Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6104|eXtreme to the maX

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

How did you get "white people bad" out of all that?

uziq wrote:

Yet no American president has so flagrantly pandered to white grievance as Donald Trump, even as he has praised himself for doing more for Black Americans than anyone ‘except maybe Abraham Lincoln’. The significance of this ugly achievement should not be underestimated. Trump understood that euphemisms are no longer necessary when it comes to attacking and humiliating people of colour – or making common cause with white nationalists, whose company would have scandalised earlier Republican leaders, whatever their convergences of views. In the last four years, Trump has fed his supporters a steady diet of racism and aggression. A small selection from this extensive menu would include his Birtherist questioning of Obama’s citizenship; his attack on the family of a Muslim-American soldier killed in action; his praise of those ‘very fine people’ among the Neo-Nazis who marched in Charlottesville; the Muslim travel ban; the fulminations against ‘shit-hole countries’; the gulag archipelago that his adviser Stephen Miller created for undocumented immigrants, in which children were separated from their parents and some women forced to undergo invasive vaginal examinations that reportedly resulted in sterilisation; and, not least, the violent dispersal of a Black Lives Matter protest outside the White House.

Not all of Trump’s supporters have enjoyed this theatre of cruelty. But most were indifferent, and saw no reason not to support him a second time. (An estimated 93 per cent of Republicans voted for him.) They were not dissuaded by his brazen misogyny, his envious embrace of foreign strongmen, his corruption and double-dealing or his continual lies. Even when those lies became literally lethal, Trump’s followers were not dissuaded by his conspiratorial claims that Covid-19 was a hoax contrived by Democrats, scientists or doctors to shut down his wonderful economy and deprive him of victory at the polls (or ‘Poles’, as he tweeted on election night). They were not dissuaded by the revelation, in Bob Woodward’s Rage, published in September, that Trump had recognised the airborne lethality of Covid-19 as early as 7 February. They were not dissuaded when he became infected with the virus and briefly acknowledged its gravity. On the contrary, they continued to go to his rallies, where not wearing a mask was a badge of pride. Epidemiologists have estimated that these gatherings caused 30,000 infections and 700 deaths. If this were the Middle East, the behaviour of Trump’s most ardent supporters might have been described by the mainstream media as an expression of fatalism, fundamentalism or a desire for martyrdom. But they believed that the closure of the economy posed a greater threat to them than Covid-19 – even when it began to ravage red states, whose residents, taking their cue from the president, either denied its reality or took comfort in the fact that it had so far mainly killed people in the infernal blue states of New York and California. They did not protest when Trump openly spoke of refusing to accept the election results, or assailed the postal service, or accused the Biden campaign of cheating. There was no possibility that ‘their’ America – and they left little doubt whose America it was – could vote against Trump; any victory for Biden could only be an illegitimate takeover, a triumph for ‘socialism’, for Black Lives Matter and antifa rioters, foetus killers and other enemies of the nuclear family. Trump, as one of his evangelical supporters told the New York Times, is ‘our bodyguard’.

In The Paranoid Style in American Politics, Richard Hofstadter wrote that the right-wing extremists who rallied behind Barry Goldwater’s 1964 race for president were

concerned more to express resentments and punish ‘traitors’, to justify a set of values and assert grandiose, militant visions, than to solve actual problems of state ... Their true victory lay not in winning the election but in capturing the party – in itself no mean achievement – which gave them an unprecedented platform from which to propagandise for a sound view of the world.

Trump, however, succeeded not only in capturing the Republican Party, but in proving that open resentment, raging against foreigners, denouncing ‘treason’ and essentially avoiding governance could be, for nearly half the population, an acceptable, even admirable, style of presidential leadership. Through his thunderous, nihilistic fury, he established an almost erotic connection with his base, which, unmoved by reason, often heedless of its own economic interests, found emotional compensation in his tributes to the ‘uneducated’ and his insults against members of Eastern seaboard ‘elites’.
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Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6104|eXtreme to the maX

uziq wrote:

a 'radical black democracy'? lmao.
Thats what the BLM crowd want - no police, unconstrained drug use, socialism so no-one has to work - look at any african country to see how that works out in the long run.
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unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6770|PNW

That's not "white people bad." A better take would be that it's a critique of the president and his supporters.

Honestly I think this forum is a bad influence on you. The more you're called out on weirdness here, the more entrenched and wacky your ideas become, like that one guy who keeps trying to convince me that Hillary wanted to ethnic cleanse white America.

Also stop trying to draw connections between black America and black Africa. Completely different dynamics at play. Freaking junior high debate club up in here.
lil_droo
Member
+19|1493

Dilbert_X wrote:

uziq wrote:

a 'radical black democracy'? lmao.
Thats what the BLM crowd want - no police, unconstrained drug use, socialism so no-one has to work - look at any african country to see how that works out in the long run.
where do u get this from? they want police just better policing and not getting killed for dumb shit and they dont want unconstrained drug use. they just dont want people going to prison for having a small amount of drugs on them and shit lol. i dont fully agree with BLM but really dude not many ppl are legit promoting that shit
gang shit
Larssen
Member
+99|1886

uziq wrote:

yes, pretty good précis of some major issues.

In The Frozen Republic (1996), Daniel Lazare argued that the sacralisation of the constitution stands in the way of a genuinely popular democracy. ‘In their infinite wisdom,’ Lazare writes,

the Founders created a deliberately unresponsive system in order to narrow the governmental options and force us to seek alternative routes. Politics were dangerous; therefore, politics had to be limited and constrained. But America cannot expect to survive much longer with a government that is inefficient and none too democratic by design. It is impossible to forge ahead in the late 20th century using governmental machinery dating from the late 18th. Urban conditions can only worsen, race relations can only grow more alienated and embittered. Politics will grow more irrational and self-defeating, while the price of the good life ... can only continue its upward climb beyond the reach of all but the most affluent. Rush Limbaugh, Howard Stern and other demagogues of the airwaves will continue to make out like bandits, while the millions of people who listen to them will only grow angrier and more depressed.

Lazare’s predictions today seem understated. The ‘demagogues of the airwaves’ on Fox News, notably Tucker Carlson, not only fan the resentments of their audiences, they now help steer the Republican Party and influenced the policy-making of the Trump administration. Politics has become so constrained that both Democrats and Republicans dream of achieving through the courts what they can’t achieve through political channels. The Republicans under Trump have exploited this route more effectively than any previous administration. But, whichever side is benefiting from it, this is a defective system.

The weaknesses of American democracy, which the Trump presidency has so powerfully exposed, can’t be entirely blamed on the constitution or on political procedure. They are rooted in the defeat of Reconstruction after the Civil War and the enduring power of white supremacy. In recent years, they have been amplified by deindustrialisation, the collapse of organised labour and the rise of social media. The Democratic Party bears a share of the responsibility for this. Since the Clinton administration, it has prioritised free trade and globalisation over jobs and economic equality, becoming a party of college-educated middle-class professionals, and largely turning its back on working-class voters.

[...]

Although Trump failed to deliver on his promise to revive American industry, he gave his followers the illusion of power, something they felt they’d been denied under Obama. He spoke powerfully to red America’s understanding of what it calls ‘freedom’. This freedom is as old as the republic, as old as our other great freedom narrative: the emancipation of Black Americans in their struggles against slavery, Jim Crow, and, more recently, mass incarceration. It originated as a fantasy of untrammelled individual liberty, made possible by the enslavement of Africans and the genocide of Native Americans. Today it means not having to take responsibility for other people or for the environment. Anti-taxation, deregulation, gun-ownership, ICE raids, Blue Lives Matter and environmental despoliation are its contemporary manifestations. The adherents of this ‘freedom’ don’t seek to build the country but to be left alone – even if it means dying of opioid addiction, or Covid-19. (This was what Mike Pence meant when, in response to a question about virus controls during his debate with Harris, he said that Trump trusts American families to ‘make choices in the best interest of their health’.) They are sovereigntists who don’t care about the opinion of the world beyond America’s borders. They don’t see why they should ‘go high’, as Michelle Obama advised. Going high is what happens when you ascend to heaven. On earth, you do what it takes to win – and in politics it takes a bully.
Just reacting to this bit:

I don't think it's right to characterise people who voted for Trump as having all been swayed by his narrative of white victimhood / white supremacy or promises of unbridled power, or because they want to hide from their responsibilities under the guise of untrammeled individual liberty. Of course this is a part of it and the polarisation in society is a real thing and yes Trump managed to get an aggressive nationalist fanaticism going that we haven't seen in decades. But this all reads a bit aggressively polarising too. We shouldn't forget that alongside the above, crucially all the 'traditional republicans' voted for him, the same sort who turned out for McCain and Romney, candidates who are in no way comparable to Trump. Definitely not all or a majority are conspiracy peddling, doomsday prepping racist climate change deniers. They're motivated in many different ways, but all united in their opposition to the democrat platform. A platform which latches on to all activist causes it can find and which promises a totally engineerable world, where with enough taxation, regulation and government intervention all problems from climate change to social inequality can be solved. There's also an element of self preservation: be it from an identification with 'whiteness' to people who work in oil and gas, they veer away from the democrat platform. Let's also not forget the myriad of articles that emphasised Trump's draw among latinos in Florida and how opposition to 'socialism' drove cuban americans to vote for a seeming white supremacist. We may hate that behaviour and say that their voting for Trump is an implicit promotion of his misogynism and racism, which is unforgivable to an activist platform prioritising social issues above all, but in a system that offers only a binary choice there's little room to maneouver wrt one's views and I can imagine such groups have their own (selfish or ideological) reasons to vote for him anyway.

It is also true and shouldn't be denied that there's a vast amount of left leaning analyses in the USA that rest on a deconstruction of power and society through its racial composition and relations. In the resulting narrative the image of the 'dominant white male' and 'white society' is an antagonist, an always enduring oppressive force - from CEOs to politics to education and other areas of influence, to structural issues any other group face be it women to latinos to muslims, the conclusions are invariably that there's too many white men at the top, an ingrained preference for white people, and as a group that white people are exclusionary. Most obviously the focus of analysis/the problem is put too closely alongside racial identity (paradoxically it has to be for historical reasons), by which the processes and interactions that exist in all groups which are really responsible for exclusionary behaviour fade into the background. When pushing this narrative how can you NOT expect there to be a pushback as well? Particularly among the group of disenfranchised white trash who turn out en masse for Trump rallies. In their eyes, all they're seeing is a battle for survival, with a popular culture that is problematising them - from stereotypical depictions, disapproval of their industries, to productions like 'dear white people' or books like 'why I no longer talk to white people about race' (I know it was written by a british woman, but it was a hit in the USA particularly as well).

I've seen some episodes of dear white people and thought it was good, but can't help but notice that the title itself caused a piling on of angry incel/racial supremacists who had a field day with what they considered 'reverse racism'. Furthermore in a society obsessed by its racial divides and their analysis, the white trash too judge harshly on matters of race: the notion that minorities being poor or disenfranchised probably has something to do with the fact that they're minorities prevails.
uziq
Member
+492|3450

Dilbert_X wrote:

uziq wrote:

a 'radical black democracy'? lmao.
Thats what the BLM crowd want - no police, unconstrained drug use, socialism so no-one has to work - look at any african country to see how that works out in the long run.
l
m
a
o
uziq
Member
+492|3450

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

That's not "white people bad." A better take would be that it's a critique of the president and his supporters.

Honestly I think this forum is a bad influence on you. The more you're called out on weirdness here, the more entrenched and wacky your ideas become, like that one guy who keeps trying to convince me that Hillary wanted to ethnic cleanse white America.

Also stop trying to draw connections between black America and black Africa. Completely different dynamics at play. Freaking junior high debate club up in here.
i honestly think dilbert just comes here for attention at this point. it’s his social stimulation each day. he plays the pantomime bad guy or the gruff racist uncle. it’s like a little roleplay or something.
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6104|eXtreme to the maX

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

Also stop trying to draw connections between black America and black Africa. Completely different dynamics at play.
Its the same people with the same instincts, wherever they become dominant coincidentally turns into a shit hole.
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Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6104|eXtreme to the maX

lil_droo wrote:

they dont want unconstrained drug use. they just dont want people going to prison for having a small amount of drugs on them and shit
Whats the difference?
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unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6770|PNW

uziq wrote:

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

That's not "white people bad." A better take would be that it's a critique of the president and his supporters.

Honestly I think this forum is a bad influence on you. The more you're called out on weirdness here, the more entrenched and wacky your ideas become, like that one guy who keeps trying to convince me that Hillary wanted to ethnic cleanse white America.

Also stop trying to draw connections between black America and black Africa. Completely different dynamics at play. Freaking junior high debate club up in here.
i honestly think dilbert just comes here for attention at this point. it’s his social stimulation each day. he plays the pantomime bad guy or the gruff racist uncle. it’s like a little roleplay or something.
If that's the case, he could instead direct his energies towards writing cuck stories or creating ethnic personas like macbeth. I mean come on, if even droo looks at what you have to say and goes "whoah, hold on man."
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6770|PNW

Dilbert_X wrote:

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

Also stop trying to draw connections between black America and black Africa. Completely different dynamics at play.
Its the same people with the same instincts, wherever they become dominant coincidentally turns into a shit hole.
Belligerent wars of extermination, children enslaved to robber barons and factories, world war devastation, unrest in the southeast, ultranationalistic reactionaries, etc. etc. Haha, stupid white people with their "white instincts" amirite.
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6104|eXtreme to the maX

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

Also stop trying to draw connections between black America and black Africa. Completely different dynamics at play.
A neat example, black kids in a black street gang kill a black kid whose parents are in the UK to leach off the NHS.


"What you don't get from the pictures is the smell," the former officer said.

"There's all the rotting food, the smell of urine and that whole despair that's just wider - just a horrendous place.

"At the time of Damilola's death, there were a group of young people on the estate [who] had a hierarchy, which was a complete and utter surprise to us.

"If you looked at it now and compared it with an organised crime syndicate it would look very similar.

"We were also absolutely struck by the fact that there was a relationship between young people being the victims of crime and young people being offenders."

"We couldn't get enough information from the local community about who may be responsible. There was a real reluctance to speak out.
https://i1.wp.com/metro.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/article-1300050822707-0b2951a100000578-105820_223x335.jpg?quality=90&strip=all&zoom=1&resize=223%2C335&ssl=1
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-london-55059793

Repeated across every black area in the world no?

Last edited by Dilbert_X (2020-11-27 14:48:45)

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unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6770|PNW

There's literally no way you can be serious right now. I refuse to believe it.
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6104|eXtreme to the maX
Why do black kids everywhere form crime gangs and terrorise the community?
Its instinctive.
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Larssen
Member
+99|1886
Dilbert how does this work if you see white neonazis, is fascist racism genetic to white ppl?
unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6770|PNW

Poulsbo in Washington originated as a Norwegian community. Sure wouldn't want to build a church there. They'd be sure to murder the priests, steal the goods, and burn it to the ground.
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6104|eXtreme to the maX

Larssen wrote:

Dilbert how does this work if you see white neonazis, is fascist racism genetic to white ppl?
Its genetic to everyone, not just white people.
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SuperJail Warden
Gone Forever
+635|3718

DesertFox- wrote:

The QAnon, electron fraud, and Covid denier conspiracy theorists all make me worry about the future. It's like an even stupider Millerite cult that remains steadfast in the face of their "sure-thing" theories falling flat. The biggest hope for the election fraudsters has been this Sydney Powell's "Kraken" lawsuit that is a rehash of everything previous but with bonus typos galore. People are barely speaking the same language anymore, let alone living in the same realities. I expect a certain amount will eventually realize that they've been conned, but nowhere near the majority. They'll stay and marinate in their worldview via Parler, Newsmax, or OAN and discard previous sources like FOX when it no longer is pushing the narrative they expect.

If it's so hard to convince a lot of Republicans that Joe fucking Biden would actually be better for them than a disinterested, silver-spoon goddamn billionaire, I don't know what chance there is to break them out of that worldview and actually make some progress.
The issue of right wingers living in a separate reality is problematic and electoral politics really doesn't work in conditions like this. "Reaching out" to the other side or comprising doesn't work when the other side will distort or ignore your actions in totality.
https://i.imgur.com/xsoGn9X.jpg
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6104|eXtreme to the maX
If it's so hard to convince a lot of Republicans that Joe fucking Biden would actually be better for them than a disinterested, silver-spoon goddamn billionaire, I don't know what chance there is to break them out of that worldview and actually make some progress.
But everyone can be in the top 1% if they just work hard.

I blame the low standard of education in America, and black kids reaching critical mass.

Last edited by Dilbert_X (2020-11-27 17:34:19)

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unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6770|PNW

At this point reading your posts is like watching one of those idiots online saying increasingly dumber and dumber shit until everyone calls them retarded. And at the end of the con, the idiot hops up onto the table going "lololol u iz trolled!"

"black kids reached critical mas hurrrrr"
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6104|eXtreme to the maX
Ask Macbeth if his classes are uncontrollable.
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unnamednewbie13
Moderator
+2,053|6770|PNW

And then when someone calls you a racist piece of shit you fire back with "white man bad." Golden.
SuperJail Warden
Gone Forever
+635|3718
The black percentage of the population of America has remained stagnant at about 15%. The fastest growth in the non-white population has been in Hispanics (17%) and Asians (6%). I think the latter two groups have done the most damaged to the wages of white Americans. The black population is the most politically active of the three which has probably resulted in their issues sucking the air out of any discussions regarding the other races. I think American society is overall more kind to Hispanics and Asians than it is to black people too.
https://i.imgur.com/xsoGn9X.jpg
Dilbert_X
The X stands for
+1,810|6104|eXtreme to the maX

unnamednewbie13 wrote:

And then when someone calls you a racist piece of shit you fire back with "white man bad." Golden.

Dilbert_X wrote:

Its OK, I don't care
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SuperJail Warden
Gone Forever
+635|3718

Dilbert_X wrote:

Ask Macbeth if his classes are uncontrollable.
My classes are the most controllable they have ever been. I can literally just mute kids at will now. You will have to force me to go back to physical education.
https://i.imgur.com/xsoGn9X.jpg

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