommmm!! | 54% | 54% - 31 | ||||
| No | 31% | 31% - 18 | ||||
| It depends (explain..) | 14% | 14% - 8 | ||||
| Total: 57 | ||||||
The fact that you're playing the race card here, and I'm finding it hard to type I'm laughing so much, shows you've plain run out of ideas. Calling us English racists for a bit of piss taking is doing you no favours.CameronPoe wrote:
You went to college? Surprising.
I don't have anything against British people. I do, on the other hand, have something against British people like you. Didn't you get perm-banned for racism once (hence the '-II')?
If I were British I certainly wouldn't be proud of the whole empire thing. Trading off the misery of others all across the globe for the benefit of aristocrats and the landed classes.
*I'm crying here*
Thats another thing, why is it that the Scots, Welsh, and Irish share a common dislike for England ( not necessarily the people but how the nation is percieved as a whole ) It is best exemplified by the the English football commentaterie : they are arrogant, insular, ignorant small minded tossers. It is this attitude that does England most damage in the UK
It doesnt matter if north sea oil is on scottish territory it is already owned by private orgainisations.Ess wrote:
bertster - your view is just pish,
England has an inferiority complex because as the UK fragments, it has no real cultural identity and simply confuses British with English. You have done exactly that by your stupid "we subsidise Scotland" comment.
As far as I know England doesnt subsidise anyone. What you mean is that the BRITISH government funds Scotland, which is a part of Britain. So it cant be a subsidy if its an integral part of Britain, can it ?
You would also do well to remember that the first British king was Scottish - so we actually absorbed your country in 1603 and regretted it ever since
North Sea Oil ? - payed for the recession, so we subsidised your dumb Morris dancing fannies
We know that we are a wee diddy country, but England just cant accept that - let me quote you a small piece of Welsh which best illustrates it
TOMMY
Doesn't it make you proud to be Scottish?
RENTON
I hate being Scottish. We're the lowest of the fucking low, the scum of the earth, the most wretched, servile, miserable, pathetic trash that was ever shat into civilization. Some people hate the English, but I don't. They're just wankers. We, on the other hand, are colonized by wankers. We can't even pick a decent culture to be colonized by. We are ruled by effete arseholes. It's a shite state of affairs and all the fresh air in the world will not make any fucking difference.
Just accept it , Britain is not England, The Empire is long gone : we will get a far better deal from Europe than from Britain so I would gladly sever all ties with our southern brethren
LASTLY : West Lothian question ? - still not solved
England does financially subsidise the whole of the UK it has 10% of the population and like 30%-40% of all the wealth, so basically your talking shit.
However I think Camerons facts here are bollocks. Ive never heard a single scottish person wanting independance. I know a lot of them.
Last edited by Vilham (2006-12-14 05:13:47)
I don't think Cam is calling the guy a racist, I think he is calling his credibility as a learned thinker into question citing his previous banning for racist comments as proof. I personally don't think the two necessarily go hand in hand as a persons intellect doesn't necessary reflect his political views.RicardoBlanco wrote:
The fact that you're playing the race card here, and I'm finding it hard to type I'm laughing so much, shows you've plain run out of ideas. Calling us English racists for a bit of piss taking is doing you no favours.CameronPoe wrote:
You went to college? Surprising.
I don't have anything against British people. I do, on the other hand, have something against British people like you. Didn't you get perm-banned for racism once (hence the '-II')?
If I were British I certainly wouldn't be proud of the whole empire thing. Trading off the misery of others all across the globe for the benefit of aristocrats and the landed classes.
*I'm crying here*
I can't say that as a Briton I am particularly proud of the countries heritage of being a empire building nation but there are way too many people in here judging a whole nation by the views of a few, and then getting all annoyed when someone else does the same to them.
The fact is your country is still 10x poorer than the UK. Thus doesnt realy have the wealth to properly invest in anything.CameronPoe wrote:
You'll be laughing on the other side of your face when you have to pay to import power from them! Celts are made of sterner stuff than you give them credit for. When we drove ye out noone would have expected that we'd grow to become one of the best performing economies in Europe, with the highest quality of life and lowest unemployment rate in the EU.James-M-II wrote:
i agree. let scotland leave, see how far they get. its worth a laugh no?Bertster7 wrote:
If they want. Same as Northern Ireland.
England subsidises the rest of the UK anyway, we'd be better off financially without them.
I really don't see what all the fuss is about. It's not like the Scots are being brutally oppressed and they end up with more money being pumped into Scotland than they would have otherwise.
And that's where you're wrong. Try reading the Economist magazine or other financial/political publications or visiting the fucking place and you'll see that we are a lot better off. The only place the UK beats us is on infrastructure. But then again the Irish navvy built your infrastructure for you.Vilham wrote:
The fact is your country is still 10x poorer than the UK. Thus doesnt realy have the wealth to properly invest in anything.CameronPoe wrote:
You'll be laughing on the other side of your face when you have to pay to import power from them! Celts are made of sterner stuff than you give them credit for. When we drove ye out noone would have expected that we'd grow to become one of the best performing economies in Europe, with the highest quality of life and lowest unemployment rate in the EU.James-M-II wrote:
i agree. let scotland leave, see how far they get. its worth a laugh no?
Last edited by CameronPoe (2006-12-14 05:23:10)
Cameron I dont think you quite understand that because of Europe controlling Empires the world is as developed as it is today. You cant understand why the development of human kind is a good thing because Ireland has never contributed to that. Now don't go listing scientists who did this that and the other, you didnt take this technology and give to the rest of the world did you?CameronPoe wrote:
You went to college? Surprising.James-M-II wrote:
fair and balanced my arse mate, your just like a girl i knew once at college, always thought she was right.CameronPoe wrote:
Most exciting thing? Driving you out!!!! The empire is dead sunny jim, delusions of grandeur FTW! You can't even efficiently massacre the people of a country anymore like you used to (Iraq/Afghanistan).
One could say the Irish empire lies in the 40 million Irish Americans in existence today.
I don't have anything against British people. I do, on the other hand, have something against British people like you. Didn't you get perm-banned for racism once (hence the '-II')?
If I were British I certainly wouldn't be proud of the whole empire thing. Trading off the misery of others all across the globe for the benefit of aristocrats and the landed classes.
Im proud in everyway of our ancestors controlling half the world and then giving those countries their own independance. If we are so blood thirsty as you claim we wouldn't have backed down from ireland in 1923 we would have fucking massacred you.
Yes, I can finally say....
FFFFRRRRRRRRRRREEEEEEEEEDDDDDDDOOOOOOOOMMMMMMMMM!!!!11!! EMO!!!
FFFFRRRRRRRRRRREEEEEEEEEDDDDDDDOOOOOOOOMMMMMMMMM!!!!11!! EMO!!!
What has us being poorer than you got to do anything to do with it ???? and we or they wouldnt have to invest in anything there's enough businesses and nations willing to invest in us out thereVilham wrote:
The fact is your country is still 10x poorer than the UK. Thus doesnt realy have the wealth to properly invest in anything.CameronPoe wrote:
You'll be laughing on the other side of your face when you have to pay to import power from them! Celts are made of sterner stuff than you give them credit for. When we drove ye out noone would have expected that we'd grow to become one of the best performing economies in Europe, with the highest quality of life and lowest unemployment rate in the EU.James-M-II wrote:
i agree. let scotland leave, see how far they get. its worth a laugh no?
I called James-M a racist - NOT all English people. Learn to read. He got perm-banned for insulting various races in another thread - it kind of calls into question his credibility, as DoctorFruitLoop said.RicardoBlanco wrote:
The fact that you're playing the race card here, and I'm finding it hard to type I'm laughing so much, shows you've plain run out of ideas. Calling us English racists for a bit of piss taking is doing you no favours.CameronPoe wrote:
You went to college? Surprising.
I don't have anything against British people. I do, on the other hand, have something against British people like you. Didn't you get perm-banned for racism once (hence the '-II')?
If I were British I certainly wouldn't be proud of the whole empire thing. Trading off the misery of others all across the globe for the benefit of aristocrats and the landed classes.
*I'm crying here*
After and well beyond 1923 the English goverment was still massacring Irish nationals all over Ireland...have a look at the report out last month about the English collusion with Loyalist terrorists.....and then come back to meVilham wrote:
Cameron I dont think you quite understand that because of Europe controlling Empires the world is as developed as it is today. You cant understand why the development of human kind is a good thing because Ireland has never contributed to that. Now don't go listing scientists who did this that and the other, you didnt take this technology and give to the rest of the world did you?CameronPoe wrote:
You went to college? Surprising.James-M-II wrote:
fair and balanced my arse mate, your just like a girl i knew once at college, always thought she was right.
I don't have anything against British people. I do, on the other hand, have something against British people like you. Didn't you get perm-banned for racism once (hence the '-II')?
If I were British I certainly wouldn't be proud of the whole empire thing. Trading off the misery of others all across the globe for the benefit of aristocrats and the landed classes.
Im proud in everyway of our ancestors controlling half the world and then giving those countries their own independance. If we are so blood thirsty as you claim we wouldn't have backed down from ireland in 1923 we would have fucking massacred you.
Last edited by JonnyNuemonic (2006-12-14 05:25:33)
I'm not the historian that many here purport to be, but I'm willing to bet that a lot of the countries that we "gave" their independence back to (let's not forget they were independent to start with), weren't just sitting around living it up and enjoying imperial rule. I daresay that a lot of countries were granted independence because they were in a position to revolt.
*sigh*aardfrith wrote:
Should Scotland become an independent republic?
I have two ways of looking at this - from an English perspective and from a reasonable person's view.
English: Hell no. We need their oil and gas. Maybe let them go in 20 years time, when it runs out.
Reasonable person: If they want out and vote for it, we have to let them go. We can't do what Russia did with Chechnya, can we? They had natural resources and that's the only reason Russia didn't want them to gain independence.
It's not your oil. It's under the jurisdiction of the UK Government, under which you fall. Scotland is also an industrial desert so fuck knows what, or where, exactly you'd be getting all your money from, I'm guessing Tourism.
Errmmm, Aardfrith is from Yorkshire!RicardoBlanco wrote:
*sigh*aardfrith wrote:
Should Scotland become an independent republic?
I have two ways of looking at this - from an English perspective and from a reasonable person's view.
English: Hell no. We need their oil and gas. Maybe let them go in 20 years time, when it runs out.
Reasonable person: If they want out and vote for it, we have to let them go. We can't do what Russia did with Chechnya, can we? They had natural resources and that's the only reason Russia didn't want them to gain independence.
It's not your oil. It's under the jurisdiction of the UK Government, under which you fall. Scotland is also an industrial desert so fuck knows what, or where, exactly you'd be getting all your money from, I'm guessing Tourism.
If exploitation and pillaging represents 'development' then thanks but no thanks to development. It's a mindset I simply cannot condone. I do realise that the modern western world is built on the very pillars of empire building of which you speak but I certainly don't think that's anything to be proud of, whether it be the exploits of the British, French, Belgian, Spanish or Portugeuse empires. Contribution shmontribution. You have to balance contribution with the amount of pain and suffering caused - which puts Britain, France, Belgium, Spain and Portugal firmly in the negative.Vilham wrote:
Cameron I dont think you quite understand that because of Europe controlling Empires the world is as developed as it is today. You cant understand why the development of human kind is a good thing because Ireland has never contributed to that. Now don't go listing scientists who did this that and the other, you didnt take this technology and give to the rest of the world did you?
Im proud in everyway of our ancestors controlling half the world and then giving those countries their own independance. If we are so blood thirsty as you claim we wouldn't have backed down from ireland in 1923 we would have fucking massacred you.
Your understanding of Irish history is quite funny. The Brits got sick of constantly and gradually losing men over here and having to deal with civil disobedience that they couldn't handle it anymore. It's like in India, Rhodesia, Ireland, Pakistan, Palestine, you name it. We and they all WON their freedom. They weren't handed it like some sort of gift. They shed blood and fought hard to make it unfeasible for the Brits to remain. You're damn right too - you would have had to massacre every last one of us because if you didn't there'd still be men out there ready to shoot the nearest English soldier in the back of the head.
LOL. 'Giving' independence. Patronisorama!
Last edited by CameronPoe (2006-12-14 05:38:45)
I dont think you got my point.JonnyNuemonic wrote:
After and well beyond 1923 the English goverment was still massacring Irish nationals all over Ireland...have a look at the report out last month about the English collusion with Loyalist terrorists.....and then come back to me
Lol just read up on the police in your country... the funny thing is that your police formed in 1922 was a racist one towards Catholics, yet you chose never to change it. That was YEARS before the UK parliment took over total control of NI. So infact the problems in NI are caused mainly by the Irish killing the Irish, so um.... maybe stop blaming people in UK for shit that you have made.
And the only thing that was out of control on Bloody Sunday were the troops AFTER they were given the order to ceasefire which was at the end. They were attacked by the croud, hardly peaceful if you ask me then "reports of an IRA sniper operating in the area were given to the Army command centre" thus in my opinion giving the army the right to defend their soldiers from death. After that it went stupid where that one guy running away was shot and then the last volley of gunfire which was completely unnessecary.
Now what truely amazes me is that this is thought to be worse than 20-30 people getting blown up in a pub. 12 deaths compared to 20-30 hmmm let me think which is worse. O no wait they are both good for the Irish because it reinforces they belief that NI would be better off with the RI.
Thoroughly agreed, you would have to be massively misguided to think the the empire builders of old just one day woke up and said to themselves, "I know, let's be nice to the jolly old natives and give them their country back, what what!"CameronPoe wrote:
If exploitation and pillaging represents 'development' then thanks but no thanks to development. It's a mindset I simply cannot condone. I do realise that the modern western world is built on the very pillars of empire building of which you speak but I certainly don't think that's anything to be proud of, whether it be the exploits of the British, French, Belgian, Spanish or Portugeuse empires. Contribution shmontribution. You have to balance contribution with the amount of pain and suffering cause - which puts Britain, France, Belgium, Spain and Portugal firmly in the negative.Vilham wrote:
Cameron I dont think you quite understand that because of Europe controlling Empires the world is as developed as it is today. You cant understand why the development of human kind is a good thing because Ireland has never contributed to that. Now don't go listing scientists who did this that and the other, you didnt take this technology and give to the rest of the world did you?
Im proud in everyway of our ancestors controlling half the world and then giving those countries their own independance. If we are so blood thirsty as you claim we wouldn't have backed down from ireland in 1923 we would have fucking massacred you.
Your understanding of Irish history is quite funny. The Brits got sick of constantly and gradually losing men over here and having to deal with civil disobedience that they couldn't handle it anymore. It's like in India, Rhodesia, Ireland, Pakistan, Palestine, you name it. We and they all WON their freedom. They weren't handed it like some sort of gift. They shed blood and fought hard to make it unfeasible for the Brits to remain. You're damn right too - you would have had to massacre every last one of us because if you didn't there'd still be men out there ready to shoot the nearest English soldier in the back of the head.
I'm affraid you weren't that specific...CameronPoe wrote:
I called James-M a racist - NOT all English people. Learn to read.
Obviously my English reading lessons worked...CameronPoe wrote:
I do, on the other hand, have something against British people like you.
I think we should let Scotland have their independance back. It's no skin off our noses and thay are a burden. The country would soon turn in one massive piss/crime/heroin ridden hell hole and even the tourism would dry up.
Every day now Cameron its making it seem to me that you are infact an extremist and possibly a support of the IRA and other resistance movements.CameronPoe wrote:
If exploitation and pillaging represents 'development' then thanks but no thanks to development. It's a mindset I simply cannot condone. I do realise that the modern western world is built on the very pillars of empire building of which you speak but I certainly don't think that's anything to be proud of, whether it be the exploits of the British, French, Belgian, Spanish or Portugeuse empires. Contribution shmontribution. You have to balance contribution with the amount of pain and suffering cause - which puts Britain, France, Belgium, Spain and Portugal firmly in the negative.Vilham wrote:
Cameron I dont think you quite understand that because of Europe controlling Empires the world is as developed as it is today. You cant understand why the development of human kind is a good thing because Ireland has never contributed to that. Now don't go listing scientists who did this that and the other, you didnt take this technology and give to the rest of the world did you?
Im proud in everyway of our ancestors controlling half the world and then giving those countries their own independance. If we are so blood thirsty as you claim we wouldn't have backed down from ireland in 1923 we would have fucking massacred you.
Your understanding of Irish history is quite funny. The Brits got sick of constantly and gradually losing men over here and having to deal with civil disobedience that they couldn't handle it anymore. It's like in India, Rhodesia, Ireland, Pakistan, Palestine, you name it. We and they all WON their freedom. They weren't handed it like some sort of gift. They shed blood and fought hard to make it unfeasible for the Brits to remain. You're damn right too - you would have had to massacre every last one of us because if you didn't there'd still be men out there ready to shoot the nearest English soldier in the back of the head.
LOL. 'Giving' independence. Patronisorama!
As to India your wrong. They peacefully protested with non-violence and as the majority wanted independance we gave it. Pakistan was part of india.... get a clue.
Palestine was controlled by Britain for a short period after WWI and was given back to the people and split by the UN to give the Jewish people a country after WWII. Please explain how they "WON" their freedom.
Unfortuanatly it is like that apart from a few major cities like Glasgow and Edinborough.RicardoBlanco wrote:
I'm affraid you weren't that specific...CameronPoe wrote:
I called James-M a racist - NOT all English people. Learn to read.Obviously my English reading lessons worked...CameronPoe wrote:
I do, on the other hand, have something against British people like you.
I think we should let Scotland have their independance back. It's no skin off our noses and thay are a burden. The country would soon turn in one massive piss/crime/heroin ridden hell hole and even the tourism would dry up.
Similar to the north of England 10 years ago until the UK government pumped shit loads of money into it. Just like what is happening in Scotland atm.
Last edited by Vilham (2006-12-14 05:46:38)
Well im nor from england or scotland or, whatever of british isle nation,... but even i know that Scotland have the best whisky in all this world ! guys wake up ! englanders are stealin your whisky ! you need independence and fast !!!
I'm willing to bet there are a few Irish fellows here who would dispute that claimMogura wrote:
Well im nor from england or scotland or, whatever of british isle nation,... but even i know that Scotland have the best whisky in all this world ! guys wake up ! englanders are stealin your whisky ! you need independence and fast !!!
India was peaceful resistance but they also shed blood against the British during their long history. The Brits realised that they were too weak to hold on to India, hence why they left. The Pakistan/India/Bangladesh mess you left behind led to much bloodshed, the borders still not having been fully agreed. Palestine didn't win freedom but they, and the immigrant jews, forced you out through chaotic guerrilla warfare (akin to that seen in Ireland): you couldn't handle it anymore. I don't see why you persist in thinking the 'mighty' British left of their own accord in many of the instances of their dabblings around the globe. Burma won their independence through force against the British occupiers. You can spin it whatever way you want but the fact of the matter is - you never 'granted' many of these nations independence: they won it.Vilham wrote:
Every day now Cameron its making it seem to me that you are infact an extremist and possibly a support of the IRA and other resistance movements.
As to India your wrong. They peacefully protested with non-violence and as the majority wanted independance we gave it. Pakistan was part of india.... get a clue.
Palestine was controlled by Britain for a short period after WWI and was given back to the people and split by the UN to give the Jewish people a country after WWII. Please explain how they "WON" their freedom.
PS And where do you get off with your ludicrous remarks about extremism and the IRA? You can look up countless threads where I condemn attacks on civilians. In case you haven't reaslied: the IRA decommissioned its weapons and ceased operations btw.
Last edited by CameronPoe (2006-12-14 05:52:24)
i loved the movie Braveheart, with Mel Gibson