BF2S Forums Webb vs. Bush

I don't get it.  Bush asked how his son, how volunteered to join the Marines, was doing, why not just answer the man?

IRONCHEF wrote:

Well it's obvious that Webb was not about to toy around with Bush's fake gesture.  If I were Webb, knowing how much Bush doesn't care about the troops..i'd have that barrier up too..especially if that bastard was CIC of my son in Iraq.

It would have been wise if Bush humbly thanked Senator Webb for his son's service.  But you know..humility is just not his style..he'd rather talk to Webb as if they were the same..you know, "vets" and all! lol

Oh, and he DID answer him by saying he'd like to get him home.

TBH, I would not expect a thanks or concern from him to begin with.  I made the choice, I made the decision to join the Marines and train to kill people.  I am sure his son feels the same way.

Marconius wrote:

"Webb should've said, 'Oh, you know, just busy dodging bullets and trying not to get killed fighting your war.  How are your daughters doing in detox?'"

See, that is my point.  Why is that even a burn?  It was HIS choice to go over there and dodge bullets.  And, since his dad is in the political arena, I suspect his son is heading that way also, which may be why he is in the Corps.

Webb answered saying he'd like him to come home.  Bush, being a snotty asshole, disrespected Webb's answer and made it a political matter and a personal attack said "that's not what I asked."  He did his typical condescending shit to Webb..a real man and combat vet who KNOWS what war is and knows the hell his son is in.  THAT'S what was offensive.

My surmising that Bush doesn't care about the troops "just because I don't agree with him" has nothing to do with it.  There's dozens of examples I've seen that indicate he doesn't give a shit.  From photo ops, to dumb jokes (worse than kerry would ever say), to policies, to not listening to commanders on the ground while telling the people he is, to keeping them underequipped while funding reconstruction fully, to cutting their disability pay, their VA benefits....it's just endless how much apathy he has for them.  The first and foremost proof is that he USED the military based on HIS lies..period.  that alone is worthy of a full mutiny and coup.  If you use your country's armed forces, as a true last resort, then a pre-emptive attack based on LIES is at least worthy of an apology, immediate withdrawal, and asking for emergency spending for the tens of thousands of wounded vets to make sure EVERY comfort is there for them.  Where's the 300 billion for those guys coming home with missing limbs, shaking hands, PTSD, and other life changing scars? 

There's George Washington at Valley Forge who supports his troops..then there's George Bush at thanksgiving dinner pardoning 2 turkeys on the deadliest day in Iraq.

Stingray24 wrote:

We'll obviously have to disgree here.  I think Webb made it political by not answering the question.  You already think Bush is an asshole, hence your opinion.  I do not think Bush is an asshole, hence my opinion.  And round and round we go from here.

As far the 2 turkeys, do you expect the president to be in Iraq fighting beside troops?  Gimme a break.  Presidents always fight wars from afar, Bush is no different.

He "earned" his asshole status by being himself.  lol

Oh, and WEBB did respond..it was taken wrong and rebutted with a rude comment by the president.

A thanksgiving day tribute would have been nice....some semblance of reverence and some hollow words would have been nice towards those dying on both sides of the conflicts we're in.  If Iraq really isn't in civil war and there's safety in Iraq, then yes, a trip to baghdad to dine with soldiers would have impressed me, sent a real message of action to americans, and would have spoken more than hollow words.

but you're right..this will go nowhere.  i digress.

Last edited by IRONCHEF (2006-11-29 11:56:28)

jonsimon wrote:

He insulted Webb to his face. Stop trying to defend him.

As I said, round and round and round . . . . . zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Kracker,
Did the news reports you read say that Bush was offended by Webb's remarks?  No.  Do the news reports say that Webb was offended by Bush's remarks?  Yes.  He wanted to slug Bush.

Ok, those FACTS show that someone was offensive.  It's up to us to figure out what was offensive.  Regardless of bias here, it's obvious that after Webb's reply "We want them to come home Mr President", Bush made the rude reply of "That's not what I asked..." 

How in any way is that not clear?  Knowing how Bush responds to ANY and EVERY question that challenges his policies in an immature, condescending way, how is it not obvious that Bush was the asshole?

Go ahead, role play.  Do the conversation in your head.  Put yourselves in their shoes knowing what you know about those two.  Webb, ran for office as a real vet, opposing this foolish war, but isn't protecting his child from warfare like a coward would do for his son (Bush Sr), running for office so he can help get his son home the right way..through the voices of his constituents and the majority of the country.  Then having the author of all of that shit ask how your boy is?...Then quip back at your respectful answer (get 'em home, mr president) with attitude?  I'd have wanted to slug him too.  It would have satisified sooo many people to see that fist fight.

No, if mature people are talking, and the question "How's your boy?" comes, the answer can be many things...like "I'd like him home."  What better answer would the dad (Webb is actually the father of a son in Iraq would could die any minute for NO CAUSE) give?  Should Webb have just shot the shit and said "OH, he's a tough kid, watching out for his unit, trying to stay alive...yadda yadda."  Or could he have used that opportunity to give a real answer and one that will represent everything Webb stands for and say "I'd like him home."

Either way, Webb's answer was not an answer that deserved that immature, condescending, arrogant remark "That's not what I asked..."  I don't get why people can't put themselves in the shoes of others.  A real grown up would have said "Yeah, we'll get them home safely!  Hopefully sooner rather than later!"  Or maybe ignore the emotional answer given and say "I'm proud of his service and of yours!  Have a nice night!"

But no, the shithead had to mouth off.

If this were two people on the street, how would you judge this conversation?

IRONCHEF wrote:

. . . Should Webb have just shot the shit and said "OH, he's a tough kid, watching out for his unit, trying to stay alive...yadda yadda."

Huh, that's what the Dads say that I've talked to who have sons in the military. One example:

Me: "How's Gregg doing?"
Father: "He's doing well.  He contacted us recently and said he was about ready to go on a mission.  He's not with his regular unit right now, but he's got his game face on, ready to do his job."
Me: "Good for him.  Is he going to re-enlist?  I heard his tour is up soon."
Father: "I'm leaving that up to him of course.  I support what he's doing but I'll be glad to see him again.  He talked to his 1st Sergeant, a man he really respects, about the decision.  He told Greg to come home and make the decision to re-enlist here.  Not on the battlefield."
Me: "Sounds like good advice. I look forward to seeing him when he gets back.  Have a good night."
*shake hands*

I suspect that's the kind of conversation President Bush was looking for.  Instead of focusing on himself, the father above spoke about his son.  If my son was serving in the military I'd talk about how proud I am of him, what he's done recently, his attitude lately, and lastly that I want him home.  That's just me.

Last edited by Stingray24 (2006-11-29 14:01:44)

usmarine2007 wrote:

I don't get it.  Bush asked how his son, how volunteered to join the Marines, was doing, why not just answer the man?

I understand where Webb is coming from, dont get me wrong.  But his son DID volunteer for the service.  It wouldnt make any difference if we were fighting in Iraq, or any other country.  He still volunteered.

Last edited by {BMF}*Frank_The_Tank (2006-11-29 14:21:20)

IRONCHEF wrote:

Webb answered saying he'd like him to come home.  Bush, being a snotty asshole, disrespected Webb's answer and made it a political matter and a personal attack said "that's not what I asked."

From what I get out of it, Bush was trying to keep it from becoming political.  Webb made it politcal in the sense of bringing up the topic of him coming home.  Bush asked how he was.  That is a personal question, not a political one, and by him saying "thats not what I asked, I asked how he was doing", he seems he was trying to avoid political conversation.

IRONCHEF wrote:

And when this father (Webb) gave him an answer that he wasn't prepared for, and certainly could not equate as a friendly answer, he snapped back..as he does everytime he's on camera.  He just has no people skills..unless you're kissing his ass.

Webb had the ability to give ANY answer he wanted.  And if you know dads who enjoy having their sons put in harms way, killing people or being killed, then great.  I'm standing up for Webb's perfectly normal, fatherlike answer that he gave Bush.

Fair enough.  Webb has free speech, but when specifically asked about their son's condition most people answer the question and then give commentary.  I simply haven't seen any other military father react Webb did when asked about his son.  He skipped straight to the commentary and focused on himself instead of his son's condition.  The military fathers I know don't enjoy their sons being in harms way.  But when I tell them to tell their son to "give em hell", I see almost all of them stand up a little more straight.  They're proud their son is a man's man and is kicking some ass, though they wish they could be home.