Snowden is a coward and hypocrite

2015-02-25 15:30:22

#1

SuperJail Warden: Gone Forever; +635|3711

Civil disobedience requires you to accept your punishment for breaking unjust laws. You don't get to take a stand against the government and then try to escape retribution.

And if you really cared so much about government tyranny, you wouldn't go to live in the least freest part of the industrialized world. Everything bad about America is worse there.

I have zero sympathy or patience for him and his supporters.

Please discuss

2015-02-25 17:21:23

#2

RTHKI: mmmf mmmf mmmf; +1,736|6729|Oxferd Ohire

is shahter still here

Last edited by RTHKI (2015-02-27 10:35:31)

2015-02-25 18:07:14

#3

Steve-0: Karma limited. Contact Admin to Be Promoted.; +214|3951|SL,UT

put down your parent's HBO, and back away slowly . . .

2015-02-25 22:26:51

#4

Shahter: Zee Ruskie; +295|6767|Moscow, Russia

well, yeah, i'm here, but i don't think there's stuff to be discussed, really. snowden is a fucking twat, that at least is true, but "least freest" and the rest is just silly.

if you open your mind too much your brain will fall out.

2015-02-26 00:45:02

#5

Dilbert_X: The X stands for; +1,810|6097|eXtreme to the maX

SuperJail Warden wrote:
disobedience requires you to accept

I think I've found the flaw in your argument

Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!

2015-02-26 01:55:53

#6

DrunkFace: Germans did 911; +427|6673|Disaster Free Zone

SuperJail Warden wrote:
punishment for breaking unjust laws.

Why should you be punished for unjust laws, in fact why do unjust laws exist?

You don't get to take a stand against the government and then try to escape retribution

That's exactly what you do. Good on him I say.

2015-02-26 03:02:12

#7

Cybargs: Moderated; +2,285|6708

DrunkFace wrote:
SuperJail Warden wrote:
punishment for breaking unjust laws.
Why should you be punished for unjust laws, in fact why do unjust laws exist?
You don't get to take a stand against the government and then try to escape retribution
That's exactly what you do. Good on him I say.

Anyone with a brain would do the same shit as Snowden. He saw how fucked Manning got so he knows he gotta get out.

US court system being the lolz that it is, if snowden takes his shit to court have fun going through circuit courts before being able to bring it to the supreme court.

https://cache.www.gametracker.com/server_info/203.46.105.23:21300/b_350_20_692108_381007_FFFFFF_000000.png

2015-02-26 03:43:27

#8

Shahter: Zee Ruskie; +295|6767|Moscow, Russia

DrunkFace wrote:
SuperJail Warden wrote:
punishment for breaking unjust laws.
Why should you be punished for unjust laws, in fact why do unjust laws exist?

the questions one should ask before troubling oneself with any of this would be something like the following:
is each and every bill or joe somehow automatically qualified to be judging whether or not the laws are just? should each and every one of the fuckers go about choosing for himself how exactly would he combat the "unjust laws"?

if you open your mind too much your brain will fall out.

2015-02-26 04:23:23

#9

Cybargs: Moderated; +2,285|6708

Shahter wrote:
DrunkFace wrote:
SuperJail Warden wrote:
punishment for breaking unjust laws.
Why should you be punished for unjust laws, in fact why do unjust laws exist?
the questions one should ask before troubling oneself with any of this would be something like the following:
is each and every bill or joe somehow automatically qualified to be judging whether or not the laws are just? should each and every one of the fuckers go about choosing for himself how exactly would he combat the "unjust laws"?

no that's why we have courts and legislature.

Last edited by Cybargs (2015-02-26 04:23:51)

2015-02-26 04:26:05

#10

Jaekus: I'm the matchstick that you'll never lose; +957|5170|Sydney

The Middle East has some pretty unjust laws, are you saying that women who are raped should just accept their punishment by being stoned to death? Or are these the unjust laws that only you decide should be obeyed?

2015-02-26 04:26:47

#11

Shahter: Zee Ruskie; +295|6767|Moscow, Russia

Cybargs wrote:
Shahter wrote:
DrunkFace wrote:

Why should you be punished for unjust laws, in fact why do unjust laws exist?
the questions one should ask before troubling oneself with any of this would be something like the following:
is each and every bill or joe somehow automatically qualified to be judging whether or not the laws are just? should each and every one of the fuckers go about choosing for himself how exactly would he combat the "unjust laws"?
no that's why we have courts and legislature.

well, yeah. but then come fucking assanges and snowdens and simply decide to take matters in their own hands with no regard for anything like anything you have courts and legislature for.

if you open your mind too much your brain will fall out.

2015-02-26 04:27:33

#12

DrunkFace: Germans did 911; +427|6673|Disaster Free Zone

Shahter wrote:
DrunkFace wrote:
SuperJail Warden wrote:
punishment for breaking unjust laws.
Why should you be punished for unjust laws, in fact why do unjust laws exist?
the questions one should ask before troubling oneself with any of this would be something like the following:
is each and every bill or joe somehow automatically qualified to be judging whether or not the laws are just? should each and every one of the fuckers go about choosing for himself how exactly would he combat the "unjust laws"?

Yes Everyone and yes.

2015-02-26 04:48:40

#13

Shahter: Zee Ruskie; +295|6767|Moscow, Russia

DrunkFace wrote:
Shahter wrote:
DrunkFace wrote:
Why should you be punished for unjust laws, in fact why do unjust laws exist?
the questions one should ask before troubling oneself with any of this would be something like the following:
is each and every bill or joe somehow automatically qualified to be judging whether or not the laws are just? should each and every one of the fuckers go about choosing for himself how exactly would he combat the "unjust laws"?
Yes Everyone and yes.

enjoy you snowdens, mannings and killer dozers then.

if you open your mind too much your brain will fall out.

2015-02-26 04:58:10

#14

Jaekus: I'm the matchstick that you'll never lose; +957|5170|Sydney

Shahter wrote:
Jaekus wrote:
The Middle East has some pretty unjust laws
they are three to five hundred years behind most of the industrialized world culturally and those are the laws they developed so far. all the efforts to "uplift" them to this date pretty much failed. tough shit.

are you saying that women who are raped should just accept their punishment by being stoned to death?
no. but their attempts to resist on their own would be futile, and you know it.

Or are these the unjust laws that only you decide should be obeyed?
i asked if everybody is automatically qualified to decide everything about every law for oneself. and if the methods to combat whatever one would deem "unjust laws" should also be for everybody to decide on their own. your answer is...?

Do you always take posts directed at the OP as some sort of personal affront?

2015-02-26 05:01:38

#15

Cybargs: Moderated; +2,285|6708

Jaekus wrote:
The Middle East has some pretty unjust laws, are you saying that women who are raped should just accept their punishment by being stoned to death? Or are these the unjust laws that only you decide should be obeyed?

Middle East doesn't really have a separation of government and religion, quite different to our system. I was talking in more of the context of the western legal system where unjust laws are usually changed by either legislature or judiciary (eg high court/supreme court decisions).

The way to get an "unjust" law overturned in our legal system is to actually bring it up to court or make parliament shed a tear for you. It's practically the only way to make a substantive change.

2015-02-26 05:05:26

#16

Shahter: Zee Ruskie; +295|6767|Moscow, Russia

Jaekus wrote:
Do you always take posts directed at the OP as some sort of personal affront?

what?... oh... right.
okay, nevermind. your post just looked like it was made in context of what i've beer replying to, so yeah, i took it as directed at me.

my mistake, removing that crap.

if you open your mind too much your brain will fall out.

2015-02-26 05:07:04

#17

Jaekus: I'm the matchstick that you'll never lose; +957|5170|Sydney

Cybargs wrote:
Jaekus wrote:
The Middle East has some pretty unjust laws, are you saying that women who are raped should just accept their punishment by being stoned to death? Or are these the unjust laws that only you decide should be obeyed?
Middle East doesn't really have a separation of government and religion, quite different to our system. I was talking in more of the context of the western legal system where unjust laws are usually changed by either legislature or judiciary (eg high court/supreme court decisions).

The way to get an "unjust" law overturned in our legal system is to actually bring it up to court or make parliament shed a tear for you. It's practically the only way to make a substantive change.

Like I said, I was replying to the OP, the first sentence to be exact.

2015-02-26 05:08:47

#18

Cybargs: Moderated; +2,285|6708

mah bad jaekus.

2015-02-26 05:09:57

#19

Jaekus: I'm the matchstick that you'll never lose; +957|5170|Sydney

Maybe I should quote next time

2015-02-26 05:56:39

#20

SuperJail Warden: Gone Forever; +635|3711

Jaekus wrote:
The Middle East has some pretty unjust laws, are you saying that women who are raped should just accept their punishment by being stoned to death? Or are these the unjust laws that only you decide should be obeyed?

Getting raped doesn't fall into the framework of civil disobedience

On the most widely accepted account of civil disobedience, famously defended by John Rawls (1971), civil disobedience is a public, non-violent and conscientious breach of law undertaken with the aim of bringing about a change in laws or government policies. On this account, people who engage in civil disobedience are willing to accept the legal consequences of their actions, as this shows their fidelity to the rule of law. Civil disobedience, given its place at the boundary of fidelity to law, is said to fall between legal protest, on the one hand, and conscientious refusal, revolutionary action, militant protest and organised forcible resistance, on the other hand.

Martin Luther king and Ghandi accepted their punishment. What makes Snowden special? He wants it both ways

2015-02-26 06:01:57

#21

Jaekus: I'm the matchstick that you'll never lose; +957|5170|Sydney

He wants to stay alive, or at least not end up in Gitmo.

2015-02-26 06:41:36

#22

Cybargs: Moderated; +2,285|6708

Ghandi and MLK weren't exactly spooks either.

edit: also Snowden won't ever get a public trial as this shit deals with espionage. completely different situation macbeth and you know it.

Last edited by Cybargs (2015-02-26 06:49:13)

2015-02-26 07:26:45

#23

Jaekus: I'm the matchstick that you'll never lose; +957|5170|Sydney

There's also a big difference between rallying the masses and divulging information to the masses.

2015-02-27 03:16:36

#24

Dilbert_X: The X stands for; +1,810|6097|eXtreme to the maX

Shahter wrote:
Cybargs wrote:
Shahter wrote:

the questions one should ask before troubling oneself with any of this would be something like the following:
is each and every bill or joe somehow automatically qualified to be judging whether or not the laws are just? should each and every one of the fuckers go about choosing for himself how exactly would he combat the "unjust laws"?
no that's why we have courts and legislature.
well, yeah. but then come fucking assanges and snowdens and simply decide to take matters in their own hands with no regard for anything like anything you have courts and legislature for.

And if the govt is committing crimes, what is the citizen supposed to do?

Committing a minor crime to prevent or prosecute a major crime is permitted - hence the police are allowed to assault, detain and even kill in certain circumstances.

Arguably the same applies to citizens.

Русский военный корабль, иди на хуй!

2015-02-27 03:56:48

#25

Shahter: Zee Ruskie; +295|6767|Moscow, Russia

Dilbert_X wrote:
Shahter wrote:
Cybargs wrote:
no that's why we have courts and legislature.
well, yeah. but then come fucking assanges and snowdens and simply decide to take matters in their own hands with no regard for anything like anything you have courts and legislature for.
And if the govt is committing crimes, what is the citizen supposed to do?

crimes are only crimes when a competent entity decides that. not every citizen is such an entity... actually... no individual citizen is such an entity.

Committing a minor crime to prevent or prosecute a major crime is permitted

by law. and then comes snowden...

hence the police are allowed to assault, detain and even kill in certain circumstances.

by law. and then comes manning...

Arguably the same applies to citizens.

yeah, yeah. let every war man make his own decisions on matters of national level of importance, and act on those. see how that goes.

Last edited by Shahter (2015-02-27 03:57:43)

if you open your mind too much your brain will fall out.

BF2S Forums Snowden is a coward and hypocrite

SuperJail Warden wrote:

SuperJail Warden wrote:

DrunkFace wrote:

SuperJail Warden wrote:

DrunkFace wrote:

SuperJail Warden wrote:

Shahter wrote:

DrunkFace wrote:

SuperJail Warden wrote:

Cybargs wrote:

Shahter wrote:

DrunkFace wrote:

Shahter wrote:

DrunkFace wrote:

SuperJail Warden wrote:

DrunkFace wrote:

Shahter wrote:

DrunkFace wrote:

Shahter wrote:

Jaekus wrote:

Jaekus wrote:

Jaekus wrote:

Cybargs wrote:

Jaekus wrote:

Jaekus wrote:

Shahter wrote:

Cybargs wrote:

Shahter wrote:

Dilbert_X wrote:

Shahter wrote:

Cybargs wrote:

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