Is America an Empire?

2013-04-03 13:06:07

#1

Macbeth: Banned; +2,444|5602

I mentioned before that America was an empire. Several people disagreed with me.

Newbie believed that we are not an empire because we don't have an emperor. I think that is a dumb statement. Several Australians argued with me that America isn't an empire and the last and greatest was the British. I think they are just trying to feel better about their country's insignificance and are trying to ride the coattails of the British.

What do you think?

2013-04-03 13:08:33

#2

pirana6: Go Cougs!; +685|6307|Washington St.

Define "empire" in your own words.

2013-04-03 13:16:28

#3

Macbeth: Banned; +2,444|5602

A large state that exploits multiple smallwr states and people for economic gain using violence.

2013-04-03 13:39:55

#4

pirana6: Go Cougs!; +685|6307|Washington St.

Then yes.

But "America" (assuming you mean the US of course) is one of many in the current world who are Empires

2013-04-03 13:50:04

#5

Uzique The Lesser: Banned; +382|4271

pax americana

2013-04-03 14:17:22

#6

AussieReaper: ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°); +5,761|6169|what

World Police.

2013-04-03 14:26:46

#7

KEN-JENNINGS: I am all that is MOD!; +2,973|6648|949

Manifest Destiny across the world!

2013-04-03 14:31:14

#8

Macbeth: Banned; +2,444|5602

You are all ruining the discourse of this forum. Stop.

2013-04-03 14:37:16

#9

Uzique The Lesser: Banned; +382|4271

yes, i do think america is an empire. but not as the terms classically set as simply 'empire'. neo-colonial/global capital 'empire'.

though it's quickly becoming irrelevant.

2013-04-03 14:38:05

#10

AussieReaper: ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°); +5,761|6169|what

Macbeth wrote:
You are all ruining the discourse of this forum. Stop.

I think they aren't in the business of Empire building, so aren't an Empire.

Policing the world doesn't count. That's just trying to maintain the state they have.

Let's argue that they are Empire building, their main rival would be China. When 1/5th of the worlds population is Chinese and the average human on Earth is a Han Chinese male, I think China has the better "Empire".

2013-04-03 14:56:00

#11

13urnzz: Banned; +5,830|6513

AussieReaper wrote:
I think they aren't in the business of Empire building, so aren't an Empire.

the Empire Building does hold a lot of business

2013-04-03 14:58:23

#12

AussieReaper: ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°); +5,761|6169|what

13urnzz wrote:
AussieReaper wrote:
I think they aren't in the business of Empire building, so aren't an Empire.
the Empire Building does hold a lot of business

No, that's a state building.

2013-04-03 14:59:29

#13

13urnzz: Banned; +5,830|6513

You are all ruining the discourse of this forum. Stop.

2013-04-03 15:06:16

#14

Jay: Bork! Bork! Bork!; +2,006|5374|London, England

Real World Facts about Empire States:

The U.S. State of New York has been known by many nicknames, the most notable of which is The Empire State. Adopted as late as the 19th century, the nickname has been incorporated into the names of several state buildings and events. It is commonly believed to refer to the state's wealth and resources; however, the true origin of the term is unclear.
There are several theories on the toponymy of the name. Two of them involve George Washington, one credits aggressive trade routes, and another associates the nickname with New York exceeding Virginia in population. None have been proven true. The origin of the term has puzzled many historians; as American writer Paul Eldridge put it, "Who was the merry wag who crowned the State ... [as the Empire State]? New York would certainly raise a monument to his memory, but he made his grandiose gesture and vanished forever."[1]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Empire_State

"Ah, you miserable creatures! You who think that you are so great! You who judge humanity to be so small! You who wish to reform everything! Why don't you reform yourselves? That task would be sufficient enough."
-Frederick Bastiat

2013-04-03 17:04:40

#15

BVC: Member; +325|6712

Not like the British, Ottoman or Roman Empires. That said, the US is a union of fifty states and a bunch of other territories, so in that sense you could think of the US as an empire.

http://www.google.co.nz/search?sourceid … definition

em·pire
/ˈempī(ə)r/
Noun
An extensive group of states or countries under a single supreme authority, formerly esp. an emperor or empress.

I guess so.

*ahem* For Queen and country!

https://img694.imageshack.us/img694/6517/img693s.jpg

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Yes my handwriting sucks, and don't ask why I have currency from the 1940s on me.

Last edited by BVC (2013-04-03 17:13:41)

2013-04-03 17:15:55

#16

Macbeth: Banned; +2,444|5602

AussieReaper wrote:
Macbeth wrote:
You are all ruining the discourse of this forum. Stop.
I think they aren't in the business of Empire building, so aren't an Empire.

Policing the world doesn't count. That's just trying to maintain the state they have.

Let's argue that they are Empire building, their main rival would be China. When 1/5th of the worlds population is Chinese and the average human on Earth is a Han Chinese male, I think China has the better "Empire".

???

America has been empire building especially after the world wars. We built up many international organizations to facilitate trade in a way that benefits us. We forced other countries to adopt the sort of economic system that benefits us. We have military agreements with countries all over the world. We helped rebuild Europe into a favorable place. And a million other things.

The amount of people that live somewhere isn't a measure of empire. Who lives better us or them? Who makes stuff for who's children. Who buys who's paper debt?

Last edited by Macbeth (2013-04-03 17:17:29)

2013-04-03 17:17:35

#17

RTHKI: mmmf mmmf mmmf; +1,736|6753|Oxferd Ohire

britain had the best population to empire ratio

2013-04-03 17:20:52

#18

Uzique The Lesser: Banned; +382|4271

RTHKI wrote:
britain had the best population to empire of all time ratio

Last edited by Uzique The Lesser (2013-04-03 17:21:04)

2013-04-03 17:22:08

#19

Macbeth: Banned; +2,444|5602

Population wise the best was the Persian empire that had 45% of the world's population at it's height.

2013-04-03 17:22:47

#20

Uzique The Lesser: Banned; +382|4271

persians were effete and decadent. they were weak.

2013-04-03 17:56:34

#21

AussieReaper: ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°); +5,761|6169|what

Macbeth wrote:
AussieReaper wrote:
Macbeth wrote:
You are all ruining the discourse of this forum. Stop.
I think they aren't in the business of Empire building, so aren't an Empire.

Policing the world doesn't count. That's just trying to maintain the state they have.

Let's argue that they are Empire building, their main rival would be China. When 1/5th of the worlds population is Chinese and the average human on Earth is a Han Chinese male, I think China has the better "Empire".
???

America has been empire building especially after the world wars. We built up many international organizations to facilitate trade in a way that benefits us. We forced other countries to adopt the sort of economic system that benefits us. We have military agreements with countries all over the world. We helped rebuild Europe into a favorable place. And a million other things.

The amount of people that live somewhere isn't a measure of empire. Who lives better us or them? Who makes stuff for who's children. Who buys who's paper debt?

That was containment of Russia/China and the spread of communism by proxy wars, Vietnam, Korea, (bay of pigs), etc.

That isn't Empire building. It was preservation of the West and no expansion.

2013-04-03 17:58:13

#22

13/f/taiwan: Member; +940|5715

it wasn't actually about communism.

2013-04-03 17:58:41

#23

Uzique The Lesser: Banned; +382|4271

AussieReaper wrote:
Macbeth wrote:
AussieReaper wrote:

I think they aren't in the business of Empire building, so aren't an Empire.

Policing the world doesn't count. That's just trying to maintain the state they have.

Let's argue that they are Empire building, their main rival would be China. When 1/5th of the worlds population is Chinese and the average human on Earth is a Han Chinese male, I think China has the better "Empire".
???

America has been empire building especially after the world wars. We built up many international organizations to facilitate trade in a way that benefits us. We forced other countries to adopt the sort of economic system that benefits us. We have military agreements with countries all over the world. We helped rebuild Europe into a favorable place. And a million other things.

The amount of people that live somewhere isn't a measure of empire. Who lives better us or them? Who makes stuff for who's children. Who buys who's paper debt?
That was containment of Russia/China and the spread of communism by proxy wars, Vietnam, Korea, (bay of pigs), etc.

That isn't Empire building. It was preservation of the West and no expansion.

lol

2013-04-03 18:13:39

#24

AussieReaper: ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°); +5,761|6169|what

13/f/taiwan wrote:
it wasn't actually about communism.

Domino theory. Look it up.

2013-04-03 18:19:17

#25

13/f/taiwan: Member; +940|5715

i guess when we went in with the brits to overthrow mossadegh it was about preserving western culture and not just because they happened to have oil.

BF2S Forums Is America an Empire?

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