Phantom2828
Member
+51|6800|Land of the free
What are your economic views?
All of that stuff free market, government subsides, welfare, taxes, government debt, government spending, all of that.

Here are mine

Ok. This is going to be a longgggg post.

I will take it in sections.

FREE MARKET*

I believe people should be able to buy and sell without government restrictions, no taxes or tariffs making entrepreneurship unwieldy.
Here is a video about what happens when there is to much government restrictions.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do... … ibertarian
I believe in a almost completely free market. The lazier fair system.
Have you ever heard of the invisible hand of capitalism?
Let me explain. If there is a big company that monopolized an industry and raises his prices, anybody can come along and sell for less. Thus both company's are competing by lowering prices and the consumer benefits.
The way it is set up now is very bad. Government subsides ETC. that creates a very corrupt connection between business and government. Kinda how the guy with a small business in selling used records got fucked because of the government interfering. The big company didn't want any competition so he gave money to the politicians campaign so when he got in office passed a law so you couldn't sell used records. The guy had to shut down.
Another thing bad about all these regulations is they hurt the people they are supposed to help. Little business can't survey they things while big business can buy their way out and survive. Kinda like how all the little bars shut down because the fucking state decided they know whats best and passed a smoking Ban.
WELFARE*
I am against welfare. Its basically stealing. Forced aid. The government has NO right to decide how I spend my hard earned money.
Welfare should be replaced by private charity. Charity's benefit the needy much more than welfare anyway.
Now on the the welfare state.
Those that welfare is supposed to be helping are fucked anyway because they get trapped in a cycle of dependence. Welfare rewards you for doing nothing and its more profitable than getting a job because they will cut it more than your job can provide.
This brings me to personal responsibility. Those who don't graduate and waster their lives on cheap booze and hookers don't deserve to get money from me and have to face their consequences.
Taking away welfare also makes people say hey I should get a job and make something of myself.
TAXES GOVERNMENT SPENDING AND DEBT*
Taxes should be as low as possible. I believe that YOU know the best way to spend your hard earned money not the government. There should still be some taxes to fund certain things but not nearly the level we have now funding outrageous things like beaver research.
government spending should be drastically reduced to reduce the strain on the American taxpayer. Government debt should be greatly greatly reduced as to not burden the taxpayer. Congress should operate on a pay as you go system instead of borrowing massive amounts of money from lenders to fund useless shit.
EXTRAS AND INFO*
Well that ends my post. Excuse my spelling.
I mind you all that was written from my personal beliefs and not just copy pasted.
Here is some extra info about this that you might find interesting. It goes along with my views pretty well.

This is a video response but it explains the free market well.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSLCi... … mp;search=

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m0lkA... … mp;search=

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do... … &hl=en

http://www.lp.org/issues/platform_all.shtml#ii

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What Happened to Your Family Budget?


Do you remember when the standard of living in America was the best in the world?


Today it is doubtful if our children will be better off than we are. Today, buying a decent home is no more than a dream for many hard-working American families.

Something has caused your family's budget to be cut. Something is going to destroy your family's future unless you act to stop it.

That something is the Federal government and its policy of taxation and inflation. Let's take a look at a median income family of four in the 1950s. At that time, the Federal income tax amounted to only 2% of the family budget. Americans enjoyed the highest standard of living in the world.

By contrast, in the 1990s, the Federal income tax takes 25% of income for the same family of four. Taxes at all levels -- federal, state, and local; hidden and visible -- take about 50% of a family's income. We must work from January to June just to pay taxes.

It now requires two paychecks to keep many families from going bankrupt. Typically, a working mother brings home 32% of a family's income.

So, whether she chooses to work -- or must work to make ends meet -- taxes have stolen her contribution to the family budget. In other words, one spouse now works all year just to pay taxes.

Ask yourself: Is the government spending that half of your income wisely?

You Work Harder
During those same years, the government has increased the money supply -- producing inflation. Whether the inflation rate is 12% or 3%, the result is the same: groceries cost more; clothing costs more; your car costs more. You work harder every year for less purchasing power.

The Federal government is driving your family into bankruptcy.

The government hasn't stopped there. They have borrowed so much money that your children will be sacrificing their entire economic lives to pay the Federal debt.

It seems that no matter who we elect to public office, the government budget gets bigger and the family budget gets smaller.

All too often we have only two choices in an election: a Democrat or a Republican. And no matter which one you vote for, you get higher taxes, bigger deficits, and broken promises.

There is Hope for Your Family
There is a political party that believes the family budget is more important than the Federal budget. A political party that is working to restore the hopes and dreams of every hard-working American family.

It is the Libertarian Party.

Over one hundred Libertarians are currently holding public office. Each of them is working today to keep the government from taking any more of your money. And each of them believes that if government were limited to protecting us against force and fraud, then most Americans would be better off. Less government corruption. No more expensive "boondoggle" projects. No more "special interest" favors at your expense.

The Libertarian Party always defends the family budget. In its entire history, elected Libertarians have never voted to increase taxes. In fact, Libertarians were instrumental in having the Alaska state income tax repealed.

The Libertarian Party will stop the waste in government by decreasing its size and power. We will work to roll back the power of Washington bureaucrats and politicians -- and leave you and your neighbors in control of your own lives
http://www.lp.org/issues/family-budget.shtml

Highlights of the Libertarian Party's "Ending the Welfare State" Proposal



From across the political and ideological spectrum, there is now almost universal acknowledgment that the American social welfare system has been a failure.

Since the start of the "war on poverty" in 1965, the United States has spent more than $5 trillion trying to ease the plight of the poor. What we have received for this massive investment is -- primarily -- more poverty.

Our welfare system is unfair to everyone: to taxpayers who must pick up the bill for failed programs; to society, whose mediating institutions of community, church and family are increasingly pushed aside; and most of all to the poor themselves, who are trapped in a system that destroys opportunity for themselves and hope for their children.

The Libertarian Party believes it is time for a new approach to fighting poverty. It is a program based on opportunity, work, and individual responsibility.

1. End Welfare
None of the proposals currently being advanced by either conservatives or liberals is likely to fix the fundamental problems with our welfare system. Current proposals for welfare reform, including block grants, job training, and "workfare" represent mere tinkering with a failed system.

It is time to recognize that welfare cannot be reformed: it should be ended.

We should eliminate the entire social welfare system. This includes eliminating AFDC, food stamps, subsidized housing, and all the rest. Individuals who are unable to fully support themselves and their families through the job market must, once again, learn to rely on supportive family, church, community, or private charity to bridge the gap.

2. Establish a dollar-for-dollar tax credit for contributions to private charity
If the federal government's attempt at charity has been a dismal failure, private efforts have been much more successful. America is the most generous nation on earth. We already contribute more than $125 billion annually to charity. However, as we phase out inefficient government welfare, private charities must be able to step up and fill the void.

To help facilitate this transfer of responsibility from government welfare to private charity, the federal government should offer a dollar-for-dollar tax credit for contributions to private charities that provide social-welfare services. That is to say, if an individual gives a dollar to charity, he should be able to reduce his tax liability by a dollar.

3. Tear down barriers to entrepreneurism and economic growth
Almost everyone agrees that a job is better than any welfare program. Yet for years this country has pursued tax and regulatory policies that seem perversely designed to discourage economic growth and reduce entrepreneurial opportunities. Someone starting a business today needs a battery of lawyers just to comply with the myriad of government regulations from a virtual alphabet soup of government agencies: OSHA, EPA, FTC, CPSC, etc. Zoning and occupational licensing laws are particularly damaging to the type of small businesses that may help people work their way out of poverty.

In addition, government regulations such as minimum wage laws and mandated benefits drive up the cost of employing additional workers. We call for the repeal of government regulations and taxes that are steadily cutting the bottom rungs off the economic ladder.

4. Reform education
There can be no serious attempt to solve the problem of poverty in America without addressing our failed government-run school system. Nearly forty years after Brown vs. Board of Education, America's schools are becoming increasingly segregated, not on the basis of race, but on income. Wealthy and middle class parents are able to send their children to private schools, or at least move to a district with better public schools. Poor families are trapped -- forced to send their children to a public school system that fails to educate.

It is time to break up the public education monopoly and give all parents the right to decide what school their children will attend. It is essential to restore choice and the discipline of the marketplace to education. Only a free market in education will provide the improvement in education necessary to enable millions of Americans to escape poverty.

Summary
We should not pretend that reforming our welfare system will be easy or painless. In particular it will be difficult for those people who currently use welfare the way it was intended -- as a temporary support mechanism during hard times. However, these people remain on welfare for short periods of time. A compassionate society will find other ways to help people who need temporary assistance. But our current government-run welfare system is costly to taxpayers and cruel to the children born into a cycle of welfare dependency and hopelessness.

The Libertarian Party offers a positive alternative to the failed welfare state. We offer a vision of a society based on work, individual responsibility, and private charity. It is a society based on opportunity and genuine compassion It is a society built on liberty.

http://www.lp.org/issues/welfare.shtml

The Libertarian Party: Working to slash your taxes!



The Libertarian Party is working every day to cut your taxes. By contrast, professional politicians from the other parties just want more of your money, and are busy increasing the size of government.

In the last few decades, the federal government has exploded in size. No area of your life or business is free from the meddling of politicians -- especially your wallet.

It doesn't have to be that way. With less government and lower taxes, you could keep more of what you earn. It would be easier to start new businesses, build new homes, and fuel stronger economic growth.

Just Defend Our Rights
Libertarians believe that if government's role were limited to protecting our lives, rights and property, then America would prosper and thrive as never before. Then the federal government could concentrate on protecting our Constitutional rights and defending us from foreign attack. A federal government that did only those two things, could do them better and at a small fraction of the cost.

How Can We Cut Taxes?
Instead of tending to the basics, government has grown into a bloated conglomerate of political services that gets larger every year -- with no end in sight.

For example, politicians spend millions of dollars to urge people not to smoke -- while spending more millions to subsidize tobacco farmers. They send billions overseas for foreign aid -- while the federal deficit swells. They spend millions to subsidize public art -- while working families struggle to pay their taxes.

Politicians also run trains, bail out savings and loans, construct houses, sell insurance, print books, and build basketball courts -- you name it! But the fact is, every service supplied by the government can be provided better and cheaper by private business.

Privatize And Cut Taxes
All over the world, governments are busy selling airlines, power plants, housing, and factories to private owners. Where inefficient government bureaucrats lost money and squandered tax dollars, hard-working private owners now make profits and create new jobs. Why can't we do the same thing in America?

Defend America: Cut Taxes
Military expenses are over $250 billion a year! A large percentage of this is spent overseas to defend wealthy countries like Germany and Japan -- who then wallop us in international trade. Let's take them off military welfare. We can defend America better and save at least $100 billion a year in taxes.

Stop Bailing Out Industry
No one has the right to cover his losses at taxpayer expense -- and yet wealthy corporations demand exactly that. The federal government has bailed out railroads, banks, and other corporations with your tax dollars. This must stop!

Replace Welfare: Cut Taxes
The bulk of your welfare tax dollars goes to pay the handsome salaries of well-educated welfare workers. The poor get little from government welfare except meager handouts and a cycle of despair. Let's get government out of the charity business. Private charities and groups do a better and more efficient job of helping the truly needy get back on their feet.

Why An Income Tax?
Before 1913, federal income taxes were rare and short-lived. America became the most prosperous nation on earth. The U.S. Government did not try to police the world or play "nanny" to everyone from cradle to grave. People took responsibility for themselves, their families, and their communities. That is how the founders of America thought it should be. And it worked. It can again!

http://www.lp.org/issues/cut-taxes.shtml

Last edited by Phantom2828 (2006-11-05 13:20:30)

..teddy..jimmy
Member
+1,393|6922
mmm which website did you copy this from
Phantom2828
Member
+51|6800|Land of the free

..teddy..jimmy wrote:

mmm which website did you copy this from
I wrote the top part.
The rest past Extras and info and the 3 lines is copied because it goes with my views well.

I got it from http://www.lp.org/issues/issues.shtml and  http://www.lp.org/issues/platform_all.shtml

Last edited by Phantom2828 (2006-11-05 13:20:48)

mafia996630
© 2009 Jeff Minard
+319|7036|d

Phantom2828 wrote:

..teddy..jimmy wrote:

mmm which website did you copy this from
I wrote the top part.
The rest past Extras and info and the 3 lines is copied because it goes with my views well.

I got it from http://www.lp.org/issues/issues.shtml and  http://www.lp.org/issues/platform_all.shtml
SO its wasnt really a long post, was it?
Phantom2828
Member
+51|6800|Land of the free
The first part was.

Ok guys either post about economics or don't post in this thread.
Naughty_Om
Im Ron Burgundy?
+355|6905|USA
im in Econ AP right now. all i know is that Free Trade rules. and "shifts happen"
Phantom2828
Member
+51|6800|Land of the free
I despise government control of the economy.
wah1188
You orrible caaaaaaan't
+321|6732|UK
Being honest no economy is completely free market, the U.S is a mix and not entirely free same with UK. Free markets allow for maximum efficiency and allocation of resources to their most profitable output the invisble hand (Alan Smith) . It removes the tried and failed method of a planned economy where in there is no profit motive to work, this can lead to low labour productivity and the "free riders". However one thing can be said about the free market and that is, it can create huge inequalities and many different social economic groups within society.

Also some goods and services are just not valued enough by the general public and will just not be provided this requires government intervention in order to provide this. Schools for example many parents most likely wouldn't pay for their children to school. The government is required to set-up and run schools since it will benefit society by hopefully creating a higher skilled workforce. There are grammar schools and stuff but if you think about it and all the government run schools were privatised the number of children attending school would differ.

Oh and one thing to consider G.D.P bares only some relation to H.D.I, one good exmaple is Cuba a communist country does quite poor in the G.D.P ranking but does a lot better in the H.D.I. So not all communist countries completely fail.

In brief free markets do create a better economy in monetary terms, however sometimes the government does need to step and a sort some stuff mainly the social even though it usually makes things worse.
Phantom2828
Member
+51|6800|Land of the free
One of the reasons America became as strong as it did was the free market. We no longer have it like that anymore as is addressed in my post.
One of the reasons the Soviet union fell was because their economic system sucked.
wah1188
You orrible caaaaaaan't
+321|6732|UK
No this thread can't die!!!
mafia996630
© 2009 Jeff Minard
+319|7036|d

wah1188 wrote:

No this thread can't die!!!
LOLOLOL, i agreee dude. I feel sry for poster.
Agent_Dung_Bomb
Member
+302|7008|Salt Lake City

Phantom2828 wrote:

One of the reasons America became as strong as it did was the free market. We no longer have it like that anymore as is addressed in my post.
One of the reasons the Soviet union fell was because their economic system sucked.
Just remember that there is no way this country could thrive on a pure free market system, any more than we could survive as a pure democracy.  This is why we had the depression after the market crash of 1929.  The regulation we have in place are also meant to try avoid things like those we've seen from Enron, World Com, Tyco, Adelphia, etc.

Monopolies are not a good thing.  When you lack competition, the drive to inovate goes out the window.  It could also lead to massive unemployment.  The fact is that privately owned businesses provide more jobs than major corporations.  If we were to allow monopolies to exist, larger corporations with the ability to raise massive capital or borrow mass amounts of money could simply wipe out any small business competition.
jonsimon
Member
+224|6767
The "Free Market" as it is understood by the foolish layman, is actually damaging to society.

I am an advocate of support for long term economic growth. This includes anything that aids the economy in the long term, ie. social welfare, distribution of wealth, anti-corporation, free trade, etc. When you support the long-term future, the short-term future is more likely not to experience fluctuations, particularly recessions or depressions.
Turquoise
O Canada
+1,596|6677|North Carolina
I'm a cross between a free market economist and a monetarist.
Bertster7
Confused Pothead
+1,101|6854|SE London

I don't really care. As long as Bush starts to balance his books and gets rid of the enormous deficits he's managed to create with his extortionate spending and disproportionate tax cuts. He should take a leaf out of Clintons book and turn those deficits into supluses, or even better, he should clear national debt - like Jackson did.

Defence is one area where spending could fall radically quite easily. People go on and on about America being able to defend itself, which of course it can and could for half the expenditure, easily. As for abandoning countries America has long term defence commitments to, that is an awful and selfish idea. The Japanese have American defence backing because the US dropped nukes on them, it can't suddenly be withdrawn. If the US did withdraw forces from the area then Japan would have developed nukes of their own in no time.

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