I wonder what the Democratic view of what would happen if we pull out of Iraq immediately? (Within the next 3 months)
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- So Democrats...what's do you think will happen if we pull out of Iraq?
Apparently they have no ideas. How surprising!
I'll be a democrat for this thread.
Well, we'll leave them to govern there own affairs and stand back and watch as millions are slaughtered like they were by Pol Pot.
Then we will use this of an example why the U.S. military shouldn't go anywhere and do anything other than plant tree and empty out the military bases so wez can close dem butt goot!
Well, we'll leave them to govern there own affairs and stand back and watch as millions are slaughtered like they were by Pol Pot.
Then we will use this of an example why the U.S. military shouldn't go anywhere and do anything other than plant tree and empty out the military bases so wez can close dem butt goot!
I'll tell you... Everything will go to shit.....
the same exact thing as if we stay.
Only we'll save US lives, save loads of money we don't have in the first place, and we can divert resources to where the real 9/11 problem lies (afghanistan), shore up port security, etc. Need I go on?
I also know this... it sure beats the hell out of "stay the course and lose." doctrine of the current administration.
But here's one for you.... What do you think would have happened if we pulled out of Vietnam in 1968?
the same exact thing as if we stay.
Only we'll save US lives, save loads of money we don't have in the first place, and we can divert resources to where the real 9/11 problem lies (afghanistan), shore up port security, etc. Need I go on?
I also know this... it sure beats the hell out of "stay the course and lose." doctrine of the current administration.
But here's one for you.... What do you think would have happened if we pulled out of Vietnam in 1968?
anybody got a time machine the goverment could use?
The same thing as when we pulled out in 74-75MoChief wrote:
I'll tell you... Everything will go to shit.....
the same exact thing as if we stay.
Only we'll save US lives, save loads of money we don't have in the first place, and we can divert resources to where the real 9/11 problem lies (afghanistan), shore up port security, etc. Need I go on?
I also know this... it sure beats the hell out of "stay the course and lose." doctrine of the current administration.
But here's one for you.... What do you think would have happened if we pulled out of Vietnam in 1968?
If we do not establish some decent standard of living for these people, and give them a help up with freedom they will always act out.
The population cannot be trusted to see the big picture. That is why we elect people to do it for us...well...thats the idea anyways.
A foothold of freedom in the middle east will change the world.
John Kerry would tango with Jock strap Chriraqueee! Hillary would call to impeach Bush. Bill would have sex with someone other than his wife. Rush would complain. China would give nukes to Iran while our satellites are blinded by freaking laser beams. Chavez would drink more coffee while pleasuring himself -thinking about his UN speech and that Iranian dictator nut job. The insurgents would dance in the street screaming some gibberish shooting their AK's with one hand and beating their 12 wives with the other. OPEC would raise the price on oil by 3000 dollars a barrel. The newly formed NFL team comprised entirely of Hollywood Actors would win the Super Bowl. Cuba would take over Florida, Georgia and South Carolina -while illegal Mexican aliens annex Texas (we let em though cause we were jerks to them).... Cars would fly, powered by V8 drinks -Gore figures out how to do it. Dolphins would become smart enough to avoid the tuna nets. Ice Caps and Glaciers would reform and take Canada (no one notices though). World peace breaks out except for France which decides to prove that they are bad asses by invading Zanzibar (they lose). Republicans are rounded up and summarily executed by PETA.
I stood in line for four hours. They better give me a Wal-Mart gift card, or something. - Rodney Booker, Job Fair attendee.
Bam +1 for youDBBrinson1 wrote:
John Kerry would tango with Jock strap Chriraqueee! Hillary would call to impeach Bush. Bill would have sex with someone other than his wife. Rush would complain. China would give nukes to Iran while our satellites are blinded by freaking laser beams. Chavez would drink more coffee while pleasuring himself -thinking about his UN speech and that Iranian dictator nut job. The insurgents would dance in the street screaming some gibberish shooting their AK's with one hand and beating their 12 wives with the other. OPEC would raise the price on oil by 3000 dollars a barrel. The newly formed NFL team comprised entirely of Hollywood Actors would win the Super Bowl. Cuba would take over Florida, Georgia and South Carolina -while illegal Mexican aliens annex Texas (we let em though cause we were jerks to them).... Cars would fly, powered by V8 drinks -Gore figures out how to do it. Dolphins would become smart enough to avoid the tuna nets. Ice Caps and Glaciers would reform and take Canada (no one notices though). World peace breaks out except for France which decides to prove that they are bad asses by invading Zanzibar (they lose). Republicans are rounded up and summarily executed by PETA.
But in reality I think Iraq would have a massive civil war, probably breeak up into three countries of shiites, kurds and suni's. The UN and US would come back to stop the fighting, but most likely leave it as three countries. Oil prices would sky rocket as the oil fields in Iraq would be fought over daily.
Either that or the second the US left Iran would invade and really cause some problems. (remember, Iran and Iraq have been at war before in recent history) And Democrats would scream that this would have never happend if we hadn't destroyed Sadaams army, and republicans would blaim democrats for leaving Iraq before Iraq had a means of defending it self.
Your damned if you do, and your damned if you don't. Personally I think the US should stay just on princible. We came in, destroyed infrustructure, left the country defenseless and in general fucked things up. You don't do that and say, well that was fun, good luck cleaning up that mess. you've made your bed, now you've got to sleep in it.
I like how you say that like the dems got us into this mess.Stingray24 wrote:
Apparently they have no ideas. How surprising!
Idiot.
The US is in a tough position politically atm. Sort of like stuck in quicksand, or a giant sticky bog.....If they pull out they will lose even more international credibility. If they stay, guerilla warfare will get worse.
Between a rock and a hard place I'd say.
Between a rock and a hard place I'd say.
You're supposed to say "quagmire"maffiaw wrote:
The US is in a tough position politically atm. Sort of like stuck in quicksand, or a giant sticky bog.....If they pull out they will lose even more international credibility. If they stay, guerilla warfare will get worse.
Between a rock and a hard place I'd say.
aye, thats the word.Ikarti wrote:
You're supposed to say "quagmire"maffiaw wrote:
The US is in a tough position politically atm. Sort of like stuck in quicksand, or a giant sticky bog.....If they pull out they will lose even more international credibility. If they stay, guerilla warfare will get worse.
Between a rock and a hard place I'd say.
Interesting choice: the US supported the Khmer Rouge.ATG wrote:
Well, we'll leave them to govern there own affairs and stand back and watch as millions are slaughtered like they were by Pol Pot.
QFEPRiMACORD wrote:
I like how you say that like the dems got us into this mess.Stingray24 wrote:
Apparently they have no ideas. How surprising!
Idiot.
Dividing the country up like this is perhaps not a bad idea. Have a limited amnesty, during which people are free to cross borders between the three, then have the borders either patrolled by foreign troops or have foreign troops supervise the patrols. With the various groups not forced to live together, perhaps things will quiet down. These sorts of tactics have worked before.ts-pulsar wrote:
But in reality I think Iraq would have a massive civil war, probably breeak up into three countries of shiites, kurds and suni's.
Really who cares what happens. They want us out, lets grant their wish.
Which foreign troops? Remember he said if we pull out.Bubbalo wrote:
, then have the borders either patrolled by foreign troops or have foreign troops supervise the patrols.
Xbone Stormsurgezz
How bout go and read what the democratic politicians are saying about it! It might surprise you that they're NOT saying "We should leave Iraq immediately and plant flowers and trees for them to adore as they go back to their previously blissful life before the war machine hit them."
OMG NOOOO!!!! That certainly is NOT the idea!! The government is supposedly there to run things for us the way WE tell them to. That is to say: The government will act according to the peoples' will, no matter what. In an ideal state of democracy and freedom, the people would decide about everything through plebiscites. You sure have a strange understanding of Democracy ATG... sounds more like fascism!!! You better get your facts straight fast!ATG wrote:
The population cannot be trusted to see the big picture. That is why we elect people to do it for us...well...thats the idea anyways.
ƒ³
Isn't that why we have referendums, amendments, and propositions? ^^
Xbone Stormsurgezz
ummmm......ok, you're in greece so I know it's easy to mistake the two, even most americans wrongly believe we live in a democracy, but our founding fathers basically saw democracy=mob rule, so they established a representative republic, sometimes called a constitutional republic, or after Lincoln a federal republic, republic meaning-it is a government of representatives in the tradition of rome, the democratic aspect is that we, the public, gets to elect those who represent usoug wrote:
OMG NOOOO!!!! That certainly is NOT the idea!! The government is supposedly there to run things for us the way WE tell them to. That is to say: The government will act according to the peoples' will, no matter what. In an ideal state of democracy and freedom, the people would decide about everything through plebiscites. You sure have a strange understanding of Democracy ATG... sounds more like fascism!!! You better get your facts straight fast!ATG wrote:
The population cannot be trusted to see the big picture. That is why we elect people to do it for us...well...thats the idea anyways.
ATG - what you're saying makes sense, but show one example of where the general public was against a war and the Generals still ended up winning. Was the general public against World War 1 and 2? No.... what about Vietnam? Well, that's a different story.
Do you honestly think that in the middle of a firefight, soldiers in Iraq say to themselves "Screw it, I saw those hippies protesting the war and so now I have no more will to fight. "and get shot? You say it's up to the elected people to decide what to do, well, you do know that there is a very small percentage of politicians who actually have kids in the military?
The whole idea in Vietnam and maybe in future Iraq wars, is that in thr begining, most politicians support the war, until the draft is put in place, and it's their sons and daughters going over there to fight. I realize that we might be saving some innocent lives, but is it worth dying for at this point? We've killed tens of thousands of innocent people, whether you support the war or not, and that will certainly create more terrorists. It's a no win situation. We stay there, hope for the best, keep killing and creating terrorists, or we leave, and all things turn crazy.
No one knows what will happen, but if you can cite one US led complete occupation of an unstable country that lasted more than 3 years and still managed to help the people create their own government, in recent history, I'd like to read about it.
Do you honestly think that in the middle of a firefight, soldiers in Iraq say to themselves "Screw it, I saw those hippies protesting the war and so now I have no more will to fight. "and get shot? You say it's up to the elected people to decide what to do, well, you do know that there is a very small percentage of politicians who actually have kids in the military?
The whole idea in Vietnam and maybe in future Iraq wars, is that in thr begining, most politicians support the war, until the draft is put in place, and it's their sons and daughters going over there to fight. I realize that we might be saving some innocent lives, but is it worth dying for at this point? We've killed tens of thousands of innocent people, whether you support the war or not, and that will certainly create more terrorists. It's a no win situation. We stay there, hope for the best, keep killing and creating terrorists, or we leave, and all things turn crazy.
No one knows what will happen, but if you can cite one US led complete occupation of an unstable country that lasted more than 3 years and still managed to help the people create their own government, in recent history, I'd like to read about it.
Well I guess you could say South Korea is a example. They were at war and being invaded which makes them stable. Though they already had a goverment of there chosing so w/e.Spearhead wrote:
No one knows what will happen, but if you can cite one US led complete occupation of an unstable country that lasted more than 3 years and still managed to help the people create their own government, in recent history, I'd like to read about it.
I know what will happen. Not only will Iraq get taken over by terrorists and al-queda(sp), Iran will get nuclear bombs (if they don't already have them), and attack Israel and America, starting WW III and many, many more deaths.
I don't think I'm mistaken here... I know very well what democracy is (being from greece 'n all ) and how the American system works. It is as you say: they are elected to represent you. In other words to carry out YOUR will. Don't get carried away with insignificant particularities of each democratic subsystem. In essence all democratic governments are the same in their basic principles. And it doesn't get any more basic than this. Either the governors do as the people command, or they are kicked out. Having a mind of your own and acting all elitistic about info that concerns the country has no place in a democracy.kr@cker wrote:
ummmm......ok, you're in greece so I know it's easy to mistake the two, even most americans wrongly believe we live in a democracy, but our founding fathers basically saw democracy=mob rule, so they established a representative republic, sometimes called a constitutional republic, or after Lincoln a federal republic, republic meaning-it is a government of representatives in the tradition of rome, the democratic aspect is that we, the public, gets to elect those who represent usoug wrote:
OMG NOOOO!!!! That certainly is NOT the idea!! The government is supposedly there to run things for us the way WE tell them to. That is to say: The government will act according to the peoples' will, no matter what. In an ideal state of democracy and freedom, the people would decide about everything through plebiscites. You sure have a strange understanding of Democracy ATG... sounds more like fascism!!! You better get your facts straight fast!ATG wrote:
The population cannot be trusted to see the big picture. That is why we elect people to do it for us...well...thats the idea anyways.
ƒ³
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- So Democrats...what's do you think will happen if we pull out of Iraq?