BF2S Forums just a reminder as to who the bad guys are in Iraq.

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

lowing wrote:

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

It is your total intransigence that makes you just as bad as them.

acually, I was thinking it is your willingness to appease that I found disgusting.

You disgust me. I disgust you. That's fine.

Because we live in democratic countries and have freedom of speech and thought, we are both free to say and think whatever we want.

When we disagree we can debate our points of view and try to reach some kind of consensus. Even if that consensus is nothing more than "We agree to disagree".

That, not wanting to kill those that disagree with you, is the freedom and democracy you supposedly hold so dear.

huh???? I don't want to kill people that "disagree with me" I want those that do not have any quarums about killing children to be recognized for what they are and dealt with accordingly without any concerns about "understanding" them and appeasing them in hopes they won't do it again.

TeamZephyr wrote:

SoC./Omega wrote:

TeamZephyr wrote:

Please leave your tired prejudices and generalisations at the door before entering Debate And Serious Talk.

You guys never say that when libs attack republicans

Once again, another generalisation. Yes mate, all of us "libs" generalise republicans *rolls eyes*

And for the love of god could the "lib labellers" of this forum please STOP calling me a liberal?

sure thing, as soon as you stop posting like one.

lowing wrote:

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

lowing wrote:

acually, I was thinking it is your willingness to appease that I found disgusting.

You disgust me. I disgust you. That's fine.

Because we live in democratic countries and have freedom of speech and thought, we are both free to say and think whatever we want.

When we disagree we can debate our points of view and try to reach some kind of consensus. Even if that consensus is nothing more than "We agree to disagree".

That, not wanting to kill those that disagree with you, is the freedom and democracy you supposedly hold so dear.

huh???? I don't want to kill people that "disagree with me" I want those that do not have any quarums about killing children to be recognized for what they are and dealt with accordingly without any concerns about "understanding" them and appeasing them in hopes they won't do it again.

The root of the problem is that they disagree with you about how they should live their lives.

Last edited by Scorpion0x17 (2006-11-14 20:01:02)

lowing wrote:

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

lowing wrote:

huh???? I don't want to kill people that "disagree with me" I want those that do not have any quarums about killing children to be recognized for what they are and dealt with accordingly without any concerns about "understanding" them and appeasing them in hopes they won't do it again.

The root of the problem is that they disagree with you about how they should live their lives.

Ahhhhhhh, my fault. They want the freedom to kill women and children when they get mad. Damn I knew I lacked understanding for others.

No they kill men (for lets not leave them out of this), women and children because we are trying to force our opinion of how they should lead their lives upon them.

ATG wrote:

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

ATG wrote:

No. Just no.

Actually, yes.

Dude, if you think Lowing is in any way on the same level as islamofascist who saw peoples heads off you seriously need to have your head examined.

Or just stop talking because your sounding rather moronic right now. Sorry.

I usually don't tell this to anyone but.......................I also run with scissors.

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

lowing wrote:

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

No they kill men (for lets not leave them out of this), women and children because we are trying to force our opinion of how they should lead their lives upon them.

Ahhhhh once again my fault............by all means, don't go to war with the US, kill YOUR OWN MEN WOMEN AND CHILDREN....now I completely understand...boy once you think like a liberal it all makes sense, I do not know how I coulda missed it. And no, we are not trying to force our opinions on them we are telling them Islamic radicalism will not be entertained. That is of course until now.

So we're not trying to turn the whole of the middle east into western style democracies?

They do not want to live in a western style democracy. That is why they commit acts of terrorism - because they see what we are doing as an act terrorism against them.

I am sorry please post the articles that say we are converting the ME into a western world against their will.

Cuz I can post all day long articles that support their will to convert the west to Islamic rule. And I still can't remember a single suicide bombing on a school by our troops aimed at killing women andchildren.

lowing wrote:

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

lowing wrote:

Ahhhhh once again my fault............by all means, don't go to war with the US, kill YOUR OWN MEN WOMEN AND CHILDREN....now I completely understand...boy once you think like a liberal it all makes sense, I do not know how I coulda missed it. And no, we are not trying to force our opinions on them we are telling them Islamic radicalism will not be entertained. That is of course until now.

So we're not trying to turn the whole of the middle east into western style democracies?

They do not want to live in a western style democracy. That is why they commit acts of terrorism - because they see what we are doing as an act terrorism against them.

I am sorry please post the articles that say we are converting the ME into a western world against their will.

Cuz I can post all day long articles that support their will to convert the west to Islamic rule. And I still can't remember a single suicide bombing on a school by our troops aimed at killing women andchildren.

1. If we're not there to give them western style democracy then what are we there for?
2. If the terrorists want that western style democracy, why are they fighting against it so vigorously?

lowing wrote:

we are not trying to force our opinions on them we are telling them Islamic radicalism will not be entertained

Ok, I'm trying to get my head round this...

"we are not trying to force our opinions on them we are telling them Islamic radicalism will not be entertained"

Erm...

"we are not trying to force our opinions on them we are telling them Islamic radicalism will not be entertained"

Nope, still doesn't make sense...

How exactly is "telling them Islamic radicalism will not be entertained" not "trying to force our opinions on them"?

Last edited by Scorpion0x17 (2006-11-14 22:07:59)

Bubbalo wrote:

lowing wrote:

Bubbalo wrote:

So war the pro-Independence forces in the American War of Independence.

Read your history books and tell mere the colonists killed women and children for their cause.

They were killing members of the British army whilst they were subject to British law, they were criminals.

There were many domestic battles between loyalist and independants where horrible murders of men, women and children occured. Loyalist would kill and mutilate the families of independants.

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

lowing wrote:

Scorpion0x17 wrote:

No they kill men (for lets not leave them out of this), women and children because we are trying to force our opinion of how they should lead their lives upon them.

Ahhhhh once again my fault............by all means, don't go to war with the US, kill YOUR OWN MEN WOMEN AND CHILDREN....now I completely understand...boy once you think like a liberal it all makes sense, I do not know how I coulda missed it. And no, we are not trying to force our opinions on them we are telling them Islamic radicalism will not be entertained. That is of course until now.

So we're not trying to turn the whole of the middle east into western style democracies?

They do not want to live in a western style democracy. That is why they commit acts of terrorism - because they see what we are doing as an act terrorism against them.

Disagree. Many of them want to live in a democracy per se (as in where they get a say in how their country is run - by shariah law or otherwise), but terrorism is bred out of hatred of the west and israel. (won't comment on whether this hatred is justified).

lowing wrote:

And per Cameronpoe, forgive them so we can all move forward together. Problem is, I have no interest in moving forward with terrorists.

That's your prerogative. The problem with that approach is having to deal with a perpetual war that cannot be won outright. Noone will ever defeat Al Qaeda outright - they will just end up having to be contained. With Palestinians and Israelis however one would hope that given that there is a rational solution and that compromise is possible (as in Northern Ireland) perpetual war is not necessary. The thing is guerrilla warfare is very rarely beaten - it's perfect warfare (from a warfare point of view). It's how USA was founded, how the Republic of Ireland was founded, how Cuba was founded, how Vietnam came out on top in the 60s/70s, how Afghanistan humbled Russia, the list is a mile long. Blindly plugging away along the lines of the status quo means a slowly increasing US death toll for the rest of eternity. My methods involve brains over brawn, because brawn alone won't win.

Last edited by CameronPoe (2006-11-15 01:50:39)

Spark wrote:

lowing wrote:

Spearhead wrote:

Oh, YEAH, I'm totally with those terrorists.  I mean, Bush is such a great president I need SOMEONE to make him look like an incompetent, asshole, and failure in order for us liberals to get people to vote for that not-so-liberal-anymore Democratic party. 

lowing, honest to god, I don't know what in the name of Jesus Christ went wrong with you.  Liberals have repeatedly spammed into your fucking face from day one that we DON'T side with terrorists, hell, even a lot of us, including me, say that we SUPPORT the god damn war in Afgahnistan.  You know.... that one country which really was harboring terrorists?  If you ever expressed ANY sort of doubt that MAYBE you're wrong, then I wouldn't flame you so much.  But the truth is, you have proven to all of us your delusional and cannot be taken seriously.  Don't tell us what WE fucking believe.

I don't tell you what you believe, I tell you how you come across.

1. YOU bash Bush and the US 10 times more than terrorists.

Is there any need to bash terrorists? It's like proclaiming 'Hitler was really evil'. There's no point to it because everyone knows it anyway.

2. YOU post threads that say the US actually attacked itself so we could go to war in the ME.

I don't believe in these theories, so count me out of the 'YOU'. Stop generalizing. MENTION NAMES.

3. YOU call Bush a war criminal, which is bullshit, but I neverread anywhere from you that the terrorists are war criminals.

The definition of a war criminal is a person who commits crimes through/during war. It could be argued (I'm not stating my personal position here) that Bush HAS commited such crimes (again, I haven't stated my opinion).

4. YOU blame Bush for ALL the deaths in Iraq, you do not blame the terrorists.

And yet if someone is shot you blame the person and not the gun [manufacturer]. While <---this makes sense, your position here doesn't. If someone throws someone off a cliff, who do you blame? The guy who threw him, or the guy who decided not to stop him? You blame both, don't you? In any case, go back to 1. Do we need to state the bleeding obvious?

5. YOU think terrorists should be negotiated with and understood.

Negotiated? Fuck no. Give me one example of ANYONE saying that we should negotiate with a terrorist (save in hostage situations where we judge each situation on the circumstances). Understood? Yes. How can you defeat something you don't understand? It's like trying to run around the earth when you don't understand what the earth is.

6. YOU have even post topics debating who is the bigger terrorist Bin Laden or Bush.

Hm. Haven't seen this topic yet, but bin Laden is the obvious one in the most logical sense. Bush may cause fear, but he doesn't do it with the INTENTION of causing fear.

7. hell, you have even blamed BUSH for the fuckin weather. (Katrina)

I think it's pretty much undisputed (save by you, I think) that the response to Katrina was grossly inadequate.

So don't preach to me about my "black and white view on the world" the topics posted in this forum by you all reeks of black and white. It is all Bushes fault, it is all Israels fault. Never mind the ME was all screwed up and violent long before Bush OR Israel. YOur black and white view on the world is, get rid of Bush and get rid of Israel and we will all be running throw the fields holding hands feeding unicorns and shit. DOn't talk to me about BLACK AND WHITE. And the funny thing is. most of you talking shit still live with your parents and don't really even have a clue as to the "REAL WORLD " is all about.

And there you are again. Making generalizations and assumptions.

Show me one person who says it's all Bush's fault.

Have you interviewed all the people here to see if they actually are in the 'real world' (which actually has little to do with the debate at hand)?

Win.

Bubbalo wrote:

lowing wrote:

Bubbalo wrote:

So war the pro-Independence forces in the American War of Independence.

Read your history books and tell mere the colonists killed women and children for their cause.

They were killing members of the British army whilst they were subject to British law, they were criminals.

not what I asked you for now is it bubalo?? I will keep waiting.