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Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,776|5400|eXtreme to the maX
Trump Jr looks like he gutted a hobo and had his beard transplanted on.
Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+1,975|6066|USA

It does look strangely drawn on in certain lighting, even in candid photos. He's got his dad's "what?" frown, too.

https://media.gq.com/photos/5dd6f6a3be771100085d0b80/16:9/w_2560%2Cc_limit/Donald-Trump-Jr-book-gq-november-2019.jpg
'Ain't I a stinker?'

The book's title anyway, "the left wants to silence us." Yes, the left, so widely known for sending people with guns to block voters from the polls. Thriving on hate, unlike the chanting church people in mac's video.
SuperJail Warden
Gone Forever
+558|3013
I am working on a project for the SS Department (Social Studies you weirdos!). I am using new tech to create lessons on LGBT history. I thought this up since the LGBT mandate is new and you need to work on projects in order to have a chance of moving up in the system.

But yes, I will be creating lessons on LGBT history that many other teachers will use. I am the greatest ally in American history. Nobody can ever call me a homophobe ever again.
https://i.imgur.com/xsoGn9X.jpg
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+1,975|6066|USA

I suppose you're doing it to advance your career but will still be posting your fears and doubts here of a "transwoman linebacker," ("it" for short) using the restroom in a stall next to your aunt alongside the fears and doubts of the very "pigmen" you badmouth.

I don't even know what the contents of your program will be.
SuperJail Warden
Gone Forever
+558|3013
I strongly support lesbians, gays, and bisexuals. The trans situation is a bit more complicated. I support the government paying for gender reassignment surgery. I will use whatever pronoun or name anyone wants. I came in contact with a kid a few months back who didn't want me to use the name on the list because that is their "dead name". I smiled and said "okay. That's super cool. Have a great rest of your day [new name]." The kid was probably very nervous to speak up to a stranger about their name.

Transgender women playing in women sports is incredibly problematic. I don't know any good solution to the bathroom situation. I have seen guys act like the bathroom police and try to drag a butch lesbian out of the bathroom because they didn't know they were a girl. I am also a bit more cautious about youth gender reassignment. I wonder how many of the kids who want to change genders would instead be happy to live proudly out as a gay person if society didn't make that hard. How many just need some depression medication and less social media. I will acknowledge that being trans is a lot of work and something people wouldn't do on a whim.

That is way more progressive than pig people.

Also the project gives me an opportunity to punch down on red states.
https://i.imgur.com/xsoGn9X.jpg
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+1,975|6066|USA

I see a lot of editorializing and fears on the sports stuff but not a lot of reference to studies. From BMJ:

Objective: To examine the effect of gender affirming hormones on athletic performance among transwomen and transmen.

Methods: We reviewed fitness test results and medical records of 29 transmen and 46 transwomen who started gender affirming hormones while in the United States Air Force. We compared pre- and post-hormone fitness test results of the transwomen and transmen with the average performance of all women and men under the age of 30 in the Air Force between 2004 and 2014. We also measured the rate of hormone associated changes in body composition and athletic performance.

Results: Participants were 26.2 years old (SD 5.5). Prior to gender affirming hormones, transwomen performed 31% more push-ups and 15% more sit-ups in 1 min and ran 1.5 miles 21% faster than their female counterparts. After 2 years of taking feminising hormones, the push-up and sit-up differences disappeared but transwomen were still 12% faster. Prior to gender affirming hormones, transmen performed 43% fewer push-ups and ran 1.5 miles 15% slower than their male counterparts. After 1 year of taking masculinising hormones, there was no longer a difference in push-ups or run times, and the number of sit-ups performed in 1 min by transmen exceeded the average performance of their male counterparts.

Summary: The 15–31% athletic advantage that transwomen displayed over their female counterparts prior to starting gender affirming hormones declined with feminising therapy. However, transwomen still had a 9% faster mean run speed after the 1 year period of testosterone suppression that is recommended by World Athletics for inclusion in women’s events.

continues: https://bjsm.bmj.com/content/55/11/577
The results seem really far from the dominating tranny linebacker punch-down fare you get from Fox, "it-people" out to slap your grandmother's tush or creep on your niece in the rest stop restroom.

Who the hell makes such a life-sundering "choice to go trans" just so they can compete in girl's vollyball at the high school level, with a razor-thin edge over the competition if even that?
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+1,975|6066|USA

Transgender women playing in women sports is incredibly problematic. I don't know any good solution to the bathroom situation. I have seen guys act like the bathroom police and try to drag a butch lesbian out of the bathroom because they didn't know they were a girl. I am also a bit more cautious about youth gender reassignment. I wonder how many of the kids who want to change genders would instead be happy to live proudly out as a gay person if society didn't make that hard. How many just need some depression medication and less social media. I will acknowledge that being trans is a lot of work and something people wouldn't do on a whim.
Do people really "go trans" in America because it's an "easier path" (lol) than, er, coming out as gay? Is that theory in your program? Aren't their easier ways for a delinquent, other than permanently altering their body, to perv on girls' locker rooms?

I wonder how many movies are there of people coming out as trans vs. coming out as gay? In & Out probably has more of a boomer audience than Boys Don't Cry.

I think dominion of judgment should fall to doctors and psychiatrists, and individuals themselves, and not on moralists flapping their jaws on ten o'clock news. The decline of society, based on a gut feeling, because of the LGBT sandwich and people not going to church. Stay tuned for more jedi prophecies.
uziq
Member
+460|2746
i think that paragraph by macbeth is actually pretty remarkably level headed and fair.

lots of young people are confused and don't know what they 'are' (does anyone at that age? or ever in their lives, in some existential respects? and so on). all that motivates them is a basic body dysmorphia or a sense of not socially fitting in. i would be very surprised indeed if the majority of pre-teens/early teenagers knew decisively whether they are 'trans' or 'gay' (or both). everything is a muddle at that age, even for heterosexual people without major hangups over their gender or sexuality.
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+1,975|6066|USA

Of course, none of this to dismiss women's objection to having a transwoman's wing-wang ostentatiously flapping in the breeze at the local spa in front of their daughters, but these seem like outlying cases to me.

One trans acquaintance (former classmate) who came out did so very reluctantly, almost as if following some regimen set by their psychologist or something. I, who had been a guest at their wedding beforehand (I didn't pry on how that went), rather took it in stride. "Nice to hear from you, glad you're doing ok, still down for Unreal Tournament whenever." They knew me in the Bush years, so wer probably expecting a poor reaction, or had already received several poor reactions. I'm was under the impression that they preferred to leave most of their former social life behind. Rate of message exchange is currently like once every 5 years.

Anyway they had given years of thought to it and at least some of the family had been accepting (and unsurprised), so that's cool I guess.

uziq wrote:

i think that paragraph by macbeth is actually pretty remarkably level headed and fair.

lots of young people are confused and don't know what they 'are' (does anyone at that age? or ever in their lives, in some existential respects? and so on). all that motivates them is a basic body dysmorphia or a sense of not socially fitting in. i would be very surprised indeed if the majority of pre-teens/early teenagers knew decisively whether they are 'trans' or 'gay' (or both). everything is a muddle at that age, even for heterosexual people without major hangups over their gender or sexuality.
Same, but sadly some of that stuff often leads into knee-jerk. One person had second thoughts, let's cancel the whole program.
uziq
Member
+460|2746
one of the staff members at the UK's pioneering/most notable clinics specialising in child therapy wrote a very long contribution on this topic for the LRB. it was very insightful. she, too, has faced a lot of public criticism and had her career partially derailed by the politicisation of the topic. for years they were just doing 'good work' but now trans is part of a 'culture war'. can't be an easy minefield for the medical practitioners to navigate.

certainly a topic requiring a lot of nuance, patience and listening. that goes for pushy parents trying to do too well for their children, too.
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+1,975|6066|USA

US right now is a pretty good example of medicine getting sucked into culture war:

- the doctors are part of a vast conspiracy to make you all afraid of the scamdemic so the Democrats can assume dictatorship!
- sex change surgeons are milking America and ruining families. the gay agenda at work!
SuperJail Warden
Gone Forever
+558|3013

Uzique wrote:

lots of young people are confused and don't know what they 'are' (does anyone at that age? or ever in their lives, in some existential respects? and so on). all that motivates them is a basic body dysmorphia or a sense of not socially fitting in. i would be very surprised indeed if the majority of pre-teens/early teenagers knew decisively whether they are 'trans' or 'gay' (or both). everything is a muddle at that age, even for heterosexual people without major hangups over their gender or sexuality.
I read somewhere that a lot of youth age of the being trans. Same way a lot of people age out of being goth, emo, etc. Get them away from their mandatory high school communities and the pressure to conform to whatever group goes away. The fact that LGBT clubs are probably the most welcoming probably drives some of it too.


uziq wrote:

i think that paragraph by macbeth is actually pretty remarkably level headed and fair.
https://youtu.be/EScVpo-1zlw

@Newbie

A lot of the worries about women's sports and youth from conservative anti-T people is bad faith. Who really gives a shit about the sanctity of the WNBA? Conservatives hate the youth too. "Their music is bad. Back in my day, you needed a guitar to make music...no I can't play the guitar"

Also, I assume most male anti-LGBT people are closet cases. Need to go incognito before heading to xvideos. I know your sins. God knows your sins.
https://i.imgur.com/xsoGn9X.jpg
Larssen
Member
+90|1181
I really don't know a single trans person in my life and have maybe interacted with one a handful of times. Can't believe the gender identity of <0,01% of the population has become a major political topic and one of the centrepieces in a 'culture war'. I also barely have the energy to spend my days pondering how we as a society can best accomodate people at the absolute cultural fringes, at least not to the point where I believe we should have national whole-of-society debates on the topic.
SuperJail Warden
Gone Forever
+558|3013
You, Ken, and Uzique work with white collar types all day. I doubt you get many chances to meet people outside of your professional class.

I am around thousands of random people all day. I see plenty of obvious LGBT people. They exist. I have seen them.

Also
https://c.tenor.com/B5HkXHQgZ74AAAAC/im-in-touch-with-humanity-christian-bale.gif
https://i.imgur.com/xsoGn9X.jpg
Larssen
Member
+90|1181
gay and bisexual people sure, but it's statistically unlikely you personally know transgender people or even interact with them on any semi-regular basis. It's rare to the point that I'd just fall back to a philosophy of 'live and let live', where beyond basic adjustments in national laws where necessary I'd just defer to professionals & local organisations to figure out their own way of working wrt trans people.
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+1,975|6066|USA

I think sometimes that gets translated into them being such a small group that it's not worth bothering with any guarantees of fair treatment, even with the oversized target on their back. Let the small governments and corporate structures work it out. I'm sure that'll always be in their favor.
SuperJail Warden
Gone Forever
+558|3013
The free market will sort it all out.
https://i.imgur.com/xsoGn9X.jpg
Larssen
Member
+90|1181
The alternative would be that for some reason national legislators would have to put pen to paper and devise and entrench into law transgender-specific norms and rules to stuff like bathroom rights and gender reassignment treatment.

No thanks. First, that's ridiculous. Second, let the professionals and local people involved decide on a case basis what they want to do with this. The national government is not some national cultural police, with the important caveat that any treatment should not be in violation of existing discrimination laws. Which are for the courts to deal with and create jurisprudence on.
uziq
Member
+460|2746
You, Ken, and Uzique work with white collar types all day. I doubt you get many chances to meet people outside of your professional class.
my entire social life is based around music and the arts. LMAO at the idea i spend my entire time around 'white collar' people. the publishing industry isn't working for the tax revenue service, macbeth. it's arty and bohemian and fosters quite a lot of eccentrics. (there is literally a staff member at my publishing house, in the IT department, who sent an email to send:all in the organisation announcing his transition and requesting to be named a woman's name.)

i have been to tonnes of clubnights, more than i can count, with an element of drag/ballroom/vogue or with a big LGBTQ+ crowd. that's kind of what house music is, or was traditionally. melting pots and 'safe spaces', in the original, pre-culture war sense of the term.

i am pretty willing to bet i've been around some more 'out there' people than you have. i've lived in london, bristol and for short periods in places like berlin. you live in new jersey. you wouldn't survive a fucking weekend in berlin

Last edited by uziq (2022-01-13 10:26:01)

SuperJail Warden
Gone Forever
+558|3013
Your system is probably very different from ours. Workplace accommodations and school whatever is all done through executive departments. Anything they do can be undone by the next executive. Codifying things into law is very hard in America but also hard to undo. If Congress passed legislation to protect LGBT rights, that would be much better than having a department make a decision.
https://i.imgur.com/xsoGn9X.jpg
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+1,975|6066|USA

Larssen wrote:

The alternative would be that for some reason national legislators would have to put pen to paper and devise and entrench into law transgender-specific norms and rules to stuff like bathroom rights and gender reassignment treatment.

No thanks. First, that's ridiculous. Second, let the professionals and local people involved decide on a case basis what they want to do with this. The national government is not some national cultural police, with the important caveat that any treatment should not be in violation of existing discrimination laws. Which are for the courts to deal with and create jurisprudence on.
The "local people" are some of the ones who will grab a butch woman by the shoulders and toss her out because they think she's a dude looking to perv on the women's room.

One of many anecdotes:

It was bound to happen, given the wave of anti-trans bathroom bills and accompanying hysteria and propaganda stirred up by conservative organizations and other right-wingers in the United States and Canada.

A cisgender woman — that is, a natal female who identifies as female — was allegedly dragged out of  the women’s washroom in a restaurant by a security guard and thrown into the street because he thought she was a man. According to reports, neither the security guard nor the restaurant’s manager would listen to her when she told them she is female.

The incident allegedly happened in January at Fishbone’s Rhythm Cafe in Detroit to Cortney Bogorad, who has filed a lawsuit against the establishment, reports Advocate.com .

https://montrealgazette.com/life/bathro … men-beware
No thanks to leaving this kind of stuff purely in their capable hands.

How would you feel if one of mac's pigmen punched one of your relatives in the face because they thought she was a dude? And then maybe punched her again after finding out she was a woman because of some triggered sense of insecurity?
SuperJail Warden
Gone Forever
+558|3013
I live 5 minutes from Manhattan. Survive Berlin lol
https://i.imgur.com/xsoGn9X.jpg
uziq
Member
+460|2746
berlin is lot crazier than manhattan macbeth. people live incredibly 'alternative' lifestyles. sex clubs, gay clubs, chem-sex parties, etc, are mainstream, not hidden and out the way. you can go to (normal) dance clubs in berlin and there's dark rooms for people to do drugs, have orgies, etc. nobody bats an eyelid.

manhattan maybe had that in the era of paradise garage, warhol/velvet underground, the factory, etc. lmao. let's not pretend manhattan has been that way post-giuliani.

let's not get into a conversation of 'i'm worldy wizened'. you have never been to europe.

Last edited by uziq (2022-01-13 10:31:02)

SuperJail Warden
Gone Forever
+558|3013
NYC also has festivals and clubs you can overdose and get raped in.

I have been to every major city on the East Coast.
https://i.imgur.com/xsoGn9X.jpg
uziq
Member
+460|2746
wow! from atlantic city to camden. you sure have seen the world.

comparing manhattan to berlin now, today, just shows how little you know. it's a simple difference of gentrification. manhattan lost all of that 'weirdo originals' scene in the 1990s, at best. there aren't big drag clubs or hippies eking out alternative bohemian lifestyles in the village anymore, macbeth.

berlin, until very recently, was still extremely cheap for rent. it has been an 'artist's city' for this reason for decades. it's shabby-genteel, where manhattan is now, as far as cultural venues and scenes are concerned, 100% genteel. even brooklyn is way more commercialized and expensive than berlin today, where brooklyn-berlin used to be the central axis of arty hipsterdom in the early 2010s.

berlin also has an international reputation as a magnet for, well, freaks and outcasts. because it's known for being a welcoming and nonjudgmental place. it has been this way since the era of fucking wim wenders movies and the new german cinema. it was that way in the weimar era. berlin has always been a freaky little sex-pit -- not a reputation that manhattan has particularly traded on. in fact, haven't recent mayors gone out of their way to clean up times square and shut the sex cinemas and clean the whole place up?

you also need to consider that europeans are way more relaxed and permissive in general. like, waaaaay more relaxed about anything to do with sex or vice. it's a mark of sophistication, even, in some european circles.

silly point anyway. again, my whole social life in my 20s was tracked around underground music scenes and nightlife. lots of extreme environments, a very wide spectrum of characters, lots of drugs and afterparties and norm-bending, anything-goes behaviour. this isn't a brag, but the idea that you're more 'exposed' to the variety of life as a special education teacher in suburban new jersey is LOL.

weren't you literally posting here a few years ago like 'i went to my first ever nightclub the other night, i was high on weed and it was crazy!'

Last edited by uziq (2022-01-13 10:45:47)

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