BF2S Forums Would the US be a better place without religion?

Stingray24 wrote:

Call it the "culture war" or whatever name you prefer to use in defining the phenomenon - there is a widespread debate about the direction of our country will take with it's values.  We're debating the place of religion and it’s ideas in a wide array of areas, one of which being the teaching of intelligent design along with evolution.  Rather than argue whether atheists/secularists or religious people are more tolerant or less tolerant, I want to look at this differently and ask the question:

Would the US be a better place without religion?

Discuss

Yes, the corrupt ultra-right wouldn't be able to wrangle in the support of rednecks just because they're both christian.

The entire enlightened/civilised world no longer needs religion and would be better off without it.

Erkut.hv wrote:

jonsimon wrote:

Stingray24 wrote:

Call it the "culture war" or whatever name you prefer to use in defining the phenomenon - there is a widespread debate about the direction of our country will take with it's values.  We're debating the place of religion and it’s ideas in a wide array of areas, one of which being the teaching of intelligent design along with evolution.  Rather than argue whether atheists/secularists or religious people are more tolerant or less tolerant, I want to look at this differently and ask the question:

Would the US be a better place without religion?

Discuss

Yes, the corrupt ultra-right wouldn't be able to wrangle in the support of rednecks just because they're both christian.

Instead, the far-left godless heathens can turn this great nation into a bunch of transgendered queens standing in line at the abortion clinic waiting to get partial birth abortions and anti-depressants.

Yes, because all democrats are atheist.

Someone sounds disgruntled.

Last edited by jonsimon (2006-11-17 13:49:29)

jonsimon wrote:

Erkut.hv wrote:

jonsimon wrote:

Yes, the corrupt ultra-right wouldn't be able to wrangle in the support of rednecks just because they're both christian.

Instead, the far-left godless heathens can turn this great nation into a bunch of transgendered queens standing in line at the abortion clinic waiting to get partial birth abortions and anti-depressants.

Yes, because all democrats are atheist.

Someone sounds disgruntled.

No, I had to give what I believed the exact opposite of your response. For balance purposes, nothing more. I am neither ultra-right wing, nor a redneck.

My intent was to encompass all religions with my question.  + 1 Ironchef

Erkut.hv wrote:

jonsimon wrote:

Erkut.hv wrote:

Instead, the far-left godless heathens can turn this great nation into a bunch of transgendered queens standing in line at the abortion clinic waiting to get partial birth abortions and anti-depressants.

Yes, because all democrats are atheist.

Someone sounds disgruntled.

No, I had to give what I believed the exact opposite of your response. For balance purposes, nothing more. I am neither ultra-right wing, nor a redneck.

Ah, I thought you might, but I wasn't sure. Sorry for any ill-intent in my response.

well, this country was founded by people of the Christian faith.

no. have you seen the last two weeks south park? they make a good point. otters are bad.

jonsimon wrote:

IRONCHEF wrote:

people, people, people....please.  let's be real here.  take your heads out of your agenda laden asses and think for a minute.  realize that when you say "yes, the country would be better without religious people" it encompases ALL religious people..and not just that big voting block that YOU see when you turn on tv and see them tangling in politics.  The real religious people of this country go about silently making things better.  they dig deepest into their pockets when there's an international or national crisis, they selflessly offer their service above and beyond, they contribute to their communities and neighborhoods.  They do things unique to religion that you godless heathens don't even fathom that make this a better country.

But as long as you ignorant youngins continue to equate religion with terrorism/bad politics/intolerance/hatred and the host of other false blanket statements, you'll never be able to answer the OP honestly.

But alass, you have anyway.  So let's get together now and flame the religious crazy man ironchef now... zzzzzzz

I'm glad you won't be surprised if anyone flames you, after all, your choice of wording begs for it. Referring to your opponents as 'heathens', which carries an obvious negative connotation, suggesting your opponents fail to be as intelligent as yourself (in that the 'heathens' can't fathom, or understand, something you have implied you can), blatantly provoking response through the labeling of 'ignorant youngins' and the ironic blanket statement that your opponent is incapable of honesty.

I can see your religious beliefs have imparted within you the everlasting love and acceptance of Jesus.

Ok heathen, let's now point out where you failed...

Your disdain for religious people made you percieve things I did not say or suggest when you assumed I said godless heathens were not intelligent.  It was a sarcastic and spiteful title yet appropriate because if you are not god-worshipping, you are in fact heathens.  As for not fathoming a religious principle, it has little to do with intelligence.  Would it be reasonable for me to accept that I'm unintelligent because i cannot fathom the physics of space travel while trained astronauts can?  Likewise, will a non-religious "heathen" not fathom religious principles as you and many other "heathens" have abundantly illustrated when doing battle with me and stingray in these forums?  For example, do you understand the "justice-mercy" concept and how it's applicable to our lives because of the atonement of Jesus Christ?  DO you "fathom" the scope and process of the gathering of the lost tribes of israel?  Can you begin to understand the intricacies of FAITH?  If you answer no to any of these then you are still intelligent, yet not able to fathom religious principles.

jonsimon wrote:

. . . I can see your religious beliefs have imparted within you the everlasting love and acceptance of Jesus.

Jesus does have everlasting love.  The acceptance part depends on what connotations come along with it.  Acceptance of the person?  Absolutely.  Acceptance of their actions if they are immoral?  No.  This is where the so called culture war comes into play.  Our politically correct society believes everyone should accept almost everything that anyone wants to do, immoral or not, in the name of "tolerance".  Yet when "religious" people dare to express their belief that there is a moral standard to be followed the athiest/secularist cannot "tolerate" that "intolerance".  Interesting.

sergeriver wrote:

Am I heathen too?
Which definition?  The unconverted individual, uncultured, or uncivilized person, pagan, all of these?  Lol.

No, you go passed being a heathen and are considered a vile devil worshipper!  Down to hell you go serge!!! 

*smooches*

doctastrangelove1964 wrote:

[Removing religion altogether would cause society to have almost no morals or care for other people, so it would be alot worse without it.

Hang on there.  Religious people do NOT corner the market on being moral or caring towards others!  People, religious or not, are generally "good."  It is my belief that the earth is endowed with an atmospheric layer (to be scientific since nobody here knows "god-speak") that has "light" in it (see creative period "1" in Genesis).  I understand this light to be none other than "the light of christ."  It is something that permeates every creature, human, object, and every inch of space.  With this light is the influence of the holy ghost..which according to my beliefs is what many consider that little angel that sits on your shoulder begging you to make good choices.

Religious or not, EVERYONE has the influence of the Light of Christ (or "good intuition" to the layman) and EVERYONE can do good, or change and be better.

Last edited by IRONCHEF (2006-11-17 16:50:00)

Oh sure it does.  I just wanted to point that out since it is a common truth even my "heathen" brethren on this forum will quickly correct you on, often with anger!

And I couldn't agree more because where else would an individual go to learn how to serve others selflessly so as to "be like jesus?"  In church, i learn and relearn things that I guarantee I would never have learned by not going.