Pages: 1 2

 

2006-12-19 03:06:44
De_Jappe
Triarii
+432|6523|Belgium

I don't know the map, as I don't play 2142, but how can you not think of shooting 4 tank shells at a time for every 2 seconds in the enemy uncap which is the last flag as baseraping. People spawn, people die immeadiatly. So for BF2 that would mean: You can't go on the carrier to kill them off, but you can shoot TV's from 450 feet away to kill them?

The decision to not attack uncaps in any way is to give the losing team a chance to come back,to make the game fun for everyone, and not only the team that is winning. If you guys are attacking with 4 tanks from the outside, shooting shells where people will spawn, it's not fun for the losing team. And don't start with the 'they deserve it'-shit as many people left by then and the guys who recently joined (and so always end up in the losing team) had nothing to do with it, yet they get spawnkilled all the time.

Just follow the rules, and don't attack the uncap in any way, the server supports teamplay and fun for everyone. I'm sure this purpose hasn't changed in BF2142. If you like attacking uncaps, then join one of the 600 other servers.
2006-12-19 03:17:39
madmurre
I suspect something is amiss
+117|6706|Sweden

De_Jappe wrote:

I don't know the map, as I don't play 2142, but how can you not think of shooting 4 tank shells at a time for every 2 seconds in the enemy uncap which is the last flag as baseraping. People spawn, people die immeadiatly. So for BF2 that would mean: You can't go on the carrier to kill them off, but you can shoot TV's from 450 feet away to kill them?

The decision to not attack uncaps in any way is to give the losing team a chance to come back,to make the game fun for everyone, and not only the team that is winning. If you guys are attacking with 4 tanks from the outside, shooting shells where people will spawn, it's not fun for the losing team. And don't start with the 'they deserve it'-shit as many people left by then and the guys who recently joined (and so always end up in the losing team) had nothing to do with it, yet they get spawnkilled all the time.

Just follow the rules, and don't attack the uncap in any way, the server supports teamplay and fun for everyone. I'm sure this purpose hasn't changed in BF2142. If you like attacking uncaps, then join one of the 600 other servers.
If you play the map Suez in 2142 you might come to another conclusion first of all the PAC has 2 uncap bases ( on the 64 player map. ) one of the bases is fairly well protected which basicly means you can´t fire in that base. They have alot of options really the biggest problem would be stacked teams with all the good players on one side. Wake island really ain´t comparable where one single J10 pilot all alone could keep the carrier under control.


Edit: I don´t know where i got Wake island from cause you did´nt mention it i guess i loved that map to much but it´s pretty much the same on bf2 on any map that includes a carrier.

Last edited by madmurre (2006-12-19 03:19:58)

2006-12-19 03:21:21
B.Schuss
I'm back, baby... ( sort of )
+664|6837|Cologne, Germany

for obvious reasons, I have merged this thread with the rules sticky. Please, to avoid multiple threads on the same topic, only create new threads if you are sure there are no existing ones.
2006-12-19 03:40:25
B.Schuss
I'm back, baby... ( sort of )
+664|6837|Cologne, Germany

now, for the topic at hand, Alpha is in charge of the server rules and the rulebook.

I have yet to have a match in BF2142 in which Base Raping was eminent. Up to now, most matches I have had so far were pretty balanced, with the example of Berlin, but on Berlin, base rape is part of the map design.

Also, since Aircraft are less powerful and dominating in BF2142, base rape just doesn't happen that often.
Tanks can be easily countered with IL-29 motion mines, stationary guns and the AT kit.

I guess what I am saying is that if you play intelligently and as a team, you should never face base rape by the enemy. And if your tactic fails, you deserve to be pounded.

Also, the anti-baserape rule is quite difficult to enforce, lesson learned from BF2.

So, I think we can do without them.
2006-12-19 03:42:43
Mike<Eagle23>
BF2sEU old school admin - I don't care who you are
+359|6723|Germany

The same discussion has been there during the time of the BF2 server...
At that time, Goldman wrote the following statement, which was supported by the other admins of the server.
Even though I have not been an admin then, I still agree to that statement totally.

Lt.Goldman wrote:

For all lazy readers I start with my conclusion.
But please read on to understand why I came to this conclusion
_____________________________________________________________________________________

Conclusion:
- Arty on uncaps              Not allowed
- Base Rape uncaps        Not allowed
- Base Bomb uncaps        Not allowed
_____________________________________________________________________________________

Why ?
- It can't be that all of a sudden all the rules are no longer any good.
  They have worked for months, players like them and they are found on many more BF2 servers
- [...]
- If someone does not like our rules maybe he should find another server
- [...]

Goals
Our goals with the BF2s EU server are:
1. Have fun
2. Teamwork

Achievements
What have we achieved with these server-goals in a couple of months:
- full 64 server almost every evening [...]
- at least 20 member who regularly visiting the server and play as a team
- more and more players join the teamwork idea
- at least 75% of the bans have noting to do with these rules (but are deliberate teamkilling/padding)
- zero complaints about being banned regarding these rules
- [...]
- lots of good replies on the BF2s EU server games

Our rules are to ensure our goals so the majority of players can have fun.
Also we offer something special other servers don't have:
Huge great forum, teamspeak, clanbased teamwork  but full freedom to join/leave/play/don't play

Having no rules
If we remove the rules we fall back on the goals EA has set with the game (besides $$):
1. Winning
2. Get points/ranks/medals for yourself

These goals (although we like winning) confict with the serve goals we have set.
And remember in an uncap after spawning:
- it takes 3 seconds to get fully "battle ready"
- but it takes 0 seconds to get killed by bombs/arty/gunned/knifed

NO one likes to be killed in an uncap without being able to at least have a change to run/hide/fight back
Players will leave the server because they don't have fun anymore
edit: schuss seems to be quite right about baseraping not happening that often and intensely in 2142, but from my point of view that does not necessarily mean that we should abolish that rule...

Last edited by Mike<Eagle23> (2006-12-19 03:47:10)

2006-12-19 03:51:52
superfly_cox
soup fly mod
+717|6777

We can talk about rules all we want but for the time being, adminning is not very easy because you can't alt-F4 to desktop and back because you'll get that 2142 black screen.  Even if an admin sees something and wants to kick, most of the time it means having to restart your 2142 just to do one admin action.

Luckily baserape has not been an issue so far but this still sucks.  Anybody know a fix for this problem?

edit!  I meant Alt-Tab!  Yeah, Alt-F4 would certainly explain the problem but unfortunately that's not it

Last edited by superfly_cox (2006-12-19 04:13:18)

2006-12-19 03:54:14
DoctorFruitloop
Level 13 Wrongdoer
+515|6542|Doncaster, UK
When admining the [netsas] server I just have my laptop running at the side of me with clanforge open.

That said, I don't have problems ALT-TABing to desktop to change anything in TS. Although if you really are ALT-F4ing then that might be your problem
2006-12-19 03:59:37
Mike<Eagle23>
BF2sEU old school admin - I don't care who you are
+359|6723|Germany

I've got no problems with ALT-TAB...
I used to have problems when I had only one GB RAM
2006-12-19 04:05:45
De_Jappe
Triarii
+432|6523|Belgium

Woow, nice that goldman had the same opinion I used today

To MADMURRE: As I said, I don't know the map so it would be in my disadvantage. Yet there probably are other maps that have only one uncap. So if you remove the rules, people on that map might get spawnkilled. And even if there are 2 uncaps, it's not fun to spawn and be killed. And it would be rediculous to make rules like: on that map you can... on this map you can not...

I should suggest to keep the rules, so you cannot be killed in an uncap to keep it fun for everyone. BUT I must say that my opinion isn't of much value, as I don't play BF2142 and so am not part of the bf2142 eu server. I just wanted to give the other point of view as it was discussed for the BF2 EU server too.

To SUPERFLY, Aren't there any hotkeys like: "!k playername reason"?
2006-12-19 04:16:44
Slayer
---hates you
+1,137|6752|Hell, p.o box 666

Enemy in a uncap is a kick/ban for me!!! It´s easy!

@Gemi: I´m sorting the ingame admin stuff, but also have to mention, most forums dont give too much helpfull details about this. Seems like there is a bug about rcon in 2142CC. I´ll keep you updated.
2006-12-19 04:17:59
aardfrith
Δ > x > ¥
+145|6788
So what do you do on a map like Minsk (conquest mode)?  If you're the attacking side, I forget which is which, you start with an uncap and only one way into the rest of the map, which is through the first enemy flag.

Obviously, if you're attacking, you have to attack.  If you're defending, however, immediately have tanks and a walker at the flag so how far into the uncap are you allowed to go?

The other unbalanced one on the current map cycle is Camp Gibraltar.  At least with that map there's less armor to contend with as the attacking side has a walker at their uncap while the other walker is right over the far side, so the attackers should have a chance to get out of their base.
2006-12-19 05:00:53
theDude5B
Cool member
+804|6746
@ Aardfrith -  I think I know what map you are talking about. There is a pretty far distance between the uncap and the first base so there a big battle ground in the middle, but the team who are attacking do have two spawn points further from the actual base, so in this case it is just a matter of people using their common sense. If the defending team start going into the actual uncap base then that would be breaking the rules.
2006-12-19 05:39:54
Slayer
---hates you
+1,137|6752|Hell, p.o box 666

Well, lets formulate it this way enemy IN the uncap->kick/ban
2006-12-19 05:43:50
madmurre
I suspect something is amiss
+117|6706|Sweden
Well i guess it´s all about common sense as Dude pointed out. And true Baserapes, spawncampings pretty much only happen when the teams are way unbalanced aka all good players on one team and that will get rid off more people on a server than baserape ever will ( in my experience )
2006-12-19 05:52:16
superfly_cox
soup fly mod
+717|6777

Ram is not my problem when I alt-tab.  Don't really know why I got it but i'm not the only one.  There's a thread about it: http://forums.bf2s.com/viewtopic.php?id=52715 but haven't found any solutions yet.

In case you guys don't know about it, I can Alt-Tab to desktop no problem but when I try to go back the game resizes into a black screen but my resolution remains my desktop resolution and i can see my desktop around the edges of the game window. 

which brings me to a wierd thing, why can't I run my 2142 in same native resolution as my lcd?  1280x1042...is not even that detailed compared with ubber rigs today.  2142 only give me the option to play play at the highest something just below 1280x1042...
2006-12-19 06:03:49
Slayer
---hates you
+1,137|6752|Hell, p.o box 666

Well, a little offtopic here, but are you sure? I play the game in 1900 x 1280 on both of my rigs (the uber and the above average). There was no problem to set this resolution at all, it´s in the graphic options

About the Alt-Tab thingy, well I have 4096MB RAM and during a game I cant go back to Desktop without crash! The whole system, not only 2142, freezes I´ve just tried it on the empty server without problems, and on a 22 players server with the result pushing the reset button... Strange.

BACK TO TOPIC NOW!
2006-12-19 06:35:38
B.Schuss
I'm back, baby... ( sort of )
+664|6837|Cologne, Germany

B.Schuss wrote:

now, for the topic at hand, Alpha is in charge of the server rules and the rulebook.

I have yet to have a match in BF2142 in which Base Raping was eminent. Up to now, most matches I have had so far were pretty balanced, with the example of Berlin, but on Berlin, base rape is part of the map design.

Also, since Aircraft are less powerful and dominating in BF2142, base rape just doesn't happen that often.
Tanks can be easily countered with IL-29 motion mines, stationary guns and the AT kit.

I guess what I am saying is that if you play intelligently and as a team, you should never face base rape by the enemy. And if your tactic fails, you deserve to be pounded.

Also, the anti-baserape rule is quite difficult to enforce, lesson learned from BF2.

So, I think we can do without them.
to make my above statement more precise:

all the things Goldman mentioned

- Arty on uncaps              Not allowed
- Base Rape uncaps        Not allowed
- Base Bomb uncaps        Not allowed

are still not allowed on the server. What I mean by "Base rape" is driving into an uncap with a tank or APC, killing people spawning left and right. The same goes for Arty on uncaps or bombing runs on uncaps.

However, shooting into an uncap from a certain distance is not considered base-raping, at least not in my book. As long as the opposition still has a safe place to spawn at and figth back, it is fine. Most uncaps will have multiple spawn points anyway.
Also, gunships in BF2142 do not have bombs any more. Bombing runs just don't happen. Most pilots seem to be content with attacking the enemy outside their uncaps.

The only enemies I want to see in my uncap are Recon soldiers who want to destroy assets or steal a vehicle.

But anything that results in Spawn killing is illegal base-rape and therefore not allowed

Stay away from uncaps. There is a reason why they have the "do not go there" signs on them.

my 2c.
2006-12-19 09:01:21
Negerkungen
I could not care less
+541|6738|Topside

Bernadictus wrote:

- Using Hacks, Padding is NOT allowed. |BAN|
- Exploiting is NOT allowed. |BAN/KICK|
- Excessive Teamkilling is NOT allowed. |KICK > BAN|
- Attacking an uncap aka Base Raping is NOT allowed. |KICK > BAN|
- Attacking the commander assets is allowed, leave when you're done.
- Killing Team members for Vehicles in any form is NOT allowed. |BAN/KICK|
- Bad Language is NOT allowed, Admins will decide on Kick or Ban + Auto Admin, depends on situation.
- Respect the Staff.
- Don't be an ass wink
- Attacking an uncap aka Base Raping is NOT allowed. |KICK > BAN|
- Attacking the commander assets is allowed, leave when you're done.

Of all the current rules. These 2 are the most obsolete unnecessary rules their are to think of.
Why are they in our rules anyway? Last night on the BF2s EU server there were several PAC players complaining of us 'Baseraping' them. This was on Suez Canal. And when a force has all flags, you can't expect a 4 tank strong squad not to suppress the enemy in their own base. And especially when you have no uncap on your map.
Note: we were not in the base, we were shelling them from the hills surrounding the bottom uncap.
There where 2 guys IN the uncap so I banned them,and then you start yelling that I'm abusing my admin powers.If you where up on that hillside,how would you know if they where inside or outside the uncap??
2006-12-19 12:33:39
l41e
Member
+677|6644

Guys, if we're going to have rules about "no baseraping IN the uncap"...we have to define "in".

If "in" is defined as "whatever the on-duty admin(s) feel like", it's inevitable people will come here and complain because "it was ok the last time i played on ur server".

Have a "radius" - distance from a flag/landmark where it becomes "baseraping".

If only EA/DICE would let us have custom server-loaded minimaps...
2006-12-19 13:31:20
^*AlphA*^
F*ckers
+3,135|6734|The Hague, Netherlands

Updated the rules, but I'm not going to make a radius with a area that is called uncap base raping, admins on the server have to make up if its allowed or not.
https://bf3s.com/sigs/36eac2cb6af70a43508fd8d1c93d3201f4e23435.png
2006-12-20 00:06:11
B.Schuss
I'm back, baby... ( sort of )
+664|6837|Cologne, Germany

QFE. After all, that is what admins are there for. They decide. And unfortunately, the way the game is set up right now, there is no perfect way to determine who is legally in an uncap and who isn't.

As a result, we have two options:

1.) keep the "no-base-rape" rule and rely on the judgement of our admins to enforce it
2.) remove all rules related to base rape to avoid this.

We have had little to no complaints about admins or rules, so I suggest we stick to the rules that worked on the BF2 server. You can't make everybody happy anyway. Those who don't like the rules can easily go play somewhere else.

I'll continue to kick /ban anyone who enters the enemy uncap in any sort of vehicle. Individual recons attacking commander assets or snipers shooting into the uncap don't bother me. Those can easily be countered  by a good commander.

EDIT: While I realize there are different opinions on this particular topic, and that there are servers out there who will allow any form of base rape, I consider this a question of principle for our community.
We have decided a while ago, after quite a long discussion, that base rape just doesn't go along with our approach to the game. It doesn't fit in our concept if you will.
That's why it is outlawed.

 

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